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Luigi Video Thread

OnFullTilt

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 2, 2014
Messages
188
Location
MA
NNID
Gregolus
Anyone want to critique my Luigi? If so:

Vs. Ivy/Ganon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM1T5GymDXQ (Luigi both games)
Vs. Charizard https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqVJJBmr34E (Luigi 1st game)
Vs. Marth https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWwtmUuhGcw (Luigi 1st game)

My Luigi tends to be really inconsistent- usually if someone knows how to play against Luigi I do poorly. Though the Charizard and Marth players are flat out better than me and I didn't know the mathchup, I still feel like I lost worse than I should have. Part of that is if I feel uncomfortable in a match I make bad decisions it seems. Anyone have advice for how to be less predictable in such a situation?
 

moonfolk

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 31, 2014
Messages
85
Dude, those are the most annoying commentators I've ever heard. Good playin though. I love watching Luigi matches.
 

Boomer3d

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2011
Messages
374
Location
Overland Park Kansas
Yeah it is also unfortunate that they are right behind me so I can hear them talk and react while I am playing. It gets pretty distracting to be honest :/
 

Broasty

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
252
Location
Orlando, Florida
Yo Boomer3d, that's really interesting! The way you play Weegee is a polar opposite to my own! You seem to take a more Brawl Style approach with "less is more" where you focus mainly on reacting and predicting the opponent with strong attacks or short combos. Whereas, the Orlando Melee based scene has brought me towards pushing the character as a Super-Offensive-Coke-Snorting-Rushdown-Glass-Canon. Basically, I'm always trying to move and keep the game feeling like I'm always applying pressure. I never stay on the ledge, I always get up as fast as possible with the offstage (I'm facing the left direction) Wave land via tilt:GCL:hold til jump to execute backflip then waveland for max distance and least time. In neutral I work off a set of approaches working from dash dance unless they're at a disadvantage (off stage or teching), in which case I play rush down tech chase covering options via fireballs, Dairs (perfectly spaced spikes for attack getup or standup), DSmash, Grab->DThrow->Chaingrab tech chase, DSpecial, or Shoruken.

Can't wait to use this ****ty ass Easycap to show you what I'm doing these days.
 

Boomer3d

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2011
Messages
374
Location
Overland Park Kansas
Yeah from what I experienced during my summer in Florida, it seems like you guys are all super offensive. I also went to a 40 person tournament on Saturday and got 5th in pm and 4th in melee both with Luigi. I will get those videos here when they are uploaded. In general I play more on reaction but I feel like I can also flip the switch to offensive as well.
 

Boomer3d

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2011
Messages
374
Location
Overland Park Kansas
Things that I noticed:
  • Spacing, a lot of time you would wave dash towards them and you would get punished. Also I saw a lot of whiffed aerials. If you know the range of your opponent and keep it in mind it goes a long way
  • Movement, your movement is a little sloppy and you don't have the fierce speed that Luigi is known for yet. Mostly work on your successful wavedashes. No one has 100 percent wavedash accuracy, but it did seem you missed some wavedashes at some crucial points of the matches.
  • Combo / punish game, Luigi is known for his combos. When your movement gets better this will come naturally.
Overall pretty impressive for only 3 months of the L man.
 

Broasty

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
252
Location
Orlando, Florida
Right from the beginning of the dubs match, you could've Baired Game and Watch off stage and edge guarded him. The big points to take from this is to abuse the speed of your aerials and use remember that most characters can be edge guarded using well spaced and timed Bairs, Dairs, and Fireballs.

You should make it muscle memory to instantly waveland on stage by tilting away, hold for just long enough after release to jump and make the input a backflip, then wave land on stage. This lets you stay in the action, abuse invincibility frames, and let you survive much better past 100%.

In dubs specifically, a great way to work with your teammate is to do SH Dair an opponent. Naturally they'll shield and attempt to grab you OoS. Let your partner know if he sees you doing this attack, be prepared to go in and punish the opponent while they're grabbing you.

If an opponent is above you, standing or laying on a platform, an ideal attack is to jump (full hop), instantly do Uair, fast fall, Nair and L-Cancel. It keeps shielded opponents in shield stun (which you can either finish with a Dtilt if it's about to break or grab if not) and non-shielders in a nasty combo starter. I noticed you had a good opportunity to do this during the first dubs match.

Avoid rolling. Any higher level opponent can react to your roll and punish you...and in a lot of cases, put you off stage where you'll most likely die. If you're close quarters with shield up, WD OoS backwards, do a Nair SHFFL OoS, Grab OoS, or USmash OoS (especially if the opponent is right behind you to get caught in the beginning of the hitbox). If you REALLY want to dodge, spot dodge is ok. Notice how in match two for dubs you got punished with Mario's FSmash for your first stock. Also, remember you have super armor if the grab hitbox land on the opponent's hurtbox at the same time as the opponent's hitbox.

Careful about throwing out that Misfire, if any hitboxes get in your way, your attack won't hit. This is especially the case for projectile wall characters like Link and Mario. Try to reserve it for combo finishers or reads you're pretty sure you'll guess correct.

For the sake of dubs, a rather "safe" way to throw is to do BThrow since the swung opponent acts as a hitbox and can sorta guard you on ground. Plus it's great way to do what Luigi does really well in dubs: get one opponent off stage so you can double team on the other opponent.

Never ever ever ever accidentally press Dash Attack. That mistake can cost you a stock in a lot of cases. The only time it's ever safe to dash attack is if the opponent is shielding right next to the ledge so you can push them off...and even that has a few matchups that end up countering you during the end lag.

Although you can't really edgeguard Diddy, in general, the two ways to hit vertically edge approaching opponents while staying on stage are SHFFL Dair at the edge or a really well spaced Filt with a downward angle.

As for general things, at least from my personal opinion:

Try to avoid jumping. If you're facing a high level opponent, you'll find that Luigi is a sitting duck in the air if his opponent isn't stuck in stun lock when dealing with neutral game on stage. In other words, your go-to neutral game moves should be the ground based ones.

Movement is looking pretty groovy, however that doesn't mean you've conquered the Luigi footsies. The fastest means of getting from one side to the other is alternating between WDs and Dashes in the same direction. It takes a lot of work, but man is it worth it. Also, your lack of movement (remember, this is all coming from the perspective of someone who's trying to make Luigi a super fast rushdown character) doesn't really put much in the way of pressure on the opponent. When faced with high pressure players, you'll find this leads you to getting "trapped", or easily susceptible to being put in bad positions for neutral game since the opponent is positioning around a stationary player. This especially is a problem for characters like Marth, Roy, Ike, and Sheik (I can tell you from a lot of personal experience that those grabs are the bane of Luigi's existence). I'd recommend not letting the opponent get the upperhand by using dash dancing more often when you're not applying pressure. Like Boomer3d said, spacing is really important because it's how Luigi "get's in" and starts racking up the combo damage. As such, a high level opponent will know that and try to make sure you don't have the proper spacing.

Your punish game can become better, though it's looking pretty good so far. This is honestly a thing that just gets better with time and experience. Don't stress about it, just try to push those combos farther over time.

Other than that dude, you're doing amazing, seriously. Keep it up!
 

Elza~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Plano, TX
Right from the beginning of the dubs match, you could've Baired Game and Watch off stage and edge guarded him. The big points to take from this is to abuse the speed of your aerials and use remember that most characters can be edge guarded using well spaced and timed Bairs, Dairs, and Fireballs.

You should make it muscle memory to instantly waveland on stage by tilting away, hold for just long enough after release to jump and make the input a backflip, then wave land on stage. This lets you stay in the action, abuse invincibility frames, and let you survive much better past 100%.

In dubs specifically, a great way to work with your teammate is to do SH Dair an opponent. Naturally they'll shield and attempt to grab you OoS. Let your partner know if he sees you doing this attack, be prepared to go in and punish the opponent while they're grabbing you.

If an opponent is above you, standing or laying on a platform, an ideal attack is to jump (full hop), instantly do Uair, fast fall, Nair and L-Cancel. It keeps shielded opponents in shield stun (which you can either finish with a Dtilt if it's about to break or grab if not) and non-shielders in a nasty combo starter. I noticed you had a good opportunity to do this during the first dubs match.

Avoid rolling. Any higher level opponent can react to your roll and punish you...and in a lot of cases, put you off stage where you'll most likely die. If you're close quarters with shield up, WD OoS backwards, do a Nair SHFFL OoS, Grab OoS, or USmash OoS (especially if the opponent is right behind you to get caught in the beginning of the hitbox). If you REALLY want to dodge, spot dodge is ok. Notice how in match two for dubs you got punished with Mario's FSmash for your first stock. Also, remember you have super armor if the grab hitbox land on the opponent's hurtbox at the same time as the opponent's hitbox.

Careful about throwing out that Misfire, if any hitboxes get in your way, your attack won't hit. This is especially the case for projectile wall characters like Link and Mario. Try to reserve it for combo finishers or reads you're pretty sure you'll guess correct.

For the sake of dubs, a rather "safe" way to throw is to do BThrow since the swung opponent acts as a hitbox and can sorta guard you on ground. Plus it's great way to do what Luigi does really well in dubs: get one opponent off stage so you can double team on the other opponent.

Never ever ever ever accidentally press Dash Attack. That mistake can cost you a stock in a lot of cases. The only time it's ever safe to dash attack is if the opponent is shielding right next to the ledge so you can push them off...and even that has a few matchups that end up countering you during the end lag.

Although you can't really edgeguard Diddy, in general, the two ways to hit vertically edge approaching opponents while staying on stage are SHFFL Dair at the edge or a really well spaced Filt with a downward angle.

As for general things, at least from my personal opinion:

Try to avoid jumping. If you're facing a high level opponent, you'll find that Luigi is a sitting duck in the air if his opponent isn't stuck in stun lock when dealing with neutral game on stage. In other words, your go-to neutral game moves should be the ground based ones.

Movement is looking pretty groovy, however that doesn't mean you've conquered the Luigi footsies. The fastest means of getting from one side to the other is alternating between WDs and Dashes in the same direction. It takes a lot of work, but man is it worth it. Also, your lack of movement (remember, this is all coming from the perspective of someone who's trying to make Luigi a super fast rushdown character) doesn't really put much in the way of pressure on the opponent. When faced with high pressure players, you'll find this leads you to getting "trapped", or easily susceptible to being put in bad positions for neutral game since the opponent is positioning around a stationary player. This especially is a problem for characters like Marth, Roy, Ike, and Sheik (I can tell you from a lot of personal experience that those grabs are the bane of Luigi's existence). I'd recommend not letting the opponent get the upperhand by using dash dancing more often when you're not applying pressure. Like Boomer3d said, spacing is really important because it's how Luigi "get's in" and starts racking up the combo damage. As such, a high level opponent will know that and try to make sure you don't have the proper spacing.

Your punish game can become better, though it's looking pretty good so far. This is honestly a thing that just gets better with time and experience. Don't stress about it, just try to push those combos farther over time.

Other than that dude, you're doing amazing, seriously. Keep it up!
Ok....a lot of the stuff you are telling me, I already know. It is easy to go back and watch a match and think about the things that I COULD have done. I have done that myself already. However, when you are playing mid-match, most of the options you don't actually think about as you have to be on the move. There are far too many options in the game to just say "You could have just B-aired". 6+3 = 9, but so does 7+2. There are more ways to come to the same result.

Referring to Boomer's footage. His WDs looked forced. There was a point in time he used 5 Wavedashes to cross PS2 when you can cover that distance in 2 1/2. That looks "sloppy" to me personally. The speed Luigi is known for has to be one of the vaguest things anyone can say. You realize there are characters that can dash just as fast as Luigi's WD. I.E Marth.

Lastly, you keep saying "High level opponent", as if Luck is currently not on the list for Best Diddy Kong. He holds the 3rd spot.
 
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Broasty

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
252
Location
Orlando, Florida
Ok....a lot of the stuff you are telling me, I already know. It is easy to go back and watch a match and think about the things that I COULD have done. I have done that myself already. However, when you are playing mid-match, most of the options you don't actually think about as you have to be on the move. There are far too many options in the game to just say "You could have just B-aired". 6+3 = 9, but so does 7+2. There are more ways to come to the same result.

Referring to Boomer's footage. His WDs looked forced. There was a point in time he used 5 Wavedashes to cross PS2 when you can cover that distance in 2 1/2. That looks "sloppy" to me personally. The speed Luigi is known for has to be one of the vaguest things anyone can say. You realize there are characters that can dash just as fast as Luigi's WD. I.E Marth.

Lastly, you keep saying "High level opponent", as if Luck is currently not on the list for Best Diddy Kong. He holds the 3rd spot.
Hey dude, I'm sorry my feedback wasn't helpful. :(

I don't personally know what you know, so the best I can do to rate you Luigi is provide an in-depth critique based off detailed points in the videos you gave us, which personally is the way I learn best. Don't misunderstand me, you're doing hella awesome. Far better than I was doing in 3 months.
 

Elza~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Plano, TX
Hey dude, I'm sorry my feedback wasn't helpful. :(

I don't personally know what you know, so the best I can do to rate you Luigi is provide an in-depth critique based off detailed points in the videos you gave us, which personally is the way I learn best. Don't misunderstand me, you're doing hella awesome. Far better than I was doing in 3 months.
I don't mean for my comment to sound like your feedback isn't appreciated because it is.

There are some parts of the critique that lack explanation, but at the same time contradict themselves(referring to Boomer's reply about how I "don't possess the speed Luigi is known for") when I just explained characters can dash just as fast if not faster than Luigi's WD. Says, the movement is a little sloppy, but then re-affirms that nobody has 100% accuracy(his footage didn't help his claim from MY pov)

You are alright man. Meant no harm to you.
 

Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
Columbus, OH
NNID
XYKman
Hey guys! I just wanted to know if you could give me some critics to my Luigi :) I´ve uploaded two videos. Thank you so much.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OWbs24YCR8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RmjDkeJbhs
Cool stuff man! It always makes me happy to see people passionate about Luigi and understanding his potential as a character.
Here are something things I noticed in your matches (critiques, affirmations, etc)...

Critiques: I saw many missed wavelands, which allowed the Lucario the opportunity for a punish. Wavelands are things we as Luigi players need to master or else that will be the number one way an opponent gains control of neutral game or even gets that last hit. I also noticed that after about the third tornado, I instantly knew how you were going to use it from there on. Tornado has so many ways in which you can mix it up, which is one of my favorite things about Luigi. The max distance on the tornado is crazy! I find myself wavedashing away and then immediately using tornado towards my opponent. It feels faster and catches them off-guard. Also, you tend to retreat after getting your tornado hits in. Try mixing it up by mashing the tornado upon hitting to continue the combo with an aerial sometimes. Not many people know how to deal with that, so think about using that for those who can't seem to punish it! Start using wavelanding as an option when recovering from the ledge and think about the different distances wavedashing can travel. When you approach with upsmash from a wavedash, if you turn around, the hitbox reaches further and hits earlier btw, so it can be super deadly! MORE WAVEDASH FTILTS! :D
Affirmations: Excellent use of the vudu dashing! Not enough people use this technique and tend to stay right on the ledge. Sometimes ya gotta be aggressive and go get your kill instead of expecting it to come to you. Good job! Your grab game is pretty good and wavedashing into smashes (down smashes were the best!) and you were really good about getting the nair kills. Yoshi's Story is such a good Luigi stage and his aerials kills super quickly. I think Luigi plays well against Lucario because it is harder for him to continue his combos because of your floatiness and aerials, so Lucario should rarely give you a whole lot of trouble. Was cool to see jab resets on ZSS! Those can be very scary for your an opponent against Luigi. Overall, not bad at all!

This is all stuff that came to mind while watching those matches. Some of my critiques were just thought processes of what works for me that I figured I'd share with you. I hope it helps in at least some way! If you have any questions I am willing to share extra input where I can. Great Luigi :)
 
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POLOGUN

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
25
Location
Oh Canadaaa
Cool stuff man! It always makes me happy to see people passionate about Luigi and understanding his potential as a character.
Here are something things I noticed in your matches (critiques, affirmations, etc)...

Critiques: I saw many missed wavelands, which allowed the Lucario the opportunity for a punish. Wavelands are things we as Luigi players need to master or else that will be the number one way an opponent gains control of neutral game or even gets that last hit. I also noticed that after about the third tornado, I instantly knew how you were going to use it from there on. Tornado has so many ways in which you can mix it up, which is one of my favorite things about Luigi. The max distance on the tornado is crazy! I find myself wavedashing away and then immediately using tornado towards my opponent. It feels faster and catches them off-guard. Also, you tend to retreat after getting your tornado hits in. Try mixing it up by mashing the tornado upon hitting to continue the combo with an aerial sometimes. Not many people know how to deal with that, so think about using that for those who can't seem to punish it! Start using wavelanding as an option when recovering from the ledge and think about the different distances wavedashing can travel. When you approach with upsmash from a wavedash, if you turn around, the hitbox reaches further and hits earlier btw, so it can be super deadly! MORE WAVEDASH FTILTS! :D
Affirmations: Excellent use of the vudu dashing! Not enough people use this technique and tend to stay right on the ledge. Sometimes ya gotta be aggressive and go get your kill instead of expecting it to come to you. Good job! Your grab game is pretty good and wavedashing into smashes (down smashes were the best!) and you were really good about getting the nair kills. Yoshi's Story is such a good Luigi stage and his aerials kills super quickly. I think Luigi plays well against Lucario because it is harder for him to continue his combos because of your floatiness and aerials, so Lucario should rarely give you a whole lot of trouble. Was cool to see jab resets on ZSS! Those can be very scary for your an opponent against Luigi. Overall, not bad at all!

This is all stuff that came to mind while watching those matches. Some of my critiques were just thought processes of what works for me that I figured I'd share with you. I hope it helps in at least some way! If you have any questions I am willing to share extra input where I can. Great Luigi :)
Thank you so much for your feedback xykness :D your analysis es amazing. You are right, i find myself pretty predictable when i use tornado, i´ll mix it up as you said. I know that i miss a lot of wave landings and thats what i´m trying to improve specifically. I have no experience with wavedash turnaround upsmash so i will add the technique to my game as you recommend.

Thanks for the compliments! i will keep working in vududashing, i´ve realized that you can keep all momentum if you did a perfect waveland, but if you did two it works even better, this tech is a must with luigi because it gives so much speed to you and also confuses the opponent so bad lol
Im trying to develop a consistent way to pull Super Jump Punch in a combo but i´m still looking for the right timing, maybe with ftilt and wavedash SJP :) anyway, i´ll be around trying to write sometimes and help. If you need anything or have a question also, you are welcome.
 

Elza~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Plano, TX
Hey guys! I just wanted to know if you could give me some critics to my Luigi :) I´ve uploaded two videos. Thank you so much.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OWbs24YCR8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RmjDkeJbhs
I am still working on my Luigi so I'll give the best advice I can.

Your wavelanding on the platforms is good for the most part as it is natural for people to miss them from time to time. One thing I noticed though, is your Luigi on just a ground level is pretty "sane". Basically you don't really move a lot. Luigi is one of those characters that can throw your opponent into a loop by having them try to guess what you are going to do. I would suggest to move around a lot more.

One con, is you rely a little too much on the Down-B as an approach option. Luigi is fortunate enough to have a ton of mix-up options so you don't have to rely on the Down-B all the time. You could benefit greatly from Wavedash F-Tilt*Upwards*, Wavedash Grabs, Wavedash Down Smash, Wavedash Up-Tilt, etc......Not to mention, you CAN waveland out of the down-b if you raise at the last possible time to get extensive movement across the stage.

Outside of the few Vududashes I saw you do, it seems the Fireball is a little unexplored by you. It is a great tool and has multiple applications. It is up to the player how they want to apply them. You can use them for

1.) Covering tech roll options
2.) Resetting an out of range opponent that has been knocked down giving you time to get back in
3.) Extending otherwise finished combos
4.) Controlling space on screen (Limiting Opponents Movement)

Punish game could use some work, but as long as your overall movement gets better, the punish game will also naturally get better. Sometime you want to make it a mission to either take the opponents stock entirely, or just do a TON of damage to remind your opponent not to mess up in this game.

I would also work a little on the mind games. Your Luigi was rather straight forward and even though I wasn't playing you personally, I already had an idea of what you were going to do.

Also, as a note, not once did I see you use the Down-B off-stage so I am concerned whether or not you can perform it to make it back to the stage were it to be necessary.

Here is some footage of myself playing. Rather extensive so there should be some things. There are 2 more like it on the same channel titled under "Exhibitions"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3daE7FhqB18

I guess let me know what you think about my play. Hope this helps.
 

POLOGUN

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
25
Location
Oh Canadaaa
I am still working on my Luigi so I'll give the best advice I can.

Your wavelanding on the platforms is good for the most part as it is natural for people to miss them from time to time. One thing I noticed though, is your Luigi on just a ground level is pretty "sane". Basically you don't really move a lot. Luigi is one of those characters that can throw your opponent into a loop by having them try to guess what you are going to do. I would suggest to move around a lot more.

One con, is you rely a little too much on the Down-B as an approach option. Luigi is fortunate enough to have a ton of mix-up options so you don't have to rely on the Down-B all the time. You could benefit greatly from Wavedash F-Tilt*Upwards*, Wavedash Grabs, Wavedash Down Smash, Wavedash Up-Tilt, etc......Not to mention, you CAN waveland out of the down-b if you raise at the last possible time to get extensive movement across the stage.

Outside of the few Vududashes I saw you do, it seems the Fireball is a little unexplored by you. It is a great tool and has multiple applications. It is up to the player how they want to apply them. You can use them for

1.) Covering tech roll options
2.) Resetting an out of range opponent that has been knocked down giving you time to get back in
3.) Extending otherwise finished combos
4.) Controlling space on screen (Limiting Opponents Movement)

Punish game could use some work, but as long as your overall movement gets better, the punish game will also naturally get better. Sometime you want to make it a mission to either take the opponents stock entirely, or just do a TON of damage to remind your opponent not to mess up in this game.

I would also work a little on the mind games. Your Luigi was rather straight forward and even though I wasn't playing you personally, I already had an idea of what you were going to do.

Also, as a note, not once did I see you use the Down-B off-stage so I am concerned whether or not you can perform it to make it back to the stage were it to be necessary.

Here is some footage of myself playing. Rather extensive so there should be some things. There are 2 more like it on the same channel titled under "Exhibitions"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3daE7FhqB18

I guess let me know what you think about my play. Hope this helps.
Hi Elza. Thank you so much for your feedback, you are right about the tornado, i still need to explore it deeply to be able to mix it up as well as the wavedash into ftilt and wavedash pivot upsmash as xykness said. Fireball? i don't know, is actually pretty slow and has a slow startup and a lot of ending lag, i hope they allow fireball wave landing in 3.5 lol

By the way, i just watched a couple of your matches. You are pretty good with the edge guards but they are always the same, maybe adding some vududashing will do the trick. You got nice combos there, as well as that wolf though. i recommend you to play against flotier characters than wolf because fast fallers will not represent a big challenge against luigi´s punishing games. good ledge guarding and punishes. ;)
 

Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
Columbus, OH
NNID
XYKman
Hi Elza. Thank you so much for your feedback, you are right about the tornado, i still need to explore it deeply to be able to mix it up as well as the wavedash into ftilt and wavedash pivot upsmash as xykness said. Fireball? i don't know, is actually pretty slow and has a slow startup and a lot of ending lag, i hope they allow fireball wave landing in 3.5 lol

By the way, i just watched a couple of your matches. You are pretty good with the edge guards but they are always the same, maybe adding some vududashing will do the trick. You got nice combos there, as well as that wolf though. i recommend you to play against flotier characters than wolf because fast fallers will not represent a big challenge against luigi´s punishing games. good ledge guarding and punishes. ;)
You actually can short hop fireball waveland :) I use it all the time! It makes it so the opponent can't use an aerial approach as you go in for a grab, smash, or whatever with the wavedash. I almost ALWAYS have fireballs out lol. I use them when the opponent is coming down and I can't get an aerial just to add extra damage OR set up an aerial. I use them to get in the most during neutral like stated before. They can also be good for making sure they don't go to platforms. On stages like Battlefield, I'll throw one towards the platform above them before going in to make sure that they are grounded and if they jump into it, it is a free aerial. Definitely recommend using more fireballs! Don't underestimate them :) I would not have made the Columbus, OH power rankings without them!
 

POLOGUN

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
25
Location
Oh Canadaaa
I didn't know! but you are right im practicing that right now :D the timing is very specific but it works very well. i´ll definitely adopt it.
 

Elza~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Plano, TX
Hi Elza. Thank you so much for your feedback, you are right about the tornado, i still need to explore it deeply to be able to mix it up as well as the wavedash into ftilt and wavedash pivot upsmash as xykness said. Fireball? i don't know, is actually pretty slow and has a slow startup and a lot of ending lag, i hope they allow fireball wave landing in 3.5 lol

By the way, i just watched a couple of your matches. You are pretty good with the edge guards but they are always the same, maybe adding some vududashing will do the trick. You got nice combos there, as well as that wolf though. i recommend you to play against flotier characters than wolf because fast fallers will not represent a big challenge against luigi´s punishing games. good ledge guarding and punishes. ;)
There are vududash edgeguards in the video. As well as fireball wavelanding. There is a platform drop cancelled combo. Up-B kills. All sorts of Luigi things. Vududashing is good, but it isn't always the best choice.
 

Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
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XYKman
I didn't know! but you are right im practicing that right now :D the timing is very specific but it works very well. i´ll definitely adopt it.
You can even jump from the ledge --> fireball --> waveland --> downsmash (with C-stick is easiest)
I use that to sneak some hits in :)
 

POLOGUN

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
25
Location
Oh Canadaaa
There are vududash edgeguards in the video. As well as fireball wavelanding. There is a platform drop cancelled combo. Up-B kills. All sorts of Luigi things. Vududashing is good, but it isn't always the best choice.
Hey elsa can you teach me how to do the platform drop cancel combo? is the same that was in melee where you don't fall the platform but land the neutral air hit?
 

POLOGUN

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
25
Location
Oh Canadaaa
You can even jump from the ledge --> fireball --> waveland --> downsmash (with C-stick is easiest)
I use that to sneak some hits in :)
How would it be? you drop the ledge and then fireball, then jump and waveland in the stage?
 

otek

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
14
Here are videos of my Luigi from a tournament in July that I won

Unfortunately, the only set that I lost didn't get recorded, which was the first set of GFs against Fox/Falco

WFs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_dqh4ZHpqo (vs Clade's Lucas)
GF2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG0oG2Iv5nQ (vs Clade's spacies)

If you see anything that I can work on, feel free to tell me! Hopefully you guys can see some cool stuff and maybe implement that into your own gameplay! :)
 

Broasty

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
252
Location
Orlando, Florida
Here are videos of my Luigi from a tournament in July that I won

Unfortunately, the only set that I lost didn't get recorded, which was the first set of GFs against Fox/Falco

WFs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_dqh4ZHpqo (vs Clade's Lucas)
GF2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG0oG2Iv5nQ (vs Clade's spacies)

If you see anything that I can work on, feel free to tell me! Hopefully you guys can see some cool stuff and maybe implement that into your own gameplay! :)
That Bair you used to stuff Fox's vertical recovery was beautiful. Also, figured you might want to know, but if you space your cyclone just a little to the right or left of a spacie at the end of the animation, you can go for a continuous knockdown til around 40% since from that position you can easily cover all options via cyclone (including attack get up wiff punish).
 

CBO0tz

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 2, 2014
Messages
1,055
Location
Yoshi's Island
Here are videos of my Luigi from a tournament in July that I won

Unfortunately, the only set that I lost didn't get recorded, which was the first set of GFs against Fox/Falco

WFs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_dqh4ZHpqo (vs Clade's Lucas)
GF2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG0oG2Iv5nQ (vs Clade's spacies)

If you see anything that I can work on, feel free to tell me! Hopefully you guys can see some cool stuff and maybe implement that into your own gameplay! :)
I play basically the same as you in the match vs Lucas, a bit too dependant on Cyclones.
You can tell you've been training in the lab in the spacies match, it taught me a thing or two. Like the U-throw to the Cyclone followup as he rolled off the platform looked good. Also I didn't know Luigi actually made sound after taunt canceling..
And Karate Chopping through the Ledge??!
Does Cycloning near the edge cancel the endlag?
 
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Elza~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Plano, TX
Here are videos of my Luigi from a tournament in July that I won

Unfortunately, the only set that I lost didn't get recorded, which was the first set of GFs against Fox/Falco

WFs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_dqh4ZHpqo (vs Clade's Lucas)
GF2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG0oG2Iv5nQ (vs Clade's spacies)

If you see anything that I can work on, feel free to tell me! Hopefully you guys can see some cool stuff and maybe implement that into your own gameplay! :)
I saw an excessive use of Down-B. Majority of the instances it was entirely unsafe. Had your opponent actually knew how to punish correctly, I could have seen an entirely different outcome, but that is more on the other player. On the other hand, since they didn't, I suppose you were just feeding off that fact and going to town.


I wanna say you were trying to waveland your fireballs as you kept popping shield when you touched the ground. I would practice that of course because it is very useful for covering approaches or buying some time in retreating and resetting neutral.

Also, I would work on ledge-dashing. I didn't see you do it once.(The closest I saw was a double-jump from ledge waveland, but that isn't a true ledge dash.) Opens up a ton of options for Luigi as one of the things I enjoy most about him, is he freedom in creativity. Not to mention the grounded coverage he can get is easily the best in the game if done right. Being able to just pass through Zelda's Din's Fire without having to throw out a move due to invulnerability is a godsend. Refer to .gifs for ledgedash options:

https://gfycat.com/ThickGiftedAvians
https://gfycat.com/GloriousSpectacularDogfish

Also, the combos (especially on spacies) could have been more fierce. If you touch a spacie from 0%, they should either lose a stock or take a ton of damage. So I would suggest working more on punish game. Improving your movement will improve your punish game overall.

https://gfycat.com/InfatuatedGiddyGnu

Hope this helps. Other than good stuff.
 

Broasty

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
252
Location
Orlando, Florida
http://www.twitch.tv/gamingknights1/b/590350986

3.5 tourney last week, match starts at 4:53. Lmao at the "wonderful" things the commentators said about me including not giving proper credit where it's due for the Wave Scuttle (shout outs to Boomer3d lol). UAir buff get's a chance to shine at the end of the first match. I think this set shows how to handle the Ivysaur matchup pretty well.
 
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Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
Columbus, OH
NNID
XYKman
Hey guys! I somehow always avoid the recording setups at my biweekly, but I really wanna show you all some stuff about what Luigi is capable of with movement baits and speed/pressure. This Tuesday I will try my best to get on a recording setup and share a video explaining some of my thought process. Would also be cool to get a few of us together on Skype to talk about Luigi videos or just his meta-game overall. I've had a lot on my mind and have been writing a huge Luigi guide/information booklet. Hope I can be of some kind of assistance! LET THE LUIGI'S RISE!

-Edit-
So the guy who normally has the recording setup didn't show, so I will post ASAP.
 
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DMG

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Messages
18,958
Location
Waco
Slippi.gg
DMG#931
Elza should have some vids from Bowser's Revenge 14 up, where he got 4th including beating Luck

Edit: Playlist should have 2-3 of his matches?
 
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Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
Columbus, OH
NNID
XYKman
Rate my Weegee? All advice/critique welcome and appreciated!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Em3oCgi_yZk
Overall, I think you have a great Luigi! How do you place at your local events usually?

Here are just some things I noticed (writing as I watch videos)...

Your wavedashing is on point! I noticed that you tend to always go for the fair when they're in the air, when moves like uair can string in a bit more damage. Against Diddy, you can usually get like two uairs in and then follow up with fair in quite a few situations. I don't know if these were intentional, but there were quite a few random dodge rolls in places. You are very good at getting the ledge roll distance punishes. I was rather impressed with that! Also wavedash, jab, downsmash (or super jump punch) is godlike as Luigi. Not sure if you use it, but figured I'd throw it out there. If that downsmash gets shielded you're typically always safe. Just some other food for thoughts that I share with Luigi players... Get comfortable with perfect wavelands from the ledge. It makes ledge options so much better especially against matchups where its harder to get back once you're on the ledge. Also get comfortable with forward B sweet spots because those save my life and I can get them 9/10 times when going for them. Having more options and mixups is always a good thing. Overall, good job! Was definitely an interesting Luigi to watch! Lemme know your thoughts! I don't have all the answers, but I am always willing to chat.
 
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1+1=3

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 11, 2014
Messages
60
Location
Huntington, NY
Thanks!^_^ I average around third place out of typically 9-14 players, but this tourney was I think about 20ish players? Maybe a little more. But this match was the only one with a higher skilled player in my area. I do have a few other matches, like one posted above here. Against the Zelda player. Would you guys care to see some of my other stuff? I've got a few more matches, I think.
 
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Xykness

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
Columbus, OH
NNID
XYKman
Thanks!^_^ I average around third place out of typically 9-14 players, but this tourney was I think about 20ish players? Maybe a little more. But this match was the only one with a higher skilled player in my area. I do have a few other matches, like one posted above here. Against the Zelda player. Would you guys care to see some of my other stuff? I've got a few more matches, I think.
If you want, you can create a playlist or put several links in your original post. I'm sure people would enjoy watching them! I really hope I can grab a recording setup this weekend!
 
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