Legality For Miis

Ronand

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
1
I’m honestly hoping they will be tournament viable, but judging by there trailers and reveal at E3 I don’t think they will. Brawler has conflicting Up-B’s and Gunner has conflicting Neutral-B’s, so maybe just for them they’re showing off custom moves but I don’t want them to be customizable from the start and have a play style for 1111 that doesn’t work. We also have no idea if height comes into play speed wise, so I’m crossing my fingers it doesn’t. I actually feel like the Miis could be viable fighters if correctly utilized by Sakurai, so I’m hoping that they’re going to be used in tournaments. I’m especially hoping that because it looks like Sakurai is paying attention to competitive play but you never know.
 

DNeon

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 24, 2015
Messages
986
Location
Brisbane, Australia
NNID
D_Neon_Lamp
Given the statement that they really want to see if they can get them online I think there's a good chance they're going to focus more on balancing the miis. I think that there's no way Sakurai compromises on having the custom specials part of that since it's core to their design.

Overall the Smash community has demonstrated that they do put some respect on the 'default' methods of play so if Miis are made legal online and easy for TOs to enable then the pressure is on to have them legal.
 

osby

Smash Legend
Joined
Apr 25, 2018
Messages
17,073
I'd like to see them in tournaments but it would require competitive crowd to go out of their comfort zone so it might be too much to ask.
 

supersaiyanmikito

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 26, 2009
Messages
30
Location
Gresham, OR
I've always felt like there was such a simple solution regarding Miis. Make the game come with 3 default Miis you can't delete or edit. The 3 default Miis would use the same Miis as their artwork, have average size and weight, and would all use the 1111 set. Aside from giving people versions that could always be legal for competitive, it would help the normal game as well. The game doesn't have any Miis normally and they don't show on the select screen until you make one. This would make them always there by default so you could easily just select one to do Classic or All-Star without the hassle of making one if you have no interest. Having stock Miis would also allow them to be usable online.
 

Manonymous

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 2, 2018
Messages
299
Location
France
I'd like to see them in tournaments but it would require competitive crowd to go out of their comfort zone so it might be too much to ask.
Yeah, but the community don't want Mii playable I think. Even with weight changed, they'll still say :"Meh, they have custom moveset they're banned lol".

I mean, I don't hate competitive (Hell, I love watching proplayers fighting in tournaments) but they have to admit they're not really tolerant regarding of stages and Miis.
 

solitonmedic

Potassium, potassium
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
540
Location
The Time Gate
NNID
Dantel
Mii physique are now one standard size now, custom moves for every other fighter are removed (for Spirits) except for the Miis.

I don't see why should they continue to be banned though.
 

dakotaisgreat

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 9, 2015
Messages
161
Location
New York
NNID
MegaSkarner XLR
The good thing is it looks like all of the miis have been buffed enough so that even if you have to go with 1111, which is going to be fine almost everywhere anyways since there's only one size, the characters will be good enough to allow you to still compete somewhat seriously.
 

Guybrush20X6

Smash Legend
Premium
Joined
May 22, 2012
Messages
15,298
NNID
Guybrush20X6
3DS FC
4253-3477-4804
Switch FC
SW-2140-7758-3904
The only thing getting in the way of Legality I can see is how many slots the game has for Mii fighters given all the combos needed to cover all possible combos.

Unless I've done the math wrong, that's 768 different combos.
 

Erimir

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2001
Messages
1,732
Location
DC
3DS FC
3823-8583-9137
There are three variants for four special moves for the three types of Miis.

That's 3x3x3x3 = 81 possible move combinations for each type, so 243 Miis necessary to cover them all. I think you calculated using four variants for each special.

It's likely, however, that one or two moves for each Mii (at least) will be generally regarded as worthless or just clearly worse than a different move.

That could cut down the number needed by half, or more. And that's assuming that people really want every variation and that it's too time consuming to let players create their Miis before the match/tournament if needed.
 

dakotaisgreat

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 9, 2015
Messages
161
Location
New York
NNID
MegaSkarner XLR
Is it really a huge issue if you just have the Mii player make the Mii right there when they have to play? With base miis already on every system, and without having to exit the game, or worry about height/weight, it should take less than a minute to go from the Smash character selection screen to make a Mii and back. Considering how few mii players there are to begin with, I really can't see this being an issue at almost any tournament, maybe a super major or something where time is extremely strict
but I'll never play at one of those anyways so eh
 

Erimir

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2001
Messages
1,732
Location
DC
3DS FC
3823-8583-9137
Unless Miis become as dominant as Meta Knight was in Brawl, the amount of time required for customization shouldn't be too much of a problem in most tournaments. And honestly, I doubt there are more than 20 setups per Mii that are really required except for some oddball players, so having them preloaded is probably very doable (or even, gasp, you could just accumulate the setups that actually get used). The reason they had to settle on eight per character in Smash 4 was that non-Mii characters only had that many custom character slots. It's probably the case that there's at least one move per Mii that is so clearly optimal that they'll almost always want that one (I don't want to rule out some match-up dependent reasons to pick a different one, or even just for the purpose of mixing things up so the opponent is less familiar).

Another reason customs were such a pain in Smash 4 was the process of unlocking custom moves, which is not an issue for Miis.

But if they were that dominant, it probably would only be because of customization (since I doubt 1111 is the optimal setup for them), so...
 

SiO2

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 23, 2015
Messages
100
Location
Arizona, USA
NNID
Sprocket
Default all 1s gunner is busted, I don't think we're getting any moveset customization in tourneys.
How so? Mii Gunner in general is very strong but not invincible. I'm not sure, based on early impressions, that I would even rank her high tier. Maybe mid-high.
 

qwetroop

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 27, 2013
Messages
6
Location
Farmington Hills, Michigan
Switch FC
4457-0955-2788
How so? Mii Gunner in general is very strong but not invincible. I'm not sure, based on early impressions, that I would even rank her high tier. Maybe mid-high.
Smash moves have bonkers hitboxes, 1 side and up b are both king, 2 and 3 for those are jank, and 1 neutral+down are maybe mediocre, but not every tool needs to be super useful especially when your f-smash covers nearly half of most stages with invisible hitboxes at it's tip. I think 1111 is plenty strong and all of the BS surrounding customs can just be thrown out the window and those who want to main miis should be fine with how strong they are by default, I feel like the level of bustedness will just increase as people figure out even more setups with the alternate special moves. Even a few moments of setup time makes a huge difference when you're at a tourney with 25 setups and 75 players and a time you have to be packing it all up by. Given however that online allows full custom, who knows what the result will actually end up being. All I know is my GSP is soaring with gunner, and that Ray Mk III costume from custom robo satisfies so much in me.
 

SiO2

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 23, 2015
Messages
100
Location
Arizona, USA
NNID
Sprocket
Smash moves have bonkers hitboxes, 1 side and up b are both king, 2 and 3 for those are jank, and 1 neutral+down are maybe mediocre, but not every tool needs to be super useful especially when your f-smash covers nearly half of most stages with invisible hitboxes at it's tip. I think 1111 is plenty strong and all of the BS surrounding customs can just be thrown out the window and those who want to main miis should be fine with how strong they are by default, I feel like the level of bustedness will just increase as people figure out even more setups with the alternate special moves. Even a few moments of setup time makes a huge difference when you're at a tourney with 25 setups and 75 players and a time you have to be packing it all up by. Given however that online allows full custom, who knows what the result will actually end up being. All I know is my GSP is soaring with gunner, and that Ray Mk III costume from custom robo satisfies so much in me.
I'd wager a large part of it is that most players are not yet familiar with Gunner, since it was basically non existent during Smash 4.

Besides, I'm pretty sure that a few characters have equally nutty hitboxes to challenge Fsmash. It is very strong, but is easily challenged with many projectiles.
 
Top Bottom