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GOT Fans Rejoice- The World of Ice and Fire 8/28

Cammed Z28

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The World.of Fire.and.Ice is officially released! This is GRRMs first published GOT universe book since DOD and the first "encyclopedia" written from a maesters a POV...who else is beyond excited? I am desperate for new information and lore. I just downloaded my Kindle version for 20 and will buy the real thing Friday. Who else is huge into Game of Thrones? The books specifically. Although I enjoy the show it is merely a distraction for me while waiting for WOW and DoS to be finished and published
 

Venus of the Desert Bloom

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Still waiting on Winds of Winter but this is a welcomed addition.
 

Cammed Z28

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As much as I would enjoy a Cleganebowl it is just not very likely ..... booooo :(

And I agree with everyone else..... I mean, lol, who else isn't impatiently waiting for TWoW? I almost dread the day it releases (almost) because once I devour the book I cannot read it for the first time ever again and will have to wait an even longer amount of time for ADoS to also release so I can finally know how it all ends. In between I will just do what I am doing now.... far-reading the books countless times while also lurking on AFOIAF crackpot theory threads and reading any and all ASOIAF related content. Also cannot wait for the She Wolves of Winterfell
 
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Sehnsucht

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I'm reading this at the moment also.

I ended up starting backwards, going to the last sections about the Far East, then working my way back up. After I read the sections about the Free Cities, I went back to the beginning, and I'm now at the section concerning the Rhoynar.

Those latter sections had some interesting implications about the world of Ice and Fire. Those black, greasy stones, man...
 

Cammed Z28

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I'm reading this at the moment also.

I ended up starting backwards, going to the last sections about the Far East, then working my way back up. After I read the sections about the Free Cities, I went back to the beginning, and I'm now at the section concerning the Rhoynar.

Those latter sections had some interesting implications about the world of Ice and Fire. Those black, greasy stones, man...
LOL I have already read the entire thing front to back at least three times since its release last Tuesday. Regardless of the fact that I was scheduled to work the next day, I purchased a digital copy on Amazon and immediately began reading about 1:00am on release day (which was a Monday night because the book was dropped on the 28th. Some people reportedly were able to find and buy copies before street date at stores like Target and several others lol). It was totally worth dragging ### the next day at work

And THE OILY BLACK STONE !!! LOL I knoooow

I am convinced there is a very good reason that this specific material was mentioned throughout the entire book. Abandoned or increasingly remote cities and structures that happened to posses the oily black stone, which is said to drink in light leaving even Assashi "gloomy" during the middle of the daytime. The black stone....if one could even call it stone seeing as you, myself, nor the maester know what it is. One thing that I noticed in the maester's writing, maybe some of you did as well, was that he seems to be quite familiar with geology and the many different varieties of stone found throughout the known world are named by him while describing keeps and castles, he also names the composition of certain geological formations such as mountains, cliffs, rough and dangerous coasts lined with sharp and unforgiving rocks and reefs, as well as other instances. Unfortunately I do not have the source material with me so this entire post is from memory and recollection only. The point I took forever to just arrive at is although the maesters of the citadel shun magic and deny its existence while dismissing anecdotal evidence and other abnormal phenomenon as either nothing more than folk tales and superstition or that the reports are all made by unreliable eye witnesses (which are also in fact notoriously unreliable today in our real world) that are all either mad, under the influence of drink or another mind altering substance, or have some agenda and thus something to gain by perpetuating false tales. This maester however skeptical of magic and it's existence, he is quite knowledgeable when it comes to geology and the many stones as well as their natural origin.....usually even the specific site of a quarry used to provide stone for a specific project. The mystery black stone however cannot be explained or identified. There are no areas in the KNOWN world with a quarry providing the "black stone." No evidence has been found and no reasonable or rational theory has been put forth. I am sure that maybe the maester speculated that it could have arrived in world from space via a meteor or some type of similar event. That or it was even accepted as fact. Again I do not have the book in front of me. But it seems that this is not your average obsidian built by the magical valyrian road and wall construction crew. And it's beyond ancient. And is involved in some dark or crazy stuff.
 

Sehnsucht

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Yeah, the fact that certain things keep on cropping up again and again across regions and cultures is fairly telling.

[collapse=Thoughts on the Grand Scheme]
[collapse=Black Stone and Ancient Beings]I did notice Maester Yandel's knowledge of geology, which seemed to fail him only when it concerns these black oily stones. So you have the Black Stones in Yeen, on the Basilisk Isles, and in Asshai. The Five Forts are apparently made of this material, and possibly the Seastone Chair of the Iron Islands (which all histories and legends suggest predates the arrival of the First Men). K'Dath is probably a Black Stone City also.

So there's the implication of ancient races going WAY back. You have hints of the Old Ones in Leng, who dwelt beneath the vast subterranean cities found there. The Mazemakers of Lorath probably were of an ancient kind as well. And there's the Deep Ones, the deep-sea fish-race that legend suggests were responsible for scouring the Thousand Isles way back when. They may also be the architects of the Seastone Chair, and may have interbred with humans (such as with the alleged inhabitants of the Thousand Islands, or the people of the Three Sisters, who sometimes bear webbed digits, perhaps implying the Deep Ones held sway there in the ancient past). The mythos of the Drowned God and the Ironborn reverence of the sea may stem from past dealings between the First Men and the Deep Ones (and Martin said that the Drowned God faith is basically Cthulhu worship, so there you have it).

This is all very Lovecraft, by the way. The Old Ones and the Deep Ones are terms lifted right out of Lovecraft lore. The ancient ruin of K'Dath is reminiscent of Kadath (as in, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath). And in the world map of the Lands of Ice and Fire, you have the city of Carcosa at the very eastern edge, a clear reference to The King in Yellow. So all of this is very cool.

Concerning races, the Ifequevron are/were probably Children of the Forest (or are related to them), since the term is Dothraki for "wood-walkers". There are a lot of references to Hairy Men as well, who are either the Ibbenese or are the ancestors to them, and are allegedly not capable of reproducing with humans (implying a distinct race). Are the Hairy Men possibly related to the Giants in some way? The Brindled Men and the Shrykes may also be non-humans (or if not, then cousins to humans).[/collapse]

[collapse=The Long Night]
There's also the note on the Long Night happening in Yi Ti, so the entire world was likely affected by the Long Night. It also seems that the mythical figure of Azor Ahai recurs across cultures -- you have Azor Ahai proper, in the R'hllorian mythos of Asshai, and we know that a "last hero" is spoken of in the North of Westeros, a figure who helped end the Long Night. But you also have Hyrkoon the Hero (the Kingdom of Hyrkoon historically being north of Yi Ti), and other names as well (Yin Tar, Neferion, Eldric Shadowchaser).

Yin Tar is probably the YiTish variant, due to linguistic similarity. Neferion is probably of the N'Ghai (the sedentary cousins of the Jogos Nhai), since their ancestral city is Nefer to the northeast, near Mossovy. Eldric is probably either of Asshai or Mossovy. Also, a hero king named Huzhor Amai (Azor Ahai?) is said to be the ancestor of many of the Sarnori, and perhaps found that ancient kingdom of the Tall Men. And Huzhor is similar to Hughor of the Hill, the King of the Andals back when they first came to the Vale (and who was known as Hukko by the pre-Valyrian inhabitants of the Pentos area, if those tales be true).

It also seems the whole Lightbringer-Nyssa Nyssa stuff may have a basis in facts. Tales of a Maester who resided in Qohor noted that blood sacrifice may have a role to play in the secret to forging and reworking Valyrian Steel. Which makes sense, since basically all magic in the World of Ice and Fire has some basis in blood, life, and death (bloodlines, blood magic, the power of a person's blood, life for death, etc.).
[/collapse]

[collapse=Greater Implications]So you have ancient black, oily structures cropping up around the world, and the recurrence of the Long Night phenomenon and this mythic hero-saviour figure whose shows up everywhere. Did the Long Night happen around the world at the same time? Or did several "Long Nights" happen over several thousand years? Perhaps several cataclysms led to the gradual undoing of the Old Ones (and/or Deep Ones or whoever else). And the Bloodstone Emperor apparently worshiped a black stone that fell from the sky, as part of the Blood Betrayal that unleashed the Long Night upon Yi Ti. Is this tied to the "second moon" legend? Are the Black Stones of extraterrestrial origin? Are they weird meteors or something?

All of this makes you wonder about the Others. Were they human, of the First Men, or are they remnants of the Old Ones? If you venture to the Lands of Always Winter, finding the Heart of Winter, will you find ruined cities or fortresses of Black Stone? Was it always cold in the Far North, or did some ancient magical cataclysm create a wasteland of ice?

Speaking of ice, we get mentions of Ice Dragons, which is cool. Also, near Asshai is the corpse city of Stygai. Could undead, necromantic beings like the Others be dwelling there?

I also wonder if each of these magical cataclysms has to do with the misuse of one of the elements. The Others pertain to Ice, clearly. For Fire, we have Valyria. Asshai is a land of shadowbinders, so perhaps Shadow is another. The Deep Ones are tied to Water, and the Rhoynar had access to waterbending (as did the Children of the Forest, apparently); perhaps the Scouring of the Thousand Islands was the Water cataclysm. And if the Old Ones are subterranean, maybe they're tied to the Earth.

Perhaps the seasons are in disarray because long ago, the Elements were made to be in disarray to due misuses or unintended exploitation of magic. Who knows? Martin did say that by the end, we'll definitely know why the seasonal cycle went awry (though he didn't state if the problem would ever be rectified). I would imagine that whatever answer we'll get will focus on the Elements of Ice & Fire (via the Others and the R'hllor business), though this explanation may indirectly give insight into how the Long Night and/or individual cataclysms were caused in other regions.
[/collapse]
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Clearly, there's a lot to think about in light of this book. I'm glad this offering has given us some food for thought, to tide us over until the next Ice & Fire release (which will hopefully be Winds).
 
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