UMBC Super Smasher
Smash Lord
I DON'T WANT CRITIQUES ON MY GUIDE. I WILL NOT UPDATE IT. IT IS INCOMPLETE, BUT I DIDN'T CARE.
Enjoy!
Marth Guide:
Written by UMBC Super Smasher
Thanks to all the people from MD/VA/NJ/NY who have helped me suck less at this game.
Table of Contents:
I. Introduction
II. About Marth
III. Technical Stuff
IV. Tactics and Strategies
V. Character Match-ups
VI. Stage Guide
Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques
Scenarios
Becoming Good
Updates
I. Introduction
The purpose of this guide is to provide a resource to beginner and intermediate marth players. The information contained within this guide is a combination of all the information I have gathered since I started playing this game. It is meant to cover most of the questions newbies and intermediate players ask within the marth character specific forum. The terms and information used in this guide assume the reader has a knowledge of terms such as fair, SHFFL, DI, CC, wavedash, etc. Information on those terms may be found at http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=97603 Please have a good knowledge of them before continuing through the guide. You should also check out marth's page on SmashWiki: http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Marth
For anyone who believes they have a correction or addition to the guide, or simply wants to talk to me about marth or Smash in general, you can contact me via PM or IM (in profile). As Smash evolves, this guide should as well.
NOTE: This guide assumes NTSC version for everything. PAL version has many differences which will not be covered.
II. About Marth
Sword:
Any marth player needs to know of the two sections of marth’s sword: tipper and hilt (any section that doesn’t make the slashy sound). The tipper section sends the opponent up with more hit stun; the hilt sends the opponent further away with minimal hit stun. It is possible to Ken combo with both parts. It is important to note that most of marth’s priority lies in front and above him. It’s very difficult to get out of being juggled from below since his dair is somewhat laggy.
Ground Movement:
His dash is godly and sexy. Abuse it by dash dance camping for a grab or aerial or whatever works. He also has a very fast walk, which is good for spacing when edge guarding. His wavedash works similarly to other characters. There are lots of possibilities for movement.
Jumping:
Marth is most vulnerable when in the air against most characters. In general, unless facing peach, full hopping is bad. That means most of the time marth should short hop. Fast falling is also important since it limits the amount of time marth spends in the air.
Tilts:
Down tilt and up tilt are amazing. Ftilt still has its uses, as does jab. Experiment with them, I can’t go into every usage.
Aerials:
Fair is marth’s best move IMO. If in doubt, fair. Nair works well against spot dodgers. Bair is great for edge guarding and as a means of turning marth around either to face his opponent or to grab the ledge. Uair is great for juggling.
Specials:
Dancing Blade:
This is useful if marth needs to do a move quickly with little lag, or if the opponent is in a shield (best if marth is behind the shielding opponent so they can't grab. However, if the dancing blade is done at the quickest speed, it makes it difficult for the opponent to grab marth). You will have to experiment with the many variations, but they all work in the same manner: sideB+sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB for a total of four possible slashes. I use sideB+sideB+sideB+downB against people's shields. Also note that sideB+sideB+downB is a meteor spike, though not very practical.
Counter:
Has many uses. Any time you know for certain marth is going to get hit is a good time to counter. Examples: falco approaching marth; samus crouch cancels marth’s fair in order to dsmash, but marth counters before she can get it off; or link/fox up B too high and get countered back off the stage.
Dolphin Slash:
Good as an attack when the opponent is in lag and there isn’t enough time to fsmash, or even in the air. It is usually reversed in order to increase the range of the attack (marth can change the direction of the up B during the animation of the attack). Common examples are during sheik’s up B onto the stage, or when fox firefoxs next to the stage.
Throws:
Fthrow: Can chaingrab many characters at low percentages. See character guide for in-depth info.
At higher percentages it is useful for tech chasing.
Sometimes the opponent may miss the DI and it can lead to an fsmash. It is even possible to dash then pivot fsmash in certain circumstances. Can dash attack against marth at mid percentages and peach depending on DI and percentage. Can also lead to fair against some characters.
Dthrow: Similar to the fthrow, dthrow is useful for tech chasing. Depending on the opponent’s DI, it can even lead to an fsmash.
III. Technical Stuff
Short Hop Double Fair (SHDF):
This is a useful skill for marth players in stringing together combos and possibly ending in a second jump dair for a “Ken Combo”. Ken, Azen, Neo, Husband, Mew2King, and others (including myself) perform this by pressing A for the first fair then using the C-stick for the 2nd. It is the fastest, most reliable way of doing the SHDF. Using the C-stick for the second fair also allows for marth to DI in order to maintain proper spacing from his opponent. When practicing the move, pay attention to when the animation for the fair ends, because that is when the 2nd fair should come out. At first it will be difficult to get the entire second fair out before hitting the ground. With time and practice however, the move becomes fluid and easy.
Note: Jumping may be performed with either X or Y. As a general rule, the control stick should not be used to jump.
Short Hopped Bair to Edge Guard:
Very useful skill for when marth needs to travel a distance to get to the ledge to edge hog an opponent. It is done by short hopping and immediately using the C-stick to bair, which orients marth towards the ledge. He will then fall and grab the ledge. The other method of accomplishing this, which should not be used, is using marth's sideB to orient him toward the ledge. It should not be used because it's slower and it uses marth's floaty side B (if he gets hit off he can't gain any height with the sideB).
Note: This cannot be performed if marth fast falls the short hop. It also must be done with the C-stick in order to DI toward the ledge during the bair animation.
III. Tactics and Strategies
Cross-ups:
Cross-ups are when marth positions himself behind his opponent. Here are some uses:
- grab war between marth and any other character. The other character sidesteps, and instead of grabbing in place, marth dashes beyond the character and in for a grab. That way, even if he misses, it is more difficult for the other character to grab him.
- Dashing beyond a character instead of grabbing them then fsmashing or side B, etc.
- Performing an aerial that places marth behind his opponent.
IV. Character Match-Ups
One aspect of marth's game which makes him difficult to use is that all of his match-ups are different and require marth to change his style to adapt to the opponent.
Bowser: The first mistake to avoid in this match-up is to underestimate bowser. In order to beat bowser, like many characters, you need to know what he has to give you. Things to watch out for include Bowser's up B spin attack, his attack (using A/B) from the ledge as both an edge guard when marth is recovering and an attack if you're too close to him while he's on the ledge. Bowser can KO marth at ~80% with his uair attack, so be careful when in the air.
One technique which works especially well on bowser is dash dance grabbing. Just play patient and let bowser come to you, then grab. Or just dash in and grab. Many bowsers take security in the ledge and will retreat to it if they feel threatened.
Captain Falcon: This is a difficult match-up for marth. Falcon and sheik are considered counters for marth.
Approaching a dash dancing falcon:
One of falcon's strengths on marth is his grab game. His grab to uthrow and grab to dthrow destroy marth. When down on stock or percentage, some falcons may try to dash dance marth in an attempt to grab. In this situation, approach with fair or nair, and if falcon goes in for a grab, then marth has several options. He can either land, dash away then dash back in and grab (best option), land and spot dodge, or land and roll away.
Against falcon, similarly to some other characters, marth needs to stay low to the ground. Never full hop. Keep falcon in front of marth at all times.
Some useful facts: falcon's dthrow to knee always works once marth is above ~80% (unless the falcon sucks). Two of his signature combos on marth are uair to uair to knee and stomp (dair) to knee.
Donkey Kong: A rising threat thanks to Bum (see his videos from mlg ny 07 at long island). Marth needs to make sure he does not let DK capitalize on his strengths. Those strengths include DK's uthrow to uair combos, his donkey punch, his up B recovery, and his bair.
Dr. Mario: Can be a difficult match-up for marth.
It's likely Doc will spam pills, so approach with nairs and fairs. If he sidesteps a lot then use nair and dancing blade.
Sweetspotting the ledge when Doc is on the stage is crucial, since his cape can reverse marth making it impossible to grab the ledge. If Doc is on the ledge, a good Doc player will try to bair marth right during the upB process.
Falco: Very important and tough match-up for marth. Falco's main advantages are his SHL, pillaring, and edge guarding.
(The following guide on “Getting Past Falco’s Lasers and Defending Against His Approach” was written by Emblem Lord. It was taken from a thread, but I chose not to modify anything.)
The topic of this thread is an area of difficulty for many Marth players. How exactly are you supposed to get past all those lasers? And how are you supposed to deal with his deadly approach? After speaking with Cactuar, Mew2king, and Lord Knight I have compiled a list of tactics to use in order to fight against Falco's onslaught. This thread is to spread knowledge, share ideas and spark intelligent discussion among the Marth community. I tried to post the most reliable methods of dealing with Falco's lasers/approach as well as the most common methods. I also posted a few tricks that many players may not have even considered.
1) Dash Attack
Probably the first method Marth players learn in order to combat Falco's use of lasers. The dash attack animation has Marth ducking very low to the ground as he slashes. Good against Falco's that don't shoot low lasers or don't shoot low lasers that much.
2) Use Platforms
Another way of dealing with lasers that all players discover early on. This method is quite obvious, but still effective. Marth uses the platforms to avoid lasers while closing the distance betwen Falco and himself. Use wavelanding to speed Marth's movement on the platforms. And make sure to watch Falco carefully so you can react if he tries to attack you.
3) Power Shielding
There seems to be quite a bit of controversy over this technique. Some question it's viability, saying it's too difficult to do consistently so it shouldn't be relied on too much. Others argue that it's not all that difficult to become proficient at and it's the best way to deal with lasers. Personally I think that unless you can power shield 6 out of 10 lasers that are shot at you, then you shouldn't make a big deal about power shielding. Theoretically speaking, someone who mastered this technique could completely shut down Falco's approach. To perform this technique simply hit L or R the moment the laser would strike your body and it will be reflected back at Falco, if you did it correctly. Still, don't get cocky if you did power shield correctly. Remember Falco can shine his own laser or power shield it right back. He could even just take the hit and go right back to lasering. So take advantage of a power shield if you pull it off.
4) Jumping over lasers
A somewhat risky approach because Marth is vulnerable while in the air. Marth must be very careful and watch Falco's movements while doing this. You'll usually want to come down with a fair. Most Falco's will try to roll away so they can shoot more lasers. Predict this and chase him down with a grab or a dash attack. Then chain throw or combo from there. Remember that if they shield the fair, Marth has his usual shield trap guessing games that I discussed in my Approaching with Marth thread.
5) Dash into Shield
This is a nice surprise tactic. Use it if Falco is getting up from the ground or there is a little distance between the two of you. The method is to dash up to Falco and then put up your shield right in his face. If he shot a laser, it will more then likely be power shielded and you can get a grab. If nothing else they may be caught off guard by Marth suddenly getting in thier face. If not you can always roll away.
6) Wavedash from Shield
A more defensive technique used to close the distance between Marth and Falco. You shield, JC the shield and then wavedash. From there you can shield again or do w/e. But if you don't shield again you will more then likely take a hit from another laser.
7) Shield Grab
Marth players learn very early that trying to shield grab Falco would just get them comboed across the stage. Even though it is very risky, the reward is great if you can pull it off. You just have to know what you're doing and what type of Falco you are playing against. If you are playing against a pillar happy Falco then you really shouldn't attempt a shield grab. If you are facing a Falco that tries to grab after lasering, dairing, or shining then you can attempt a shield grab. Watch the Falco closely so you know when it's the best time to grab. Anytime Falco tries to grab after a move, a shield grab will come out faster, but only if you can predict him correctly. You can also grab Falco after he does a Dair that hits your shield as he is rising while short hopping. This leaves him more vulnerable.
8) JC SH Fair out of Shield
Jump Cancel Short Hop Fair out of Shield. One of the more reliable strategies. While falco is approaching with lasers, jump out of your shield with a short hop and Fair him. You should time your jump so that it comes out the moment his laser touches your shield so your attack is less likely to be interrupted by his. If he takes the hit come down with another Fair. Then you can go into Marth's shield trap guessing games if he shielded. If he took the hit then you get a free grab.
9) Counter
Marth has the ability to counter Falco's lasers. This tactic really isn't hard to utilize and it's a good way to catch Falco off guard. When Falco approaches with lasers, counter them when he is in range. then you can tech chase or do a dash into shield. Marth can also JC counter out of his shield. He can dash in counter as well.
10) Light Shielding
This is a strategy I don't see enough of. When someone light shields and they are attacked, they will recieve more knock back and slide along the ground. How far they slide depends on how light the shield is. This gives Marth another way to get out of pillaring. And thanks to his great range you don't have to really worry about how far he slides. If Falco hits your light shield with a Dair or a shine, Marth will slide away. You should immediately grab, JC fair or JC nair. If you feel like you have slid too far then just wavedash form your shield into a grab. Ideally you want to slide just enough so you can grab Falco without being in danger of getting hit by a Dair or a shine. If you have to wavedash from your shield it gives Falco more time to react. One trick you can try is to wave dash out of a light shield and then counter. This is perfect if he was going to attack as you wavedashed from your light shield.
11) Rolling
A basic effective maneuver. Roll out of your shield when Falco approaches with lasers or tries to pillar your shield. If you roll behind him you can put up your shield and use Marth's shield techniques. You could also try countering as soon as you get out of the roll if Falco is close enough and he is pressuring you.
As you can see Marth has quite a few ways of dealing with the bird that everyone hates. Remember to mix it up and stay unpredictable. Watch Falco carefully and capitalize on his patterns and mistakes. Please feel free to comment on anything or bring up other ways of dealing with Falco's approach.
Fox: A match-up every marth player must know, since it is probably the most common match-up for marth.
This match-up is largely about which character can grab the other the most, and capitalize on it. Fox will try to grab marth then uthrow to uair. He will nair to shine and dair to shine. He will also likely go off the stage to shine spike marth. Marth should SHFFL fairs and nairs, utilt juggle fox on platforms, tipper fsmash fox on platforms (except on DL64, since the platforms are too high for the fsmash), and uair juggle fox.
DI:
Fox's uthrow to uair: You want to DI away from fox for the first uair, then right after fox hits with the first uair smash DI back the other way to avoid another uair. Fox can't re-adjust his momentum to hit marth again with the second uair if he does this. If marth fails to DI the first uair, then it is possible fox may get in multiple uairs.
Fox’s waveshine to grab combo: If the fox is slow to waveshine, marth can jab to get out of the combo.
Chaingrabbing fox: (the following information written by Mew2king)
0-6 you can F Throw without them falling over, but unless they don't DI into you, they can either jab/sidestep/shine you before you regrab them
you can CG fox at 0, so do that usually, CG to 16, and after 16 look for forward DI; if they DI forward above 16% then you have to either walk forward or dash forward in order to regrab them
If you're lazy like Husband, or even me sometimes, you can up tilt after 16% to get guaranteed damage + a possible tech chase, (often with a dash attack where they land cuz they often won't tech)
or you can just down throw F smash tipper them randomly and they usually wont tech
16+ for forward DI
20+ for no DI
28+ for back DI
for up tilts, start them at about 30% or really really close to 30%, is usually best.
If they don't DI, reverse up tilt is recommended usually cuz it's harder for them to DI out of
if they DI forward above 35%, you need to walk forward in order to up tilt them again
35%+ for forward DI
50%+ for back DI
After up tilts, you can either regrab them or do an uair, react properly to the situation
for up throw F smash, 60% is the best time to do it, but 50 and 70 work too, as well as various other %s
if they don't DI at 60%, walk forward slightly, and reverse C-stick F smash tipper them
There are tons more things than what I'm telling you now, however these are the basics that you should all master
FOR FALCO, the %s for no DI are 25%, back DI 31%
for up tilts 42% forward DI 54% back DI
and if falco DIs back at 0% you cant regrab him he will land first
Chaingrabbing fox from 0-death is an art. The person I've seen do this best is Mew2King, and I know I will never use fox against him in tournament because he is scary. Here are the stages of the chain grab, and they are not set in stone (whatever works, works—see M2K’s guide above this for percentages):
1) Grab fox and do NOT press Z/A immediately after grabbing to hit. For the first grab you can either fthrow then follow it up with another grab (unless the fox sees it coming and sidesteps or jabs), or start into the uthrow chainthrow. Do this for five or so grabs.
2) Begin hitting fox after each grab to tack on damage. Do this until mid percentage.
3) Now depending on how the fox Dis, it is possible to do an utilt then re-grab or even do more utilts.
4) Once the fox is at mid-high percent, begin uair comboing.
5) Finish with a bair or fair (or finish around step 3 with a fsmash)
6) Edge guard
Edge guarding fox:
Fox can return to the stage with either a phantasm or his firefox, and marth can edge guard well against either method. Here are some scenarios:
fox phantasms to the ledge. Marth should dtilt him before fox has a chance to actually grab the ledge. Or marth could even dair him at this point, but the dair is difficult to pull off. If marth misses the dair, then fox can short hop from the ledge to drill shine marth. If marth misses the dtilt, it's no big deal – fox still has to get on the stage and marth has space and time from a non-laggy attack.
fox phantasms into marth. A lot of fox players love to do this because many marths don't know what to do. I love it when fox phantasm into me. If fox does that a lot, move to the edge of the stage and do a neutral A (jab) on fox right as he phantasms into marth. He will fall without grabbing the ledge, at which point I like to perform a dair as fox returns to the stage unless the fox player knows to tech the hit, in which case either a counter (if the fox doesn't sweet spot the ledge perfectly), dtilt, neutral B or fsmash will work. Note that the jab also works on fox's firefox if he wants to try to hit marth with that. In fact, any move of marth's works on either fox's phantasm or firefox, and the utilt is a good option to begin combos.
fox begins his firefox and is more than an fsmash distance away from the ledge (if he's within fsmash distance and at least at stage height, then get to the edge with a crouch cancel or wavedash to the edge and fsmash him). If there is time, then in this case, marth should drop from the stage (or jump, depending on the fox's height), jump and hit fox in the middle of its firefox with the non-tippered section of his sword (to hit fox out instead of up). Or marth could even up B fox’s firefox for greater knockback.
fox begins his firefox but is less than an fsmash distance away from the ledge and below the stage. In this case, perform the counter at the edge of the stage, which will hit the fox out from the ledge allowing marth to go off the stage and fair it during its firefox. Again, up B can work here.
What marth should do:
grab a lot
chaingrab with uthrow to grab, then uthrow to utilt, uthrow to uair, then uthrow to fair/bair and edgeguard
SHFFL fairs/nairs, wavedash forward or back to fsmash
Edgeguard well (using dtilt, fsmash, neutral B, Counter, fall or jump off stage to fair, dair)
Ganondorf: This match-up is equal with marth. Be mindful of Ganon's fair, dair, jab, and uair (uair works for edge guarding marth). Ganon might fall off the stage and uair marth as he recovers, or he may even grab the ledge and perform an uair while marth does his upB. Keep in mind that all of Ganon's attacks have a lot of wind-up time, so it's possible for marth to get a hit in before Ganon can even attack. The idea is to keep hitting Ganon so he can never attack marth. Ganon juggles well with fair and uair, so keep him in the air as much as possible. Over-run Ganon with a barrage of fairs and keep constant pressure on him so he can never get off an attack. If marth tries to intercept Ganon too late and exchange hits, Ganon will win.
Ice Climbers: ChuDat pioneered the ICs, and it's more than likely that marth will have to face at least a couple decent imitators. The main thing to watch out for in this match is not getting grabbed due to wobbling, chaingrabbing, and just the amount of damage the ICs can do during a grab.
Approaching ICs:
Fair to dtilt. Wavedash to dtilt. Once the ICs are in the air, keep them up. Do not grab them and do NOT fsmash!!!! Do not Dair because there is too much lag even when l-canceled. Marth should be doing lots of dtilts and fairs.
Defending against ICs:
Keep them in front of marth and stay in the air the majority of the time.
Edge guarding ICs:
Simple fsmash edge guarding works.
Jigglypuff: There is more to this puff ball than meets the eye. Beware of its rest, uair combos, and bair combos.
Approaching jigglypuff:
The trick here is to not approach. Perform fairs without moving forward – spacing is crucial. Something that works well is wavedash to fsmash. Jigglypuff is too slow to evade it in time and gets hit. If jigglypuff gives marth space then move forward and continue performing SHFFL fairs in place.
Defending against Jigglypuff:
Some jigglypuffs will try to roll in front of marth then crouch hoping marth will grab. If marth grabs, jigglypuff gets a free rest. Also be careful with fsmashes or any other laggy move such as the dolphin slash (up B). Jigglypuff is slow enough that if the fsmash is spaced correctly, marth doesn't get punished too badly for it besides losing spacing and maybe getting a bair in the face; puff is too slow to grab marth after a fsmash unless it's horribly spaced (it would choose to rest if that close).
Be careful when using bair or even dair against jigglypuff when it is off the stage, because its side B attack sends marth out behind it.
Again, in summary: grab rarely, fair in place, wavedash to fsmash.
Note: marth's standing grab cannot grab jigglypuff when it's crouching. A running, non jump-cancelled grab can grab jigglypuff, but the lag from a missed grab is probably not worth the grab.
Kirby: I will play Kirbstir's kirby then come back to this... The only thing I can think of is not to get sucked into kirby when at the side of the stage, cause Kirby can deposit marth below the stage and return to the stage.
According to G-reg, Kirby's best and only good move is his bair. Keep that in mind when fighting Kirby.
Link: Not a hard match-up for marth, but if played well can be quite difficult.
Link's bombs and boomerangs can give marth a hard time, so I find it best to pressure Link so much that he can't take the time to pull out a bomb or throw a boomerang.
Luigi: Very underrated character. He can pull off some pretty crazy stuff, so beware.
Approaching luigi:
Mario:
Marth (Ditto): A very important match-up to know, and also a very fun (sometimes annoying) and popular one.
Approaching marth:
This is not the same as many other match-ups where marth can just shffl fairs and nairs; doing that is asking for a fsmash in the face. Approach with dtilt, a dash canceled by a shield to bait an fsmash, or even a dash attack. If fairs and nairs work against your opponent, then use them. Adapt to how they play.
Grabbing (chaingrabbing) and throwing marth:
Marth has a true fthrow to fthrow chaingrab from 0-6% no matter how the opponent Dis. If the opponent Dis down or away, then at 6% the chaingrab no longer works. If the opponent Dis down, then fthrow to fsmash never works; if they DI away, then it works before ~20% and can lead to a tipper. I like to do the following grab sequence if I grab the other marth when he is at 0%:
grab(no hit after the grab)->fthrow to grab(again no hit)->fthrow to grab(with a hit)->uthrow to utilt or fair.
When the other marth is at mid-high percentages, then I like to grab to fthrow or dthrow either to throw the person off the stage or to tech chase to grab/fsmash. Never use bthrow except to put the opponent on a platform then utilt/fsmash/fair/uair/etc.
Edge guarding marth:
There are tons of options when edge guarding another marth. Here are some scenarios:
If the marth is approaching high above the stage, then a jump to bair or even jump to fair (hitting with non-tip) work to send him back out.
If the marth is approaching at or below stage level, then dashing off the stage and doing a fair (non-tipped, with or without a jump depending on the other marth's position) or neutral B will hit him out again, often too far to return depending on the percent.
If the marth is approaching at around stage level, then a wavedash off the stage to bair or even wavedash off to neutral B works. These techniques are described in the “Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques” section.
If the marth is doing his upB to the ledge, then it is possible to either fsmash, dtilt, or short hop to dair (harder to time and takes practice).
If the marth is approaching above the stage, then a dash to crouch canceled fsmash or wavedash to fsmash work. It is also possible to dash and at the last moment before falling off the ledge move the control stick to the neutral position. This immediately puts marth in the standing position and able to fsmash. It works for other characters as well.
If the marth is approaching near the ledge but not close enough to grab it, then it is possible to do a wavedash off the stage to a fast falled ledge grab then immediately short hop dair to the stage and spike the other marth. I learned from Mew2King who did it to me, and it's very flashy and satisfying when pulled off correctly. The fast falled ledge grab is described in the “Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques” section.
Things marth should do:
wavedash out of shield if the other marth fsmashes and grab
dash attack if the other marth is dash dancing then combo from there
Grab a lot.
Dtilt a lot. Wavedash to dtilt, crouch cancel a dash to dtilt, and dtilt when edge guarding if marth wants to get up on the stage and also when he does upB to the stage.
Always DI down when grabbed. It prevents chaingrabbing past 6%, fthrow->fsmash hits, and dthrow->fsmash hits.
DI away ASAP if hit by a fair. In fact, anticipate getting hit and DI away before receiving the blow.
Fast fall before using the upB to return to the stage in order to make it harder to time a fsmash.
Things Marth should NOT do:
fsmash a lot unless the other marth can't wavedash out of shield to punish it
Full jump. The marth that's below has the advantage, because marth's priority lies in front and above him. Always short hop, and that's the case for most match-ups.
Mewtwo:
Mr. Game & Watch:
Ness:
Peach: This is a fairly unique match-up for marth that will definitely require a change of style.
Approaching Peach:
Peach has a high priority dash attack that can catch marth's feet when short hopping or landing, so full jumped fairs work well. Walking away from peach and waiting for her to move, then attacking her is effective. Also, jumping backwards and fairing peach works well. Since peach's main move against marth when on the ground is her dash attack, expect it when approaching her. Run up and cancel the run with a shield as necessary. If she hits the shield, then marth can either grab or jump out of the shield and dair peach.
Peach has one of the best crouch cancels in the game along with Samus. If she crouch cancels, then dairs and grabs work well. One thing that must be learned early on is to NOT HOLD DOWN. Do not crouch cancel against peach and be careful with dtilt.
Peach has turnips (watch out for the stitched face!) and many peaches love to spam them. When approaching a peach with a turnip and if she attacks while throwing one, marth's nair works well in cutting through the turnip and peach. It's best not to catch any turnips because marth can't use any moves while holding one, and it takes marth longer to throw a turnip than peach. Instead, prevent peach from grabbing more turnips by dash attacking when she predictably pulls another. However, it is possible to catch a turnip on the ground and air by pressing A when it is about to hit marth. A safer way to do the same thing is to air dodge and press A, because then marth can't be hit if he misses the turnip.
Marth has a fthrow chaingrab on peach at early percentages up to about 20%. Take advantage of it and get in a fsmash. Sometimes marth can catch peach off guard and hit her with a tippered fsmash at higher percentages if she misses the DI.
Recovering for marth:
Peach will usually try to hit marth with turnips during his recovery. When thrown horizontally at marth, avoid the turnip by either falling without a side B, jumping, swatting it away with a fair, or grabbing it. When thrown vertically down at marth, move either further in or away from the stage and delay the up B as necessary to avoid getting hit. Sometimes it is inevitable that marth will get hit by a turnip.
Defending against Peach:
When defending against a peach, if she is coming to grab then dash dance away then back in to grab her. Perform extra dash dances as necessary depending on whether she is sidestep-happy. If she dash attacks, then shield. If she is floating with a fair coming, then get the heck out of there with a wavedash (out of shield), dash, or roll as necessary. Do not attempt to out-prioritize her moves. At most, marth can preempt her moves with a fair.
Edge guarding against Peach:
When edge guarding, peach will sometimes have a jump until she has to use her up B. Try to hit peach with a fair or bair so that she has to use her up B, because it makes her recovery more difficult (no air dodge). If she has her jump, then peaches will usually either air dodge to the stage or fair. Never fsmash at peach when she is recovering, because she will always air dodge and punish marth. Use utilt instead. Peach hates the utilt, so abuse it on her. If peach has already used her jump, then the best thing to do is to make sure she lands on the ledge and not on the stage. Peach has a hard time getting from the ledge to the stage. When she is over 100%, it is usually safe to fsmash or utilt her as she rolls or jumps up on stage. Otherwise, a grab or dtilt is probably the best choice.
Note: It is sometimes possible to dair or bair peach while she is recovering depending on her height.
On most stages, peach dies at 140-150% by utilt. On Dreamland she can live up until 170-180% from an utilt. Tippered fsmashes can be very useful against peach on most levels and lead to an early death for her. She is so slow that it is hard for her to punish fsmashes other than dash attacking before marth can get off the fsmash.
Pichu:
Pikachu:
Roy:
Samus: One of marth's good match-ups, but it can be difficult if played incorrectly.
Approaching samus:
Approach with dtilt. Marth's goal should be to get samus in the air, and once samus is in the air, fair combo samus and get her off the stage. If samus is spamming missiles just fair or nair or ftilt through them. Anything marth does goes through missiles. Marth can even destroy a partially charged beam shot.
Edge guarding samus:
Bair from the stage or from the ledge works well on samus to hurt her recovery (she is vulnerable in morph ball form). If samus does get to the ledge, most samus players will grapple since it is safer than using the up B. Always stay on the stage (don't grab the ledge) when samus recovers. If the samus player messes up on the grapple, then samus will rise up above the ledge and become susceptible to a dtilt or fsmash. If she is hit by that, then samus is very vulnerable when recovering because once she has used her grapple once, she can no longer use it until she lands on the stage. Grab the ledge if samus is far out, but be careful because her up B will catch marth if he is vulnerable when on the ledge. Otherwise, a dtilt or fsmash should finish her off.
Recovering against samus:
When recovering, marth will have to get through missiles and beam shots and possibly a spike from samus (her nair). Marth can fair through the missiles (side B does not work!) and fall below them or jump over them. Samus may try to fall off the stage and nair marth when performing the second jump to grab the ledge, so see it coming and drop lower to up B to the ledge.
Things marth should do:
dash attack if samus is about to shoot a missile. Marth runs beneath the missiles and it works well to start combos.
Remain patient throughout the entire match. This match can take forever, but just keep calm and wait for samus to return to the stage to get edge guarded again by an utilt or dtilt.
Note: Avoid samus's grapple grab by jumping. She can pull out an extended grapple too, so watch out.
Yoshi:
Young Link:
Zelda: In this match-up, watch out for Zelda's fair/bair and her grab. Take advantage of the fact that she is incredibly slow and her recovery is very punishable.
Sheik:
V. Stage Guide
Generally speaking, marth does well on small stages and poorly on large stages. He also likes platforms within fsmash tipper range, such as on Yoshi's Story, FoD, and Battlefield. Marth's game revolves largely around his superior edge guarding skills, plus his up B is laggy so marth needs a stage with a ledge for both edge guarding and recovery. Marth's best stages are Yoshi's Story, FoD, and Battlefield. He is still good on FD and Pokemon Stadium. You will see other characters counter pick marth on virtually every other stage: Kongo Jungle, Corneria, Mute City, Onett, DL64, Rainbow Cruise, Green Greens, and Poke Floats. This is why it is good to have fox as a secondary for non-neutral stage counter picks.
Princess Peach's Castle: Very bad stage for marth; switch to fox. Marth has no space to maneuver here, and a good fox or falco will destroy marth due to the walls (shines).
Great Bay (banned)
Brinstar: Alright stage for marth. Focus on gimpy edge guarding kills when the stage is high up so the fire doesn't save the opponent.
Yoshi's Story (Neutral): Many characters will automatically ban YS against marth. The characters that might not are fox (low ceiling), falco (little room for marth to maneuver, fsmash for edge guard works less due to tilted stage at ledge, plus not much horizontal distance for easy KOs), and marth. Flying fish (Shy Guys) can be annoying, but it's that way for both marth and his opponent.
Note that marth's dtilt reaches further down than expected when he is on the tip of the stage because the stage angles down at that point. It can lead to an unexpected death for an opponent who approaches too high. Also keep in mind that YS is shallow; marth must be careful when going off stage to fair or neutral B.
Fountain of Dreams (Neutral, banned in Doubles): This stage has good platforms for marth, a mid range ceiling (good vs fox), and the edge is easier to edge guard for marth than Yoshi's Story. On the other hand, the stage's platforms keep changing heights which makes grabbing harder. Plus, marth is not helped much by the lower of the two platforms because other characters can hit marth whether he is on the ground or on the platform or air (peach, spacies, sheik), and marth has trouble if he has to recover on a platform.
Corneria: Poor stage for marth, particularly vs fox, sheik and pikachu (low ceiling). Try to pressure the opponent toward the edge and hit them off. Also beware of the firing ship. Be careful of the right section of the stage because fox can shine combo marth there.
Pokemon Stadium (Neutral): A good stage for marth; the platforms can be fsmash tippered and it has a lot of space to maneuver, similar to FD. The best thing to do when the stage changes formation is to just camp until it goes back to normal—unless marth is winning by a comfortable amount, of course. Be careful when recovering to not hold over on the joystick because marth will up B underneath the stage. The stage tends to be more difficult to sweet spot.
Mute City (banned in Doubles): Marth will see many peaches counter pick here. It is still possible to win, but it is definitely a tough stage because it has no ledge.
Onett: One of fox's counter pick stages against marth because of the low ceiling and walls to shine.
Mushroom Kingdom:
Icicle Mountain (banned):
Battlefield (Neutral): A good stage for marth that is sometimes used as a marth counterpick. In respect to the other neutral stages, it has a fair size width and ceiling (and floor).
Dream Land (N64) (Neutral):
Kongo Jungle (N64):
Rainbow Cruise:
Jungle Japes:
Hyrule Temple (banned)
Brinstar Depths (banned)
Yoshi's Island:
Green Greens:
Venom:
Poke Floats:
Big Blue:
Fourside (banned in Singles):
Mushroom Kingdom II:
Flat Zone (banned)
Final Destination (Neutral):
Yoshi's Island (N64) (banned)
VI. Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques
VII. Becoming Good
This is what it's all about – becoming good so you can beat your friends, place well at tournaments, and best of all enjoy the game to the fullest. Whatever your motivation to get better, you're here reading this guide for that reason, and I can tell you that with time and practice, you will improve. Many people improve at different rates depending on their circumstances, natural ability, and effort. It's ultimately up to you to improve, but I am offering my advice on what I believe are good methods to improve your game.
There are three ways to improve your technical ability without another human to act as a sandbag: Training Mode, Single Player vs cpus, and Single Player with a second controller plugged into the gamecube and no human controlling it. I do not advise using Training Mode because it disables the C-stick and it is not good training to practice at different speeds of game play. It's important to learn how to wavedash, waveland, l-cancel, etc at normal game speed. Practice technical moves by yourself in Single Player against a human player; that will offer the most realistic training experience. Once you have mastered the technical stuff, practice it against a lvl1 cpu (it offers an experience most similar to a human; do NOT play lvl9 cpus!!) in a 99 stock match with no time limit. Then try it out versus a human. You should learn what works and what does not by watching videos of pro players. You may notice that your game gets worse when you implement new techniques. That is natural, just stick with it and you'll learn when to use those techniques and develop mindgames.
Watching videos is an important aspect of improving. There is a marth video archive stickied in the marth forums – use it! When watching videos, consider exactly what is happening. If marth grabs the other character, why and when did he do it? At what percentage was the other character? Which way did marth throw them? How did marth follow up the throw? Did he dash attack, wait for their tech, fair, etc? If marth fsmashes, what did he do before fsmashing? Where was the other character and what were they doing when marth fsmashed? Analyze all aspects of the game and you will discover new things. There should always be a cycle of improvement: if you're a beginner, then you will need to read lots of guides for all the different characters and become familiar with their strengths and weaknesses. All players should watch videos, practice techniques or combos by themselves or preferably with a group of friends, go to tournaments and smashfests to play a variety of players and learn new techniques by experiencing others using them on you, then repeat the cycle.
Some people believe that you are only as good as your competition. This is largely true; try to find the best players and figure out why they are winning. One reason why you want to find the best players is they are who you will imitate when you play. Don't play anyone less than the best because it is like limiting yourself. On the other hand, you need to make sure you can understand what those better players are doing against you. That is where your personal study of the game will help.
Remember, Smash is just like any other thing in life; with discipline practicing a bit every day, you will become an excellent smasher before you know it. You get out of Smash what you put into it. Just treat it like what it is – a game. Remember at tournaments and in money matches, crew battles etc that you are playing a game. Let that fact shape your attitude. Enjoy the people you meet, make friends, and most importantly – have fun!
Good luck,
UMBC Super Smasher
VIII. Updates
04/23/08 - First published to Smashboards
Enjoy!
Marth Guide:
Written by UMBC Super Smasher
Thanks to all the people from MD/VA/NJ/NY who have helped me suck less at this game.
Table of Contents:
I. Introduction
II. About Marth
III. Technical Stuff
IV. Tactics and Strategies
V. Character Match-ups
VI. Stage Guide
Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques
Scenarios
Becoming Good
Updates
I. Introduction
The purpose of this guide is to provide a resource to beginner and intermediate marth players. The information contained within this guide is a combination of all the information I have gathered since I started playing this game. It is meant to cover most of the questions newbies and intermediate players ask within the marth character specific forum. The terms and information used in this guide assume the reader has a knowledge of terms such as fair, SHFFL, DI, CC, wavedash, etc. Information on those terms may be found at http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=97603 Please have a good knowledge of them before continuing through the guide. You should also check out marth's page on SmashWiki: http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Marth
For anyone who believes they have a correction or addition to the guide, or simply wants to talk to me about marth or Smash in general, you can contact me via PM or IM (in profile). As Smash evolves, this guide should as well.
NOTE: This guide assumes NTSC version for everything. PAL version has many differences which will not be covered.
II. About Marth
Sword:
Any marth player needs to know of the two sections of marth’s sword: tipper and hilt (any section that doesn’t make the slashy sound). The tipper section sends the opponent up with more hit stun; the hilt sends the opponent further away with minimal hit stun. It is possible to Ken combo with both parts. It is important to note that most of marth’s priority lies in front and above him. It’s very difficult to get out of being juggled from below since his dair is somewhat laggy.
Ground Movement:
His dash is godly and sexy. Abuse it by dash dance camping for a grab or aerial or whatever works. He also has a very fast walk, which is good for spacing when edge guarding. His wavedash works similarly to other characters. There are lots of possibilities for movement.
Jumping:
Marth is most vulnerable when in the air against most characters. In general, unless facing peach, full hopping is bad. That means most of the time marth should short hop. Fast falling is also important since it limits the amount of time marth spends in the air.
Tilts:
Down tilt and up tilt are amazing. Ftilt still has its uses, as does jab. Experiment with them, I can’t go into every usage.
Aerials:
Fair is marth’s best move IMO. If in doubt, fair. Nair works well against spot dodgers. Bair is great for edge guarding and as a means of turning marth around either to face his opponent or to grab the ledge. Uair is great for juggling.
Specials:
Dancing Blade:
This is useful if marth needs to do a move quickly with little lag, or if the opponent is in a shield (best if marth is behind the shielding opponent so they can't grab. However, if the dancing blade is done at the quickest speed, it makes it difficult for the opponent to grab marth). You will have to experiment with the many variations, but they all work in the same manner: sideB+sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB + sideB/upB/downB for a total of four possible slashes. I use sideB+sideB+sideB+downB against people's shields. Also note that sideB+sideB+downB is a meteor spike, though not very practical.
Counter:
Has many uses. Any time you know for certain marth is going to get hit is a good time to counter. Examples: falco approaching marth; samus crouch cancels marth’s fair in order to dsmash, but marth counters before she can get it off; or link/fox up B too high and get countered back off the stage.
Dolphin Slash:
Good as an attack when the opponent is in lag and there isn’t enough time to fsmash, or even in the air. It is usually reversed in order to increase the range of the attack (marth can change the direction of the up B during the animation of the attack). Common examples are during sheik’s up B onto the stage, or when fox firefoxs next to the stage.
Throws:
Fthrow: Can chaingrab many characters at low percentages. See character guide for in-depth info.
At higher percentages it is useful for tech chasing.
Sometimes the opponent may miss the DI and it can lead to an fsmash. It is even possible to dash then pivot fsmash in certain circumstances. Can dash attack against marth at mid percentages and peach depending on DI and percentage. Can also lead to fair against some characters.
Dthrow: Similar to the fthrow, dthrow is useful for tech chasing. Depending on the opponent’s DI, it can even lead to an fsmash.
III. Technical Stuff
Short Hop Double Fair (SHDF):
This is a useful skill for marth players in stringing together combos and possibly ending in a second jump dair for a “Ken Combo”. Ken, Azen, Neo, Husband, Mew2King, and others (including myself) perform this by pressing A for the first fair then using the C-stick for the 2nd. It is the fastest, most reliable way of doing the SHDF. Using the C-stick for the second fair also allows for marth to DI in order to maintain proper spacing from his opponent. When practicing the move, pay attention to when the animation for the fair ends, because that is when the 2nd fair should come out. At first it will be difficult to get the entire second fair out before hitting the ground. With time and practice however, the move becomes fluid and easy.
Note: Jumping may be performed with either X or Y. As a general rule, the control stick should not be used to jump.
Short Hopped Bair to Edge Guard:
Very useful skill for when marth needs to travel a distance to get to the ledge to edge hog an opponent. It is done by short hopping and immediately using the C-stick to bair, which orients marth towards the ledge. He will then fall and grab the ledge. The other method of accomplishing this, which should not be used, is using marth's sideB to orient him toward the ledge. It should not be used because it's slower and it uses marth's floaty side B (if he gets hit off he can't gain any height with the sideB).
Note: This cannot be performed if marth fast falls the short hop. It also must be done with the C-stick in order to DI toward the ledge during the bair animation.
III. Tactics and Strategies
Cross-ups:
Cross-ups are when marth positions himself behind his opponent. Here are some uses:
- grab war between marth and any other character. The other character sidesteps, and instead of grabbing in place, marth dashes beyond the character and in for a grab. That way, even if he misses, it is more difficult for the other character to grab him.
- Dashing beyond a character instead of grabbing them then fsmashing or side B, etc.
- Performing an aerial that places marth behind his opponent.
IV. Character Match-Ups
One aspect of marth's game which makes him difficult to use is that all of his match-ups are different and require marth to change his style to adapt to the opponent.
Bowser: The first mistake to avoid in this match-up is to underestimate bowser. In order to beat bowser, like many characters, you need to know what he has to give you. Things to watch out for include Bowser's up B spin attack, his attack (using A/B) from the ledge as both an edge guard when marth is recovering and an attack if you're too close to him while he's on the ledge. Bowser can KO marth at ~80% with his uair attack, so be careful when in the air.
One technique which works especially well on bowser is dash dance grabbing. Just play patient and let bowser come to you, then grab. Or just dash in and grab. Many bowsers take security in the ledge and will retreat to it if they feel threatened.
Captain Falcon: This is a difficult match-up for marth. Falcon and sheik are considered counters for marth.
Approaching a dash dancing falcon:
One of falcon's strengths on marth is his grab game. His grab to uthrow and grab to dthrow destroy marth. When down on stock or percentage, some falcons may try to dash dance marth in an attempt to grab. In this situation, approach with fair or nair, and if falcon goes in for a grab, then marth has several options. He can either land, dash away then dash back in and grab (best option), land and spot dodge, or land and roll away.
Against falcon, similarly to some other characters, marth needs to stay low to the ground. Never full hop. Keep falcon in front of marth at all times.
Some useful facts: falcon's dthrow to knee always works once marth is above ~80% (unless the falcon sucks). Two of his signature combos on marth are uair to uair to knee and stomp (dair) to knee.
Donkey Kong: A rising threat thanks to Bum (see his videos from mlg ny 07 at long island). Marth needs to make sure he does not let DK capitalize on his strengths. Those strengths include DK's uthrow to uair combos, his donkey punch, his up B recovery, and his bair.
Dr. Mario: Can be a difficult match-up for marth.
It's likely Doc will spam pills, so approach with nairs and fairs. If he sidesteps a lot then use nair and dancing blade.
Sweetspotting the ledge when Doc is on the stage is crucial, since his cape can reverse marth making it impossible to grab the ledge. If Doc is on the ledge, a good Doc player will try to bair marth right during the upB process.
Falco: Very important and tough match-up for marth. Falco's main advantages are his SHL, pillaring, and edge guarding.
(The following guide on “Getting Past Falco’s Lasers and Defending Against His Approach” was written by Emblem Lord. It was taken from a thread, but I chose not to modify anything.)
The topic of this thread is an area of difficulty for many Marth players. How exactly are you supposed to get past all those lasers? And how are you supposed to deal with his deadly approach? After speaking with Cactuar, Mew2king, and Lord Knight I have compiled a list of tactics to use in order to fight against Falco's onslaught. This thread is to spread knowledge, share ideas and spark intelligent discussion among the Marth community. I tried to post the most reliable methods of dealing with Falco's lasers/approach as well as the most common methods. I also posted a few tricks that many players may not have even considered.
1) Dash Attack
Probably the first method Marth players learn in order to combat Falco's use of lasers. The dash attack animation has Marth ducking very low to the ground as he slashes. Good against Falco's that don't shoot low lasers or don't shoot low lasers that much.
2) Use Platforms
Another way of dealing with lasers that all players discover early on. This method is quite obvious, but still effective. Marth uses the platforms to avoid lasers while closing the distance betwen Falco and himself. Use wavelanding to speed Marth's movement on the platforms. And make sure to watch Falco carefully so you can react if he tries to attack you.
3) Power Shielding
There seems to be quite a bit of controversy over this technique. Some question it's viability, saying it's too difficult to do consistently so it shouldn't be relied on too much. Others argue that it's not all that difficult to become proficient at and it's the best way to deal with lasers. Personally I think that unless you can power shield 6 out of 10 lasers that are shot at you, then you shouldn't make a big deal about power shielding. Theoretically speaking, someone who mastered this technique could completely shut down Falco's approach. To perform this technique simply hit L or R the moment the laser would strike your body and it will be reflected back at Falco, if you did it correctly. Still, don't get cocky if you did power shield correctly. Remember Falco can shine his own laser or power shield it right back. He could even just take the hit and go right back to lasering. So take advantage of a power shield if you pull it off.
4) Jumping over lasers
A somewhat risky approach because Marth is vulnerable while in the air. Marth must be very careful and watch Falco's movements while doing this. You'll usually want to come down with a fair. Most Falco's will try to roll away so they can shoot more lasers. Predict this and chase him down with a grab or a dash attack. Then chain throw or combo from there. Remember that if they shield the fair, Marth has his usual shield trap guessing games that I discussed in my Approaching with Marth thread.
5) Dash into Shield
This is a nice surprise tactic. Use it if Falco is getting up from the ground or there is a little distance between the two of you. The method is to dash up to Falco and then put up your shield right in his face. If he shot a laser, it will more then likely be power shielded and you can get a grab. If nothing else they may be caught off guard by Marth suddenly getting in thier face. If not you can always roll away.
6) Wavedash from Shield
A more defensive technique used to close the distance between Marth and Falco. You shield, JC the shield and then wavedash. From there you can shield again or do w/e. But if you don't shield again you will more then likely take a hit from another laser.
7) Shield Grab
Marth players learn very early that trying to shield grab Falco would just get them comboed across the stage. Even though it is very risky, the reward is great if you can pull it off. You just have to know what you're doing and what type of Falco you are playing against. If you are playing against a pillar happy Falco then you really shouldn't attempt a shield grab. If you are facing a Falco that tries to grab after lasering, dairing, or shining then you can attempt a shield grab. Watch the Falco closely so you know when it's the best time to grab. Anytime Falco tries to grab after a move, a shield grab will come out faster, but only if you can predict him correctly. You can also grab Falco after he does a Dair that hits your shield as he is rising while short hopping. This leaves him more vulnerable.
8) JC SH Fair out of Shield
Jump Cancel Short Hop Fair out of Shield. One of the more reliable strategies. While falco is approaching with lasers, jump out of your shield with a short hop and Fair him. You should time your jump so that it comes out the moment his laser touches your shield so your attack is less likely to be interrupted by his. If he takes the hit come down with another Fair. Then you can go into Marth's shield trap guessing games if he shielded. If he took the hit then you get a free grab.
9) Counter
Marth has the ability to counter Falco's lasers. This tactic really isn't hard to utilize and it's a good way to catch Falco off guard. When Falco approaches with lasers, counter them when he is in range. then you can tech chase or do a dash into shield. Marth can also JC counter out of his shield. He can dash in counter as well.
10) Light Shielding
This is a strategy I don't see enough of. When someone light shields and they are attacked, they will recieve more knock back and slide along the ground. How far they slide depends on how light the shield is. This gives Marth another way to get out of pillaring. And thanks to his great range you don't have to really worry about how far he slides. If Falco hits your light shield with a Dair or a shine, Marth will slide away. You should immediately grab, JC fair or JC nair. If you feel like you have slid too far then just wavedash form your shield into a grab. Ideally you want to slide just enough so you can grab Falco without being in danger of getting hit by a Dair or a shine. If you have to wavedash from your shield it gives Falco more time to react. One trick you can try is to wave dash out of a light shield and then counter. This is perfect if he was going to attack as you wavedashed from your light shield.
11) Rolling
A basic effective maneuver. Roll out of your shield when Falco approaches with lasers or tries to pillar your shield. If you roll behind him you can put up your shield and use Marth's shield techniques. You could also try countering as soon as you get out of the roll if Falco is close enough and he is pressuring you.
As you can see Marth has quite a few ways of dealing with the bird that everyone hates. Remember to mix it up and stay unpredictable. Watch Falco carefully and capitalize on his patterns and mistakes. Please feel free to comment on anything or bring up other ways of dealing with Falco's approach.
Fox: A match-up every marth player must know, since it is probably the most common match-up for marth.
This match-up is largely about which character can grab the other the most, and capitalize on it. Fox will try to grab marth then uthrow to uair. He will nair to shine and dair to shine. He will also likely go off the stage to shine spike marth. Marth should SHFFL fairs and nairs, utilt juggle fox on platforms, tipper fsmash fox on platforms (except on DL64, since the platforms are too high for the fsmash), and uair juggle fox.
DI:
Fox's uthrow to uair: You want to DI away from fox for the first uair, then right after fox hits with the first uair smash DI back the other way to avoid another uair. Fox can't re-adjust his momentum to hit marth again with the second uair if he does this. If marth fails to DI the first uair, then it is possible fox may get in multiple uairs.
Fox’s waveshine to grab combo: If the fox is slow to waveshine, marth can jab to get out of the combo.
Chaingrabbing fox: (the following information written by Mew2king)
0-6 you can F Throw without them falling over, but unless they don't DI into you, they can either jab/sidestep/shine you before you regrab them
you can CG fox at 0, so do that usually, CG to 16, and after 16 look for forward DI; if they DI forward above 16% then you have to either walk forward or dash forward in order to regrab them
If you're lazy like Husband, or even me sometimes, you can up tilt after 16% to get guaranteed damage + a possible tech chase, (often with a dash attack where they land cuz they often won't tech)
or you can just down throw F smash tipper them randomly and they usually wont tech
16+ for forward DI
20+ for no DI
28+ for back DI
for up tilts, start them at about 30% or really really close to 30%, is usually best.
If they don't DI, reverse up tilt is recommended usually cuz it's harder for them to DI out of
if they DI forward above 35%, you need to walk forward in order to up tilt them again
35%+ for forward DI
50%+ for back DI
After up tilts, you can either regrab them or do an uair, react properly to the situation
for up throw F smash, 60% is the best time to do it, but 50 and 70 work too, as well as various other %s
if they don't DI at 60%, walk forward slightly, and reverse C-stick F smash tipper them
There are tons more things than what I'm telling you now, however these are the basics that you should all master
FOR FALCO, the %s for no DI are 25%, back DI 31%
for up tilts 42% forward DI 54% back DI
and if falco DIs back at 0% you cant regrab him he will land first
Chaingrabbing fox from 0-death is an art. The person I've seen do this best is Mew2King, and I know I will never use fox against him in tournament because he is scary. Here are the stages of the chain grab, and they are not set in stone (whatever works, works—see M2K’s guide above this for percentages):
1) Grab fox and do NOT press Z/A immediately after grabbing to hit. For the first grab you can either fthrow then follow it up with another grab (unless the fox sees it coming and sidesteps or jabs), or start into the uthrow chainthrow. Do this for five or so grabs.
2) Begin hitting fox after each grab to tack on damage. Do this until mid percentage.
3) Now depending on how the fox Dis, it is possible to do an utilt then re-grab or even do more utilts.
4) Once the fox is at mid-high percent, begin uair comboing.
5) Finish with a bair or fair (or finish around step 3 with a fsmash)
6) Edge guard
Edge guarding fox:
Fox can return to the stage with either a phantasm or his firefox, and marth can edge guard well against either method. Here are some scenarios:
fox phantasms to the ledge. Marth should dtilt him before fox has a chance to actually grab the ledge. Or marth could even dair him at this point, but the dair is difficult to pull off. If marth misses the dair, then fox can short hop from the ledge to drill shine marth. If marth misses the dtilt, it's no big deal – fox still has to get on the stage and marth has space and time from a non-laggy attack.
fox phantasms into marth. A lot of fox players love to do this because many marths don't know what to do. I love it when fox phantasm into me. If fox does that a lot, move to the edge of the stage and do a neutral A (jab) on fox right as he phantasms into marth. He will fall without grabbing the ledge, at which point I like to perform a dair as fox returns to the stage unless the fox player knows to tech the hit, in which case either a counter (if the fox doesn't sweet spot the ledge perfectly), dtilt, neutral B or fsmash will work. Note that the jab also works on fox's firefox if he wants to try to hit marth with that. In fact, any move of marth's works on either fox's phantasm or firefox, and the utilt is a good option to begin combos.
fox begins his firefox and is more than an fsmash distance away from the ledge (if he's within fsmash distance and at least at stage height, then get to the edge with a crouch cancel or wavedash to the edge and fsmash him). If there is time, then in this case, marth should drop from the stage (or jump, depending on the fox's height), jump and hit fox in the middle of its firefox with the non-tippered section of his sword (to hit fox out instead of up). Or marth could even up B fox’s firefox for greater knockback.
fox begins his firefox but is less than an fsmash distance away from the ledge and below the stage. In this case, perform the counter at the edge of the stage, which will hit the fox out from the ledge allowing marth to go off the stage and fair it during its firefox. Again, up B can work here.
What marth should do:
grab a lot
chaingrab with uthrow to grab, then uthrow to utilt, uthrow to uair, then uthrow to fair/bair and edgeguard
SHFFL fairs/nairs, wavedash forward or back to fsmash
Edgeguard well (using dtilt, fsmash, neutral B, Counter, fall or jump off stage to fair, dair)
Ganondorf: This match-up is equal with marth. Be mindful of Ganon's fair, dair, jab, and uair (uair works for edge guarding marth). Ganon might fall off the stage and uair marth as he recovers, or he may even grab the ledge and perform an uair while marth does his upB. Keep in mind that all of Ganon's attacks have a lot of wind-up time, so it's possible for marth to get a hit in before Ganon can even attack. The idea is to keep hitting Ganon so he can never attack marth. Ganon juggles well with fair and uair, so keep him in the air as much as possible. Over-run Ganon with a barrage of fairs and keep constant pressure on him so he can never get off an attack. If marth tries to intercept Ganon too late and exchange hits, Ganon will win.
Ice Climbers: ChuDat pioneered the ICs, and it's more than likely that marth will have to face at least a couple decent imitators. The main thing to watch out for in this match is not getting grabbed due to wobbling, chaingrabbing, and just the amount of damage the ICs can do during a grab.
Approaching ICs:
Fair to dtilt. Wavedash to dtilt. Once the ICs are in the air, keep them up. Do not grab them and do NOT fsmash!!!! Do not Dair because there is too much lag even when l-canceled. Marth should be doing lots of dtilts and fairs.
Defending against ICs:
Keep them in front of marth and stay in the air the majority of the time.
Edge guarding ICs:
Simple fsmash edge guarding works.
Jigglypuff: There is more to this puff ball than meets the eye. Beware of its rest, uair combos, and bair combos.
Approaching jigglypuff:
The trick here is to not approach. Perform fairs without moving forward – spacing is crucial. Something that works well is wavedash to fsmash. Jigglypuff is too slow to evade it in time and gets hit. If jigglypuff gives marth space then move forward and continue performing SHFFL fairs in place.
Defending against Jigglypuff:
Some jigglypuffs will try to roll in front of marth then crouch hoping marth will grab. If marth grabs, jigglypuff gets a free rest. Also be careful with fsmashes or any other laggy move such as the dolphin slash (up B). Jigglypuff is slow enough that if the fsmash is spaced correctly, marth doesn't get punished too badly for it besides losing spacing and maybe getting a bair in the face; puff is too slow to grab marth after a fsmash unless it's horribly spaced (it would choose to rest if that close).
Be careful when using bair or even dair against jigglypuff when it is off the stage, because its side B attack sends marth out behind it.
Again, in summary: grab rarely, fair in place, wavedash to fsmash.
Note: marth's standing grab cannot grab jigglypuff when it's crouching. A running, non jump-cancelled grab can grab jigglypuff, but the lag from a missed grab is probably not worth the grab.
Kirby: I will play Kirbstir's kirby then come back to this... The only thing I can think of is not to get sucked into kirby when at the side of the stage, cause Kirby can deposit marth below the stage and return to the stage.
According to G-reg, Kirby's best and only good move is his bair. Keep that in mind when fighting Kirby.
Link: Not a hard match-up for marth, but if played well can be quite difficult.
Link's bombs and boomerangs can give marth a hard time, so I find it best to pressure Link so much that he can't take the time to pull out a bomb or throw a boomerang.
Luigi: Very underrated character. He can pull off some pretty crazy stuff, so beware.
Approaching luigi:
Mario:
Marth (Ditto): A very important match-up to know, and also a very fun (sometimes annoying) and popular one.
Approaching marth:
This is not the same as many other match-ups where marth can just shffl fairs and nairs; doing that is asking for a fsmash in the face. Approach with dtilt, a dash canceled by a shield to bait an fsmash, or even a dash attack. If fairs and nairs work against your opponent, then use them. Adapt to how they play.
Grabbing (chaingrabbing) and throwing marth:
Marth has a true fthrow to fthrow chaingrab from 0-6% no matter how the opponent Dis. If the opponent Dis down or away, then at 6% the chaingrab no longer works. If the opponent Dis down, then fthrow to fsmash never works; if they DI away, then it works before ~20% and can lead to a tipper. I like to do the following grab sequence if I grab the other marth when he is at 0%:
grab(no hit after the grab)->fthrow to grab(again no hit)->fthrow to grab(with a hit)->uthrow to utilt or fair.
When the other marth is at mid-high percentages, then I like to grab to fthrow or dthrow either to throw the person off the stage or to tech chase to grab/fsmash. Never use bthrow except to put the opponent on a platform then utilt/fsmash/fair/uair/etc.
Edge guarding marth:
There are tons of options when edge guarding another marth. Here are some scenarios:
If the marth is approaching high above the stage, then a jump to bair or even jump to fair (hitting with non-tip) work to send him back out.
If the marth is approaching at or below stage level, then dashing off the stage and doing a fair (non-tipped, with or without a jump depending on the other marth's position) or neutral B will hit him out again, often too far to return depending on the percent.
If the marth is approaching at around stage level, then a wavedash off the stage to bair or even wavedash off to neutral B works. These techniques are described in the “Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques” section.
If the marth is doing his upB to the ledge, then it is possible to either fsmash, dtilt, or short hop to dair (harder to time and takes practice).
If the marth is approaching above the stage, then a dash to crouch canceled fsmash or wavedash to fsmash work. It is also possible to dash and at the last moment before falling off the ledge move the control stick to the neutral position. This immediately puts marth in the standing position and able to fsmash. It works for other characters as well.
If the marth is approaching near the ledge but not close enough to grab it, then it is possible to do a wavedash off the stage to a fast falled ledge grab then immediately short hop dair to the stage and spike the other marth. I learned from Mew2King who did it to me, and it's very flashy and satisfying when pulled off correctly. The fast falled ledge grab is described in the “Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques” section.
Things marth should do:
wavedash out of shield if the other marth fsmashes and grab
dash attack if the other marth is dash dancing then combo from there
Grab a lot.
Dtilt a lot. Wavedash to dtilt, crouch cancel a dash to dtilt, and dtilt when edge guarding if marth wants to get up on the stage and also when he does upB to the stage.
Always DI down when grabbed. It prevents chaingrabbing past 6%, fthrow->fsmash hits, and dthrow->fsmash hits.
DI away ASAP if hit by a fair. In fact, anticipate getting hit and DI away before receiving the blow.
Fast fall before using the upB to return to the stage in order to make it harder to time a fsmash.
Things Marth should NOT do:
fsmash a lot unless the other marth can't wavedash out of shield to punish it
Full jump. The marth that's below has the advantage, because marth's priority lies in front and above him. Always short hop, and that's the case for most match-ups.
Mewtwo:
Mr. Game & Watch:
Ness:
Peach: This is a fairly unique match-up for marth that will definitely require a change of style.
Approaching Peach:
Peach has a high priority dash attack that can catch marth's feet when short hopping or landing, so full jumped fairs work well. Walking away from peach and waiting for her to move, then attacking her is effective. Also, jumping backwards and fairing peach works well. Since peach's main move against marth when on the ground is her dash attack, expect it when approaching her. Run up and cancel the run with a shield as necessary. If she hits the shield, then marth can either grab or jump out of the shield and dair peach.
Peach has one of the best crouch cancels in the game along with Samus. If she crouch cancels, then dairs and grabs work well. One thing that must be learned early on is to NOT HOLD DOWN. Do not crouch cancel against peach and be careful with dtilt.
Peach has turnips (watch out for the stitched face!) and many peaches love to spam them. When approaching a peach with a turnip and if she attacks while throwing one, marth's nair works well in cutting through the turnip and peach. It's best not to catch any turnips because marth can't use any moves while holding one, and it takes marth longer to throw a turnip than peach. Instead, prevent peach from grabbing more turnips by dash attacking when she predictably pulls another. However, it is possible to catch a turnip on the ground and air by pressing A when it is about to hit marth. A safer way to do the same thing is to air dodge and press A, because then marth can't be hit if he misses the turnip.
Marth has a fthrow chaingrab on peach at early percentages up to about 20%. Take advantage of it and get in a fsmash. Sometimes marth can catch peach off guard and hit her with a tippered fsmash at higher percentages if she misses the DI.
Recovering for marth:
Peach will usually try to hit marth with turnips during his recovery. When thrown horizontally at marth, avoid the turnip by either falling without a side B, jumping, swatting it away with a fair, or grabbing it. When thrown vertically down at marth, move either further in or away from the stage and delay the up B as necessary to avoid getting hit. Sometimes it is inevitable that marth will get hit by a turnip.
Defending against Peach:
When defending against a peach, if she is coming to grab then dash dance away then back in to grab her. Perform extra dash dances as necessary depending on whether she is sidestep-happy. If she dash attacks, then shield. If she is floating with a fair coming, then get the heck out of there with a wavedash (out of shield), dash, or roll as necessary. Do not attempt to out-prioritize her moves. At most, marth can preempt her moves with a fair.
Edge guarding against Peach:
When edge guarding, peach will sometimes have a jump until she has to use her up B. Try to hit peach with a fair or bair so that she has to use her up B, because it makes her recovery more difficult (no air dodge). If she has her jump, then peaches will usually either air dodge to the stage or fair. Never fsmash at peach when she is recovering, because she will always air dodge and punish marth. Use utilt instead. Peach hates the utilt, so abuse it on her. If peach has already used her jump, then the best thing to do is to make sure she lands on the ledge and not on the stage. Peach has a hard time getting from the ledge to the stage. When she is over 100%, it is usually safe to fsmash or utilt her as she rolls or jumps up on stage. Otherwise, a grab or dtilt is probably the best choice.
Note: It is sometimes possible to dair or bair peach while she is recovering depending on her height.
On most stages, peach dies at 140-150% by utilt. On Dreamland she can live up until 170-180% from an utilt. Tippered fsmashes can be very useful against peach on most levels and lead to an early death for her. She is so slow that it is hard for her to punish fsmashes other than dash attacking before marth can get off the fsmash.
Pichu:
Pikachu:
Roy:
Samus: One of marth's good match-ups, but it can be difficult if played incorrectly.
Approaching samus:
Approach with dtilt. Marth's goal should be to get samus in the air, and once samus is in the air, fair combo samus and get her off the stage. If samus is spamming missiles just fair or nair or ftilt through them. Anything marth does goes through missiles. Marth can even destroy a partially charged beam shot.
Edge guarding samus:
Bair from the stage or from the ledge works well on samus to hurt her recovery (she is vulnerable in morph ball form). If samus does get to the ledge, most samus players will grapple since it is safer than using the up B. Always stay on the stage (don't grab the ledge) when samus recovers. If the samus player messes up on the grapple, then samus will rise up above the ledge and become susceptible to a dtilt or fsmash. If she is hit by that, then samus is very vulnerable when recovering because once she has used her grapple once, she can no longer use it until she lands on the stage. Grab the ledge if samus is far out, but be careful because her up B will catch marth if he is vulnerable when on the ledge. Otherwise, a dtilt or fsmash should finish her off.
Recovering against samus:
When recovering, marth will have to get through missiles and beam shots and possibly a spike from samus (her nair). Marth can fair through the missiles (side B does not work!) and fall below them or jump over them. Samus may try to fall off the stage and nair marth when performing the second jump to grab the ledge, so see it coming and drop lower to up B to the ledge.
Things marth should do:
dash attack if samus is about to shoot a missile. Marth runs beneath the missiles and it works well to start combos.
Remain patient throughout the entire match. This match can take forever, but just keep calm and wait for samus to return to the stage to get edge guarded again by an utilt or dtilt.
Note: Avoid samus's grapple grab by jumping. She can pull out an extended grapple too, so watch out.
Yoshi:
Young Link:
Zelda: In this match-up, watch out for Zelda's fair/bair and her grab. Take advantage of the fact that she is incredibly slow and her recovery is very punishable.
Sheik:
V. Stage Guide
Generally speaking, marth does well on small stages and poorly on large stages. He also likes platforms within fsmash tipper range, such as on Yoshi's Story, FoD, and Battlefield. Marth's game revolves largely around his superior edge guarding skills, plus his up B is laggy so marth needs a stage with a ledge for both edge guarding and recovery. Marth's best stages are Yoshi's Story, FoD, and Battlefield. He is still good on FD and Pokemon Stadium. You will see other characters counter pick marth on virtually every other stage: Kongo Jungle, Corneria, Mute City, Onett, DL64, Rainbow Cruise, Green Greens, and Poke Floats. This is why it is good to have fox as a secondary for non-neutral stage counter picks.
Princess Peach's Castle: Very bad stage for marth; switch to fox. Marth has no space to maneuver here, and a good fox or falco will destroy marth due to the walls (shines).
Great Bay (banned)
Brinstar: Alright stage for marth. Focus on gimpy edge guarding kills when the stage is high up so the fire doesn't save the opponent.
Yoshi's Story (Neutral): Many characters will automatically ban YS against marth. The characters that might not are fox (low ceiling), falco (little room for marth to maneuver, fsmash for edge guard works less due to tilted stage at ledge, plus not much horizontal distance for easy KOs), and marth. Flying fish (Shy Guys) can be annoying, but it's that way for both marth and his opponent.
Note that marth's dtilt reaches further down than expected when he is on the tip of the stage because the stage angles down at that point. It can lead to an unexpected death for an opponent who approaches too high. Also keep in mind that YS is shallow; marth must be careful when going off stage to fair or neutral B.
Fountain of Dreams (Neutral, banned in Doubles): This stage has good platforms for marth, a mid range ceiling (good vs fox), and the edge is easier to edge guard for marth than Yoshi's Story. On the other hand, the stage's platforms keep changing heights which makes grabbing harder. Plus, marth is not helped much by the lower of the two platforms because other characters can hit marth whether he is on the ground or on the platform or air (peach, spacies, sheik), and marth has trouble if he has to recover on a platform.
Corneria: Poor stage for marth, particularly vs fox, sheik and pikachu (low ceiling). Try to pressure the opponent toward the edge and hit them off. Also beware of the firing ship. Be careful of the right section of the stage because fox can shine combo marth there.
Pokemon Stadium (Neutral): A good stage for marth; the platforms can be fsmash tippered and it has a lot of space to maneuver, similar to FD. The best thing to do when the stage changes formation is to just camp until it goes back to normal—unless marth is winning by a comfortable amount, of course. Be careful when recovering to not hold over on the joystick because marth will up B underneath the stage. The stage tends to be more difficult to sweet spot.
Mute City (banned in Doubles): Marth will see many peaches counter pick here. It is still possible to win, but it is definitely a tough stage because it has no ledge.
Onett: One of fox's counter pick stages against marth because of the low ceiling and walls to shine.
Mushroom Kingdom:
Icicle Mountain (banned):
Battlefield (Neutral): A good stage for marth that is sometimes used as a marth counterpick. In respect to the other neutral stages, it has a fair size width and ceiling (and floor).
Dream Land (N64) (Neutral):
Kongo Jungle (N64):
Rainbow Cruise:
Jungle Japes:
Hyrule Temple (banned)
Brinstar Depths (banned)
Yoshi's Island:
Green Greens:
Venom:
Poke Floats:
Big Blue:
Fourside (banned in Singles):
Mushroom Kingdom II:
Flat Zone (banned)
Final Destination (Neutral):
Yoshi's Island (N64) (banned)
VI. Tricks and Super Advanced Techniques
VII. Becoming Good
This is what it's all about – becoming good so you can beat your friends, place well at tournaments, and best of all enjoy the game to the fullest. Whatever your motivation to get better, you're here reading this guide for that reason, and I can tell you that with time and practice, you will improve. Many people improve at different rates depending on their circumstances, natural ability, and effort. It's ultimately up to you to improve, but I am offering my advice on what I believe are good methods to improve your game.
There are three ways to improve your technical ability without another human to act as a sandbag: Training Mode, Single Player vs cpus, and Single Player with a second controller plugged into the gamecube and no human controlling it. I do not advise using Training Mode because it disables the C-stick and it is not good training to practice at different speeds of game play. It's important to learn how to wavedash, waveland, l-cancel, etc at normal game speed. Practice technical moves by yourself in Single Player against a human player; that will offer the most realistic training experience. Once you have mastered the technical stuff, practice it against a lvl1 cpu (it offers an experience most similar to a human; do NOT play lvl9 cpus!!) in a 99 stock match with no time limit. Then try it out versus a human. You should learn what works and what does not by watching videos of pro players. You may notice that your game gets worse when you implement new techniques. That is natural, just stick with it and you'll learn when to use those techniques and develop mindgames.
Watching videos is an important aspect of improving. There is a marth video archive stickied in the marth forums – use it! When watching videos, consider exactly what is happening. If marth grabs the other character, why and when did he do it? At what percentage was the other character? Which way did marth throw them? How did marth follow up the throw? Did he dash attack, wait for their tech, fair, etc? If marth fsmashes, what did he do before fsmashing? Where was the other character and what were they doing when marth fsmashed? Analyze all aspects of the game and you will discover new things. There should always be a cycle of improvement: if you're a beginner, then you will need to read lots of guides for all the different characters and become familiar with their strengths and weaknesses. All players should watch videos, practice techniques or combos by themselves or preferably with a group of friends, go to tournaments and smashfests to play a variety of players and learn new techniques by experiencing others using them on you, then repeat the cycle.
Some people believe that you are only as good as your competition. This is largely true; try to find the best players and figure out why they are winning. One reason why you want to find the best players is they are who you will imitate when you play. Don't play anyone less than the best because it is like limiting yourself. On the other hand, you need to make sure you can understand what those better players are doing against you. That is where your personal study of the game will help.
Remember, Smash is just like any other thing in life; with discipline practicing a bit every day, you will become an excellent smasher before you know it. You get out of Smash what you put into it. Just treat it like what it is – a game. Remember at tournaments and in money matches, crew battles etc that you are playing a game. Let that fact shape your attitude. Enjoy the people you meet, make friends, and most importantly – have fun!
Good luck,
UMBC Super Smasher
VIII. Updates
04/23/08 - First published to Smashboards
