lock please

[Tapion013]

Smasher89: I really couldn't understand your post at all but I'll do my best. Not trying to give you a hard time, I know you're not American.

the reason why it's 3 stock in brawl is because matches, even at 3 stock, take a very long time. Time constraints make it necessary to do 3 stock since even now they're lasting over 5 minutes. Also the general rule is best 2 out of 3, best 3 out of 5 for finals.

Also, f-tilt locking can be escaped by smash DIing up and towards and trying to jump off of sheik's head. The only really bad thing is zero suit's down smash lock on fox. That's unavoidable no matter what if done properly.

Dedede vs DK is the only true infinite of the chain grabs you mentioned since the others wear off after a few, and that really sucks for the DK player, but again that's one character on one character. Marth on lucas and ness, yes that sucks as well, but that's one character on only those two characters.

Your comparing it to snake's f-smash is also a little absurd. IC's have set ups that lead to their grabs such as down B, neutral B, jabs, general desynchs, etc. Snake doesn't have a set up into a forward smash, but I can guarantee you if he had a setup that was basically a guaranteed KO at 30-40%, it would be debated...

 

[Fly_Amanita]

This is not about it being difficult to pull off, it's not about anything except should ice climbers players really be rewarded with a full stock should they get one off?

Sure, why not?

 

[Tapion013]

Why Not = no other character in this game has a technique that can take you from 0-death on any stage. The definition of broken in a fighting game is being able to do things no other character can do, and gives them a definite advantage (not something useless like ganon's taunt is the only one that pumps his fists together, something like an infinite that no other character has is more appropriate).

Come on Millar, I'm interested in your reasoning the most out of all these people behind it being a legitimate tactic. I've heard Hylian's argument which so far is the only good one even in its simplicity. What's your take?

 

[momochuu]

The definition of broken in a fighting game is being able to do things no other character can do, and gives them a definite advantage (not something useless like ganon's taunt is the only one that pumps his fists together, something like an infinite that no other character has is more appropriate).

Dedede's chaingrab on Mario, DK, Samus, and the others. Why is that not banned?

 

[Hylian]

Dedede's chaingrab on Mario, DK, Samus, and the others. Why is that not banned?

Because it only works on 5 characters, and just effectivly makes DDD counter those characters. That really isn't a problem in competitve play and it's a pretty bad example to try and use when defending the IC's .

Also, IC's have 1 move that actually set's up a grab and that's ice block. If you Ice block with nana and run after it with popo on the ice block hits your opponent you can grab. But that is the ONLY true set-up. Jabs and blizzards don't work tapion. You can just DI up when being hit by blizzard and then you won't land on the ground, so just jump.

Solo squall can sometimes set up for a grab now that I think about it, but it isn't very practical :/.

Anyways, I've already told Tapion my arguement so I don't really need to do anything here but correct people hehehe.

 

[Tapion013]

lol, blizzard can set up for grabs. Any time a character is in the air I consider it a chance for a grab. Ice block is the only guaranteed one, but you can get grabs out of blizzard every once in a while.

And also, the infinite doesn't last forever on those 5 characters, it only lasts forever on DK and in dedede dittos at the ledge.

 

[Miller]

Tapion, I know IC are broke to ****, but it doesn't warrant a ban. If the player has enough skill to get a 0-death off, then they deserve to get it off.

 

[YiffyBaro]

I main Ice Climbers in the hopes of being good enough to get them banned.

 

[JustNoOne]

You should try and do that with Meta Knight first =P

I also main Captain Falcon in the hopes of being manilly enough to get him banned xD

/* end sarcasm

 

[chewyy]

Tapion, I know IC are broke to ****, but it doesn't warrant a ban. If the player has enough skill to get a 0-death off, then they deserve to get it off.

Saying it's hard doesn't mean it shouldn't be banned, because honestly, it isn't THAT hard and can be done consistently. As long as it isn't really fricking ridiculous (like breaking someone's shield with multishines in melee) the difficulty doesn't matter.

The definition of broken in a fighting game is being able to do things no other character can do, and gives them a definite advantage (not something useless like ganon's taunt is the only one that pumps his fists together, something like an infinite that no other character has is more appropriate).

Do the IC's have a definite advantage? I'm pretty sure that tournaments have shown that the IC's do not automatically win because they have the infinite. Their grab range is horrible and they slide alot when their shield is hit, making it difficult to SET UP the grab.

They are also light (okay, so they are the 14th lightest character, but they are still pretty light), sure they get the infinite off, then you just come in and kill them at 80%.

 

[choknater]

it isn't THAT hard

Yes it is fool