I found evidence that Ike doesn't have invisible lag, and he has 3 quick attacks

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Were you at the demo? If so, I'd like to here your opinion about Ike's U-Air, B-Air, and N-air.

U-Air- comes out at a moderate speed, but alot of ending lag and not that much priority

B-Air- Comes out the fastest off all of his aerials, but has a heavy amount of ending lag

N-air- Moderate speed, and has the best priority of sll of his aerials. An all around useful aerial.

 

[Hellbeing]

I'm not against you Gimpyfish, but I have to ask , how long did you play as Ike? I know there were long lines, the matches were only 2 minutes, and you didn't play as Ike all the time.

Ive been saying that all along...

 

[Nodonn]

If a guy like Gimpy calls Ike unbearibly (sp?) slow, you know there's something wrong.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Dude, you're amazing.

Honestly, Skill > Tier. Also, if all you competitive players wanna just flame and rant about SLLOOOWW Ike is, and how he has such a terrible moveset, then just keep those thoughts to yourself. I myself actually think he'd be a slower character, but hey, I'd play him just because I'm a FE fanboy.

Most of the people talking about Ike's speed probably haven't even actually TRIED using him yet. They just base it off some crap quality videos (no offense to yours though, Rhyfelwyr) and other people's posts and say "Oh, Ike is such slow and useless ****, I don't even wanna use him!"

Seriously. just STOP TALKING about how "bad" Ike is. Rhy is just trying to boost the currently "low" status of Ike, and trying to raise the morale of those who are disappointed.

And most important: THE FINAL VERSION IS NOT OUT YET. THE VIDS WERE ALL DEMOS.
This fact should be taken into account the most. Once the final version comes out, THEN you can flame or praise Ike all you want.

The videos aren't mine, and they are low-quality.

A character shouldn't be completely praised, like Metaknight, or totally dismissed, such as Ike. We are free to speculate on these characters, but for even the people who played the demo, our knowledge is limited, and the game could change.

U-Air- comes out at a moderate speed, but alot of ending lag and not that much priority

B-Air- Comes out the fastest off all of his aerials, but has a heavy amount of ending lag

N-air- Moderate speed, and has the best priority of sll of his aerials. An all around useful aerial.

So Ike does have some okay moves in regards to speed. I've been only hearing people say that Ike has only slow attacks.

If a guy like Gimpy calls Ike unbearibly (sp?) slow, you know there's something wrong.

I'm not apt to believe Gimpyfish, or the videos first. There seems to be an inconsistency between the two, and I only want to have things cleared up.

 

[ripman3]

I have a question, how can you disprove INVISIBLE lag on a video? I thought the whole point of it being INVISIBLE LAG is that you can't really notice it on videos. I like Ike. I want him to be good. But from what people who have actually played him have said, he is pretty crap and I am inclined to believe a first hand experience.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

The point of lag is that there's a delay before the attack. Using the first attack of a sequence as a reference, you shouldn't be able to see another attack start right after it, if it had invisible lag.

 

[GenG]

The point of lag is that there's a delay before the attack. Using the first attack of a sequence as a reference, you shouldn't be able to see another attack start right after it, if it had invisible lag.

Unless you could buffer them.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

There is the possibility that Ike's move just have awesome IASA properties, which could explain the existence of invisible lag, while still allowing these strings to be shown.

I already mentioned the possibility.

All I've been saying is that I've found evidence, not facts.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I personally feel that ssbb is going to be more balanced than melee was. And I know that when the game still isn't finished, and when no one has actually mastered ike, it's pointless to even hint that he sucks, at this point everyone just sucks with him. Ike is gonna kick some *** when the game comes out, and when ppl learn how to play with him.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Just my 2 cents :

I think Ike will do ok in a 1vs1 if someone skilled who knows everything about ike plays him, like gimpyfish does with bowser, chudat with game and watch etc etc.

It will be AWESOME to see pro Ike vids, slow but really smart play, knowing how to get those big hitting moves, and set them up with good spacing, excellent mindgames, and hopefully a FEW quick moves, well have to see...

 

[Tom]

Just my 2 cents :

I think Ike will do ok in a 1vs1 if someone skilled who knows everything about ike plays him, like gimpyfish does with bowser, chudat with game and watch etc etc.

It will be AWESOME to see pro Ike vids, slow but really smart play, knowing how to get those big hitting moves, and set them up with good spacing, excellent mindgames, and hopefully a FEW quick moves, well have to see...

Actually, you're right. And seeing as how Mike G has already said that he is going to not only main Ike but also shut himself in his apartment for a month once the game comes out (LOL! Man cave!), I think we'll have some nice Ike tactics. :D

 

[Speedsk8er]

Call me crazy but....

Invisible lag.....? O_o

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

The idea that Ike has invisible lag was first brought up by Gimpyfish, who we all know went to E for All. He's told us that when playing Ike, it felt like he would first do absolutely nothing, then show an animation for start-up lag, and finally attack.

 

[Nodonn]

A bit offtopic but..
Ryfel your avatar looks like a twisted Rebecca from FE7
Might also have something to do with me playing that game too much >_>

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

The avatar is Serge from Crono Cross, but wow, I do see what you're talking about. The angle and expression of the face is identical.

P.S. If something is off-topic, and is directed at a single person, you should private message them by clicking on their name.

 

[Endless Nightmares]

What is this "invisible lag" you're talking about? Do you mean a break between when you press the move and when the move actually starts? Or a period at the end of the move where you can't do anything?

Anyway, in Melee, every move has a concept called "IASA" frames, which stands for "interruptable as soon as". For moves that have good IASA frames, another move can be performed during the ending lag of the move (Marth's dtilt is a good example). So maybe Ike's moves have good IASA time at the end where the lag can be ended sooner by performing another move.

EDIT: Oh, I see IASA has already been discussed. Oh wellz

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

You know how slow moves in Melee always had an animation showing the start-up? I.E. Ganondorf lifting his leg when he does his U-tilt. Ike has that too, but he is said to have another lag even before that, which you can't see

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

This whole thread is stupid because it contradicts what was actually played by Gimpyfish. Seriously, stop hunting for "evidence". Just wait for the game to come out. Is it really that hard?

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Aren't you being a little harsh? If we shouldn't talk about the game until it comes out, then SWF should just close down until Feb.

You could put your statement in vice versa, and say that Gimpyfish is contradicting the videos. I'm not trying to call him a liar, and I was supporting what Gimpyfish said at first. It's just that after looking at the videos, I'm kinda confused. You can call me stupid for being confused, but could you at least make me smart, and explain things to me?

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Aren't you being a little harsh? If we shouldn't talk about the game until it comes out, then SWF should just close down until Feb.

You could put your statement in vice versa, and say that Gimpyfish is contradicting the videos. I'm not trying to call him a liar, and I was supporting what Gimpyfish said at first. It's just that after looking at the videos, I'm kinda confused. You can call me stupid for being confused, but could you at least make me smart, and explain things to me?

But that's my point. I'm not saying speculation is bad. I'm saying, speculate about something else for a while. You seem hellbent on finding Ike's fast moves despite Gimpy's impressions. Just find out when the game comes out! On top of all that, Ike will probably be tweaked between now and the final release, so none of it will matter anyway.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

I'm hellbent? 0_o All I've done is respond to the others who've posted here. Well, maybe I am a little too motivated. I'm going to main Ike, that could be why.

But Eternal Pheonix Fire did say those three aerials have decent speed, which was never mentioned anywhere before to my understanding.

 

[Chaosblade77]

I find it difficult to believe that so many people know exactly who they are going to main. Especially those who try to find ways around the fact certain characters are clearly not as good as others as far as what we have seen, which is all we can go off of. Yes, what was seen was a demo, but we have no idea what will be changed from the demo to the actual game. So the argument that "he MIGHT get fixed" is just as valid as "he might NOT get fixed."

I am not saying that tiers are greater than skill, but when you can not only pick up and play, but master another character that you still like with much more ease, I doubt you will continue to main the former due to the extra effort. You might use said character as a secondary, but I doubt you would actually main him. You [plural, to the group] might still main said character, I just doubt it.

Now for a more optimistic point, I am not an Ike hater. I am not saying that Ike sucks in general, only that he did not play as well as the other characters. I love Fire Emblem and Ike will probably be the first character I try out in Brawl, and I would love to main him. But I am willing to admit he has issues via the demo that may or may not be solved before the game's release. I am hoping they fix the speed issues, especially since the super armor, among other things, was also buggy. If he is not fixed, I will see that for myself and use him on occasion, but main someone else.

~Realism.

 

[Black Waltz]

honestly, those were the slowest attacks ive seen. it was like bowser fsmash three times. >.> im planning on maining ike, but i still flame his crappyness, so doesnt matter if youre going to maining him or not. ike will pretty much suck *** if he doesnt get some decent recovery/attacks/speed/everything.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

I find it difficult to believe that so many people know exactly who they are going to main. Especially those who try to find ways around the fact certain characters are clearly not as good as others as far as what we have seen, which is all we can go off of. Yes, what was seen was a demo, but we have no idea what will be changed from the demo to the actual game. So the argument that "he MIGHT get fixed" is just as valid as "he might NOT get fixed."

I am not saying that tiers are greater than skill, but when you can not only pick up and play, but master another character that you still like with much more ease, I doubt you will continue to main the former due to the extra effort. You might use said character as a secondary, but I doubt you would actually main him. You [plural, to the group] might still main said character, I just doubt it.

Now for a more optimistic point, I am not an Ike hater. I am not saying that Ike sucks in general, only that he did not play as well as the other characters. I love Fire Emblem and Ike will probably be the first character I try out in Brawl, and I would love to main him. But I am willing to admit he has issues via the demo that may or may not be solved before the game's release. I am hoping they fix the speed issues, especially since the super armor, among other things, was also buggy. If he is not fixed, I will see that for myself and use him on occasion, but main someone else.

~Realism.

Although a good read, this really belongs in the "Who's going to main Ike?" thread.

 

[Chaosblade77]

Although a good read, this really belongs in the "Who's going to main Ike?" thread.

It was a reply to a lot of things in this thread. I didn't want to quote a page and a half worth of posts though. XD

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

I thought you were just posting about my small comment on maining Ike, which really seemed like going off on a tangent.

I'm thinking of closing this thread. Everything that can be said, I think has been said, and I know people are going to come in without reading the whole thread, and post an old question.

 

[geemann2236]

Listen, Ike is slow. Slow slow slow. He's so slow that u cannot imagine, slow slow slow. SLOOOW... There is no hidden lag or anything. He's SLOW. You used videos as evidence that he was fast, but I played him at E-4-All, AND HE WAS FREAKING SLOW!!! Lol, bye.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

I was never trying to make Ike out to be fast.

Wait a minute. Did you say there's no hidden lag?! Please expound!