Ice Climbers aren't very easy to learn...

[Betrayed]

...but my friend's trying to anyways.

I really don't know ANYTHING about IC (including how to play them) so...

We're looking for advice here. Practice this, don't do that, learn how to *whatever*.

And please don't just come in here and say "You guys suck" because WE ALREADY KNOW and that's why this is here... to get better.

Some of these earlier matches will be painful to watch, but they serve the purpose of "Did he improve since then?"

May 17, 2006
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAkFUthfwUg vs Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhamvpjBdAw vs Yoshi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZYF1KeSpAI vs Mario
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFW9EPsA1gI vs Marth

June 8, 2006
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ch-MxlWxoY vs Mario

October 5, 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGPT7CG-mW0 vs Fox
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqYceQXDmMk vs Fox
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzwmNsTHF5o vs Marth

October 9, 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LP5JuIBY04E vs Roy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B5di8PAHYw vs Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TomlyovsntU vs Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHtZttcEgX4 vs Mario

If I mislinked something, point it out (please?). Trying to put together three of these topics at once was a little confusing at times.

 

[Genuine]

Your ICs made too many technical mistakes. The thing that got me the most is IMPROVE YOUR WAVEDASHES. They brought shame to my eyes half the time it seemed as you were triangle jumping. Marth cannot be dair chain grab. Dthrow into blizzard chaingrab doesnt work. You have good mindgames you just need to get a lot better with your technical skill.

Some i can think of are
-get better at WD srsly
-grabbing is not the only thing that makes them good ( ok it is but you shouldnt rely on it)
-make nana short hop when you dair chaingrab
-time your Usmashes better when you Dthrow into Usmash
-more Uairs
-and stop WDing into spot dodge you should shield seeing as you can smash with the free IC is you get grabbed

i prolly missed other things but thats the main things i noticed

 

[Lixivium]

Let me give you some comments as the best Ice Climbers main in St. Louis . I'm going by the most recent videos here.

Your friend must be a Peach or Jigglypuff main because it looks like wavedashing is a real chore for him. You won't do well with IC's unless you can wavedash fluidly. Especially not against Marth, who can space you out with totally unpunishable attacks if you don't move around.

IC's have an awesome shield. Use it. Having twice the hitlag can really screw over a lot of people, especially ones that SHFFL a lot. Yet another reason to get better at wavedashing, so he'd be able to do stuff out of his shield.

He D-air chaingrabbed Fox correctly in the first video but kept screwing it up in the second? Is it the stage? Nothing more to say other than practice practice practice. Or Up-smash out of grabs instead.

 

[Betrayed]

He always says he needs to learn how to wavedash better. Watching Chu and all...

Yeah, he did main Puff and Peach in the past actually. I'll let him read this later so he can practice up and change some things. Thanks guys, we'll toss a few updated videos later in the week I guess.

As for chain-grabbing Fox... I was that Fox, I'm bad I know, but I wanted him to get some experience against spacies. I DI'd up(ish) the first one, and away(ish) the second.

 

[Seymour Buttz]

-and stop WDing into spot dodge you should shield seeing as you can smash with the free IC is you get grabbed

Could you explain that a little more? I have a lot of delay between the wavedash and when the shield pops out so it doesn't really work too well for me.

And how do I control Nana better? Like, sometimes she'll grab when I want her to smash and I don't know why or how...?

 

[Lixivium]

Could you explain that a little more? I have a lot of delay between the wavedash and when the shield pops out so it doesn't really work too well for me.

And how do I control Nana better? Like, sometimes she'll grab when I want her to smash and I don't know why or how...?

He means that after you WD, keep your shield up instead of spotdoding; if you get grabbed, you can punish the opponent. I wouldn't recommend it because your WD is inconsistent, nor do I advocate letting the opponent grab Nana.

 

[Genuine]

He means that after you WD, keep your shield up instead of spotdoding; if you get grabbed, you can punish the opponent. I wouldn't recommend it because your WD is inconsistent, nor do I advocate letting the opponent grab Nana.

Geuss your right, when you WD that close to an opponent I geuss you better have some strategy in mind.

 

[PB&J]

if u want to get better with icys watch chu dat video's and copy what he does

 

[Binx]

if u want to get better with icys watch chu dat video's and copy what he does

Quoted for failure.

The only way to truly get good at this game is to play until you understand why you do certain things, what makes you win and what makes you lose, your style is created based on experience, if you are grab happy odds are you played with some people who fell for a lot of grab set ups ect. Playing with better people makes you better because you need to play like a different person all the time to even confuse them enough to hit them.

Generally though ICs should iceblock less, its really slow and if you expect it, it becomes very easy to punish. ICs should also generally mix up recovery better, wigglling out of stun and airdodging is often better than trying to squall again at close range. ICs generally should smash or grab less and mix them up more. ICs should dash dance more, ICs should roll less than they do.

Chu is easily the best IC in terms of unpredictablity/skill but it's because he is him and he discovered what works, I will be honest that you can learn a lot from watching him play, but more or less I just watch it for spacing, I can SEE his spacing, and what attacks he chooses to use in which situations as well as how often he is successful. That does help a lot. But what you don't see is what makes him so good, and that is his ability to know exactly what you want to do against him and counter it as you do it.

 

[choknater]

Quoted for failure.

I think it's a decent way to start out

 

[PB&J]

thats how i started out when i picked icy's out and then i practiced everything else and i ended up good ,but binx u are right..i was just saying it is a way to start icy practice

 

[Binx]

I didnt mean to sound like a **** lol =D I had a stressful day at work and although it's no excuse I just really want to stress the importance of developing your own style, I agree that watching Chu is a great way to improve but you can't do it to copy him, just to learn simple tricks. I guess I just wanted to say that you can't copy mindgames. Hehe.

Have a good one man, I like your posts.

I think I am slowly becoming one of the more douchey people on the boards, I used to be really respectful until I finally came to the realization that 99% of advice that anyone gives is wrong. And that the simple truth to this particular game can only learned by playing, people cannot tell you how to predict your opponents better and yet everyone insists on trying.

I am at the point where I come here when bored, but the mental aspect of this game is impossible to read about anymore because its the same crap being regurgitated (and it's wrong).

I really need to get some recording equipment and start practicing a lot so I can actually get good and have people listen when I say things haha. I am probably mediocre at best, I am in the top 10 in my state, and 3 of them play Marth and there are 2 peaches and a falcon, they are also just plain better at the game, they have played more, they do play more, and they keep up with new videos to learn to tricks. Although Oregon's metagame isn't very good I think it still beats out quite a few states so while I am relatively proud of my skills I doubt I would make it out of pools at a big event yet. Probably next year though with my Brawl ICs.

 

[PB&J]

don't be so hard on your self..i read alot of ur post and for the most part they are good advice..just keep practicing and you will become better

 

[Betrayed]

A few new matches today, mainly to show fights against other characters. There might be some improvement, which is for anybody that watches to decide. Wavedashing for him is still pretty rough, I'm pretty sure he thinks it's the exact same timing for everybody. Anyways, here we go:

October 9, 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LP5JuIBY04E vs Roy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B5di8PAHYw vs Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TomlyovsntU vs Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHtZttcEgX4 vs Mario

 

[brawlpro]

make him learn how to wobble lol

 

[Betrayed]

Oh right, we tried getting that down but... we don't have the timing quite right. We'll get a vid of attempts to see if we can fix that <<