help me refine this

[Deleted member]

Alembic
Metagross @ Lum Berry
Adamant, Clear Body
236 HP / 228 Att / 20 Def / 24 Spe
Bullet Punch
Meteor Mash
Earthquake
Explosion

Jiraiya
Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Jolly, Sand Veil
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Outrage
Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Pursuit

Athenor
Tyranitar @ Babiri Berry
Jolly, Sand Stream
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Dragon Dance
Stone Edge
Fire Punch
Crunch

Mercurius
Salamence @ Life Orb
Naive, Intimidate
4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Draco Meteor
Fire Blast
Earthquake
Outrage

Crucible
Heatran @ Shuca Berry
Naive, Flash Fire
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Fire Blast
Earth Power
Substitute
Explosion

Dispersion
Suicune @ Leftovers
Timid, Pressure
104 HP / 208 SpA / 196 Spe
31/31/31/30/31/31
Calm Mind
Hidden Power (Electric 70)
Ice Beam
Surf

 

[kirbyraeg]

IMO the best way to deal with stall is a bulky setup attacker. Considering you're using Suicune as a faster sweeper type as well as a check to fire-type pokemon, maybe you'd be a fan of SubCharge Lanturn?

Lanturn @ Leftovers
52 HP/252 SpAtk/148 SpDef/56 Spe
Modest / Volt Absorb

Charge Beam
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Substitute

It sets up 101 HP subs, doesn't mind defensive Celebi with its weak Grass Knot that won't even always break its Sub, and has enough power to gradually muscle through Hippo and Swampert with its Hydro Pump. It can set up on and beat Blissey regardless of what moves it has as long as it doesn't switch into a Toxic.

Also, I know you know Mence and Chomp are Uber, but this team really needs both of them to function well...and it's no fun to play without them

 

[Deleted member]

i've been looking at tyranitar as a sub user to function as a stall breaker that retains some utility otherwise also.

 

[0RLY]

Heatran, possibly celetran, would do well in handling the problems you're facing. The best replacement, imo, is your scarfchomp. It's been a while since I've played with Garchomp so I don't really remember how important he is in a team like this. You could try either a subtran with HP (grass) and leftovers (personal preference) or you can use a scarftran to fill the role Garchomp had. If you feel Garchomp is absolutely necessary for the team, the second best swap would probably be Tyranitar. If you absolutely want to abuse sand veil, you could drop Salamence, but if you do Suicune would probably need to be changed to ddgyara.

Celebi is just a solid status absorber if you feel your team needs it. It can also Nasty Plot to stick with your team's offensive strategy.

You're a pretty smart guy so I don't think I need to explain too much of my suggestions.

 

[NJzFinest]

Are you planning on getting rid of Mence and Garchomp?

If not, your team is just fine with 2 ubers lol.

 

[Deleted member]

Are you planning on getting rid of Mence and Garchomp?

If not, your team is just fine with 2 ubers lol.

I like how people assume those pokemon that move tiers are substantially better than those that don't even if they were legal for years without any problems.

I bet you really hate ADV celebi.

 

[NJzFinest]

I don't hate ADV Celebi, but I do hate ADV Suicune lol.

Despite how adamant I am about Garchomp being stupid, I actually voted against the Mence ban. However, I'm coming to sense with the ban seeing how immensely nerfed Mence teams, including my own, became.

Mence and Garchomp-> Garchomp gets banned-> Salamence gets buffed with Outrage but Latias becomes OU not too long after-> Latias is banned again-> Buffed Salamence is loling his *** off.

Nevertheless, if it's banned, it's banned. Especially if the people behind it have proven their worth.

Anyways, if I made a team like this, who would I play lol? Randoms?
I'd rather not leave the community and miss out on a new metagame.

 

[Pink Reaper]

Replacing Scizor with SubTran could go a long way in helping with you Rotom and general WoW problem as well as giving you an even MORE solid Celebi counter. Your team would also appreciate the STAB fire move that you're so obviously lacking. Steel types, Bronzong especially, have very little to fear of your team.

 

[Pink Reaper]

mycatgoesmow 8:43 pm
(8:43:53 PM): ****
(8:43:59 PM): the subtran idea is perfect
(8:44:05 PM): and i don't want to admit it
(8:44:05 PM): lol
ThePinkReaperr 8:44 pm
(8:44:11 PM): LOL
(8:44:18 PM): good thing you didnt

 

[Wave⁂]

Pink Reaper: 1
Umbreon: 0

 

[Gates]

Attacking Metagross+SubTran is also a good lead combination.

 

[Deleted member]

I want a good check for rotom as well, so i'm basically forced to run either hasty or mild. I'm not sure which to pick. under art's suggestion i'll go with sub HP grass FB explosion, but I'm not sure what spread and item to run. ideally, i'd like to feign a choice item to optimize my sub chances, so i was considering expert belt to secure the ohko on swampert, but then i can't OHKO blissey with explosion. ideas?

 

[Gates]

SucaTran is good at faking a choice item, but Expert Belt might be better.

As for the spread, I would reccommend Hasty 252 Spe/252 SpA/4 Def. It's pretty much the standard build for any non-defensive Heatran.

 

[ss118]

No real need to go Hasty, since without Earth Power you don't really need to speed tie other heatrans, and you don't hit anything in that speed tier between those speeds. Mild hits for much needed power, especially against Swampert with HP Grass(why the hell doesn't it die to one normally with 130 base sp. Attack >_>').

 

[Gates]

Well specially defensive Swamperts CAN survive a +2 SpecsMence Dragon Pulse lol

I think that the added speed could be useful. Non-Choice Dragonites only run about 200 speed which would enable a +nature Heatran to outspeed them.

You're right though, you don't hit anything in that speed tier other than Mamoswine for super effective damage, but that's mostly due to type coverage. At the very least you need to give it enough speed to outspeed Breloom.