Q&A Generic Fox Matchup Q&A (See the MU discussion thread for in depth talk!)

[Xamad]

What do you guys use to counter approach Corrin when corrin wants to use side b as you dash in? Ive considered using run up shield as a mixup to close the gap, but i want to at least have 2 more mixups.

I know challenging her in the air can be difficult, any ideas?

You could try empty hopping to avoid the lunge, then shield+grab/aerial to punish the kick.
If they're already stuck in the ground, it might be better to just laser them and avoid getting punished, though you might be able to hit them from above with an aerial.

 

[Elyan]

im a new fox player, and i've been having trouble with cloud. cloud's neutral is just so good since it forces fox to approach or they get limit. it's generally hard to find openings. cloud can even camp on large stages like town and city and duck hunt. what can i do? only solution i've found is to generally counterpick small stages.

(As I am far from a great player in any ways, please take into consideration that my point of view might be completely wrong)
But after being knocked out of a tournament by a Cloud player who was pretty much the first Cloud knowing how to space bair, uair and to make his Dair lagless, I persisted and played many friendlies with him after the tournament was over, and kinda figured out a solution which allowed me to win a couple of matches

Usually, Cloud's ways of approaching won't be grounded because those are never safe in any ways, so he'll always try to jump in and land next to you with a lagless aerial, basically allowing him to gain advantage state,apply pressure while remaining safe.
So, what I started to do was to call his jump by full hoping above him/Before he could even jump, as cloud needs to already be at the peak of his jump to have safe aerials,so every time he tried to jump, he would just straight up jump into a Nair or a FH Dair.
So that can work when you start reading the Cloud's pattern.
Edit : Beware though, because I you just become too jump happy, the almighty U air will just chop you up as an anti air. I realized that today, and my guess was that the particular player I wa fighting just didn't figure it out,as it seems an obvious answer when I think about it

Second thing I figured out, is that Cloud isn't THAT fast, so I started shooting lasers and camping even more,like really never EVER approaching him ,staying at one side of the stage shooting lasers, when he comes in (as he will rarely ever dash attack,again) I'd simply run past him (below him if he jumped or eventually throwing a b air on the back of his shield if he ever did that) ( 3rd fastest run speed in the game yay) ,then PP into lasers again from a distance
I did this for an ungodly amount of time during a match, witch bring him to around 160%,where an Utilt killed him.

So... it was REALLY annoying for him and for myself, but it worked . Which made me realise that yeah,Cloud's still pretty slow compared to us,so on big stages like FD or SV, he pretty much can't avoid being hit by lasers by going to platforms.
Edit : I guess the key to this (and every match up in the end) is to improve your movement by a lot in order to wave in and out A LOT. But this is basic fox gameplay in the end *dumbface* .

Of course as I was playing that way he could always have his limit charged up, but now that it takes a good amount of time, eating 20% for it didn't seem so worth it, and the speed boost wasn't enough to help him catch up to me. Plus I felt confident I could just predict where he would use his limit.

Then again, even to me and to him it seemed like a scruby tactic,but afte we played like, ten games, he and I came to realize that he really did not know what to do against that. Just be a running away fox scared of his big ol' blade ,forget the "bait and punish" part of the "fox is a run,bait and punish character " until your opponent screw up one of his aerial .

I basically played the player more than the character,but I hope this helps someone somehow .
We have one of the greatest damage racking projectile, so I abused it, same goes for our jump speed

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

What are Fox's most polarizing (best/worst) matchups?

 

[HoSmash4]

Any advice on fighting Fox with Bayonetta?

 

[Xamad]

What are Fox's most polarizing (best/worst) matchups?

Most of us Fox mains agree Luigi, Kirby, Bayo, and Rosa. Ryu, Sheik, and Cloud could also give some trouble.

 

[_Wumbo_]

Most of us Fox mains agree Luigi, Kirby, Bayo, and Rosa. Ryu, Sheik, and Cloud could also give some trouble.

I've never had trouble with Ryu. Maybe it's because I've never played a really good Ryu, but I think the MU is even or very close to it. They both combo each other very well but Fox has an easier time getting in with his superior mobility. He has a reflector for hadouken and lasers for long range pressure, as well as a plethora of multi-hit moves to deal with focus attack. He also can't use FA to get out of juggles because uair is 2 hits. Obviously you can't be reckless or he'll 0-Death you, but if you gove him enough respect, that can be easily avoided.

 

[Xamad]

I've never had trouble with Ryu. Maybe it's because I've never played a really good Ryu, but I think the MU is even or very close to it. They both combo each other very well but Fox has an easier time getting in with his superior mobility. He has a reflector for hadouken and lasers for long range pressure, as well as a plethora of multi-hit moves to deal with focus attack. He also can't use FA to get out of juggles because uair is 2 hits. Obviously you can't be reckless or he'll 0-Death you, but if you gove him enough respect, that can be easily avoided.

Definitely true, I'm mostly talking what I've heard from top players' matchup lists. I agree with your sentiments too, since not only what you mentioned is true, but also SDI can really help Fox get out of his tap strings as well.

 

[ToastPerson]

I need help withedge trump b-air, my timing on the ledge release is off and sometimes I stay on the ledge or my opponent escapes, any way to get the timing down better?

 

[M@v]

Since this is the generic matchup thread, here's my feelings on Fox's matchups for patch 1.1.5

 

[PK Gaming]

The Corrin boards are currently discussing the Fox matchup

Feel free to drop on by!

 

[Ethan7]

Hi, what are good ways I can punish Fox out of shield? I was fighting this Fox as Diddy and I kept getting pressured as I could't shield-grab him as he could jab before my grab could even hit him.

 

[Goont]

Hey I'm looking for any Fox guides on combos that are very helpful and not outdated. I just ended up spending a half hour trying to preform a double-jab combo before reading that it was patched out. So any helpful guides on them would be very appreciated!

 

[Pixel_]

Any bnb Fox combos I should know and footstool combos that could be helpful?

 

[Sabz09]

Any solutions on playing against mewtwo? im actually really surprised he has an advantage over mewtwo on that chart. I find it really hard to get past dtilt and his air dodge makes it really hard to punish with uair. I feel like i have to read his timing and were he appears and if i miss it and am in a bad position he just fairs me. I just feel like he's hard to combo compared to other characters and kills so much easier

 

[Jontho]

Any solutions on playing against mewtwo? im actually really surprised he has an advantage over mewtwo on that chart. I find it really hard to get past dtilt and his air dodge makes it really hard to punish with uair. I feel like i have to read his timing and were he appears and if i miss it and am in a bad position he just fairs me. I just feel like he's hard to combo compared to other characters and kills so much easier

Well it's a tricky matchup for sure if you're not familiar with it. Your main strategy as Fox is to get into close quarters combat and abuse his relatively poor frame data compared to Fox. To get to this spot you can reflect Shadow Balls which will allow for protection when you approach (remember to jump cancel or roll from the shine). He CAN reflect them back at you, but is generally not bad for Fox since if baited allows for an aerial approach.
Speaking of aerial approaches, be careful with them since his up tilt and up smash cover that area well. To circumvent this, double jump aerials is a good mixup.

Once he's in the air, I rarely try to hit him with up airs since his airdodge and aerial drift is so good. I just run to where I think he's going to land (while taking stage control) and abuse my better frame data, which again was our strategy. One thing Foxes rarely abuses in this matchup is Mewtwo's bad LEDGE recovery. Once he's on the ledge, his options are mediocre at best due to how bad his double jump is when dropping from ledge. An early and well timed short hop Nair will beat all ledge options except roll (which can sometimes also be covered with a follow-up dash attack) and drop-off double jump airdodge. By that point, once he has passed through you he can only Bair, which has a ton of startup lag. You can react to this and also just dash attack on reaction.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

How do you DI/SDI out of U-air, Fox-copter and Jab?

 

[Megamang]

Jontho

I find m2, if patient, has solid ledge options. Fall down into DJ with good spacing gives him fair/confusion/airdodge mixup, which is just super solid and covers everything if he chooses the right option.

Still, being light and big isnt fun vs fox. Id suggest sometimes going for the uair, it isnt easy but damn the reward is high. Just enough to scare him from airdodging recklessly.

 

[Heracr055]

Hello Fox boards.
I want to try using Fox as a secondary. I feel that he's one of the most technical characters in the game, and that his potential has been showing by his placings in recent tournaments. I main Ryu, another technical character, so my question is: should I expect a smooth transition to this character?

 

[Ralugi]

Anyone know the MU against Robin? I've been having difficulty.

 

[Greensad]

I'm looking for help with the Bowser matchup, I play a really competent Bowser at a local/monthly who's improving rapidly and recently our grand final matches have been less and less close. Allow me to clarify, this Bowser knows how and when to jab to armor through seemingly all my options and mixups, he's really good at mixing up his walks and his dashes and reacts to/anticipates shield super quick. I'm also having a difficult time getting in and even landing safely, I try to land with b-air to u-tilt or even just a turnaround grab as a mix-up but he's able to counter with the first hit of jab to dash grab and shield to pivot/dash grab if I'm not crossing him up or whirling fortress if I do try to cross him up with a nair, I've even tried waiting out his shield a little to try to shield break with firefox but he knows me too well at this point. On ledge he usually goes for a dash grab/pivot grab or whirling fortress and sometimes jab (similar to when I land). Any help? I need to break through this wall.

Also side note and a little off topic but: my attempts to hit some more skilled players with u-tilt/dash attack to firefox after conditioning an airdodge (around %125) has led to them doing a late air-dodge through my firefox, should I only be using this option if I'm at higher percent and when they're around %100 - 110?