"Let me out!!!" Yoshis Shield Conundrum

[auroreon]

I've been analysing my matches and it has occured to me that I NEVER use Yoshi's shield. For a while I wondered why, then I tryed implementing it into my game and soon remembered why...
Now, I don't like the word "useless", I like to think that every move a character has is helpfull at least some of the time... but I cannot for the life of me use Yoshi's egg shield.

It isn't a shield. Shield implies that its funtion is to protect Yoshi from harm, I prefer the term 'Cage'. A device designed by Sakurai to capture and tame the beast that is Yoshi. Every time I attempt to utilize the cage for any purpose I find it just comes back and bites me in the tail. I try to use it to shield grab, but firstly when someone attacks the cage it slides back so far that Im now out of range for the grab, then, when I am actually in a position to punish with a shield grab... the REDICULESS ammount of lag there is on both the breakout of shield animation AND the standing grab animation just gets me hit.

Now, the reason I call it a 'cage' is very simple. It TRAPS Yoshi in... I hounestly cannot see any option out of the cage. Sure it can't be poked but... He can't jump or Up B out of it. Theres too much lag to grab out of it. Simply bringing the shield down gets you hit cos of the **** breakout lag. Then to top it all off, Yoshi probably has the worst roll in the whole game... he is so vunerable its rediculess not to mention its slow as hell and barely covers any distance.

So my question to all Yoshis is... when (if ever) do you use the cage? What uses have you found for it and how should it be used properly.
And if you don't use the cage, what do you use as a replacement? Personally I spotdodge... probably far too much actually, but at least theres less lag on it than the cage.
If I can get a lot of good advice about using the shield properly I could even turn this thread into a guide on how to use it, I think Yoshi's cage is a difficult problem to overcome and some guidance might be usefull for those wishing to play him.

 

[DKKountry]

Personally I use a short-hop air-dodge a lot in place of a shield roll. I still shield sometimes, but I probably do it less with Yoshi than I do with other characters.

 

[Shiri]

I'll come back with my response. The shield is a tough nut to crack in this game.

 

[nicalobe]

I love Yoshi's shield. First, as you said, when you get hit you slide back far. This is great, it keeps your opponent off of you and gives you plenty of options to counter attack him. If you are a smart player, the slight lag time of getting out of the shield won't get you punished. Also, what isn't to love about the never diminishing shield? It really helps with pokes, and is a life saver against the nado. Finally, as you've already said, there is the spot dodge. Block an attack, let the shield slide you away from the opponent, if they give chase, spot dodge and punish. If they don't give chase, then you can release the shield and go on your merry way.

 

[Elefterios]

I use his shield against mk's tornado, and marth's sword dance. What I try to do is shield most of the attack and dodge and downsmash as soon as it's about to end.

 

[auroreon]

I love Yoshi's shield. First, as you said, when you get hit you slide back far. This is great, it keeps your opponent off of you and gives you plenty of options to counter attack him.

The slide can occasionally be usefull, but most of the time the shield doesn't slide far enough to get you a safe distance from the opponant and it means that you are unable to punish them for attacking ur shield as you not only have the distance you slided to cover but you almost have to deal with the breakout lag.

If you are a smart player, the slight lag time of getting out of the shield won't get you punished.

If a player is pressuring your shield and THEY are a smart player, there is no way to break out without being punished as a smart player isn't going to be using moves with enough lag to give you time to escape.

Also, what isn't to love about the never diminishing shield? It really helps with pokes, and is a life saver against the nado.

Your deffinalty right about the tornado, its one of the rare situations where the cage is a huge bonus and another reason IMO why Yoshi does well against MK.
Not getting poked is the one great thing about the cage, but I don't think its worth the restrictions it has.

Finally, as you've already said, there is the spot dodge. Block an attack, let the shield slide you away from the opponent, if they give chase, spot dodge and punish. If they don't give chase, then you can release the shield and go on your merry way.

If you've just blocked an attack, surely it would have just been easier to have spotdodged the attack that you would have blocked and punished? Although I can see situations where what you described could be a better option maybe.

I use his shield against mk's tornado, and marth's sword dance. What I try to do is shield most of the attack and dodge and downsmash as soon as it's about to end.


EDIT: but his shield truly sucks. His shield is keeping him from being a higher tier character.

Yea, the tornado and sword dance are great to use the shield against, as well as other moves that go on for a while. Isn't there lag between being in shield and dodging?



Thanks for all the advice here guys, good stuff =)

 

[Elefterios]

Yea, the tornado and sword dance are great to use the shield against, as well as other moves that go on for a while. Isn't there lag between being in shield and dodging?

if you're asking if you can get hit in between your shield and spot dodge, you can't.

 

[Elefterios]

Shielding near the edge is good against people who are not used to fighting yoshi's. What they'll usually do is attack your shield, pushing you off the edge and grabbing it. That puts in a relatively safe position where you can egg camp and rack some damage up.

What a smart player would do in this situation is just wait. Wait till you try rolling out (which can only be away from the edge), spot dodge, getting out of your shield (w/ shield lag), and even shieldgrabbing. Your opponent can punish everything without even moving. There really isn't much yoshi can do in this situation, you can try dodging twice in a row maybe dodging once and shield. But chances are, you will still get hit.

 

[Shiri]

You actually can get hit between the shield and the spotdodge.

I believe there are two (?) frames of startup before the dodge invulnerability steps in. This applies to both regular spotdodges and spotdodges out of shield.

 

[Elefterios]

You actually can get hit between the shield and the spotdodge.

I believe there are two (?) frames of startup before the dodge invulnerability steps in. This applies to both regular spotdodges and spotdodges out of shield.

Oh i didn't know that. 2 frames vulnerability isn't going to stop me from doing it though.

 

[Dyz69]

i think most of my dodges are in the air...i use the *egg Cage* aggaints constant hits
you know like Kirby´s Dash attack, Marths blade dance, Pikachus Seizure or Dsmash
MK Tornado, but ialso use it for strong people like Dk, Ike, and Ganon when ever they Fsmash me
i shield when it hits i roll back, the thing about Yoshi´s Shield is that the stronger the blow is
the more *push back* you get combine this with a retreating Roll and your back into a safe spot
just be careful not to use it for a while its also good for a power shield aggaints projectiles if you
can time it nicely you power shield it nicely sure you could have block most of them with a Nair
but reacting faster with R, just sounds easy to me

other than that i dont really use it, i dont Roll that often neither and like i said my entire game is in the air, so my dodges are done there, im mostly on the ground too, but i end up spot dodging for that
i must say tough the Egg Cage has saved me many times and has not broken on me when i tought it
would instead of riskingly trying to spot dodge it, i use my shield especialy at high %
those are my uses hope this helped ^_^

 

[MyCurse4Life]

Is yoshi the only one with a different sheild? Who knew an egg shell can be so rough....