How to buff Dedede?

[greatbernard]

Up-B (Super Jump)
+ Projectiles distance +25%

Side-B (Gordo Throw)
+ Startup lag decreased by 20%
+ Gordo's only inflict half damage to King Dedede

Down-B (Jet Hammer)
+ 20% less start-up lag
+ 20% greater hitbox
+ Reflects projectiles [that it has priority over]

Grab
+ 20% greater hitbox

F/B Air + F-Smash
- inflicts 30% less damage
+ 30% less startup-lag
+ 30% less ending lag

 

[Jabejazz]

Side-B being not reflectable with a damage nerf to compensate would make me the happiest penguin. The rest I can live without.

 

[Lavani]

Side-B being not reflectable with a damage nerf to compensate would make me the happiest penguin. The rest I can live without.

This, a thousand times this.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Seconded on the Gordo.

Smooth Criminal

 

[A_male_platypus]

Jabejazz has a picture of me running on the grass for his sig

I would love for Gordo's to not be reflected, and that is really all. I'm surprised you have issue with the DownB actually, I've managed to sneak a lot of kills in with it because it starts up relatively fast, and has more knockback than his Fair. I always change my L-trigger to jump, so it's very easy to start the Jethammer, and do a quick jump to catch people falling back to stage. No one ever expects it

 

[Nick Fury]

The thing is, IF the gordo was unreflectable, he would easily be the best character in the game imo, but, reduced dmg to D3 would be a godsend. PLS NINTENDO

 

[TTTTTsd]

Gordos should just disappear when the opponent damages them enough. As it is right now Dedede's most respectable long distance option doesn't even have to be respected at all, which seems counterintuitive. Clanking gordos or something of that kind wouldn't be OP, it would give him a lot to work with.

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

Honestly, I'd be fine with reflectable Gordos if only the knock back wasn't so goshdarn high.
Half damage is also a good idea.

And while I'm not complaining about it, it would sure be nice if the Jet Hammer was as fast as it is in PM... One can dream...

 

[dean.]

It seems like the balancing team attempts to balance the roster by emphasising character flaws and weaknesses rather than making more rounded characters, unless something is brazenly too good. This is why Sheik's kill power and Little Mac's recovery were nerfed, rather than those character's strong points.

Considering this for Dedede. I do feel that Dedede is a fairly mediocre character that could do with some buffs. As a heavy character Dedede's strengths would probably focus on his range, damage output and kill potential. There's nothing wrong with Dedede's range or damage (nearly every move does a good 10%+), but personally I feel like Dedede's kill power is somewhat lacking - you ain't gonna be hitting anyone with fsmash. Therefore some possible buffs could include:

• Increased grab range. It's not especially small but I don't feel it's currently especially large either. Would help our OoS game a bit.
• Increased fair knockback. Big-ass slow laggy hammer swing is weaker than jab? This move constantly surprises me with how weak it is.
• Increased utilt knockback. Not as ridiculous as Brawl but making this a kill move before 170% might be nice. I currently feel this move has limited application outside of comboing into it from nair at early percentages.
• Increased bthrow knockback. Could combine this with point 1 to make him a real "grappler"-type character, even more than he already is. Downing KO percentages from 200% to more 150% would be sweet.

Don't need all these buffs (since we don't want him becoming overbuffed or anything). I would love as much as anyone for Gordo changes but I cannot see it happening for the life of me. I'm surprised he was even nerfed in 1.0.4 - although I suppose they did base some of their decisions off of For Glory. I do feel Dedede is quite strong on Wi-Fi compared to most of the cast.

 

[Jabejazz]

I really miss our old UTilt, that move alone gave us some pretty amazing advantages on stages with low ceilings.

Killing people off the top in Halberd at ~80% was incredible. Right now UTilt feels extremely underwhelming and in my case, it sees very little use in-game. Does it even have those invincibility frames in the start of the animation?

 

[Soul Train]

This, a thousand times this.

No gordo reflecting? You guys are missing out on one of the most hilarious parts of D3 playstyle. I'm currently working on a D3 guide/walkthrough, but here's a fun bit.

http://youtu.be/wr06c-wySmk

 

[Smooth Criminal]

...okay?

That can easily be used against us.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Jabejazz]

No gordo reflecting? You guys are missing out on one of the most hilarious parts of D3 playstyle. I'm currently working on a D3 guide/walkthrough, but here's a fun bit.

http://youtu.be/wr06c-wySmk

It's funny, but in no way really useful in any given matchup.

 

[Soul Train]

It's funny, but in no way really useful in any given matchup.

I agree.

Every time we throw out a gordo, we take a risk. But with decent spacing and timing of Nair/Bair/dodges, that risk can be mitigated. Sure the video's mostly fun; a good villager wouldn't fall for that twice in a row. But as long as we have more experience with gordos on our side, the risk will smack them more often.

 

[Jabejazz]

Definitely agree that we need to make the most out of what we have, and in the case of Gordo Throw, it's about minimizing the risks when throwing it. Usually that means using them on surfaces where the resulting bounce isn't expected.

On stages such as FD, there's very little use to be found in the move outside of edgeguarding. But as the stage selection expands drastically on Wii U, so are surfaces where we can use Gordo in quirky ways.

I made fairly decent usage out of Gordo in YI:B's slopes on the 3DS version, and there's definitely a lot more to do with them on Wii U. Lylat Cruise, DK64, Skyloft to cite a few all have some interesting layouts that can be exploited.

I still don't think the move will be amazing on such stages, but it'll be less ****ty.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Im ok with the Gordo being "reflectable". But I think they could revert the damage needed nerf.
Maybe improve the spike hitbox from Dair?.

 

[Karthage]

Definitely agree that we need to make the most out of what we have, and in the case of Gordo Throw, it's about minimizing the risks when throwing it. Usually that means using them on surfaces where the resulting bounce isn't expected.

On stages such as FD, there's very little use to be found in the move outside of edgeguarding. But as the stage selection expands drastically on Wii U, so are surfaces where we can use Gordo in quirky ways.

I made fairly decent usage out of Gordo in YI:B's slopes on the 3DS version, and there's definitely a lot more to do with them on Wii U. Lylat Cruise, DK64, Skyloft to cite a few all have some interesting layouts that can be exploited.

I still don't think the move will be amazing on such stages, but it'll be less ****ty.

I'm pretty certain that even with the reflect, gordo is still DDD's single most important move in neutral.

Usually you can use it to create situations where they can't safely reflect the gordo. By locking themselves into a move that reflects the gordo, you now have plenty of information on how to act, and if they shield the gordo, they come out neutral at best, thrown at worst.

It's really his only way to force an advantageous situation in neutral, otherwise he just get crushed by defensive play.

 

[Jabejazz]

I can't really disagree with you here, because outside of our FTilt in mid/close range, we have basically nothing that's worth of use in neutral.

So it's better than nothing for sure. The problem remains that we can't liberally use it, unless the opponent is too scared to reflect them. If you notice they shield them most of the time, it gives you strong positional advantage for sure.

And that's where slopes and walls come in; it's much harder to effectively reflect Gordos when they're extremely inconsistent in their bounces and speed, so it's generally safer to shield them.

 

[Karthage]

God damnit playing against a character with a projectile like mario's is obnoxious as hell.

They really need to fix this gordo horsecrap. Call it a failed experiment and change it to be more normal( reduced damage + knockback, clangs instead of reflects )

I'm worried that Nintendo is going to balance around a very low level of play and nerf DDD even further when he has unfavorable matchups against almost the entire cast.

 

[AlextheTwin]

Dedede needs a gordo buff. The knockback is ridiculous. Happens far too often. Everything else is balanced I feel. As others said, nerf the damage but make it so it can no longer be knocked back.

It's so stupid how much damage and how much knockback a reflected gordo does...and gordos are too easily knocked back. No other character with a projectile has to deal with this.

Everyone and their mother can knock them back. I feel as is DDD is a middle of the pack character at best in 1v1. Any projectile based character and any speed characters is a losing matchup in 1v1. He needs an effective counter so ranged characters just can't camp him.

That would make it fair IMO. Put DDD at an even matchup with camping characters - he's still losing to all kinds of speed characters.

 

[Flawed]

Gordos have ONE problem.

Why are they being hit back with projectiles? They seem to be a heavy piece of equipment that takes DDD a long time to throw out. But a Falco laser can just plink it back? Its a serious problem.

I died yesterday, I didn't save the replay because I turned off my WiiU in rage. How?

Megamans aerial pellet knocked my gordo back, and the gordo hit me a total of 3 times-REPEATEDLY- killing me. Like what?

Gordos should only be able to get knocked back by physical moves

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Another way to fix Gordos could be reducing the lag of the throwing animation. I mean, you are supposed to use the downB again to reflect them back, but the true is that the only way you have enough time to react is if the enemy bounces the Gordo from the other side of the Final Destination.
Mostly I think we are all infuriated over Gordos because its such a double-edged attack. They give a heavy and slow character a projectile so it doesnt get camped that hard. And yet, its even easier for campers to reflect it.
Now, less ranting and more on topic. I think the only kind of buffs and nerfs Smash Bros. is getting are either reduction of lag on moves or simple damage increase. No way they would be changing moves entirely. But we shall see, next patch will be interesting now with a lot more of feedback...