Manipulation Of RNG?!?!?!

[VaLoR_Ryan]

I've been experimenting with Mr. Game and Watch for a great amount of time now, I understand that manipulating the RNG of Mr. Game and Watches side B would be an extremely difficult task, but i understand that a TAS can manipulate the RNG of the hammer, but would it be physically possible to manipulate the RNG of the hammer to get whatever you want whenever you want? I've been theory crafting possible button combinations, maybe even name tags, or some type of ingame feature to allow the user to get a 9 hammer whenever they wanted. If this could be physically possible we have a chance of changing the game completely and be able to raise one of the most underrated characters in the game so much higher on the tier list. I am going to continue and theory craft and try out new things to see if this is physically possible without having to use a computer or anything to change in game content.

 

[EZえん]

ask nintendo for the algorithm they used for the pseudo-rng "9 hammer." then simplify the algorithm as deeply as u can and attempt to master the patter of the hammer

 

[Elsey]

sounds a little out there, but if you can explore and get some results out, that would be ****ing godly

 

[LeadRod]

Game & Watch Out.

 

[CeeV]

You have my swor--er, hammer.

 

[IoSSBM]

Well, in order to manipulate anything in Melee, you need numbers. Here's the chances of a 9 for each hammer:

1st hammer: 1/7 (1 and 2 are impossible)
2nd hammer: 1/8 unless you got a 9 on the first hammer (1 is impossible)
3rd hammer: 1/9 unless you got a 9 on the first or second hammer
so on.
If you wanted to have a 1/2 chance for the next hammer, you would need around 5 hammers (not exact).
So, if you wanted to consider using hammer in a combo or for style, throwing 4, 5, or 6 hammers would increase your chance of getting a nine the next hammer, although because of RNG, you might just throw away a 9. Honestly, using RNG abuse sounds cool but is pretty difficult since RNG doesn't always work the way you want.

 

[Magical Samurai]

Well, in order to manipulate anything in Melee, you need numbers. Here's the chances of a 9 for each hammer:

1st hammer: 1/7 (1 and 2 are impossible)
2nd hammer: 1/8 unless you got a 9 on the first hammer (1 is impossible)
3rd hammer: 1/9 unless you got a 9 on the first or second hammer
so on.

This is inaccurate to my understanding. Each time you use the move you have 7 potential outcomes as you cannot get either of the last two numbers (with 1 and 2 being the set as the last two each time you respawn). So you're always 1/7 unless you previously hit a 9, in which case your odds are 0%.
Now, maybe there is some hidden algorithm to check gamestate for the generation of that 1/7 chance, maybe there's some factor with game-time, the lead of your opponent, or something, but the only odds I know are the 1/7.

 

[TUBAN]

What Samurai said. LoSSBM is incorrect with his/her statements on 9 hammer manipulation.

Your probability to hit a 9 is 1/7, always. The key to the 9hammer is the following: you CANNOT get a number your received in your last two swings. That being said, when you enter the game, your last two swings are counted to be 1 and 2, thus rather than entering a game with a 1/9th probability of pulling a 9, you have a 1/7th probability.

This does not change and is not affected by a differential of outcomes from multiple numbers.

Pulling 7,8 give you the EXACT SAME odds of hitting a 9 next compared to 4,7 6,3 or ANY combination of numbers. It doesn't freaking matter what exactly your last numbers were.

No numbers can be pulled again for the next two swings, and THAT IS IT.

People try to overcomplicate the hammer. That's just how simple it is.

 

[Magical Samurai]

What Samurai said. LoSSBM is incorrect with his/her statements on 9 hammer manipulation.

Your probability to hit a 9 is 1/7, always. The key to the 9hammer is the following: you CANNOT get a number your received in your last two swings. That being said, when you enter the game, your last two swings are counted to be 1 and 2, thus rather than entering a game with a 1/9th probability of pulling a 9, you have a 1/7th probability.

This does not change and is not affected by a differential of outcomes from multiple numbers.

Pulling 7,8 give you the EXACT SAME odds of hitting a 9 next compared to 4,7 6,3 or ANY combination of numbers. It doesn't freaking matter what exactly your last numbers were.

No numbers can be pulled again for the next two swings, and THAT IS IT.

People try to overcomplicate the hammer. That's just how simple it is.

God, hearing someone use my 2008 username makes it feel even more outdated, lol. I made the name sometime back in middle school - in like 04/05 or something.

In case mine or TUBAN's descriptions aren't simple enough and you need a walkthrough...

CASE 1: Start of Game
Previous two Hammer #s = 2, 1
Possible Hammer #s = 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
Possible Chance of any of those Numbers = 1 in 7
Possible Chance of a 9 = 1 in 7
The Number I Got: 4

Case 2
Previous two Hammer #s = 1, 4
Possible Hammer #s = 2, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
Possible Chance of any of those Numbers = 1 in 7
Possible Chance of a 9 = 1 in 7
The Number I Got: 9

Case 3
Previous two Hammer #s = 4, 9
Possible Hammer #s = 1, 2, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8
Possible Chance of any of those Numbers = 1 in 7
Possible Chance of a 9 = 0
The Number I Got: 6

At this point my Previous two Hammers would be 9 and 6, but

I died, after respawn I clear out that previous number queue and start fresh.

Case 4: Freshly Respawned
Previous two Hammer #s = 2, 1
Possible Hammer #s = 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
Possible Chance of any of those Numbers = 1 in 7
Possible Chance of a 9 = 1 in 7
The Number I Got: 3

 

[Audos]

I believe in the cause, long live the Judge hammer. Too bad it isn't just the second counter so you could abuse the grab combo and pummel to victory. If you ask me you just need to optimize flattening. All hail crouch2win. (puff main speaking lol)

 

[AnonymousRex]

its been 7 years, still waiting for mah guaranteed |9|