Issues with Fox, Falco, and Sheik.

[SirhcEz]

I am a new Melee player, and I main Marth.

I prefer to play Marth offensively, and find it works out pretty well except for when I go against Fox, Falco, and Shiek.
I have to play purely defensively, or I just get knocked about.

What are some good guide to these matchups, and how can I play offensively vs them?

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

Against Fox and Falco, you can just chain grab them, and use guaranteed setups. Against Sheik, just crouch cancel anytime you can (at low%) and punish. If you want more specific info, I'll be glad to help.

 

[Link24a]

Sheik is RIP for a new player so yeah. Shield grab her dash attack and down tilt her dash grab

Chain grab fox and Falco. Practice vs a level 1 CPU of either on fd. A lot

I could tell you a lot more but you'd need more specific questions

 

[Flippy Flippersen]

Don't practice chaingrabs on cpus. You have to react to di and no matter what cpu you pick they will always di the same way every time. (unless you have 20xx I guess)

 

[Link24a]

Don't practice chaingrabs on cpus. You have to react to di and no matter what cpu you pick they will always di the same way every time. (unless you have 20xx I guess)

It still works alright because they always di back, the hardest place to reach for Marth (have to buffer back to get grabs and up tilts)

If you have a human to play definitely use that person instead, though

 

[PlamZ]

Don't practice chaingrabs on cpus. You have to react to di and no matter what cpu you pick they will always di the same way every time. (unless you have 20xx I guess)

Humm that's stupid.

Always practice it against them. Even though you won't get the intuitivity, you'll get the speed required to achieve the perfect pivot and the turnaround u-tilt.

If you don't have the technical requirements down, it is totally useless to try it on people.

 

[Flippy Flippersen]

Humm that's stupid.

Always practice it against them. Even though you won't get the intuitivity, you'll get the speed required to achieve the perfect pivot and the turnaround u-tilt.

If you don't have the technical requirements down, it is totally useless to try it on people.

From my understanding if you practice your movement these techniques just come on their own pivots grabs are a huge part of marth, turn around uptilt is tbh not even close to hard. The only thing chaingrabbing cpus does for you is get you in a rythm for your chaingrab which any opponent with di won't have. Again it's prolly fine on 20xx cause of random di but chaingrabbing cpus doesn't really do that much for you.

 

[FE_Hector]

Figure out what you're doing is my suggestion. Also, you've GOTTA remember that CPUs fight way differently from how people do. Here's what I can generally do, though.

Fox: Dash up to him and use your dash attack. Dash attack + fsmash + dash attack + fsmash until he's at the edge, then use your best edge guard option if you don't have the opportunity to dair KO him.

Falco: I typically short hop fair him until he starts getting hit by it enough that I can start comboing it, usually with a quick landing + nair to push him back, followed by whatever I've gotta do.

Sheik: ...You see so little of a Sheik AI, but a good bet is to get in a position where you KNOW they'll attack, and Counter. Once they do that, you've got a pretty good chance to combo them.

Against humans, though... you'll have to figure out what works. Just remember not to fsmash and Counter spam. It makes you super predictable. Opt for more tilts and clever short hop aerials.

 

[BluQTips]

Sheik is RIP for a new player so yeah. Shield grab her dash attack and down tilt her dash grab

Chain grab fox and Falco. Practice vs a level 1 CPU of either on fd. A lot

I could tell you a lot more but you'd need more specific questions

What are some tips to maintain neutral and stop my ass from being ripped apart against fox? There's this one fox player who's levels beyond me. I play him at weekly tournaments and I honestly feel half the time is me running away from his assault, and the other half is me getting hit.

He's faster than me and when I try dash dancing he covers all my options with a well spaced nair. I try shield-grabbing but he just shines me as soon as my shield drops. I try some dtilts and uptilts though he crouch cancels the one he gets hit by and gets right back on me. How should I playing so that I can space him away?

Also, what do I do against falco lasers? Jumping over usually ends up with a bair to the face, and shielding really clogs up my movement options.

 

[FE_Hector]

Against Falco lasers, short hop over them if he doesn't alternate spacing, dash under then if he places them high, and I'd suggest full hopping + fair/bair/nair/dair depending on the situation. Marth has amazing reach with his sword, so you've gotta use that to your advantage. If you dash in, try wavedashing to a stop and dtilting if you think he'll avoid the dash attack.

If you could get a video of you against that Fox so we could see what you're doing wrong, that'd be great. Just remember you're fighting a fast character with strong punishes and great options. Use any mistakes he makes against him and don't fear the air. Hold on to that second jump and use whatever tactics you have to.

 

[Link24a]

What are some tips to maintain neutral and stop my *** from being ripped apart against fox? There's this one fox player who's levels beyond me. I play him at weekly tournaments and I honestly feel half the time is me running away from his assault, and the other half is me getting hit.

He's faster than me and when I try dash dancing he covers all my options with a well spaced nair. I try shield-grabbing but he just shines me as soon as my shield drops. I try some dtilts and uptilts though he crouch cancels the one he gets hit by and gets right back on me. How should I playing so that I can space him away?

Also, what do I do against falco lasers? Jumping over usually ends up with a bair to the face, and shielding really clogs up my movement options.

i have the same exact issues so yeah