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Lucas Critique??

x9whitey9x

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Messages
291
Location
Virginia
I watched the vs. Ike.
You need to punish with F-smash instead of PKF. Also, edgeguard more with bair/dair. You overused PK Fire, especially since you didn't SH it.
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
I watched the vs. Ike.
You need to punish with F-smash instead of PKF. Also, edgeguard more with bair/dair. You overused PK Fire, especially since you didn't SH it.
punishing with Fsmash may or may not be a good idea based on %. at high % punishing iwth Fsmash may get the ko, while at low % punshing with fsmash may just be a wasted opportunity to get more damage done, diminishing your Fsmash power.
For example:
at 0% ike would get hit by Dsmash multiple times possibly all three times.
that could maybe get 30% off if you were to punish with dsmash(a move that isn't that reliable for killing), where as if you were to use FSmash (a very reliable killing move) it may only get you 14% and a missed oppurtunity.
Now same moves at high %.
if you were punishing for the kill and you knew either move would do, you would go for the faster/safer killing move for the punish, Fsmash.

don't quote me and say Dsmash is a reliable punishing move (besides against people that roll/spotdoge often), that was just an example of how you could get more damage done.


OK, for the critique of your lucas:
no offense to you, but i try to be as concise as i can when i critique something. So, from what i saw you played like how i used to play with lucas 4 months ago. You spam Pk fire wayyy too much. you use it to punish whiffed moves while they are right next to you, to approach, to bait an approach (nothing wrong with that) and just to rack up damage (nothing wrong with that either, but you hae more than just PK fire). PK FREEZE IS NOT A GOOD MOVE. it is easily avoided and punishable, and you should only use it a few times a match, if any. you don't have enough ftilt and jab. they are fast and can set up for more moves and combos. you should mix up your recoveries. when you are high, magnet pull is not the only way to get back on stage, and doing it too often you will become predictable (as magnet pulling has a very predictable trajectory). you can just float back magnet pull come back with an aerial/ airdodge, or even PKT2 back on when they aren't expecting it. Lucas' recovery is pretty good and you aren't using it to it's full potential. granted i'm not either because i'm not the best lucas ever, but i rarely get gimped. You fast fall everything which is not always a good idea. dair has ALOT of lag is you fastfall it incorrectly and Tyr_03 has a guide on the Dair i suggest you read it. it's a great move for lucas. when edguarding, you have choices once again. if the opponent is recovering high, Pk freeze can for an airdodge and mindgame opponents, and Bair is also a good choice. when recovering low you can pk fire if they are too close to the stage to lead into a bair spike or into a Pkt gimp, which is a really good edgeguarding tool. btw don't PK freeze when a oppnent is recovering low, because it doesn't reach down low enough.

sorry if i sound angry or mad or anything, i'm just really blunt when i try to help others.
 

lil cj

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
1,328
Location
Los Angeles, CA
Thanks alot for the advice:)
I will definitely change sum things up
I got alot to work on...lol
-No spamming PK fire
-SH PK fire more
-More ftilt & jab
-bair/dair edgeguard
-Pk freeze egdeguard(high recovery)
-PK fire edge guard when they r close to stage
-PKT edge guard/gimping/stage spike
-Switch up recovery options
-Less PK freeze
-Less fast falling
-Learn more about dair
Got it:)
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
Thanks alot for the advice:)
I will definitely change sum things up
I got alot to work on...lol
-No spamming PK fire
-SH PK fire more
-More ftilt & jab
-bair/dair edgeguard
-Pk freeze egdeguard(high recovery)
-PK fire edge guard when they r close to stage
-PKT edge guard/gimping/stage spike
-Switch up recovery options
-Less PK freeze
-Less fast falling
-Learn more about dair
Got it:)

i can play you a few times with lucas if you would like. as i said i'm not the greatest lucas (though people usually call me one of the best.)
 

Neon Ness

Designated Procrastinator
Joined
Jul 10, 2008
Messages
3,631
I watched that Marth video... Just looking at the way you play, it seems like we have similar fighting styles... Except yours is more refined. :chuckle: I would say use grabs less, it's very punishable when it misses and they're generally not as good as Ness' throws anyway. Also, I think you shouldn't give up on PK Freeze just yet... I'm a PK Freeze fiend, and I think it's good for mind games near the edge and just raw damage at low percents. Though when fighting more difficult people, maybe it would be wise to use it less.

EDIT: Wait, I forgot... Try more forward and down tilts at close range. Forward is good for spacing, and down is good for quick damage.
 

smasher?o.0

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
218
ok one thing is to PKT2 for countering edgeguards unless they have counters
another thing is dont use pk freeze for no reason, use it to setup PKT2
and u look like a ness player so try him out
and practice on timing u-smash into a hyphen-smash because its good for damage and a mindgame
 

x9whitey9x

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Messages
291
Location
Virginia
I just watched Wolf and saw one more thing.
You can full-hop dair almost laglessly, try it instead of a double jump, that approach is way too predictable.
Also, who is your friend's main? He isn't very good with Ike, Marth, or Wolf.
 

lil cj

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
1,328
Location
Los Angeles, CA
GGS man.
did you understand/see what what i meant by the tips i left you?
Those were some great matches...Ive never seen a Lucas that good before...lol
U make him look top tier

Yes
I learned alot
Usually I own with Lucas
but now i see that there r more things I need to work on...lol
Time to change up my style:)


I just watched Wolf and saw one more thing.
You can full-hop dair almost laglessly, try it instead of a double jump, that approach is way too predictable.
Also, who is your friend's main? He isn't very good with Ike, Marth, or Wolf.
...lol
He mains Lucario, but uses alot of characters
And Ike was played by another person...I think he mains Zelda and Ganon
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
did you read Tyr_03's guide that he is in the process of making?
He basically tells you everything that i do in a way more detailed form. if you read it you would see i'm the hybrid lucas =]
It's stickied and should be the 2nd from the top on the lucas boards.
thanks for the compliment about my lucas. everyone says it's the best one out there but idk... I think i could be better and could be a pro lucas one day (if i'm not one already)
 

lil cj

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
1,328
Location
Los Angeles, CA
did you read Tyr_03's guide that he is in the process of making?
He basically tells you everything that i do in a way more detailed form. if you read it you would see i'm the hybrid lucas =]
It's stickied and should be the 2nd from the top on the lucas boards.
thanks for the compliment about my lucas. everyone says it's the best one out there but idk... I think i could be better and could be a pro lucas one day (if i'm not one already)
I'll check it out
And yes i do believe u r considered a pro:)
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
I'll check it out
And yes i do believe u r considered a pro:)
thanks :)
if you ever wanna play i'll be online randomly, just don't always expect me to be lucas.

OH! btw before i forget one of the most important things to do is learn the matchups for EVERY character in the game. don't exclude characters like jiggz/yoshi because nobody plays them. believe me there are good ones out there
 

lil cj

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 29, 2008
Messages
1,328
Location
Los Angeles, CA
thanks :)
if you ever wanna play i'll be online randomly, just don't always expect me to be lucas.

OH! btw before i forget one of the most important things to do is learn the matchups for EVERY character in the game. don't exclude characters like jiggz/yoshi because nobody plays them. believe me there are good ones out there

k sounds good:)
lol...yeah Ive played a very good Yoshi before...but Ive never seen a good Jiggs except for Bowyer's....lol

Edit: Im kinda having trouble adjusting to this new style....lol...i lost a couple matches against lil inuyasha(won some too) I tried the dair approach but it was kinda hard to hit with it properly since its on wifi...I always have trouble in Lucas dittos:(
The next time we brawl could u train my Lucas?
My style is too predictable and i really need to change that...lol



yes. how do i get to become world-renowned for my lucas like cj and pink?

Lol...Im not world renowned
My Lucas is average or a little above(when Im in the zone...lol)
I lose too...but still win most of the time as well
Now Pink Fresh is a different story he has a top tier Lucas:)
And APC too
To get good with Lucas you have to put alot of time into playing him
Even if u hav alot of mains try to work hard with all of them by watching combo vids, reading strategy guides, visiting smashboards, and playing others.
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
k sounds good:)
lol...yeah Ive played a very good Yoshi before...but Ive never seen a good Jiggs except for Bowyer's....lol

Edit: Im kinda having trouble adjusting to this new style....lol...i lost a couple matches against lil inuyasha(won some too) I tried the dair approach but it was kinda hard to hit with it properly since its on wifi...I always have trouble in Lucas dittos:(
The next time we brawl could u train my Lucas?
My style is too predictable and i really need to change that...lol
i'll be sure to train you to the best of my ability.
i don't just play with lucas, so you'll be able to get a feel for about 20 differen't matchups.
i'm kinda like a lucas maining ninjalink lol.
his diddy is beastie and he can play with anyone.
my lucas is pretty good and i can play with anyone... except yoshi, jiggz, olimar and sonic.






Lol...Im not world renowned
My Lucas is average or a little above(when Im in the zone...lol)
I lose too...but still win most of the time as well
Now Pink Fresh is a different story he has a top tier Lucas:)
And APC too
To get good with Lucas you have to put alot of time into playing him
Even if u hav alot of mains try to work hard with all of them by watching combo vids, reading strategy guides, visiting smashboards, and playing others.
thanks man
i really appreciate the compliments.
I'm actually not that well known. i just started on gamebattles so my rep might go up there, but other than that i'm barely known.
on the other hand, the people that know me think my lucas is almost unbeatable, except for my bad matchups... DK, marth, G&W, and MK
though i do manage to beat MK,Marth, and DK (G&W is just too hard for Lucas lol)
but ya you get better by practice, videos, guides, and matchup experience.
P.S. I've played with lucas since day one lol
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
You misused PKT and used the Magnet Pull one time too many in the first video, for one.
 

PhoenixAlpha

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 18, 2007
Messages
387
Location
Dallas - The Land of The Killers
Sorry CJ, I said I'd get to it, but it looks like Pink Fresh beat me to it.
It sounds like you have a lot of advice to incorporate into your play.
I'll be sure to offer up some tips (earlier) when you release more vids.

Keep up that Lucas, good sir.
 

Iron Mushroom

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 21, 2008
Messages
98
Location
Hobo Land
Yeah, You did use PK fire and PK Freeze a lot, But that's just your stradgety (PK Fire was a little bit abused), and you did a lot of good combos! I'd say you're pretty good
 
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