Help against Ness/grabs

[Metaldrummer9591]

Hi, i'm new here (first post), and i just play the game rather casually with friends. We play the game a lot, so we don't suck, but we're not anywhere close to pros either. Long story short, my friend uses Ness, and does nothing but grab. Whats the best way to avoid a grab from quicker characters that can get the upper hand almost every time in that situation? I generally play as either Mario (my main), pikachu, or falcon.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

 

[blaze3927]

if you pres a button when your in the air you'll do an attack in the air. learn how to z cancel and Arial attack closer to the ground. and you have now effectively removed any chance of ness grabbing you.

 

[NixxxoN]

Yeah, do aerial attacks, and try to learn z-cancel, its not that hard. On the ground, I find falcon's forward tilt works well vs ness grab spamming, and mario fireballs too. In general, all three characters you main do well vs Ness. Ness should not be able to absorb the fireballs with down+b without getting punished afterwards. Falcon can combo Ness very easily and Pikachu ***** him in almost every way.

 

[ballin4life]

With Mario you can use jab to interrupt the grab.

With pika you should be able to do aerials on him all day without getting grabbed. Especially true if he isn't using utilt or djcing. You can approach from above and he won't be able to grab you.

With all 3 you can always counter by grabbing him back. All 3 have better grab range than ness. Falcon especially can bait him into trying to grab, dashdance back then forward then grab him. This will then lead to an uair combo, to upb to edgeguard.

Also remember almost all aerials are gonna outrange ness's pathetic grab range anyway. Be glad your friend doesn't play DK.

Videos would help too

 

[Battlecow]

Hey- Like people said, the trick is to learn to outrange his grab with an aerial, preferably short-hopped and z-canceled (To short hop, lightly tap a c button. To z-cancel, press Z right before you hit the ground, but while you're doing an attack).

If that's too hard (and it is kind of hard, although not by any means impossible, for someone at your presumed level of play) Just go one level deeper into his own game and learn to play DK. DK's grab range is easily twice that of Ness, and just as quick; Learning a rudimentary grab-spammy DK will give you easy victories here, although it won't help you out much if they learn how to space their aerials.

 

[noodles]

Happy Birthday Banks!

 

[Metaldrummer9591]

haha, it's funny because i do have a friend that spams DK's ridiculous backthrow. Thanks for all of the comments though guys, i will certainly attempt to learn all of this. I am aware of Z-canceling, i just haven't completely incorporated it in with every character yet.

A common strategy he'll employ is to bait me to attack, back roll when i try an aerial, and charge me and throw when i hit the ground. Is that a good time to z cancel after my attack? so when he charges me to throw i can already quickly move out of the way and aerials hit him for a combo?

And the fireballs is a good tip, thank you, cause he ALWAYS tries to absorb them.

 

[dandan]

if he rolls he is punishable, you should always z cancel your move, unless it is a dair with jigs, that move is better not cancelled because it sends him in the air a little bit.

 

[Banks]

Happy Birthday Banks!

Thanks noodles <3!

[LOL @ random location]

 

[ballin4life]

haha, it's funny because i do have a friend that spams DK's ridiculous backthrow. Thanks for all of the comments though guys, i will certainly attempt to learn all of this. I am aware of Z-canceling, i just haven't completely incorporated it in with every character yet.

A common strategy he'll employ is to bait me to attack, back roll when i try an aerial, and charge me and throw when i hit the ground. Is that a good time to z cancel after my attack? so when he charges me to throw i can already quickly move out of the way and aerials hit him for a combo?

And the fireballs is a good tip, thank you, cause he ALWAYS tries to absorb them.

you should always z cancel.

also rolling back and dashing forward is way too slow ... he shouldnt be able to grab you

 

[Blade689]

Ah, a ness problem, glad to see the little guy is having fun, but knowledge is power, and the secret to ness is the 3 situations that newer players use.

Situation 1: ness is defensive on the ground and has range to his attacks.
EX: YO-YO on the up and down slam. Grabs, roll&dash and PK fire. they generally roll away from the opponent, constantly updating their spacing between the 2 players, spamming those attacks while you approach.

Situations 2: Ness is in the air, and does fast/power moves.
EX: D-air, U-air, forward Air..... anything ness does in the air.... if he's close to your body, and your not fox/pika/kirby.... its quick and dirty, normally followed with another.

Situation 3: Ness is agrissive on the ground
EX: Dash-A, Dash grab, tripple tap combo into grab. Probably picking up every item he can see.


Most good ness players break these cycles to their attacks/movements just by understanding the game more....... but if I'm guessing correctly, these 3 tactices are your problems with his use of ness. And here's a basic overview of the answer.
For situation 1: throw off his distancing. Try to strike shallow (like a couple ft away... not to far, but just a fake attack aimed at him) not intending to hit him, z-cancel it, then roll away. Do this 3 or 4 times, and don't allow him to hit you.... he will get frustrated and try to either change up his distancing, or he will start running at you ahead of time to compensate to your shallow movements. Then switch back, he will get confused, and you'll catch him off guard for a couple of lives. This is more of a mental game, but it shakes up players who camp, Ness is slow, and you can always run away from him. And if he's just rolling for movement, he is really slow.

Situation 2: He will be coming at you from weird angles, hitting you and winning most moments of conflict.
The problem with his air game though, is he has to touch your hit box for it to be good. So, don't stand in 1 place for too long. Keep retreating, and spam tap attacks (not slams) in the only direction he can come from. You'll be able to see his jumping paths pretty easy, and if you can't, just test out ness, and figure out the form to ness's jump....... it really is a weak point if you know how the movement path works.

Situation 3: He is highly aggressive on the ground ehhhh? Just jump around. He is slow, you really get to pick your battles with ness unless its a small stage like peach's castle...... but ness does better there anyways. Just keep jumping backwards until he stalls out and then just jump strait up and slam down on him.



Other then that, spam projectiles..... Ness's down-B is only worth it if its Samus's breakfrast, or a free heal, so just strick close enough to charge him for the meal, and he will have a hurt *** every time the check bounce.


I really love playing ness as a character, but his short-comings are notorious in his down fall. Find a way to trip him up, either mentally or tactically, and he will just be a little boy again.

 

[NixxxoN]

LOLWTF

10wtfs

 

[smakis]

blade689 surely knows what he is talking about! /nod

 

[Professor :3]

So Im new to the forums, but Im deep in smash bros. I've been playing for about 2 years, but its only been on the n64. I've watched tournament footage on Youtube as probably most of you have, and I want to know a few things.

1) Is the online version faster then the n64 version, or is tournament footage sped up?

2) Why no items? I understand that it causes the attack to be pressed, and that play is speed up, but doesn't it ignore what I would call "stage control". Idk what this community's equivalent is, but I feel that I shouldn't have to run out to the edge of a stage after someone if their standing there. I would rather keep them over there and wait for the next item drop.

3) the tier list: this list has some general things that I agree with, but I think I have a flawed view of it because of my use of items, does this change of play cause such a huge swing in power of character?

4) can rules ever change from the 5 stock for events that I create?

And so finally I ask, who gets down on the n64 in the bay area?

My number is 1(925)989-0196 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 1(925)989-0196 end_of_the_skype_highlighting. We have about 9 strong players in the group, and we're all pretty dedicated to the n64. Txt me or call me. I would love to get an event together, and find more players in my area.

i would suggest not listening to him lol

 

[LULZY]

spacing is key if ur opponent is grabspamming