Kirby is underrated

[ShineHazZaRd]

Kirby has received some significant buffs since the Sm4sh's release. He has powerful combos even at extremely high percents, good pokes in his dtilt (which has an extremely high chance of tripping), and has decent frame data. I think that Kirby has really high potential if a lot of time is put into the character. What do you guys think?

 

[TurboLink]

Ha! Kirby is not great in the neutral.

 

[Wintermelon43]

He's great in the neutral.

...k then

 

[ShineHazZaRd]

Ha! Kirby is not great in the neutral.

I don't main Kirby, lol. A friend told me that he has a lot of good approach options and I just took his word for it.

 

[MrMFC]

You say he's underrated, I say he's overrated. What potential are you talking about btw? Most Kirby mains agree that there isn't much potential. Kirby is basic and slow, not complicated and fast.

 

[TurboLink]

I don't main Kirby, lol. A friend told me that he has a lot of good approach options and I just took his word for it.

Seriously?! What the hell?! -.-

 

[Wintermelon43]

I don't main Kirby, lol. A friend told me that he has a lot of good approach options and I just took his word for it.

Your friend must have never played aganist a good player...

 

[Dessa]

I'd say he's close to properly rated. His neutral game is a challenge against foes with good zoning tools, and his only saving graces in these fights are his small size and his inhale, neither of which make up for a lack of range or speed.

He's got about at many good as bad matchups vs. The high tiers, but his bad matchups are pretty dang tough indeed. My hope springs eternal for someone to shock me and take EVO or something with Kirby, but it's not at all likely.

 

[Shadow Keebey]

I'd say he's close to properly rated. His neutral game is a challenge against foes with good zoning tools, and his only saving graces in these fights are his small size and his inhale, neither of which make up for a lack of range or speed.

He's got about at many good as bad matchups vs. The high tiers, but his bad matchups are pretty dang tough indeed. My hope springs eternal for someone to shock me and take EVO or something with Kirby, but it's not at all likely.

In an ideal world, a Kirby would win it. But, failing that, what would the lowest place you'd be willing to see a Kirby? I'd say top 32. It would surprise a lot of people.

 

[Altair357]

NO way I've never seen this discussion before!!!

> Le depressed bandwagoning Kirby mains who think their character is the worst in the game

vs.

> Le optimistic bandwagoners who think Kirby is sleeper

It all just looks the same now.

 

[Dessa]

In an ideal world, a Kirby would win it. But, failing that, what would the lowest place you'd be willing to see a Kirby? I'd say top 32. It would surprise a lot of people.

The lowest place? Yeah, top 32, I guess, but I think Mike Kirby has a fair-but-less-than-likely chance at top 16 and an unlikely chance at top 8. Top 4 and better would be a real surprise and treat.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Kirby make top 32. I would be surprised to see Mike Kirby fail at that, but more surprised to see him at a big contest to begin with, because he doesn't often seem to make it out to them.

I say this in part because the man has got the skills to push Kirby beyond Kirby's normal bounds (Mike Kirby: The Great Pink Hope!)

NO way I've never seen this discussion before!!!

> Le depressed bandwagoning Kirby mains who think their character is the worst in the game

vs.

> Le optimistic bandwagoners who think Kirby is sleeper

It all just looks the same now.

You forgot about "Le neutral main who thinks Kirby is about where he should be."

 

[Noey]

The lowest place? Yeah, top 32, I guess, but I think Mike Kirby has a fair-but-less-than-likely chance at top 16 and an unlikely chance at top 8. Top 4 and better would be a real surprise and treat.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Kirby make top 32. I would be surprised to see Mike Kirby fail at that, but more surprised to see him at a big contest to begin with, because he doesn't often seem to make it out to them.

I say this in part because the man has got the skills to push Kirby beyond Kirby's normal bounds (Mike Kirby: The Great Pink Hope!)



You forgot about "Le neutral main who thinks Kirby is about where he should be."

YASSSS. This guy knows what's up!

 

[Mega-Spider]

Kirby's the definition of a hot and cold character. When Kirby excels, he really excels. His damage output and fantastic combo game allow Kirby to apply serious pressure, and against heavyweight characters, Kirby can keep them trapped for some time. However, Kirby's lack of approach options really do make it difficult for that to happen sometimes. Sure, his recovery's great, but it's slow and Kirby can be easily edgeguarded if not applied properly. Kirby really benefits from platform stages, but on stages like FD, his faults really do come out in full force. Overall, a direct mid-tier character if you ask me, or at the very least, has mid-tier properties.
BTW, I don't like the Debbie Downy attitude of this forum. It just feels... uninviting sometimes because of the amount of negativity. I want Kirby to be represented too, I main him after all, but can we at least balance the negativity with the optimism? That would be great.

 

[KenMeister]

I think Kirby's right about where he should be on the tier list. He's certainly got stuff that helps him win MUs once he's got momentum rolling, but stuff that keeps him from going "Oh my god, he DEFINITELY wins the MU because of .... traits!" like his underwhelming air speed and pitiful frame data on aerials kinda keep him....fairly too honest. Just about everyone above him has made impressions in regionals/majors one way or another, yet Kirby hasn't really gotten around to doing that. While I partially blame that on his small playerbase (as well as Mike not really going to majors), Kirby's admittingly too basic of a character (with a few interesting gimmicks/traits here and there) to really see him moving further than he is now. At least he can't go down any further....right? *hopes and prays*

 

[SCOAKS5]

The reason Kirby is where he is on the tier list, and why so many people disagree with his placement is because Kirby is a counter pick character. Think about it like this: you watch Kirby play against Fox, Shiek, Bowser, or Diddy Kong, you think to yourself "dang this is a pretty underrated character." But watch him play against Cloud, Luigi, Rosalina, or Sonic, you think "what a low tier character." I think what's going on here is people confusing potential in the tier list. Tier lists are based off of what characters can excel the best at a top level on their own. Unfortunately, Kirby is not one of those characters. A tier list will tell you how good a character is while being solo maimed of you will. Yes, I believe that Kirby is a great character with an extended combo game, and great off stage work, that being in both edge guarding and recovery, but solo maiming him is very difficult. Do I believe that a Kirby will soon make top 16 or even top 8 of a major tournament? Of course. But in order for that to happen, it would be a player who mains both Kirby and another character.

If you are confused and/or not convinced, think about this hypothetical example. Let's say all the sudden, somebody discovers that Jigglypuff has a 100% guaranteed Zero-to-Death on only Mario and Diddy Kong. Jigglypuff will probably barely move up on the tier list, staying a bottom tier character, but she will still see tournament usage as a counter pick to Mario and Diddy. People may think she's underrated because she can take down these top tiers, but as a solo main, she'll still get bodied by every other character.

 

[Mega-Spider]

The reason Kirby is where he is on the tier list, and why so many people disagree with his placement is because Kirby is a counter pick character. Think about it like this: you watch Kirby play against Fox, Shiek, Bowser, or Diddy Kong, you think to yourself "dang this is a pretty underrated character." But watch him play against Cloud, Luigi, Rosalina, or Sonic, you think "what a low tier character." I think what's going on here is people confusing potential in the tier list. Tier lists are based off of what characters can excel the best at a top level on their own. Unfortunately, Kirby is not one of those characters. A tier list will tell you how good a character is while being solo maimed of you will. Yes, I believe that Kirby is a great character with an extended combo game, and great off stage work, that being in both edge guarding and recovery, but solo maiming him is very difficult. Do I believe that a Kirby will soon make top 16 or even top 8 of a major tournament? Of course. But in order for that to happen, it would be a player who mains both Kirby and another character.

If you are confused and/or not convinced, think about this hypothetical example. Let's say all the sudden, somebody discovers that Jigglypuff has a 100% guaranteed Zero-to-Death on only Mario and Diddy Kong. Jigglypuff will probably barely move up on the tier list, staying a bottom tier character, but she will still see tournament usage as a counter pick to Mario and Diddy. People may think she's underrated because she can take down these top tiers, but as a solo main, she'll still get bodied by every other character.

I agree with you on Kirby needing to have a co-main. Yes, Kirby has great qualities to him, but he has just as many flaws with him, hence why I say he's a direct mid-tier character. Personally, I go for since he helps Kirby out on MUs like Cloud, Luigi, Rosalina, and Sonic, whereas Kirby can help Megs with characters like Fox and Sheik. I find it to be a very nice team, and both compliment each other really well.

 

[SCOAKS5]

I agree with you on Kirby needing to have a co-main. Yes, Kirby has great qualities to him, but he has just as many flaws with him, hence why I say he's a direct mid-tier character. Personally, I go for since he helps Kirby out on MUs like Cloud, Luigi, Rosalina, and Sonic, whereas Kirby can help Megs with characters like Fox and Sheik. I find it to be a very nice team, and both compliment each other really well.

That could work but you'll struggle a little with the Mario match up. Other than that I think you're good.

 

[Mega-Spider]

That could work but you'll struggle a little with the Mario match up. Other than that I think you're good.

Mario's the outlier. I feel that Kirby does better against him than Megs does, but it still isn't easy. Keep in mind that while Sheik is easier for Kirby compared to Megs, she's still a tough MU. Anyone who can get Luigi off Kirby's butt is a good partner in my book.

 

[Osumnis]

How would a Sheik secondary pairing work out for Kirby? I feel like it covers the least enjoyable match up for me, Sonic. Plus if I ever feel like I need a secondary for Cloud/Rosa I could use Sheik as well.

 

[Mega-Spider]

How would a Sheik secondary pairing work out for Kirby? I feel like it covers the least enjoyable match up for me, Sonic. Plus if I ever feel like I need a secondary for Cloud/Rosa I could use Sheik as well.

If you're thinking of Sheik, then I'd suggest playing her full time. I don't think there's any MUs Kirby helps Sheik with. I know for a fact that having Sheik being paired up with Kirby makes MUs like Sonic, Luigi, and Rosalina much easier.

 

[Crosstails20]

I beleve if you give the time to get to know him he can be pretty good.

 

[PMT1516]

I think Kirby as a character in this game is the worst tools wise