Mario MU on Samus? (1)

[Annihilat®]

Okay, yeah. I understand the MU can be a bit, if not a lot, in his favor. But I was seeing if I could test the MU to be closer to a 55-45 Mario. Any takers?

 

[FUEGO!]

I'll bite, what are your reasons for why it's 55-45?

 

[Annihilat®]

I'll bite, what are your reasons for why it's 55-45?

A'ight, gotta taker. I'd prefer to play when my mom finally realizes that she didn't pay the Internet bill. We'll have a better connection then.

And I say it's 55 (maybe more) for Mario because he's got a little bit of everything, ya know? Kill throw, projectile, reflector, combos, power, recovery. If you get up too close to Samus, he dishes out heavy damage.

Samus a 45 because she can out range and stuff his incoming aerial approaches. But Mario's Cape can kill at only 50% (could be 20% like Ness). That, and his combo game is something to avoid. A bit hard to get away from with her speed.

 

[IsmaR]

I think what he's trying to say is why 45 instead of lower (most peg it for 60-40, or even 70-30).

Samus being so easy to juggle due to being both floaty and having large hurtboxes (i.e. - hitting the air around her feet during tilts), on top of being reflector-bait makes it seem like it would be a lot further from even than 55-45 in Mario's favor..

 

[FUEGO!]

I think what he's trying to say is why 45 instead of lower (most peg it for 60-40, or even 70-30).

Samus being so easy to juggle due to being both floaty and having large hurtboxes (i.e. - hitting the air around her feet during tilts), on top of being reflector-bait makes it seem like it would be a lot further from even than 55-45 in Mario's favor..

Thank you, but I really wasn't being specific. In fact, I got to play a really good Samus today at a meet-up. I'm inclined to agree with the OP's reasons, if they know what they're doing, it tends to feel 55-45 tbh. I feel like I won off of skill alone but with a pinch of help from my frame data.

 

[OGPiP]

Really, the only way I see a Mario losing this match-up is if they don't know it well enough. Mario can cape all of the projectiles while hes walking forward trying to approach, then he can just wait for one opening and it's 50% and stage control. I see it as probably 60:40 or maybe even 65:35.

I'd love to be proven wrong but no WiiU qq

 

[Annihilat®]

Really, the only way I see a Mario losing this match-up is if they don't know it well enough. Mario can cape all of the projectiles while hes walking forward trying to approach, then he can just wait for one opening and it's 50% and stage control. I see it as probably 60:40 or maybe even 65:35.

I'd love to be proven wrong but no WiiU qq

Yeah, I used to think the MU was wonky like 80-20, but I've played many a Mario and learned what he does. Still wins, but not a blowout like that. I've learned the hard way of Charge Shot against reflectors I can die center stage at 50%. Missiles...eh. Yeah, they can be reflected, but Samus usually always has enough time to move out of the way. Samus's Bombs are pretty good in the MU because they stuff tons of Mario's options. The Bomb Jumping kinda limits its potential, however (should only Bomb Jump if used in air).

Samus does pretty well when opponents are in the air as well. F-air will outlast an airdodge, multi-hit U-air keeps players up there. Really, Samus is just a spacer who is terrible up close but great offstage.

 

[HeroMystic]

As a Samus player I never once believed the MU was unwinnable because Samus has options. The problem is her options are bad and requires some very stellar mindgaming and outplaying your opponent. It's not hard for Mario to get in vs Samus and it's extremely hard for Samus to get Mario off her back.

Samus' saving grace is Up-B and Charged Shot. Up-B is something Mario has to respect and Charge Shot stops Mario from more or less disrespecting everything else about Samus. Samus has good combos once she gets going but it's nothing on the level of what Mario can do to Samus. Overall, Mario is just too fast and too aggressive for Samus to handle in a straight up fight.

 

[Annihilat®]

As a Samus player I never once believed the MU was unwinnable because Samus has options. The problem is her options are bad and requires some very stellar mindgaming and outplaying your opponent. It's not hard for Mario to get in vs Samus and it's extremely hard for Samus to get Mario off her back.

Samus' saving grace is Up-B and Charged Shot. Up-B is something Mario has to respect and Charge Shot stops Mario from more or less disrespecting everything else about Samus. Samus has good combos once she gets going but it's nothing on the level of what Mario can do to Samus. Overall, Mario is just too fast and too aggressive for Samus to handle in a straight up fight.

Yeah, definitely. Samus is one of the worst characters to use against rushdowns. Too slow to escape, and too floaty. Gives them ample time to position themselves below you. It can get pretty ugly, but it's just something I learned to play against. Like one of the worst things someone can do to Samus is Run Up and Shield. I don't know how to accurately describe how to fight against that, but there's very little Samus can do in that situation agains a guy with good reflexes. And I know it too because I kept getting grabbed out of Jab 1 and the startup of U-tilt.

 

[Skeeter Mania]

As a Samus player I never once believed the MU was unwinnable because Samus has options. The problem is her options are bad and requires some very stellar mindgaming and outplaying your opponent. It's not hard for Mario to get in vs Samus and it's extremely hard for Samus to get Mario off her back.

Samus' saving grace is Up-B and Charged Shot. Up-B is something Mario has to respect and Charge Shot stops Mario from more or less disrespecting everything else about Samus. Samus has good combos once she gets going but it's nothing on the level of what Mario can do to Samus. Overall, Mario is just too fast and too aggressive for Samus to handle in a straight up fight.

Can't Mario just cape Charge Shot?

 

[HeroMystic]

A good Samus player will not let their charge shot be caped easily.

 

[Annihilat®]

I do get caped here and there, but I know when to fire it. You can even mindgame some of them into using cape. But I've been rethinking that because there's really not a whole lot of endlag on cape. They can keep using it. Reflects from behind, too. I personally don't think moves that deal over 20% should be reflected/countered/nullified. Kinda crippling, tbh.

And once my mom pays the bill, I'll fight with some Marios here as Samus.