Is is bad to roll a lot?

[LiamMail]

I find myself always rolling. Both away from opponent and behind opponent
Is rolling bad? Because I don't see as much rolling in tournaments.
Thanks!

 

[Zatchiel]

I think excessive rolling is a great option whenever I'm looking to get ****ed up.

 

[CORY]

it's bad to [anything] a lot. if you're doing something so much that it's predictable, it's now a bad idea.

 

[LiamMail]

it's bad to [anything] a lot. if you're doing something so much that it's predictable, it's now a bad idea.

well not like rolling after rolling

 

[CORY]

you don't need to use roll as your only movement method for it to be used too much.

do you roll when someone runs up and hits your shield? especially the same way (always behind the attacker, always to the center stage, etc...)? that's predictable, even if it's ostensibly safe.

do you always roll back after you decide that your shield pressure is no longer safe or you want to try and reset the situation? same thing: it becomes predictable.

insert almost any action into those situations, and it's the same deal. if you always spot dodge, it becomes predictable. that's why i phrased my original answer the way i did. rolling, in and of itself is not outright bad. rolling, in a predictable way, constantly, is bad. [anything] in a consistent manner becomes predictable, and thus, bad.

 

[LiamMail]

you don't need to use roll as your only movement method for it to be used too much.

do you roll when someone runs up and hits your shield? especially the same way (always behind the attacker, always to the center stage, etc...)? that's predictable, even if it's ostensibly safe.

do you always roll back after you decide that your shield pressure is no longer safe or you want to try and reset the situation? same thing: it becomes predictable.

insert almost any action into those situations, and it's the same deal. if you always spot dodge, it becomes predictable. that's why i phrased my original answer the way i did. rolling, in and of itself is not outright bad. rolling, in a predictable way, constantly, is bad. [anything] in a consistent manner becomes predictable, and thus, bad.

thanks,
So I should do something like jumping into an attack?

 

[Johnknight1]

If it becomes predictable and it's not challenging to counter it, it's bad.

If your rolls are predictable, you get hit often.

If you get hit often for doing something over and over again, it's time to mix things up.

 

[Japsy]

Just play a Ganondorf, they'll teach you why rolling a lot is bad
Or play Samus in Melee and you'll learn how not to roll all the time cuz her roll in that game sucks

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

I find myself always rolling. Both away from opponent and behind opponent
Is rolling bad? Because I don't see as much rolling in tournaments.
Thanks!

I think excessive rolling is a great option whenever I'm looking to get ****ed up.

This. Lol.
Rolling whenever you see fit, is a very bad habit to have. You should use it very sparingly. Like, if you are being pressured or if fox tries to up smash you, stuff sorta like that. A lot of times, if you roll and try to punish a move, you can't punish, because roll has to much lag for that. It's like a emergency escape plan. It'll save you, if used correctly, but don't expect much else. On and remember how I said it has lag? If you get read, or predictable with those rolls, it is very easy for even low level players to hit you after you roll, and since you can do nothing for a little bit of time after rolling, they can make you eat **** for it. You should learn to dance dance, fox trout, wave dash, and all the other movement options.

You should probably say a few of the situations, where you personally decide, that a roll is good.

 

[Morian]

Back in my childhood days I don't know it how to space properly so I only find myself rolling a lot. That changes when I finally learned movement ATs such as Wavedash.

Yeah, spammings rolls is bad, easily punishable. Helps you only the first time again people with no experiece.

 

[TreK]

I find that M2K rolls a lot compared to me
I also find that M2K wins a lot compared to me

so... no ?
too much of anything is bad but don't be me, rolls are still a wonderful tool and you should use and abuse them.

 

[Morian]

I find that M2K rolls a lot compared to me
I also find that M2K wins a lot compared to me

so... no ?
too much of anything is bad but don't be me, rolls are still a wonderful tool and you should use and abuse them.

If you play as G&W, no

 

[ShadowGanon]

Short answer: Yes

/thread

 

[CORY]

thanks,
So I should do something like jumping into an attack?

it depends on the situation. who do you main? some characters have really solid oos options that you can mix up with, others just have to play the "sit in shield and be paaaaaaaaaaaatient" game.

 

[krazyzyko]

it's bad to [anything] a lot. if you're doing something so much that it's predictable, it's now a bad idea.

Powersheild all you want though.

 

[CORY]

... you know... that might be the one exception. unless they get REALLY meta on you and are all "yeah, this guy, he's gonna powershield. delay by 3 frames!"

but if you've gotten to that point, you're pretty much playing 20xx

 

[Vashimus]

I find that M2K rolls a lot compared to me
I also find that M2K wins a lot compared to me.

Because M2K understands that there are no real rules in Smash (or any fighter), and that your abilities are only hampered by your imagination. Once you start to realize that, then you start to get somewhere and fast. All of a sudden all the supposedly "bad" stuff becomes available, and you can focus on blending those moves in your playstyle to work for you rather than hurt you.

Yes, rolling is punishable, but if I use it in this situation, his recovery will be too long and he won't be able to respond with a punish.

If I do a wake-up super, yeah it'll look stupid, but it has start-up invincibility, and he's not blocking it when he's busy trying to set up a meaty.

It's another one of those things that ups your game considerably once that knowledge builds.

 

[Raijinken]

If you're playing against someone bad at reading moves and learning your habits, by all means, roll as much as suits you.

But if your opponent can predict you, you'll get caught, especially if they have an easy both-sides attack like Marth and Roy (the bane of so many of my brother and I's 1v1s back in Melee). And if you keep getting caught, predict their prediction and punish their read.

 

[Altanic]

Rolling is bad if you do it too much. I rolled way to much whenever I first started competitively and I lost matches because of the bad situations it would put me in and how predictable and easy to chase it was.. Learning to use wavedashes more than rolls helped me a lot. It opens up more options, is less predictable (but still can be if you dash the same direction everytime), and you can act out of it much sooner than if you were to roll.

So my recommendation would be to practice using wavedashes more to replace some of those rolls. I would just train by playing matches and telling myself to not roll, and just wavedash instead for the whole match. Doing that also helps you understand how to wavedash effectively and how to use them when in battle. Wavelanding helps too

Anyways, I hope this helps you out. Good luck!

 

[Paradoxium]

Here is my view on this roll thing

When you roll you want to always be actively thinking about it, and you never want to automatically roll. I play on wifi where you reaction is nullified and you have to usually rely on reads, so I usually win by finding patterns and abusing them. I cant tell you how many people have really punishable roll patterns.

For example, a lot of people shffl an attack, then immediately roll backwards. They do this because they know they are vulnerable after a whiffed attack. So at this point I assume that the next time they whiff an attack they will roll backwards. So instead of trying to punish the whiffed attack I position myself to punish the spot where they will roll to. So i'll be in position to punish once there invincibility wears off.

Another example of a bad rolling habit is when people roll backwards every time you shffl into them. so instead of shffling i just empty hop which puts me in position to punish their roll and it unlocks all of my options at the same time.

These are just a few example of why it is usually bad to roll, a lot of people are looking to abuse these habits to get much stronger punishes.

People roll when your positioning makes them uncomfortable, so if your opponent is rolling a lot it means that you are in a spot that is so threatening that they feel they need to get away. So keep that in mind, people only roll when they are uncomfortable, its a way of escaping. So knowing that alone give you the edge, because you know that your opponent is scared and that you can keep pressuring them to do whatever you want.

 

[-Se7en-]

Do what you want in your play style, however try not to get predictable with it.

If you get predictable, the other player will recognize it and they will punish you for it.

Just some advice :

If you want to improve you can jump out of shield, by hitting the jump button when you hold shield.

You know what you are capable of if you can jump right?

Wave dashing.

(Wavedashing = jumping and air dodging into the ground to get a slide, you can do an attack or smash attack out of a slide).

Different characters have different lengths to their wavedash, Luigi's for example can slide a very *far distance in a short amount of time. Maybe a quarter or near half the width of Final Destination.

Abuse the wave dash, it's really good.

 

[Lil Puddin]

I roll a lot online, but it is hardly predictable... Or intentional. If you use it to move, you will wear down your shield and will also allow the opponent to punish you easily.

Offline I barely roll. It's better to stay active. If I move backwards without turning my back to my opponent, then I wavedash backwards. Even as ZELDA of all characters. Rolling just leaves you open, but it can help you get behind an opponent to do a sneak attack.

So I guess just being smart with your rolls is the way to go. You can even play mind games if you switch from rolling a lot to jumping out of your shield. Make them think you are predictable and then prove them wrong. You get a lightning kick! And you get a lightning kick! Everybody gets a lightning kiiiiiiiick!

 

[Captain Zack]

rolling is bad vs smart players.