How do you do dair to grab / upsmash?

[Tags]

I've been trying to practice this for a while now, especially since I notice it's useful against Marth. When I try to practice, even though I L-cancel the dair I don't seem to still have them in hitstun to upsmash or grab. Is there a secret to doing this or am I just screwing up?

 

[Prince_Abu]

ur screwing up

 

[-LzR-]

Learn to fastfall at the correct moment. This will cause the other character to go through a flip animation. You do those things during the flip.

 

[snex]

you should be able to get a grab out without the flip animation, but most characters have options that can stop it if they read you for it. if you *do* get the flip animation, you can get an immediate rest, so you should practice doing that instead.

 

[Sagacious]

I have the same exact issue, I just posted in another thread regarding this. It's so difficult for me to tie in the moves. I tried dairing earlier, later, and just generally timing it differently. Even when I hit L to cancel I feel so much lag and can't tie in an up smash.

 

[Massive]

L-cancelling dair is probably the hardest thing in the game to L-cancel, IMO. It feels extremely late compared to almost every other L-cancel, especially if you're hitting their shield.

It is intrinsically like every other L-cancel though, you have 1-7 frames before landing to hit a cancel button. I know Hbox uses z for this (and that works pretty well, since it's not an analog control like the triggers). If you want a more straightforward training method, there's also IE's "flash on L-cancel" Gecko code you can use for visual feedback of doing it correctly.

 

[Sagacious]

L-cancelling dair is probably the hardest thing in the game to L-cancel, IMO. It feels extremely late compared to almost every other L-cancel, especially if you're hitting their shield.

It is intrinsically like every other L-cancel though, you have 1-7 frames before landing to hit a cancel button. I know Hbox uses z for this (and that works pretty well, since it's not an analog control like the triggers). If you want a more straightforward training method, there's also IE's "flash on L-cancel" Gecko code you can use for visual feedback of doing it correctly.

Sick, thanks a lot. I'll try timing it later then. Do you think it matters if you start dair before hitting the opponent or starting it right when you hit them? I noticed timing the last couple frames of dair on an opponent allows you to fall faster which might make it easier to cancel. I've been learning a lot from your posts in these threads so thank you so much for just being so active and helpful on these boards.

 

[Massive]

There is an ideal situation (and its hitting with the hits of dair that force your opponent to tumble) but you should probably just take what you can get and L-cancel when you can.

I also want to make clear that dair is not like falco's dair>shine or fox's nair>shine, it's not a good way to go about approaching an opponent at low %.
It is better utilized in converting shield pokes into punishes at mid-high %s, especially against floaties.

If you're looking for a good (reasonably safe) approach, I recommend weaving in and out with shorthop nair. If you time it correctly, you can do some really brutal things with it (nair > rest and nair > fsmash are my favorites) and it also autocancels if performed correctly.

 

[Sagacious]

There is an ideal situation (and its hitting with the hits of dair that force your opponent to tumble) but you should probably just take what you can get and L-cancel when you can.

I also want to make clear that dair is not like falco's dair>shine or fox's nair>shine, it's not a good way to go about approaching an opponent at low %.
It is better utilized in converting shield pokes into punishes at mid-high %s, especially against floaties.

If you're looking for a good (reasonably safe) approach, I recommend weaving in and out with shorthop nair. If you time it correctly, you can do some really brutal things with it (nair > rest and nair > fsmash are my favorites) and it also autocancels if performed correctly.

Thanks, approaching with Puff is usually my problem sometimes because I weave out too much from my initial attack and they end up shielding. I practiced some dair > upsmash last night and found that when I shorthop dair it's so much easier. I rarely am able to L-cancel after doing a falling dair from above the opponent. Nair is hard for me to make useful but I realized how important it is after watching matches of Darc baiting people into it. I figured all this time that nair was just used to fall on top of people after they miss an aerial, I didn't realize it's approach capability. I'm gonna mess with the nair > fsmash today on bots.