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How about an AT Striker system?

Knuckles the Knuckles

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I had this idea for a little while, being a fan of games like King of Fighters, of a new mode to use in Smash Bros, called the Striker system.

What is it? Basically, before the match, you can pick another character besides the one you will be playing as (that character being an AT) that you can then summon on command during the match at any moment. Afterwards you will have a cooldown meter under your character portrait fill up before you use them again, speed depending on what AT you picked. The input to summon them should be something simple, like select (-), have them spawn in front of your character.

What would you say about such an idea?
 

Raijinken

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Needs a different input, the Gamecube controller has no Select button. Other than that, could be cool for an alternate game mode or a perk in Single Player/Smash Run.
 

Knuckles the Knuckles

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Needs a different input, the Gamecube controller has no Select button. Other than that, could be cool for an alternate game mode or a perk in Single Player/Smash Run.
Hmm, was considering also having it replace the taunt, or have it activate upon taunting, I forgot about the Gamecube controller, huge shame on my part :p Also, yea, having it avalible in modes other than VS in a form of a perk would be interesting, thought then screen manipulating AT's would become useless and have to be excluded from it.
 

Casey_Contra

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That's really cool! It reminds me of some of the Naruto games or Jump Super Stars. You get one AT and one Pokemon or something haha! IT would be cool to see who picks status assists and who picks offensive assists. It actually makes sense to do something like this with the focus on equipable items and such.
 

Brother AJ

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I think this would be an excellent idea, and would add more strategy to the game. I wouldn't mind being able to do this with Pokeballs either. Since it wouldn't be a random element, it's possible that this could even be implemented within competitive play and the more OP/unbalanced characters like the Devil would be banned I imagine. Unfortunately, Sakurai seems to prefer random chaos when it comes to items rather than competitiveness. I would love to see this happen because most of time I'm playing with items off, and this would make all those characters that didn't manage to be playable feel like more part of the experience.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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I honestly think this is what Assist Trophies should have been.

Back few years I kept going on with this concept - it'd make Assist feel more than just Pokeball Knockoffs with big infamous reputation on being Sakurai's labeled "rejects". Besides, it'd be awesome to use them for certain finishers or attacks compatible with certain fighters - which could in turn lead on testing which Assist would work best for which character. Also, we get to have both the newcomer playable along with the secondary wanted newcomer with not as much chances but still being an Assist teaming up for you and potentially create pairs/sets integrated to the game's gameplay.

I think we could mostly have the moving A.I-based Assists as the "Strikers", since a lot of the bosses/villains (aside from Ghirahim) and status-inducing Assists are more of stationary and don't necessarily assist you by fighting.

Also, what about giving them different moves to have different functions, much like in Jump Super Stars? It would give more balance and options, so there won't necessarily be OP-characters.

Maaan, I'm so sad that this isn't a reality. I'd bet Assists would be as belovedly received as playable characters due them being an integrated part of the game. I might realize it be because it'd be ripping off the games before it, but Assists being nowadays "*TEARSFORMASHPOTATOSAMURAI* " isn't really any better.
They don't deserve to be pokeball-esque random items for their recognition or popularity within their fanbases, especially when they'll be about as much important as easily disapproved items in general.
 
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Rickerdy-doo-da-day

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There is a system like this in Dissidia Duodecim Final Fantasy that is almost exactly the same as what OP has described


You pick another character to 'Assist' you in battle and it can do a variety of things provided you charge up your 'Assist Meter' - the most important of which are allowing you to combo attacks together to deal damage and allowing you to avoid damage altogether

It's quite a cool system and I firmly believe Dissidia Duodecim is better than the previous Dissida game because of it but it does have it's fair share of problems:

- Some characters have a much, much easier time charging up their Assist meter (looking at you Exdeath).

- Most people tend to use only two or three characters as their Assists (the Aeris Assist in particular is pretty much everyone's Assist of choice, with special mentions going to Kuja and Jecht)

- The Assist system can also really cripple some characters who have lots of beginning or ending lag on their attacking moves because a summoned Assist can easily punish you if you perform such moves

- Assists do help speed up the matches (the previous Dissidia game didn't have Assists and the matches used to take soooooo long) BUT there is the potential for matches drag out a long time because you can use your Assist to escape from hugely damaging situations, essentially resetting any favourable/unfavourable position you might have got yourself/your opponent in (your meter gets locked for a while but then it's just mostly a case of running away until you can build up Assist again)


It would be interesting to see such a system implemented in SSB4 but it would definitely need a lot of work to make sure it didn't make any of the playable characters inviable or make matches drag out for very long periods of time. I suppose the closest we'll get is Rosalina and Luma or Ice Climbers (assuming they're still in)
 
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Goten21

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Do they serve as a tag-team mechanic that you control
That you don't control
Or as a trophy like supporter?
 

LIQUID12A

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I had this idea for a little while, being a fan of games like King of Fighters, of a new mode to use in Smash Bros, called the Striker system.

What is it? Basically, before the match, you can pick another character besides the one you will be playing as (that character being an AT) that you can then summon on command during the match at any moment. Afterwards you will have a cooldown meter under your character portrait fill up before you use them again, speed depending on what AT you picked. The input to summon them should be something simple, like select (-), have them spawn in front of your character.

What would you say about such an idea?
Interesting concept. I'll comment more later.
 

Hero of the Winds

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I could see this in All Star mode, because Sakurai said they were doing something special about AT's in All Star mode.
 

Marakatu

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I honestly think this is what Assist Trophies should have been.

Back few years I kept going on with this concept - it'd make Assist feel more than just Pokeball Knockoffs with big infamous reputation on being Sakurai's labeled "rejects". Besides, it'd be awesome to use them for certain finishers or attacks compatible with certain fighters - which could in turn lead on testing which Assist would work best for which character. Also, we get to have both the newcomer playable along with the secondary wanted newcomer with not as much chances but still being an Assist teaming up for you and potentially create pairs/sets integrated to the game's gameplay.

I think we could mostly have the moving A.I-based Assists as the "Strikers", since a lot of the bosses/villains (aside from Ghirahim) and status-inducing Assists are more of stationary and don't necessarily assist you by fighting.

Also, what about giving them different moves to have different functions, much like in Jump Super Stars? It would give more balance and options, so there won't necessarily be OP-characters.

Maaan, I'm so sad that this isn't a reality. I'd bet Assists would be as belovedly received as playable characters due them being an integrated part of the game. I might realize it be because it'd be ripping off the games before it, but Assists being nowadays "*TEARSFORMASHPOTATOSAMURAI* " isn't really any better.
They don't deserve to be pokeball-esque random items for their recognition or popularity within their fanbases, especially when they'll be about as much important as easily disapproved items in general.
I couldn't agree more with you.
I mean, look at J-Stars Victory Vs, for example. It treats support characters the same way it treats playable characters. Support characters appear on the box art and on promotional material, and they even have battle intros.
In Smash, as assist character is treated as a deconfirmed character, because in a way, that's what they really are.

I would LOVE if before a match you had a menu to choose a playable character and another to choose a support character. Imagine the possibilities. They could even implement tag team attacks for some combinations.
Unfortunately, ATs that don't help the player (Nintendog, Devil, Nightmare) would make that impossible.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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I couldn't agree more with you.
I mean, look at J-Stars Victory Vs, for example. It treats support characters the same way it treats playable characters. Support characters appear on the box art and on promotional material, and they even have battle intros.
In Smash, as assist character is treated as a deconfirmed character, because in a way, that's what they really are.

I would LOVE if before a match you had a menu to choose a playable character and another to choose a support character. Imagine the possibilities. They could even implement tag team attacks for some combinations.
Unfortunately, ATs that don't help the player (Nintendog, Devil, Nightmare) would make that impossible.
Yeah, I think that's pretty underwhelming. It also makes me question the idea behind Assist Trophies. Granted, the "roster" of ATs in this game is definitely more filled with recognizable faces than mooks or NPCs from the games, but at the same time, they are always gonna be a side bonus and a poor way to cater on the fans of the Assists. Even more, if one were to see them first time, and get to know them enough to feel fond or bonded to them, it kinda makes them feel less worthy to invest on than the playable cast when they're Assists again.
Think for example, new fans of Lyn who got into her game through Brawl, and might want to see her as a playable. She might just turn into less interesting side material as a character compared to playable characters - and with her not receiving any new games, much like a lot of the ATs due them being C-listers or having one-shot games, that's quite major blow to their career.

What's the merit of being an Assist Trophy when you're a wanted character? A Pokeball-knockoff with lable of "honorary mention" at best, and to many, is seen as a easy way to brush away characters with even if, vocal minority fanbase, to a place where we have to appreciate they even got mentioned, even if in middle of getting millions of Nintendogs or Devils or whatelse unwanted characters as Assists. And lastly, the sad end of the tale for their popularity unless a new game rolls in visibility for them, which doesn't treat them as Pokemon, completely contrary to that.

I think this is what creates such big controversy with it's roster inclusions every time. Seeing how many recognizable characters we're seeing relocated to Assist-status and Sakurai even teasing about that to some people, it's what holds this series from truly becoming great, and void of negativity, bashing, whining, etc on the roster. Not to mention, Assists aren't very rewarding to be invested on when featured in Smash Bros-series. They're treated as items, which reflects on them in the fanbases and sometimes just in their popularity: people don't like them as Assists if being fans (most of the time,), and to majority of people they're easily nobodies.
And I think it's best for them to not invest on these characters, especially if wanting to see them in Smash as playable characters. More of just giving them exposure to their games- even if that can also lead to disappointment because the series they're from are easily in hiatus, or not even developed anymore in favour of more popular franchises featured in Smash.)

But goshers, it's really annoying me. These fellas are just merely brief fan-service items who have mostly brought in negative feelings to their supporters, depending on their popularity.

So yeah, it'd be much better if these characters could fight in our side rather than be just another element in free-for-all with items on-fights - they'd feel like actual characters with unearthed history and fanbase, rather than being itemized fanservice in form of Pokemon-esque summons.
 
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Marakatu

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Yeah, I think that's pretty underwhelming. It also makes me question the idea behind Assist Trophies. Granted, the "roster" of ATs in this game is definitely more filled with recognizable faces than mooks or NPCs from the games, but at the same time, they are always gonna be a side bonus and a poor way to cater on the fans of the Assists. Even more, if one were to see them first time, and get to know them enough to feel fond or bonded to them, it kinda makes them feel less worthy to invest on than the playable cast when they're Assists again.
Think for example, new fans of Lyn who got into her game through Brawl, and might want to see her as a playable. Or maybe they see her as boring side material.
What's the merit of being an Assist Trophy? A Pokeball-knockoff with lable of "honorary mention" at best, and to many, is seen as a easy way to brush away characters with even if, vocal minority fanbase, to a place where we have to appreciate they even got mentioned, even if in middle of getting millions of Nintendogs or Devils or whatelse unwanted characters as Assists.

I think this is what creates such big controversy with it's roster inclusions every time. Seeing how many recognizable characters we're seeing relocated to Assist-status and Sakurai even teasing about that to some people, it's what holds this series from truly becoming great, and void of negativity, bashing, whining, etc on the roster. Not to mention, Assists aren't very rewarding to be invested on when featured in Smash Bros-series. They're treated as items, which reflects on them in the fanbases and sometimes just in their popularity: people don't like them as Assists if being fans (most of the time,), and to majority of people they're easily nobodies.
And I think it's best for them to not invest on these characters, especially if wanting to see them in Smash as playable characters. More of just giving them exposure to their games- even if that can also lead to disappointment because the series they're from are easily in hiatus, or not even developed anymore in favour of more popular franchises featured in Smash.)

But goshers, it's really annoying me. These fellas are just merely brief fan-service items who have mostly brought in negative feelings to their supporters, depending on their popularity.

So yeah, it'd be much better if these characters could fight in our side rather than be just another element in free-for-all with items on-fights - they'd feel like actual characters with unearthed history and fanbase, rather than being itemized fanservice in form of Pokemon-esque summons.
I think a good solution would be making the use of support characters mandatory. This way, they would be more proeminent in battle. Maybe release AT amiibos, I don't know.

I remember when the Sket Dan was announced in J-Stars as support characters. I couldn't be more happy, because they were in the game. Many people felt this way when Chitoge and Kumagawa were announced too. But the reveal of Assist Trophies in Smash is generally met with disappointment, because we know that that's a really small role.
 

Scourge The Hedgehog

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Nintendo vs Capcom/Sega/Bandi Namco? On a more serious note I would approve if we could use them like this. This would add an extra layer of awesome. Lyndis all day everyday. Maybe Shadow cause reasons.
 

Rickerdy-doo-da-day

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Do they serve as a tag-team mechanic that you control
That you don't control
Or as a trophy like supporter?
More like a supporter - you summon the Assist and they then perform their attack. Depending on the Assist character you choose/meter charge they can perform different attacks. They only appear for a few seconds to perform their attack and then disappear until you summon them again (provided your meter is charged). During this time, they can get blocked or hit and this locks your Assist Meter

Or, you can use your assist to dodge out of the way of an enemy attack. Your meter gets locked and you can't charge up the meter/use Assists for a while

It is a very interesting system but there are some set ups that playable characters have that are very, very strong. For example, Zidane can set up his equipment (that's another thing btw, Dissida let's you customise equipment/attacks to an extent) and, should he land a hit, use an Aeris Assist to effectively knock off around 75% of the opponents health. Exdeath and The Emperor have attacks which are unblockable/undodgeable that you have to charge up - if they have their Assist meter charged up, it can mean that trying to stop them performing such a move ends in you getting punished and taking damage anyway. Or, if they use Aeris' Planet Protector (makes them invincible) then you have no way of stopping them from performing the move other than using your Assist to dodge out of the way when they use it (and that locks your Assist Meter, stopping you from charging you meter for a while)


It's impossible to say if such a system would work well in a Smash environment. I guess we'll never know...
 
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bkslider

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It would be pretty fun to get to choose your assist, but I feel that it would be a bit simpler than what most people are saying. Smash is easy to jump into, with no meters to understand, and any change in mechanic would reflect this.

If we were to get it, I doubt it would be in Sm4sh, since, from what we have seen, ATs are basically the same as Brawl. A future game could utilize it thoufh.
 

Farorae

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I think this would actually be pretty cool, as a separate mode of course. Not sure how well it would work in reality but the idea definitely sounds interesting.
 

Nintendrone

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This sounds very cool, and would be a nice step up from glorified Poké Ball. I think a simple system would be that the AT item works the same as now, but certain ATs/Pokémon can be equipped (some could be modified to work) and used via a meter that charges over time/attacks/damage. Each AT fills the bar at a different rate, and they do different moves depending on charge (2/3 levels, but any move will put the meter at 0). In most cases, AT's may be attacked, and a KO'd AT locks up your meter temporarily, preventing it from refilling.
 

Flaxr XIII

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Needs a different input, the Gamecube controller has no Select button. Other than that, could be cool for an alternate game mode or a perk in Single Player/Smash Run.
They could have :GCX:or:GCY: for it. Do we really need two jump buttons? Same for :GCLT:and:GCRT:.
or we can just get over the Gamecube controller and progress to one that has more buttons....

I like the idea but there's no doubt that Wiimote sideways will be an option and since that thing only has like 4 useable buttons aside from the D Pad, it seems unlikely. God I hate Wiimote sideways...
 
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Raijinken

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They could have :GCX:or:GCY: for it. Do we really need two jump buttons? Same for :GCLT:and:GCRT:.
or we can just get over the Gamecube controller and progress to one that has more buttons....

I like the idea but there's no doubt that Wiimote sideways will be an option and since that thing only has like 4 useable buttons aside from the D Pad, so it seems unlikely. God I hate Wiimote sideways...
Taunt input would also make sense (and applies to all controllers).

I'm fine with more buttons, but no other controller has such nice joystick-to-button symmetry.
 

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While were at it let's have smashball attacks be acquired after a set amount of damage accumulation. There's nothing wrong with borrowing ideas from other games Sakurai. No need to be obsessed with being "unique". :p
 

Flaxr XIII

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Taunt input would also make sense (and applies to all controllers).

I'm fine with more buttons, but no other controller has such nice joystick-to-button symmetry.
Yeah you do have a point there. The 360 controller has asymmetrical sticks as well. Aren't there some 3rd party Pro Controllers that have that too?
 

Raijinken

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Yeah you do have a point there. The 360 controller has asymmetrical sticks as well. Aren't there some 3rd party Pro Controllers that have that too?
Most likely, but after having used some pretty mediocre 3rd party controllers, I tend to stick to first party these days.
 

LeeYawshee

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Characters appeared and depending on how much of a bar you filled up, they would do a specific commands

Let's say Mario is the character and we have four bars
I'm playing as Link and I grab Zelda with one assist bar, I use it to summon Mario, Mario uses fireball, cape, or the basic jab combo. If I had two bars, Mario would use Dair, Side Smash, something like that.
If I had three bars, Mario would stay for some time, combo a little, teach 'em a lesson.
If I had four bars, Mario would come out and use the best AI he's got or straight up Mario finale.

The problem with this system is that if we have 4 players out, and we all summon the 4 bars character, we'd have a ****ton of lag.

So... keep scrolling :' (
 
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