Heavy Offense - a new team style?

[Wave⁂]

Well, it's not really "new", it's just hyper offense with a new name.

This Smogon thread is a giant wall of text explaining how heavy offense works.

Basically, you minimize prediction and switching and sacrifice Pokemon to open up a sweep. Less prediction = less over-predicting. Less switching = more attacking = more damage dealt.

An example team from the thread:

Azelf @ Light Clay
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/4 Atk/252 Spd
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
---
Salamence (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
---
Infernape (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk/6 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance

"Infernape's spot can be a few things, it's irrelevant. Tyranitar, Kingdra, and Scizor could all go in that spot."

---
Gyarados (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
---
Lucario (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 6 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Crunch
- Extremespeed
- Swords Dance
---
Metagross @ Life Orb
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 6 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Meteor Mash
- Agility
- Explosion


Thoughts?

 

[Bowser King]

I had a similar team to the one above and with the increase in rotom-h it got hurt fairly bad.

Even though that isn't the point....

 

[Metal~Mario]

Interesting....

My little brother plays like that. 'cept he's a scrub :D

So many Life Orbs...I'm seeing Life Orbs everywhere....

 

[xLeafybug =D]

Using Life Orbs instead of Choice Items is an excellent choice, as it allows you to attain maximum type coverage, which limits the amount of times that you need to switch. It's a smart idea, and looks good on paper. One of these days, I'll make a team like that, just to see how it works.

 

[Deleted member]

swords dance gives them a turn to do something. azelf doesn't **** hard enough. fix those first. compare your team to mine-



Cymbeline, Infernape (F) @ Focus Sash
Naive, Blaze
24 Att / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Fake Out
Overheat
Close Combat
Stealth Rock

Gespenst, Gyarados (M) @ Life Orb
Adamant, Intimidate
252 Att / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Dragon Dance
Stone Edge
Aqua Tail
Taunt

Balberith, Metagross @ Lum Berry
Adamant, Clear Body
252 HP / 232 Att / 16 Def / 8 Spe
Meteor Mash
Bullet Punch
Earthquake
Explosion

Basilikos, Salamence (M) @ Life Orb
Naive
80 Att / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Draco Meteor
Fire Blast
Brick Break
Crunch

Ereshkigal, Tyranitar (M) @ Expert Belt
Brave, Sandstream
252 HP/ 252 Att / 4 Def
0 Speed IV
Crunch
Earthquake
Ice Beam
Flamethrower

Audhulma, Garchomp (F) @ Choice Scarf
Jolly, Sand Veil
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Outrage
Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Stone Edge

 

[Circa]

For some weird reason, I actually thought of your team when I first saw this thread.

No Sleep Talk on Garchomp anymore? :X

 

[TheKneeOfJustice]

swords dance gives them a turn to do something. azelf doesn't **** hard enough. fix those first. compare your team to mine-



Infernape @ Focus Sash
Naive, Blaze
24 Att / 252 SpA / 232 Spd
Fake Out
Close Combat
Overheat
Stealth Rock

...

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Jolly, Sand Veil
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spd
Outrage
Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Stone Edge

Infernape is such a good anti-lead. The only issue I run into is that after the fake out, Aerodactyl and Azelf still get SR down. Is there any way to ev Ape to get a 2hko on them via Mach Punch/Vacuum Wave?

Also, Garchomp banned?

 

[WouW]

Infernape isn't perfect against set-up leads, especially not against Azelf and Aerodactyl.

Just Fake Out, CC for Aero or Fire Blast/Overheat for Azelf and lay down rocks afterwards.

 

[Circa]

Infernape is such a good anti-lead. The only issue I run into is that after the fake out, Aerodactyl and Azelf still get SR down. Is there any way to ev Ape to get a 2hko on them via Mach Punch/Vacuum Wave?

No...he can't 2HKO them with either.

 

[Deleted member]

blaze overheat definitely kills anything not resistant to it. I actually get hit by azelf psychic quite a bit, suggesting that focus sash leads aren't as popular anymore? I'm not sure honestly.

Infernape lead generally has problems with Hippowdon, Swampert, Gyarados, Salamence, and it's like 50/50 vs Machamp. I switched infernape to my lead since it's the only pokemon on my team that can't take a hit, and I'm not switching Pokemon off of my team. I use SR about 1 every 4-5 matches.

 

[Circa]

So...would it be reasonable to consider dropping SR, and put something like Grass Knot in its place? Or is the chance of getting SR up too great for covering the likes of Lead Swampert and Hippowdon instead?

Also, why 232 EVs invested in speed as opposed to 208 or 192? I'm not really seeing anything in the 105 base speed range that's threatening to it as a lead...

EDIT: Nevermind...I see now. ScarfChamp typically runs 144 Speed EVs. >_<

 

[Wave⁂]

Lead Infernape really isn't that good at stopping specific leads. The apeal of a lead like Azelf is that it gets rocks up 90% of the time, and can usually blow up the opponent's lead. Aerodactyl gets Rocks up virtually 100% of the time (if you Taunt something like Specs Abomasnow's Blizzard, lol, you fail). Swampert gets Rocks up maybe 75% of the time, but can often force switches against leads such as Hippowdon and Tyranitar. Infernape can only "stop" leads like Roserade or Smeargle. Or the common Froslass and Forretress.

Hm...

Metagross @ Occa Berry
Bullet Punch
Grass Knot
Earthquake
Stealth Rock

 

[Circa]

That set fails to 2HKO Azelf. :\

 

[Deleted member]

Metagross is much better mid-game than it is as a lead. Agility, CB, or misc. sets all work fantastically well.

 

[Wave⁂]

AgiliGross is so DP. Real men use Rock Polish Metagross.

Although I have to admit that AgiliGross is up there with SD Lucario and SubPetaya Empoleon.

 

[Mugen Infinity]

Basically, you minimize prediction and switching and sacrifice Pokemon to open up a sweep. Less prediction = less over-predicting. Less switching = more attacking = more damage dealt.

LOL, that's all I've been doing since day 1.... When you have an unfavorable match up, one of the funniest things you can do is just stay out there and keep fighting! Opponent almost never see's it coming. You can see from my team that I am almost always going for a sweep, or at least trying to take out 2-3 guys with one of my own. Scizor with U-Turn? Hell no. Why the heck would I want to retreat when I can attack? Sometimes I'll have Tyranitar out there against a Lucario or something. I don't switch, I just leave him out there to die so the next pokemon gets a free switch-in.
I've been using this exact team (and mindset) for the last 14 months or so. Never gets old, maybe a 70-80% win rate. I do occasionally get walled hard though, lolol

For me, there is no early game, mid game, or late game strategies. There is: gain the upper hand, and don't lose it. That's how I approach it, let your strongest pokemon die if it means gaining a slight advantage with the next one.

I would rather lose in 4 minutes than win in 10 minutes... somehow, that ends up working pretty well for me.