Emil Castagnier/Ratatosk V3.0.0-0 Back in Progress (Again) (NEWS!)

[Royal_Blade]

could you put up a list of animations that you have or work? That could help if I plan on modifying ideas for the movelist.

 

[Fliptocat]

Alright:
-Demon fang
-Ravaging Tiger
-Blade Fury
-Fiend Fusion
-Phoenix Rush
-Ragin Thrust
-The final movement of Converging Fury
-Sword Rain Alpha
-Heavenly Tempest
-Light Spear Cannon
-Quake Assault
-Devil's Hellfire
-Ain Soph Aur
-Ars Nova
-Devil's Maw

There could be one or two I missed.

 

[Royal_Blade]

Why so little arcane artes? btw, the aerial demon fang is the same animation as raining fangs. (or similar.) and for Raging Heaven, you could just have phoenix rush immediately followed by ravaging tiger could pull off the animation.

 

[Fliptocat]

^No idea, I just extracted what was in the file ANLGC gave me. :/
I don't know if I have the aerial demon fang. I could probably do that.

EDIT: Okay, I just found Aerial Demon Fang.

 

[Royal_Blade]

EDIT: Okay, I just found Aerial Demon Fang.

That's great news.

On a side note, does anyone mind if my make my own separate movelist to compare to Barbatos'(was it?) movelist?

 

[Fliptocat]

Yep.

I don't really mind, he wants to know what people dislike about his moveset.

 

[Royal_Blade]

Ok. i'll work on it... whenever.

 

[MagmarFire]

^Well, first of all, we don't have the animations for Raging heaven and raining fangs. Fiend fusion for downB isn't a bad idea. But for Demon fang, the Lloyd project has it for Neutral B, and I'd rather not have it as Emil's as well. I think it'll be fine as side tilt.

You could have the Tenebrae-enhanced Demon Fang for grounded Neutral B. It would seem like the perfect opportunity to use the Darkness property.

 

[Royal_Blade]

I think, if centurion elements are being included, then they should:

1. Be randomized activation. (Like Luigi's Side Special.)
2. Become active for a certain time limit through Fiend Fusion or a different mode.

That's what I think.

 

[Fliptocat]

^Here's what he thinks

So, it is completely stupid to make them activated randomly because if I take the randomness of Luigi side B. What does it do in the two cases? You still travel a distance and hit those who you encounter.

But, with Emil's moves, it is absolutely not the case!

Demon fang is a projectile, but in centurion mode, it is no longer one. So, players want to send a projectile, and because of a very bad luck, it is not what they wanted that is done... It is stupid!

An other exemple, you want to raise your mobility, you use fiend fusion, and this is the centurion mode attacks that is used, it is not what you wanted and this is a problem!

You want to eject someone upward, so you use raining fang in order to do this, because the centurion mode attacks eject up, what happens if it is not the centurion attack that is activated?

Emil gameplay is not based on luck... I can understand if the character was Patty Fleur, but not Emil... You will never be able to make a correct strategy because his moves are so random...

And besides, his skills about centurions, originally, he can choose if he use them or not. They don't come randomly! But if they come, they come definitely for a fight! So they don't have to be limited in time and they can't, centurion attacks can be used, or not, but not during a certain time during a fight. This is what I think.

 

[MagmarFire]

Maybe his artes can get Centurion upgrades when his percentage meter is past, say, 125%? I'm not sure how you guys feel about having another character with a risk-reward system like Lucario's, but if Emil "chooses" when to use them, it would seem reasonable for him to do so when he's on his last legs.

Just tossin' the idea out there. XD

EDIT: Is he saying that the player should choose whether or not he/she wants to use Centurion upgrades but will only have the chance to make that decision at the CSS? If that's the case, wouldn't that require a second PSA?

 

[Whiselifax]

I have the English voices if we want them.

 

[Royal_Blade]

Then why not have the elemental artes vary through situation?
Like if demon fang were to be used, two things could occur:

1.) Releases a single shockwave along the ground or in the air. (Can only happen if no one is around Emil front area.)

2.) Releases a wave of darkness in front of himself, hitting multiple times. (Can only happen if someone is close by to Emil.)

Could that work?

Also, can you list all basic attack motions that you guys have Fliptocat? Including EX Attack (Both versions) and the likes.

Edit:

I have the English voices if we want them.

I have both versions, (English and Japanese) for both Ratatosk and Emil.

 

[ryuu seika]

So do I and I definitely offered before Whisel.

 

[MagmarFire]

Then why not have the elemental artes vary through situation?
Like if demon fang were to be used, two things could occur:

1.) Releases a single shockwave along the ground or in the air. (Can only happen if no one is around Emil front area.)

2.) Releases a wave of darkness in front of himself, hitting multiple times. (Can only happen if someone is close by to Emil.)

Could that work?

Whoa, we can access the other players' position variables? Didn't know that. O.o

I like that idea, at any rate. It would add an adaptability element to his playstyle.

 

[Royal_Blade]

Luigi has it. (During his Up B) If your close enough Luigi will perform "Fire Jump Punch" instead of "Super Jump Punch".

So if the person it close enough, he could use Tenebrae. if no one is within close-range, he'll instead use a normal Demon Fang.

 

[ryuu seika]

The problem I foresee is that not all his altered artes have different optimal situations. Havoc Strike and Blazing Havoc, for example, do exactly the same thing. Blazing is simply better.

EDIT: Ok, Blazing is better for hitting behind Emil than the regular but that's just because it has a larger hitbox overall.

 

[Royal_Blade]

The problem I foresee is that not all his altered artes have different optimal situations. Havoc Strike and Blazing Havoc, for example, do exactly the same thing. Blazing is simply better.

EDIT: Ok, Blazing is better for hitting behind Emil than the regular but that's just because it has a larger hitbox overall.

Well, you could have it so that if the person is behind and/or above Emil (not a lot, just close enough) then Emil will use Ignis. Ignis will bring airborne character downward closer, or if they're behind, move them more in front of Emil to get hit by the actual dive.)

If they're in front of Emil, he will use normal Havoc Strike.

Also Havoc Strike should lift him off the ground so you could SD yourself near ledges. (So it looks and acts normally.)

 

[MagmarFire]

Luigi has it. (During his Up B) If your close enough Luigi will perform "Fire Jump Punch" instead of "Super Jump Punch".

So if the person it close enough, he could use Tenebrae. if no one is within close-range, he'll instead use a normal Demon Fang.

I thought that was because Luigi's Up-B has a hitbox that is only out for one or two frames before switching to sourspotted hitboxes for the rest of the attack's duration. If the opponent is in the hitbox, KREEEEENG! That wouldn't be due to PSA distance detection, but then again, I can't say for sure if PSA can calculate square roots for distance calculations...

However, the Luigi thing you mentioned does outline a possible solution: Giving Demon Fang a huge hitbox that deals absolutely no damage or knockback for the very first frame. If the opponent is in that one, use Tenebrae Demon Fang. Else, use regular Demon Fang.

 

[GP&B]

I believe MagmarFire is correct about Luigi's sweetspot on the Super Jump Punch. You can always verify it in PSA and look at how the hitbox is initiated.

 

[Whiselifax]

I believe I have the english voices on hand if you are interested.

So do I and I definitely offered before Whisel.

Uh, okay? You actually didn't because I was talking to him about it a month ago before this thread even started.

 

[Fliptocat]

The demon fang thing doesn't make much sense. In Barbatos' moveset, it isn't activated by distance, I believe it activates at a certain percentage. I don't think something like that would fit EMil well, but I've never played the game, so feel free to correct me.
Also! If you want the english voices, you'll have to do them yourselves.

 

[Royal_Blade]

The demon fang thing doesn't make much sense. In Barbatos' moveset, it isn't activated by distance, I believe it activates at a certain percentage. I don't think something like that would fit EMil well, but I've never played the game, so feel free to correct me.
Also! If you want the english voices, you'll have to do them yourselves.

Remember, i'm also working on one. So i could have it work in mine.
It should be done either today or tomorrow.

Edit: Ryuu and I have the English voices ripped from the game itself.

 

[Fliptocat]

^I know...... You'll have to hex them in Brawl yourselves if you want them........

 

[Royal_Blade]

^I know...... You'll have to hex them in Brawl yourselves if you want them........

Ah... That's what you meant. Aren't you guys gonna be changing Sound Effects (for his artes) for Emil though?
Or are you gonna do something else?

Edit: Do you guys plan on including Grabs & Throws? Or some replacement?

 

[Fliptocat]

Yes, but in Japanese. If you want English, you'll have to do it yourself.

Probably including them.

 

[Royal_Blade]

Yes, but in Japanese. If you want English, you'll have to do it yourself.

Okay. I could get someone to help translate Emil's lines to fit the English ones. (I'll probably do that once I have free time and the right program.)

 

[JetAurion]

...Translate lines?

Like what?

 

[MagmarFire]

I thought there were already both English and Japanese versions of his lines. No translation necessary. o.O

 

[Royal_Blade]

To help me figure out what line (In Japanese) to replace with whatever line fits. (In English)

 

[MagmarFire]

This is just a random question not exactly pertinent to the project, but is he planned to receive a Final Smash, as well?

If so...

 

[GP&B]

GuyGardiosX sent me this link a while ago when we were in early progress with Lloyd's PSA. It contains a bunch of sound packs from a multitude of Tales games, including ToS2's english voices. So, here it is.

 

[ryuu seika]

This is just a random question not exactly pertinent to the project, but is he planned to receive a Final Smash, as well?

In theory he should get Ain Soph Aur, preferably with a quote that actually makes sense with it.

 

[MagmarFire]

^ That does make a bit more sense from a design standpoint than Devil's Hellfire, methinks. We can't create Final Smash cutscenes like Captain Falcon's, can we? ...Or can we mooch off of CF's Final Smash cutscene and modify it somehow? That would sound like a lot of work, though...

But, of course, who can say no to a giant ball of magical energy that can fry opponents?

 

[Fire-Soul]

yeah or we can create a grab conection with Devil´s Hellfire, well like toon link and link have to the front with the final smash, thats enter to the attacks animation when grabs you with a yellow line

 

[MagmarFire]

I like that idea, but it would suffer from similarity...

But then again, the Space Animals all have essentially the same Final Smash, so I guess it's a moot point. I think both ideas are awesome, personally.

 

[Fliptocat]

Uh, guys? You have seen this, right?

Emil Castagnier moveset By Philia (Barbatos)

Emil is a fast character with good jumping, and can come back easily on the battlefield. Of course, he is a little easy to eject because his weight is not so high.

Emil normal mode:

B: Blade Fury or Fiend Fusion. Base artes. Fiend fusion allows Emil to be faster than normal during some times (normally in the game it is 45 seconds) and doesn't inflicts damage. 4 hit max for Blade Fury, can't eject.

Forward B: Havoc Strike. Base arte. Can be used to come back on the battlefield, one hit max, can't eject.

Up B: Ravaging Tiger. Base arte. Can be used to come back on the battlefield Three hit max, eject the ennemy down with the last hit, but not a good killing move.

Down B: Phoenix Rush. Base arte. Can be used to come back on the battlefield.Two hit max. Can't eject.

There are base artes. Forward B, Up B, and Down B, can be connected each other. It means you can do Ravaging Tiger then Phoenix Rush, or Phoenix Rush and Havoc Strike.


A movement: Three slashes. (basic attack.The three slashes can be used by pressing A three time, or by keep pressing A.) Can't eject.

Forward tilt: Demon Fang (base arte, projectile. It does a shockwave on the ground that does one hit, and it does a projectile that moves that does one hit as well, but the sword doesn't inflict any damage of course. So, 2 hits max.) Can't eject.

Down tilt: Savage reaper (Base arte. 3 hit max.) Doesn't eject.

Up tilt: Raining Fang (Base arte, jumping movement similar to hell pyre. 5 hit max) Can't eject.


Smash Forward: Sword Rain Alpha (Arcane arte 12 hit max.) Knockback for the last hit sends the ennemy in air, best killing move on ground if the last hits works.(the upward hit.)

Smash down: Roaring Tiger (arcane arte, 8 hit max). Doesn't eject but with the architecture of the movement, can hit opponents that are in front of Emil at the beginning of the movement, and opponents who were behind Emil when he uses his raining fang attack at the end of this movement.

Smash up: Light Spear Cannon (Arcane arte 5 hit max) Medium knockback for the last hit, eject the opponent at 45 degree up.

Dash attack: Converging Fury (only the final movement where Emil goes behind the ennemy by slashing him. One hit.) Doesn't eject.

Aerials:

Neutral: 3 slashes in the air. (Basic attack) Can't eject.

Forward A: Demon fang (base arte One hit only because in air.) Can't eject.

Down A: Heavenly Tempest (arcane arte, 6 hit max) Eject the ennemy forward, decent knockback if the last hit works.

Back A: Savage reaper (base arte, be careful with this move, with the first slash Emil should turn back then make a thrust like original but the thrust is behind him while the first slash is next to him. 2 hit max with great chances) Doesn't eject.

Up A: Dark radiance (arcane arte 6 hit max) Medium knockback, eject the opponent down with the last hit following an angle of 45 degree, good killing move if the last hit works. (in fact the direction of the demon fang as it is the last attack.)

Taunt Up: Sorcerer ring, fires a fire projectile. Little damages and no knockback.

Taunt side: Sorcerer ring, fires a thunder projectile, less strong than fire, but can stun the ennemy, the projectile moves slower than the fire. No knockback.

Taunt down: Disabled.

Grabs:
Grab hitting: Emil grabbed the opponent with his left hand, then give his opponents some hits with his right hand, but he's still holding his sword.

Grab forward: Emil makes a circular horizontal slash on his opponent. Low knockback.

Grab back: Emil releases his opponent, goes behind him, and slash him. Medium knockback.

Grab down: Emil puts his opponent on the floor then uses his sorcerer ring to send fire on his ennemy. No knockback, but most damaging grab.


Emil relies a lot on his combos, this why basic attacks can be connected to a base arte, and why a base arte can be connected to an arcane arte.

The only base arte that can't be used after a basic attack, or lead to an arcane arte is Fiend Fusion, if you use it which I hope.

But this is not over, there are two other modes.

Centurion mode: Enters in this state automatically after you have taken 70% of damages All these moves do superior damages than the previous obviously, but some of them gains some changes which will be described.

Here are the changes this mode does.

Demon Fang: 3 hits, in air and on ground, darkness element, and no longer a projectile, no other changes, can only hit in front of Emil.

Havoc Strike: Fire element, 2 hits max. No other changes, excepted it has a larger range, so it can hit opponents really close behind Emil because of the first hit which is a line of fire following Emil jump.

Blade Fury: 5 hits max, Ice element. No other changes.

Or Fiend Fusion: 4 hits, Earth element (pillars of earth surrounds Emil that hits near opponents and it strengthens his defense, no longer his mobility). No knockback.
Ravaging Tiger: Thunder element, 5 max hits, eject efficience improved because of the support of the thunder.

Savage Reaper: Light element, 4 max hits, on ground, and with great chances, in air as well, 2 hits for the thrust in fact and two hits for the first movement of this attack. No changes.

Raining Fang: Water element, 5 hits too, but stronger than original obviously. (in the game it is four hits, but I honestly don't see why...) Between little and medium knockback.

Phoenix Rush: 4 hits, wind element. No knockback so no other changes.

Emil in this mode can do basic attacks, but instead of 3 slashes, can do 4 slashes.

And the last mode:

True Ratatosk mode:

Keeps the changes of Centurion mode, activated automatically above 130% of damages.

Taunt down can now be activated. When you press down taunt, Emil becomes intangible, and does this animation.

Devil's Maw: Darkness element. Second strongest attack in term of damages but no knockback. 10 hit max. And can only be used once before you die.

And now, the basic attacks allows Emil to do 6 slashes instead of 4.

And to finish:

Final Smash: Dual death+ Devil's Hellfire+ Ain Soph Aur. (When Emil activates this final smash, he does Dual Death. He makes a thrust then unleashes two projectiles that travels along the ground ( do not make them travel as far as in the game). 3 hits max for Dual Death. If this movement makes no hit, the final smash is lost, but if there is an hit, those who are touched by this movement, are forced to be hit by Devil's Hellfire and Ain Soph Aur. The other opponents are safe because they are not seen in the screen, like in Captain's falcon final smash for example.) Do not forget to zoom on Emil when it is necessary like in the game.

22 hits max for Devil's hellfire. And 7 hits max for Ain Soph Aur. Ain Soph Aur, has medium knockback in first, mode, better knockback in second mode, and very good knockback in third mode.

The final smash is stronger according the mode you are, and has more knockback too.

The damages when you change mode are susceptible to change, because I don't truly know what weight Emil will have, I want him to be a light character but how light we will see. But what I'm sure is that the Centurion mode won't come when Emil is in very bad shape, because this mode doesn't grants so high advantages, even in the game.

 

[Royal_Blade]

The issue i have with that moveset is because every special can link into the other. Also, Blade Fury can't even be used in the air.

If we plan on doing "modes" then how 'bout this:

Emil <---> Ratatosk

Similar to Samus and her Zero Suit.

Final Smashes could work the same way:

Emil: Devil's Hellfire (Emil will get more of an urge for killing, which he will then turn to Ratatosk.)
Ratatosk: Ain Soph Aur (After the release of the "Massive Energy Sphere" Ratatosk will be tired and return to Emil.)

Again, working like Samus and ZSS.

 

[Fliptocat]

Oh, I forgot something, about Emil's moveset, and I hope it is the last thing.

Emil in the game doesn't truly use a move called Blade Fury in air, but that doesn't mean he doesn't use an arte like that in air, it is just that the name has changed and has an added attack.

When you're in air, you will use Swallow Fury. Originally, it is an arcane arte, but as it is an arcane arte, like most of his arcane artes, it is a mix between two moves. So we remove the beginning move (the move that is used in ground in fact where emil goes behind his opponent) and uses the moves he makes after that.

Yeah. I don't think the E/R thing is a very good idea..... We wouldn't be able to change the eye colors, anyway, he only has one texture slot for his eyes. And about the combo thing, that's how Emil works in ToS2. Philia (Barbatos) wanted that to be an integral part of the moveset.

 

[Judas]

I read all the topic, and as a Tales of fan, I want to express my opinion.

It would be completely unacceptable to make a Final smash where Emil turns into Ratatosk mode. It would mean that Emil mainly fights with his green eyes. And as a Tales of fan, I'm really shocked that Emil characteristics are truly not respected by this move. Those who have played the game know that the move suggested is completely contradictory and unrealist if we take a look at the game, I won't said more because some people may not have played the game so don't want to be spoiled.. I'm really afraid that this Emil in Brawl will truly lose major parts of his true identity... With the suggestions that were made, we're really going to that side... It would be a real shame according to me...