I want to learn how to get better reads on people.

[atzero]

I used to play melee a lot like 5 years ago. I picked it (being smash for the 3ds and wii u) up again recently and my technical skills are returning quite nicely. Its like riding a bike.

However, I could never get good reads on people. Its a skill I never really developed and now I want to but dont really know where to start.

Everything seems to happen to fast in the match, all I can do is react and attack off the cuff. No strategy besides knowing which moves are useful and not. I attack and defend impulsively because its happening too fast. When Im playing against another player who cant get reads on me, its not a problem. But my friends who are not as technically proficient as me, who CAN read me, can beat me 7 times out of 10.

So a few questions to all of you:
1. Is this a skill I can only develop by playing matches? Is it worth it to study matches and find out how people approach each other? Like man, sheik really likes dash attack.

2. What categories are most important to watch for when Im playing a match?

3. How do I slow the game speed down in my head? For example, I can watch M2K pummel whoever and completely follow his moveset and why he does things. But in game myself? Everything happens 100 mph faster.

4. How important is reading people? Should I even be worrying about this?

5. What are some characters that need good reads to be successful so I can gauge my progress?

Youre all amazing for reading this post. Its good to be back.

Edit: I also tried searching for this topic, so forgive me if its been posted already but I didnt see anything.

 

[Shogger]

Learning to read people is difficult and is unlike all other aspects of fighting games. It's not terribly easy to explain. The best way I can explain how I do it, is that if I know exactly how I could threaten my opponent at any given moment then I can make an educated guess about how he'd react. Easier said than done, but that's what practice is for.

1. Study helps, but focused play is always the best teacher. In particular, playing against the same person over and over really helped me get into my reading game. Once you know how someone will react in a lot of scenarios, you can start playing games with them. Playing a match with someone you don't know and then reading them is kind of like playing a sped-up version of this long "mental arms race" with a constant sparring partner. You figure out what they do, counter it, and then switch it up before they catch on.

2. Spacing, which way they roll, and what they do whenever you come at them.

3. It's just practice. Can't think fast without some of it being reflex.

4. It's important, but you can go far without being too good at it.

5. Slow characters like Ganon and Bowser thrive on reads because there's no way they can land their heavy hitting attacks without good prediction. Learning a slow character will help.

 

[Krynxe]

Watching out for habits is hugely important as well. Noticing how your opponent reacts to what you do, and seeing how consistent that behavior is. Then, when you next set up the situation, being ready to catch and punish them for their behavior. Reads aren't random, most players have reasoning or are convinced that a player will do something and then acts accordingly. This goes offensively and defensively as well - you can notice how your opponent typically follows up or tries to apply pressure and the next time you're in a bad spot, you can read how your opponent will be aggressive and turn it around and make a bad situation into a good one. It's all situation, but the most important thing is capitalizing and being committed. Making a read doesn't mean anything if you don't do anything with it, you have to be confident in yourself and maximize the potential reward of your read without putting yourself in too terrible of a spot if you guess wrong. This comes with practice and character knowledge

 

[Orngeblu]

So a few questions to all of you:
1. Is this a skill I can only develop by playing matches? Is it worth it to study matches and find out how people approach each other? Like man, sheik really likes dash attack.
If you pay close attention to your opponent, you may notice a pattern, or habits that they may have, and react accordingly by punishing them. Like you just mentioned, if that Sheik likes to dash so next time you're in that position where you think he'll dash attack, punish them for it whether it be shielding then punishing, or attacking with a spaced Fair, etc.

For another example, lower level players tend to roll when under pressure. The direction they roll can vary, whether it be behind you or away from you, or they airdodge (or attack) in an attempt to avoid an aerial attack, just to name a few. You can use this information to capitalize on their mistakes.

You could also try baiting your opponent, if you know how to do that. You could try faking any approach like dashing forward then shielding or jumping.

2. What categories are most important to watch for when Im playing a match?

Like I explained above, rolling habits, ledge getup habits, airdodge habits, etc.

4. How important is reading people? Should I even be worrying about this?
Higher level players will be harder to read, as they generally have less habits, and know to mix it up. Do not rely on reads primarily to outplay your opponent, but that doesn't mean you should never utilize it. Sometimes, rarely, you will get a gut instinct that will tell you "this guy is going to make this move, I should counter it with this", after playing the for a while. You may even have habits yourself that your opponent is capitalizing on, in which case you have to adapt on the fly.

Again, DO NOT rely on reads primarily.

5. What are some characters that need good reads to be successful so I can gauge my progress?

I've heard captain falcon is pretty read and/or mix-up reliant. I could be wrong, but you could try that.

The other character I'd suggest, is Greninja. He generally lacks KO potential because his kill moves are easy to avoid. A good read or punish can change that.

In bold/italics. I hope this helps! I didn't answer #3 because I don't quite understand what you mean.

 

[djKun]

Watching out for habits is hugely important as well. Noticing how your opponent reacts to what you do, and seeing how consistent that behavior is.

Pretty much this. Things like:

-Always backroll on wakeup
-While falling from the sky, they always double jump when you approach them.
-When you try to roll dodge them, they roll with you for some reason
-Attack/Punish patterns (Fsmash after every roll)
-Spams projectiles until you get close then they roll to dodge

As Marth, sometimes I just get the feeling that they will roll. So I just stand there as they roll into tipper range and Fsmash. As Captain Falcon, once I figure out your rolling habits, I just chase you down and prop you up with a dash attack for Uair abuse. If they keep double jumping my Uair, the next time I see them fall I'll just feint with a simple short hop fast fall. They will waste their jump, meaning all they can do is counter-air attack, air dodge or eat your air attacks as they fall.

This is something you learn as you play more. On the flipside, watch out the habits you exhibit. The same can be done to you.

 

[atzero]

So if reads arent too important, but are a necessary skill to have, what are the important skills to have?

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

I dunno, by my experience I'd say that reads are pretty important in Smash 4. Not just making them blindly, but forcing them, especially when going for a KO. Back in the demo, it was how I got KOs as Mario most of the time. Force the foe offstage with tilts and quick aerials, and do so repeatedly to limit their options. Once I know that they have to land in one of two spots, I can watch their trajectory to see where they're going to land and either leap out after them for an FAir meteor smash, or charge a Smash Attack where they're about to land and release it as they touch down.

But before reads comes spacing, and that's the harder part. You can get KOs and safe damage simply by knowing your reach better than your opponent does while also knowing their reach. Link, Marth, Lucina, and the Mii Swordfighter are good characters to play if you want to practice spacing, as is a larger-size Mii Brawler (BAir has crazy reach).

Also, in Smash 4 there's sometimes a bit more to spacing than just distance from yourself to your opponent. For example, a larger-size Mii Brawler can slip a Dash Attack right under Ganondorf's jab, sticking your foot in his ribs as his palm strike sails past overhead. Tiny-size Mii Brawlers don't have this advantage, as their small body puts their overly-large head in the way of Ganondorf's jab before the kick can reach him.

 

[Virgman]

Reads are situational, but can also be forced. Limiting their options helps me read people a lot. For instance: If someone is in the air, their options are faaar more limited than when they're on the ground. They can AD, perform a special, simply land, or perform an aerial. Knowing that they only have these four options available, you can guess what they're more likely to do (which is based on their intelligence as a player). So instead of just letting them choose which one they're going to do, force them to do something. An empty full hop often scares people into ADing or performing an aerial, in turn allowing a free attack. In Smash 4 especially, baiting or forcing an AD is super rewarding. That's just one example of a read, but it goes farther once you understand how to do it. Mind games are a big part of competitive play.

 

[Abhi-wan]

I think once you get the fundamentals down its a lot easier to read people. You'll learn what each character is capable of doing and you'll be able to react accordingly.

 

[Mechageo]

When I was learning how to read people I'd watch their character and not my own to determine my options. If they were capable of doing something I'd assume that they would and space my character in a way that would hopefully let me take advantage of what they did while avoiding any unexpected possibilities. Sometimes it's about trying to predict what they do but preparing to spot dodge if they do something else.

 

[Yoji_]

I think the key to any competitive game is to first understand what your opponent is trying to do, and then to counter his plans.
I tend to get tunnel vision when I play and just focus on my character and what I want to do, so I try forcing myself to repeat "What is he trying to do? What is he trying to do?" to make sure I make the right connections.

Did he block my attack into a grab? Realize that's his plan for when you approach, and grab him next time.
Does he always approach with a dash attack? Realize that's his plan for approaching, and shield into grab.

 

[Gawain]

Getting good reads to me is all about:
1. Knowing your opponent's character's options in any given situation
2. Knowing your opponent (or figuring out what they like to do mid-match [downloading])
3. Know your character's options in any given situation
4. And lastly, controlling the "given situation" as best as you can such that you can increase your odds of correctly predicting an opponent's move, and to be in the position to punish it as heavily as possible.

 

[The TaBuu]

Learn to condition your opponent.
This will make your life so much easier and ease the stress of having to read the opponent constantly in order to have the upper hand. Basically, whether you know what is or not, to condition your opponent is to essentially 'train' your opponent to respond to certain actions that you take. As you condition your opponent, you'll be able to develop a stronger punish game and take the upper hand in the match. Now if you have a competent opponent, they will adapt accordingly and begin to act differently to your baits/actions/etc

Here's a nice and simple, yet effective conditioning tactic you can use in your gameplay
Launch your opponent into the air whether it be a throw or an actual attack. From there proceed to chase after your opponent in the air with an attack of your choice or throw out an empty jump. Does your opponent vector/jump upwards? Do they airdodge? Perhaps they challenge your advance with a move of their own. Take note of their reaction and reset the situation (now if you were able to effectively chase them in the air and apply offensive pressure, you may want to just keep doing what you did until they finally adapt and take a defensive route). Once you have realized their preferred method of defensive evasion in the air, punish accordingly.

For example, your opponent is Mario and you're playing Sheik. You realize that the Mario player air-dodges after you used Down Throw on him and was able to evade your Nair/Fair/Uair. So the next time you have the Mario player in a grab, use ...
- Dthrow > Empty Short Hop to bait out the airdodge or wait on the ground > Wait for the airdodge to finish or the opposition to hit the ground > Punish accordingly with your choice move

 

[M00SE]

Make sure to blink your eyes so they don't dry out.

 

[wingedarcher7]

The way I see it, people are predictable. They're going to use certain strategies that work for them and stick to those strategies because it's what they know. Figure out what patterns they go with often and work around them. For example, a friend of mine was playing Little Mac and whenever he was far off on the other side of the stage, he'd dash forward but go for the side special most of the time. At first, it caught me off guard and made it difficult to counteract because I expected a running attack, but I eventually adapted to it, figured out Little Mac's typical range on that move and was able to block it and punish him for it whenever he tried to use it on me again.

Players have a set way that they play, it's your job to figure this out while you play against them and know what your character is capable of to work against it so anything they do ends up getting them into more trouble instead of helping them win against you.

 

[assassin9630]

I used to play melee a lot like 5 years ago. I picked it (being smash for the 3ds and wii u) up again recently and my technical skills are returning quite nicely. Its like riding a bike.

However, I could never get good reads on people. Its a skill I never really developed and now I want to but dont really know where to start.

Everything seems to happen to fast in the match, all I can do is react and attack off the cuff. No strategy besides knowing which moves are useful and not. I attack and defend impulsively because its happening too fast. When Im playing against another player who cant get reads on me, its not a problem. But my friends who are not as technically proficient as me, who CAN read me, can beat me 7 times out of 10.

So a few questions to all of you:
1. Is this a skill I can only develop by playing matches? Is it worth it to study matches and find out how people approach each other? Like man, sheik really likes dash attack.

2. What categories are most important to watch for when Im playing a match?

3. How do I slow the game speed down in my head? For example, I can watch M2K pummel whoever and completely follow his moveset and why he does things. But in game myself? Everything happens 100 mph faster.

4. How important is reading people? Should I even be worrying about this?

5. What are some characters that need good reads to be successful so I can gauge my progress?

Youre all amazing for reading this post. Its good to be back.

Edit: I also tried searching for this topic, so forgive me if its been posted already but I didnt see anything.

Hey, I found your post interesting, and I remembered my password (it's been years), so I thought I might try to reply.

1 - I'd say studying is worth it. Watching your own or others matches with pauses might help. Also, not binge playing probably helps, or even taking several day breaks to refresh your mind. It's from a combination of things, and honestly you have to make sure you're not 'trying' to hard. If you're aiming to see and remember instance of the read in game, you might be trying to do too much. All you have to do is react, which can be largely subconscious. Cultivating how you naturally play and training that to the best of your ability should be the aim, and it's a science that's still not largely understood. Results may come unexpectedly.

2 - I would look for things that you wouldn't have done, or things that don't turn out the way you expect. If you are just letting footage run before your eyes, youre missing the thinking. If you actually want the maximum from a match, you have to be in one person's shoes, so you might even have to watch it twice. Have expectations, and see how the match unfolds.

3 - I sort of mention this in 1., but someone's ability to see the game more slowly than you is mostly a matter of experience, not something you can will. Alternate between awareness and unthinking rhythm. Sometimes pay attention to where you looking, and where else you could be looking. See how little information you can play the game on. A lot of sequences in the games are mere formalities, and you just have to watch for deviations from the norm. It's hard to put it exactly into words. No one can hard read every situation.

4 - Not sure I'm totally qualified to answer this, but reading, I think, gets more important the worse the character is, lol. Part of what makes a good character good is because he has more guaranteed options / fewer opportunities to be exploited. Hard reads are important and something you have to commit to. Like, If i smash backwards predicting someone's roll, then we do the action at the same time. They're important especially for finishing someone at low % life, as hitting someone with a slow / risky move is usually the only way to do this. . something something high risk high reward.

5 - Like in 4, I think if you play *bad* characters, then you have to make more reads. Like Snake in Brawl was good because he could consistently kill with up-tilt, which was fast enough to punish people / easy to land / low risk . etc, and it was one of the reasons he was a good character. So, I think generally people think Ganondorf is bad in brawl and Smash 4 (maybe, idk), because he has to make reads / take risks just to damage / KO ppl. If you're reading / yomi level gets high enough, you can probably outclass any of your friends with almost any character.


edit: apparently, Im an albatross .. who knew

 

[Livelongdienever]

Great tips I need to start applying these.

 

[Dark.Pch]

1. Is this a skill I can only develop by playing matches? Is it worth it to study matches and find out how people approach each other? Like man, sheik really likes dash attack.

You can learn this by playing matches or by watching matches. Pay attention who what the opponent does a lot in a giving situation. And when in that same situation happens again, look for the most common thing you see your opponent do in that situation and counter it. Example:

Each time I go near my opponent, he loves to try to roll behind me and get a grab or attack. So when I noticed this, I get ready for it. Next time I go near my opponent, I jump back and throw out a short hop dair (Peach) And the opponent rolls into the attack. This is just one or many ways I can bait this and punish. I noticed he loves to roll back a lot so baited that reaction and punished him.

2. What categories are most important to watch for when Im playing a match?
- What your opponent does when they go near you
-What they do when you go near them
- What they do when they block your attack
- what they do when they wiff an attack.
- What they do when near the ledge.

3. How do I slow the game speed down in my head? For example, I can watch M2K pummel whoever and completely follow his moveset and why he does things. But in game myself? Everything happens 100 mph faster.

Use good movement going on and out while being safe with spaced attacks. From here you see how your opponent responds to what you are doing. From here you can get some info on what the player does and/or what he tries to do. You also look for the most common thing he does in said situation as I explained in the first question you asked. Then apply the proper punishment/bait. This helps you form a game plan and not go into a match lost swinging and hoping for the best. If you do something and have no good reason why you did it, you are playing lost and just hope things go your way. Skill>luck.



4. How important is reading people? Should I even be worrying about this?

As I stated above, if you can get a good lock on the enemy then you are playing blind. Harder players are harder to read. But they still leave some sort of method to approach and get a hit on them. Beginner/average players leave themselves more exposed and not try to be as tricky (hard to read). While more experienced players always mix it up to a point its hard to tell what they will do. Then you play lost leaving yourself easy to ready and get exposed for it. So it is very important and something one must be good at to reach a high level of skill.

5. What are some characters that need good reads to be successful so I can gauge my progress?

To be honest of you are gonna ditch said character you are using there is no point. Cause not every character plays or punishes the same way. it's best you pick a character you like and stick with them. Learn all you can about them in general and learn to apply those tools in match ups. That way when a certain situation comes along, you know how to deal with it. You wont be lost or confused. Running from one character to the next without fully understanding them and match ups is a waste of time. Cause going to a new character, you are starting the learning process all over again. Stick with one character and when you fully have a grasp of them, then you can add another character on your list to learn.

But I will say a character that is seriously heavy on reads is Ganon.