Does Falcon have an advantage match-up? Maybe over Ganon?

[DoonKoon]

I just saw your MU thread.. and I gotta say. Everything seems right cept the Ganon one. Why do the Falcon boards think it's 55:45 in his favor? The Ganon boards have it 40:60 in your favor I think.

 

[DoonKoon]

/double post. Ignore this.

 

[Acedude55]

We have it in ganons favor? Weird.

He also has an advantage over link, or its 50-50

 

[teluoborg]

This is why the Q&A thread should be stickied.

 

[lordhelmet]

I say 55:45 our favor. The Ganon boards way under estimate all of their MUs

 

[Superspright]

No they don't. They realize he is the worst--and were happy when he was established as the worst.

 

[lordhelmet]

No they don't. They realize he is the worst--and were happy when he was established as the worst.

Ok, maybe. But either way the Ganon Board's MU ratios are incorrect.

 

[Player-3]

no we have a 55-45 on ganon easy

 

[Liquid Gen]

but you guys have 95:5 on bowser

rite

 

[Red Arremer]

I think that Falcon has more than one advantageous match-up.

 

[Player-3]

link and ganon

thats it

 

[Ray_Kalm]

I adore the honesty and modesty which most of the Falcon mains are showing here.

 

[smashkng]

IMO it's 50/50, but most people think it's 55/45 Falcon. As neither Falcon not Ganon can approach each other. Ganon has a bit better priority and range and kills in less hits. Falcon has mobility. They easily gimp each other. It's a laughable matchup, easy to exploit their major weaknesses. Basically whoever decides to approach instead of defending loses the matchup.

Also, 55/45 is just slight advantage, it's no way a hard matchup.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

IMO it's 50/50, but most people think it's 55/45 Falcon. As neither Falcon not Ganon can approach each other. Ganon has a bit better priority and range and kills in less hits. Falcon has mobility. They easily gimp each other. It's a laughable matchup, easy to exploit their major weaknesses. Basically whoever decides to approach instead of defending loses the matchup.

Also, 55/45 is just slight advantage, it's no way a hard matchup.

Both can punish, but Falcon does it better.

Both can gimp, but Falcon does it better.

Both can kill, but Falcon does so better.

Both can live till high percentages, but Falcon survives longer.

Ganon is bigger and slower.

Falcon has no unusable moves, while Ganon has a couple.

Ganon receives a UAir out of his recovery, Falcon does not.

Falcon has more faster than the average gamer reaction moves than Ganon.


There you go. Listed them in separate sentences so you could read them properly.

 

[lordhelmet]

Both can punish, but Falcon does it better.

Both can gimp, but Falcon does it better.

Both can kill, but Falcon does so better.

Both can live till high percentages, but Falcon survives longer.

Ganon is bigger and slower.

Falcon has no unusable moves, while Ganon has a couple.

Ganon receives a UAir out of his recovery, Falcon does not.

Falcon has more faster than the average gamer reaction moves than Ganon.


There you go. Listed them in separate sentences so you could read them properly.

Lmao, how does Falcon kill and live longer than Ganon?

 

[Ray_Kalm]

There's a difference between the word "faster" and "easier".

Also, don't tell me you don't know the weight of your own character. Both Ganon and Falcon have the same amount of weight, Falcon only survives longer because of his recovery.

Here.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=232957

 

[LuLLo]

Agreed with Ray Kalm long before he posted..I think..
Ganon kills faster, but landing the things is an uphill battle, Falcon has faster kill moves and an easier time landing them, which is especially easy on Ganon, so Falcon wins in the killing power.

 

[lordhelmet]

Agreed with Ray Kalm long before he posted..I think..
Ganon kills faster, but landing the things is an uphill battle, Falcon has faster kill moves and an easier time landing them, which is especially easy on Ganon, so Falcon wins in the killing power.

Wrong, Ganon's moves KO moves are faster, stronger, and he has more options.

Fsmash, usmash, ftilt, and dash attack.

Falcon has fsmash (not as powerful and has more cooldown lag), utilt (will likely be stale), and usmash (also not as powerful) and Knee which will kill at about 120 with DI.

And Falcon is lighter than Ganon, just not by much.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Wrong, Ganon's moves KO moves are faster, stronger, and he has more options.

Fsmash, usmash, ftilt, and dash attack.

Falcon has fsmash (not as powerful and has more cooldown lag), utilt (will likely be stale), and usmash (also not as powerful) and Knee which will kill at about 120 with DI.

And Falcon is lighter than Ganon, just not by much.

You shouldn't be telling others they're wrong without being sure yourself.

Falcon has better kill moves. They're much more versatile than Ganon's. Especially in this match-up, where Ganon easier to hit than the other way around.

Falcon's BAir is just as powerful as Ganon's BAir, but about 4 frames faster, and with minimum lag at the end. Falcon's kill moves in general are much easier to land, and mainly because of the character's mobility allowing it to.

As for Falcon's weight. Falcon's lighter by a few percentages. Overall, he'll survive longer just because of his recovery and not being as easily comboble as Ganon.

 

[lordhelmet]

You shouldn't be telling others they're wrong without being sure yourself.

Falcon has better kill moves. They're much more versatile than Ganon's. Especially in this match-up, where Ganon easier to hit than the other way around.

Falcon's BAir is just as powerful as Ganon's BAir, but about 4 frames faster, and with minimum lag at the end. Falcon's kill moves in general are much easier to land, and mainly because of the character's mobility allowing it to.

As for Falcon's weight. Falcon's lighter by a few percentages. Overall, he'll survive longer just because of his recovery and not being as easily comboble as Ganon.

I like how you ignored Ganon's fmash, usmash, ftilt, and dash attack. I can do more if you'd like

Middle of FD, no DI:

Ganon's bair KOs Falcon at 126, Falcon's KOs Ganon at 130

Ganon's fsmash KOs Falcon at 78, Falcon's KOs Ganon at 118

Edit:

Ganon's usmash kills 1 % later, but it also does some of the DIing for you

 

[Player-3]

lmao lord

why would you get hit by ganons fsmash

 

[Lionman]

Falcon´s match ups are based on the heart of the player

a strong heart can beat every match up

Except Metaknight

DDD

...

And more

 

[lordhelmet]

lmao lord

why would you get hit by ganons fsmash

T__T

It's fast as hell ( don't have any frame data but I know it's fast)

But I'm just saying Ganon's KO moves are much more reliable than Falcon's.

Edit: I just realised today that the Knee is Falcon's strongest move lmao

 

[PK-ow!]

lmao lord

why would you get hit by ganons fsmash

No, it's Usmash that's ridiculous, here.

Fsmash has some fraction of a percent in a hypothetical world on the outskirts of the rocky portion of Hell in landing, on a techread.


Usmash is ridiculously inapplicable here. Behold: Lo, for he jest, that he should suggest Usmash will land in this matchup! Oh forsooth I ridicule it.

ftilt... y'know what, I'd like to see the debate whether it's worse or just slightly more likely.


Why don't we skip the squabbling stage, as fascinating as it is to watch Ray at work, and talk about how stage CPs work for this matchup.
Seems like it would be player dependent, which means that topic could be deep.

 

[Player-3]

ganons fsmash is not fast..

...
loooool

lordy ganon is only good at killing on wifi because he can throw random stuff out and hit you out of misspaced ****

offline hes pretty much terrible

only moves you should be killed by are uair

dashattack... and uh
uair maybe a bair? and POSSIBBBLLLYYYY a dair

and tipmanned uairs offstage but thats a gimp

us on the other hand dont need to kill, we can just gimp him like crazy

or kill him with, bair... which is very easy to land

or a dsmash

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Player-3 gets it.

 

[PZ]

WOW O_o yall should re dicuss ganon if its this much of a copetition at proving whoes worse and Ray_Kalm theres a reason why falcon was at the bottom on the 1st 2 tier list.
EDIT: THIS IS NOT THE FALCON SOCIAL!

 

[Player-3]

Ganon is worse there is no competition there

 

[A2ZOMG]

Ganondorf has zero safe moves and nothing that is viable if the opponent spotdodges on reaction, that is why Falcon is better.

 

[:mad:]

Probably should've asked in the matchup thread.