Matchup Chart Project 2015 - Calling Marth Mains!

[Zareidriel]

Hello Marth boards,

I'm Zareidriel. Over in this thread a guy called Assassannerr made a matchup chart, and asked people to help fill it out. It seems like it would be a cool thing to have. With once glance you could have a rough idea of a matchup. It won't be perfect, but for our first go at it in 2015 we're aiming for "somewhat functional."

So here's what I'm going to do. Go to every Character Discussion board, and ask the folks there if they wouldn't mind contributing. To submit one vote, you'll have to fill out one of these:

////////////******
Bowser
Bowser Jr
Captain Falcon
Charizard
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Duck Hunt
Falco
Fox
Mr. Game & Watch
Ganondorf
Greninja
Ike
Jigglypuff
King Dedede
Kirby
Link
Little Mac
Lucario
Luigi
Mario
Dr. Mario
Marth
Lucina
Metaknight
Ness
Olimar
Palutena
Pikachu
Pit & Dark Pit
Peach
Zelda
R.O.B.
Robin
Rosalina
Samus
Sheik
Shulk
Toon Link
Villager
Wario
Wii Fit Trainer
Yoshi
Zero Suit Samus
Megaman
Pacman
Sonic
Ryu
Roy
Mewtwo
Lucas
Brawler
Swordfighter
Gunner
******//////////


Mark each character with a + for a match where Marth HAS THE ADVANTAGE
Mark each character with a - for a match where Marth HAS THE DISADVANTAGE
Mark each character with a number 0 for a match you feel is very even.

NOTE THAT I AM ONLY TAKING VOTES FROM MEMBERS WITH Marth IN THEIR PROFILE BAR. It can be as either "Wii U Main" or "3DS Main". But if Marth is in neither one of those slots when I count the votes on Friday, Nov 13, it won't be counted.

(Yes, for the avid democrats out there, that means you can vote for one other character as well.)

Like I said, they won't be perfect, and each board will probably be a little biased toward their own respective character. But the results should be interesting regardless.

If this thing is successful maybe we'll do a revised version in 2016.

Thanks very much for participating! We need as many votes as possible for each character so please submit a ballot!

 

[Vipermoon]

It's too soon (especially for other characters) but I'll play along.

 

[Ako.]

It's too soon (especially for other characters) but I'll play along.

I agree, it is kinda too early, and we still hve much more to discuss in the vs mu threads, but it wont hurt to give us something to look at for now and we can always improve it in the future. I will do my best to help

 

[Zareidriel]

Voting closes tomorrow at midnight. Get those ballots in!

Marth boards, you are tied with only the Captain Falcon boards for 0 votes. If anyone gets a chance I could really use em.

 

[Zareidriel]

Oh crap no no votes! Well hopefully yous, Lucario, and Capt are the only boards with none, and should be if I recall correctly...

Well I'm still taking votes if anyone wants to submit one. Regardless, I'll meet my minimum quota of 3 ballots by asking other Marths personally, if none of you are able to provide the information. But that would be much more time-consuming and I would appreciate the other option where you do the Smash community a favor by expending a little effort =P

Zareidriel Marth votes tallied

 

[Vipermoon]

Oh crap no no votes! Well hopefully yous, Lucario, and Capt are the only boards with none, and should be if I recall correctly...

Well I'm still taking votes if anyone wants to submit one. Regardless, I'll meet my minimum quota of 3 ballots by asking other Marths personally, if none of you are able to provide the information. But that would be much more time-consuming and I would appreciate the other option where you do the Smash community a favor by expending a little effort =P

Zareidriel Marth votes tallied

I'll post mine. I just thought you said it ended that one midnight and that we're way past it already so I'm confused.

 

[Vipermoon]

To make this nice and accurate, players with good Marth results should try this out instead of flooding the slots with people who have never used Marth in tournament. So if you guys want to: @Shaya (I know Marth is not among his listed mains but that's outdated and you should accept his opinion anyway because few people know more about this character), kj22 , Locuan , Pugwest . There are other good Marth tourney users but they don't frequent SmashBoards.

Patch 1.1.3
////////////******
- Bowser
0 Bowser Jr
0 Captain Falcon
0 Charizard
- Diddy Kong
- Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
0 Falco
- Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
0 Ganondorf
0 Greninja
- Ike
+ Jigglypuff
- King Dedede
+ Kirby
0 Link
0 Little Mac
+ Lucario
- Luigi
0 Mario
+ Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
- Metaknight
0 Ness
0 Olimar
+ Palutena
- Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
+ Peach
+ Zelda
0 R.O.B.
0 Robin
0 Rosalina
+ Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
0 Toon Link
0 Villager
+ Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
0 Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0 Megaman
+ Pacman
- Sonic
0 Ryu
0 Roy
0 Mewtwo
+ Lucas
- Cloud
? Brawler
? Swordfighter
? Gunner
******//////////

 

[Zareidriel]

I'll post mine. I just thought you said it ended that one midnight and that we're way past it already so I'm confused.

No you're totally right Vipermoon, and thanks for the votes. In most of the character threads that were short on ballots I had posted a message saying "We're in overtime, so if there are less than 5 votes, you can continue to vote until the Chart is complete." But I just seemed to have missed Marth for some reason.

 

[Pugwest]

I've played against almost every MU and about 70% of the cast at a "high level" of play.

Here is my conclusion, feel free to ask about certain Match ups if needed.

Sidenote: My Play-style has a big factor on deciding these matches. My methods may work better/worst than other Top Marths.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Z0iSgnrBKdXlxJuqICPrPT6dZ_1h1iJOJjpGNc35ZqA/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Ako.]

I use marth in my local tourneys, so here are my opinions. There are some Match ups i need more experience in, so this will change in the future when I have more experience.

+ Bowser
0 Bowser Jr
+ Captain Falcon
0 Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0 Donkey Kong
- Duck Hunt
+ Falco
0 Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
+ Ganondorf
0 Greninja
0 Ike
0 Jigglypuff
0 King Dedede
0 Kirby
+ Link
+ Little Mac
0 Lucario
- Luigi
0 Mario
+ Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
- Metaknight
0 Ness
0 Olimar
+ Palutena
- Pikachu
+ Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
+ Zelda
- R.O.B.
+ Robin
0 Rosalina
+ Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
0 Toon Link
0 Villager
0 Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
0 Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0 Megaman
0 Pacman
- Sonic
0 Ryu
0 Roy
0 Mewtwo
0 Lucas
0 Cloud
0 Brawler
+ Swordfighter
+ Gunner

 

[RisingVexx]

I main Marth and I'm currently #1 in my country PRs
Here is my MU chart

+ Bowser
+ Bowser Jr
0 Captain Falcon
+ Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0 Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
+ Falco
- Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
+ Ganondorf
0 Greninja
0 Ike
+ Jigglypuff
+ King Dedede
0 Kirby
+ Link
+ Little Mac
0 Lucario
+ Luigi
0 Mario
+ Dr. Mario
0 Marth
+ Lucina
- Metaknight
+ Ness
0 Olimar
0 Palutena
- Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
+ Zelda
0 R.O.B.
+ Robin
0 Rosalina
+ Samus
- Sheik
- Shulk
0 Toon Link
0 Villager
0 Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
0 Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0 Megaman
0 Pacman
- Sonic
0 Ryu
+ Roy
+ Mewtwo
+ Lucas
+ Cloud
- Brawler
0 Swordfighter
0 Gunner

 

[Vipermoon]

The last one is WAY too optimistic. Idk, maybe most tourney smashers in your country aren't good. When there is a skill gap, Marth feels like a god so that would explain your MU estimations.

 

[Zareidriel]

Wow, thanks for the responses guys, that hits the minimum of 3! I will still take up to 5 so if there are two more that would like to share their input, you are more than free to do so. I already marked the Marth votes "completed" so I'll be counting you guys last.

 

[A_Kae]

If you're still taking matchup votes, here's mine.

////////////******
0 Bowser
0 Bowser Jr
0 Captain Falcon
0 Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0 Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
0 Falco
- Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
+ Ganondorf
- Greninja
- Ike
+ Jigglypuff
- King Dedede
+ Kirby
0 Link
0 Little Mac
0 Lucario
- Luigi
0 Mario
0 Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
- Metaknight
0 Ness
- Olimar
+ Palutena
- Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
+ Peach
+ Zelda
0 R.O.B.
0 Robin
+ Rosalina
+ Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
0 Toon Link
0 Villager
+ Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
0 Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0 Megaman
0 Pacman
- Sonic
0 Ryu
0 Roy
0 Mewtwo
0 Lucas
0 Brawler
0 Swordfighter
0 Gunner
******//////////

 

[RisingVexx]

The last one is WAY too optimistic. Idk, maybe most tourney smashers in your country aren't good. When there is a skill gap, Marth feels like a god so that would explain your MU estimations.

What's so optimistic about it.

 

[Vipermoon]

What's so optimistic about it.

There are too many characters in there you have him beating. It is severely underestimating a lot of characters. If Marth truly had this MU spread, he'd be nearly high tier but he isn't even close.

 

[RisingVexx]

There are too many characters in there you have him beating. It is severely underestimating a lot of characters. If Marth truly had this MU spread, he'd be nearly high tier but he isn't even close.

Why not.

Maybe you are the one understimating your character.

Btw, Pugwest list has more + matchups than mine and you didnt say anything lol.

 

[Vipermoon]

Why not.

Maybe you are the one understimating your character.

Btw, Pugwest list has more + matchups than mine and you didnt say anything lol.

Absolutely not. Like I said, if you are unbeatable in Venezuela more match-ups will seem positive to you.

45-55 MUs are too specific and are still considered even MUs. Notice how many 0s A_Kae has. Pugwest had a neutral MU chart when you consider everything.

Anyway I don't want to argue about this. This thread is about voting.

 

[Darklink401]

Guess I'll vote too, since there's 3 + 1 now?

I'm my country's best Marth, tho I use him in tournaments less than Villager...

////////////******
Bowser +
Bowser Jr +
Captain Falcon 0
Charizard +
Diddy Kong 0
Donkey Kong +
Duck Hunt 0
Falco +
Fox 0
Mr. Game & Watch +
Ganondorf +
Greninja 0
Ike 0
Jigglypuff +
King Dedede -
Kirby 0
Link 0
Little Mac +
Lucario +
Luigi +
Mario 0
Dr. Mario +
Marth 0
Lucina 0
Metaknight 0
Ness +
Olimar 0
Palutena 0
Pikachu -
Pit & Dark Pit 0
Peach +
Zelda -
R.O.B. -
Robin +
Rosalina +
Samus +
Sheik -
Shulk 0
Toon Link
Villager -
Wario +
Wii Fit Trainer +
Yoshi 0
Zero Suit Samus 0
Megaman -
Pacman -
Sonic 0
Ryu -
Roy +
Mewtwo +
Lucas +
Brawler 0
Swordfighter +
Gunner 0
******//////////



Well that came out more positive than I thought..

 

[Locuan]

If I'm unsure of a matchup can I leave that character out or state is as a question mark (?)?

 

[Pugwest]

I main Marth and I'm currently #1 in my country PRs
Here is my MU chart

Hello Vex , Can I ask why Shulk is difficult for you personally?

 

[Zareidriel]

Aaaaaaaaaaaand that makes 5. Thanks Marths, we're done here!

 

[Vipermoon]

Aaaaaaaaaaaand that makes 5. Thanks Marths, we're done here!

You can't take more than 5? More is always better.

Thanks to Darklink we have 2 MU charts that are too positive in my opinion

 

[Foodies]

May as well post mine. I don't go to tournies but I do study Marth a lot. Take it as you will. Or don't count it, doesn't really matter to me lol.

0 Bowser
0 Bowser Jr
0/- Captain Falcon
0/+ Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0/- Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
0 Falco
- Fox
0/- Mr. Game & Watch
0/+ Ganondorf
0/- Greninja
0/- Ike
0/+ Jigglypuff
0/- King Dedede
0/+ Kirby
0 Link
0 Little Mac
0 Lucario
0 Luigi
0/- Mario
0 Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
0/- Metaknight
0 Ness
- Olimar
0 Palutena
- Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
0/+ Zelda
0/- R.O.B.
0 Robin
0/- Rosalina
0/+ Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
0/- Toon Link
0/- Villager
0/- Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
0/- Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0/- Megaman
0 Pacman
- Sonic
0/- Ryu
0/+ Roy
0 Mewtwo
0 Lucas
- Brawler
0/+ Swordfighter
? Gunner

The 0/something means it's pretty much even but I still chose someone who'd I think would have an advantage (45/55 ratios basically). But you can probably count those as even. Those are completely winnable.

 

[kj22]

Oh just saw this o; I'll post one just for the heck of it

0 Bowser
+ Bowser Jr
0 Captain Falcon
- Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0 Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
+ Falco
- Fox
+ Mr. Game & Watch
0 Ganondorf
- Greninja
- Ike
+ Jigglypuff
0 King Dedede
- Kirby
0 Link
- Little Mac
0 Lucario
- Luigi
0 Mario
+ Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0ish Lucina
- Metaknight
0 Ness
- Olimar
0 Palutena
0 Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
+ Zelda
- R.O.B.
+ Robin
+ Rosalina
+ Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
- Toon Link
0 Villager
+ Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
- Yoshi
0 Zero Suit Samus
- Megaman
+ Pacman
- Sonic
- Ryu
+ Roy
+ Mewtwo
+ Lucas
? Brawler
? Swordfighter
? Gunner

 

[DariusM27]

+ Bowser
+ Bowser Jr
0 Captain Falcon
+ Charizard
- Diddy Kong
0 Donkey Kong
0 Duck Hunt
+ Falco
- Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
+ Ganondorf
- Greninja
0 Ike
+ Jigglypuff
- King Dedede
0 Kirby
- Link
+ Little Mac
0 Lucario
- Luigi
0 Mario
0 Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
- Metaknight
0 Ness
- Olimar
0 Palutena
- Pikachu
- Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
+ Zelda
- R.O.B.
+ Robin
- Rosalina
0 Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
- Toon Link
0 Villager
+ Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
- Yoshi
0 Zero Suit Samus
- Megaman
0 Pacman
- Sonic
- Ryu
0 Roy
+ Mewtwo
+ Lucas
? Brawler
? Swordfighter
? Gunner

 

[Darklink401]

You can't take more than 5? More is always better.

Thanks to Darklink we have 2 MU charts that are too positive in my opinion

Really? I tried to be pretty tough...XD

But that is how I feel about them.

That being said, I'm sure there's a better place for MU discussion

 

[Giannis]

Here is my opinion too! I am the only Marth in Greece and ranked 5th in the country:

0 Bowser
- Bowser Jr
+ Captain Falcon
+ Charizard
- Diddy Kong
- Donkey Kong
- Duck Hunt
0 Falco
0 Fox
0 Mr. Game & Watch
+ Ganondorf
- Greninja
0 Ike
0 Jigglypuff
0 King Dedede
0 Kirby
- Link
0 Little Mac
0 Lucario
- Luigi
- Mario
0 Dr. Mario
0 Marth
0 Lucina
- Metaknight
- Ness
0 Olimar
0 Palutena
- Pikachu
0 Pit & Dark Pit
0 Peach
+ Zelda
- R.O.B.
0 Robin
- Rosalina
0 Samus
- Sheik
0 Shulk
- Toon Link
- Villager
0 Wario
0 Wii Fit Trainer
- Yoshi
- Zero Suit Samus
0 Megaman
0 Pacman
0 Sonic
- Ryu
+ Roy
0 Mewtwo
0 Lucas
0 Brawler
+ Swordfighter
0 Gunner