How to play DK at competitive level

[Hiphiphooray]

I love getting nasty dk punch combos and want to play dk versus some of my friends. However, my friends play characters like ness, pikachu and kirby, so when i play with DK i constantly get downspiked at low percentages. So heres my questions:

1. I see pros that play with DK always jumping and changing direction while charging dk punch. what is this all about?
2. I always die when trying to recover with DK. How can i improve his recovery? sometimes ill be right at the edge using DK's upB (spin recovery move) and i wont be facing the edge and will never grab on, how can i fix this?
3. and what are some basic DK combos I can work on? Not videos or anything, but just stuff like using downB into DK punch or Fair spike. Or some combos using Uair or Dair.

thanks

 

[tacos]

I love getting nasty dk punch combos and want to play dk versus some of my friends. However, my friends play characters like ness, pikachu and kirby, so when i play with DK i constantly get downspiked at low percentages. So heres my questions:

1. I see pros that play with DK always jumping and changing direction while charging dk punch. what is this all about?
2. I always die when trying to recover with DK. How can i improve his recovery? sometimes ill be right at the edge using DK's upB (spin recovery move) and i wont be facing the edge and will never grab on, how can i fix this?
3. and what are some basic DK combos I can work on? Not videos or anything, but just stuff like using downB into DK punch or Fair spike. Or some combos using Uair or Dair.

thanks

U should of used this thread http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=237869

1.Well people usally cancel the charge (jump press R or Z while charging) to confuse there opponents,just charge normally, or when you hit somebody with a F-air and you are a little far away from the edge you want to, quickly charge the opposite way, cancel, then up b so you can grab the edge.If you would do it without the charge cancel you would be backwards which you won't be able to grab the edge.
2.Try to move back and forth a little bit to confuse your opponent. You could also use up b a little below the edge to avoid not getting hit head on
3.Just see this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJX3n41eax0

 

[ballin4life]

Grab a lot. DK's grab is really good and it has good range too

 

[felipe_9595]

1 No, is a method to charge the Giant Punch
2 IF you are facing the opposite direction of a dedge, change it with the giant punch }
3 Droping uair platfroms combos, DK is a lot better on dreamland doing this

 

[ciaza]

1. grab
2. bthrow / fthrow>upB
3. up B whenever under pressure
4. ???
5. Profit

On a serious note for comboes learn Dk's plat drop uair combos. Easy to learn and effective. Learn to ledge DI, it can help out when recovering. Especially learn that special Dreamland ledge Di to send you over the stage.

 

[Sempiternity]

One of the key combos that works on nearly every character at low percentages is Grab>Jump>F-throw>Up+B. It'll take some practice to nail down the timing, but it works great for getting your opponents off the edge early for some cheap edgeguards. Especially useful against Ness!

You can use the Punch cancel to turn around in the air. Say, you jump off the edge in an edgeguard, but realize that your Fair is out of range, and instead, you want to Bair. Simply hold toward the edge, press B, then Z right away (do this all as fast as you can), and DK will be facing the opposite direction, ready for a Bair.

Punch cancels are best done following a jump (at the top of a jump) to avoid falling down too far. It can be useful also in turning around after attacking off the edge, and discovering that you won't make it back up facing away from the edge. Grabbing the edge is very important in DK's recovery, as his vertical height blows, so make sure you're ALWAYS FACING THE EDGE when performing your Up+B recovery.

Try to plow through opponents when recovering with Up+B, but don't get caught underneath them. DK's arms are invincible, so you can go through many attacks horizontally.

Use Up+B on the ground a lot to get breathing room. It has a fixed knockback, so it will get you space even at low percentages. Can be used out of a shield, too, making this tactic invaluable.

On Dreamland, practice Uair platform chains (look for videos).

On Hyrule, Grab>Jump>F-throw against the right side of the tent>Jump>Dair. Simple spike combo, but very effective. Many other moves can be substituted for the Dair, but that is classic DK right there, and it looks flashy, to boot.

The Fair spike hit bounces enemies off the ground at an angle like Falcon's, so if you land that near an edge, be prepared to finish with another spike while they're in hitstun over the edge.

 

[Sangoku]

My problem is that most people would just instantly get out of cargo and I won't even have time to jump and throw.

I wonder if they could really do that on console (I doubt it), but it's so annoying.... fucs up every combos.

 

[Sempiternity]

You should get time to jump and throw. You're probably playing keyboard users who can mash every button in sight with all ten of their fingers to escape immediately.

 

[ciaza]

I know controller users who can break out of cargo hold instantly, I blame their melee quick fingers.

 

[Sempiternity]

The thing is, most of the time, when I land grabs, I make sure to put them on my back instantly, in the hopes of gaining an extra second or so where the opponent doesn't see it coming, and can't react as fast, thus giving me the time to throw.

 

[felipe_9595]

this the formula

grab, chargo (At the instant) Jump ann press at the same time.

 

[ciaza]

Who isn't going to put them on the back straight away if they planned to do a fthrow? They don't gain anything by just sitting there holding them in their arms.

 

[Pi]

Who isn't going to put them on the back straight away if they planned to do a fthrow? They don't gain anything by just sitting there holding them in their arms.

disagree
some times it's nice to just cuddle

 

[cheeseball341]

(06:29:09PM) <ciaza> oi
(06:29:17PM) <ciaza> you can break out of cargo hold instantly right?
(06:29:25PM) <1der> dk grab?
(06:29:30PM) <ciaza> yeah
(06:29:32PM) <1der> ezpz
(06:29:40PM) <ciaza> some guy on smashboards was like nup i can throw>upb every time ezpz
(06:29:46PM) <ciaza> doesnt matter how fast they are
(06:29:50PM) <1der> I'm pre sure its always possible to break out before being thrown.
(06:29:53PM) <1der> No matter the percent

In conclusion, your opponents have probs never played mario party and learned how to mash out correctly.

 

[Dsc]

Rom always breaks out literally after like a second..
Freaking Rom.

 

[ciaza]

Rom has hax for fast button pushing though.

 

[Dsc]

i actually think hes haxing it up. coz he does use hax DI sometimes just for fun..like..insane DI. He's a plain cheater. hope you read this Rom2014.

 

[blaze3927]

i really dont mind rom using macro's except when for the occasional insande di stock saving moment.
i can spam out of a dk fthrow-upb most of the time (B spam) if i can be bothered going for the thumb hurt, hurts my thumb like hell.
it seems that with official n64 controller, there has to be a delay when hitting two different types of buttons or else the input isnt registered.
this is most noticeable with c buttons and B. where in my experience if i tap one then the other very quickly, the shorthop will occur but no B button registered.
so im guessing that if this is a standard trait among n64 controllers (more research required obv) then tapping two buttons, (aka spamming A & B) to escape a cargo grab may be less efficient than just tapping B or a alone?

 

[Sempiternity]

I have noticed that. This happens when trying to perform an aerial or something right away, like the timing needed to complete a Uair>Falcon Punch combo with the punch. I haven't done tests with other control schemes, but there is definitely a delay of sorts that sometimes ruins my aerials (i.e. they don't come out).

 

[ciaza]

If your aerials don't come out it's probably because you're pushing A or B during the jump animation.

 

[Gammelnorsk]

spam nair up and off of dreamland platforms

works great

 

[felipe_9595]

wanna see a person break out of a good cargo on console.

 

[rpotts]

wanna see a person break out of a good cargo on console.

I do. At low precents it's not that hard.

->A
<-B
->A
<-B
->A
<-B
->A
<-B
repeat

 

[ballin4life]

If your aerials don't come out it's probably because you're pushing A or B during the jump animation.

Yeah this. It's not a delay with the controller. It's the fact that your character is still on the ground in his pre jump animation and you can't do anything during that.

 

[felipe_9595]

I do. At low precents it's not that hard.

->A
<-B
->A
<-B
->A
<-B
->A
<-B
repeat

yeah, but i mean a perfect cargo, is almost imposible.

 

[DMoogle]

I do. At low precents it's not that hard.

I'm pretty sure percentage doesn't affect how difficult it is to break out.

 

[blaze3927]

If your aerials don't come out it's probably because you're pushing A or B during the jump animation.

so you reckon animations?
ill test it out later on the input register on pc

on another note, does anyone know how when tapping getting out of a stationary cargo hold, how to end up behind donkey kong? is it character specific (like how kirby always ends up in front )

 

[Sempiternity]

I had thought of the animation thing. That's how you do short hops, yeah? You release the jump button before your character completes the jump animation. I knew all that, yet still it seemed like I had issues with attacks not coming out fast enough. They say that a good method for a jumping Falcon Punch is to slide from the c-button to the B-button, but that's too fast, apparently.

We should get a compilation of jump animation frames together. It'd be interesting to see who is easiest to shorthop with. Even though Falcon is the fastest, it seems like he's one of the easier to short hop with...

 

[ballin4life]

Link has the longest jump animation methinks. Falcon is pretty long too.

 

[Sempiternity]

It's kinda counter-intuitive. DK seems to have a very quick jump animation, while some of the more limber characters spend all the time in the world on the ground.

It makes more sense in the subsequent Smash Bros. games where the quick nimble characters are tough to short hop with, but chunky characters like Bowser and Ganondorf are easy.

 

[Gowa]

in melee, i can consistently short shop with everyone except for samus, sheik, and fox.

not that it matters but i'd just like to throw it out there

 

[Sempiternity]

And I feel like Sheik and Fox are two of the fastest characters in that game, so that makes sense. Samus is just floaty and, well... Samus.

I guess.

 

[3mmanu3lrc]

Yeah this. It's not a delay with the controller. It's the fact that your character is still on the ground in his pre jump animation and you can't do anything during that.

Actually, if you press A during that animation, you're gonna perform an UpSmash.
Any C buttom + A(while the jump animation is still going on) = UpSmash. Without using the stick at all.

 

[ciaza]

I'm not buying it. I tried in 1/4 speed training mode with multiple characters to no avail.

 

[Sempiternity]

I don't think that holds true. However, if you stick jump, then release the stick before the jump animation finishes, and then press A, you will do an Up Smash. Or maybe that's wrong, too. I can't remember!

 

[3mmanu3lrc]

I'd make a vid, but I don't have a camera to record my hand holding the controller while doing it though, so you won't believe me anyway... *-)

 

[ballin4life]

Actually, if you press A during that animation, you're gonna perform an UpSmash.
Any C buttom + A(while the jump animation is still going on) = UpSmash. Without using the stick at all.

Pretty sure this is only if you smash the stick upwards.

 

[blaze3927]

Pretty sure this is only if you smash the stick upwards.

i can confirm that it happens to me when im just tilting up

 

[SSBPete]

i actually think hes haxing it up. coz he does use hax DI sometimes just for fun..like..insane DI. He's a plain cheater. hope you read this Rom2014.

my god i just thought he had really ridiculously good di!
i hate when he mario and luigi tornado saves..and i dont even bother fthrowing him with dk anymore

also im pretty sure you can upsmash after pressing a c button

 

[3mmanu3lrc]

also im pretty sure you can upsmash after pressing a c button

inb4...
THANKS!!!