docs biggest counter?

[dawn001]

i cant stand marth.......bad matchup on battle field.....for me anyways. curse the sword.but beatable thought..........i have a hard time with projectile spammers......link and samus...........kind of difficult.............all you need is some good mindgames and a heck of a good reaction time.

what about a fox? how hard is that

 

[MASTER_VOID]

well really dont find fox to be that difficult.........the shine isent always a prob for me......thouth the random upA from nowheres confuses me somtimes......other then that you can always just upgrab them!

 

[dawn001]

well really dont find fox to be that difficult.........the shine isent always a prob for me......thouth the random upA from nowheres confuses me somtimes......other then that you can always just upgrab them!

ok void lets see what you got vs me when i get back your doc vs my fox

 

[Gea]

Wow... good spacies will always give EVERYONE problems. Ever try grabbing a good Fox? Hahaha. Even then you gotta be on a stage where you can chainthrow, and most of those stages allow Fox to just try and camp.

 

[MASTER_VOID]

true! but sometimes a little mindgames goes along way........take for instance chainthrowing......not saying its easy but when when get a chance to grab one....then try not to let him go......i find the sexykicks agianst fox's are pretty good a set up for your next move!

 

[Gea]

true! but sometimes a little mindgames goes along way........take for instance chainthrowing......not saying its easy but when when get a chance to grab one....then try not to let him go......i find the sexykicks agianst fox's are pretty good a set up for your next move!

... Chainthrowing != mindgames. And chainthrowing IS easy stuff... when you can get in a grab and actually are on a stage to do it. Fox has the advantage on Doc, period. It isn't like a counter or even WHOAMG DRASTIC but seriously, Fox is just better.

Your posts are hurting my brain.

 

[MASTER_VOID]

im talking about foxs.....somtimes foxs are hard to grab with foxs speed.....when you actualy do grab them you can take out a big chunk of damage........not really killing them.....big damage though........yea i realize that fox has an advantage but you shouldent count doc out cuz it all depends on the fox your playing.........amature tend to c-stick up alot........just wait it out......but fox can be hard on the reflector..........wavshine to your death

 

[Gea]

im talking about foxs.....somtimes foxs are hard to grab with foxs speed.....when you actualy do grab them you can take out a big chunk of damage........not really killing them.....big damage though........yea i realize that fox has an advantage but you shouldent count doc out cuz it all depends on the fox your playing.........amature tend to c-stick up alot........just wait it out......but fox can be hard on the reflector..........wavshine to your death

How long have you been playing the game? I mean there's little/no reason to discuss the matchup if your opponents flat out suck. Doc actually doesn't fear the waveshine as much as many other characters, nor shinespiking. It is really just Fox has speed, priority, range, and better smashes. They both are about equal in edgeguarding each other and it is MUCH easier for Fox to grab Doc. Then uthrow uairs work well on Doc too.

I'm not saying Doc doesn't have tricks (gogo wall of bairs and utilt and CCing into Dsmash, as well as other things like uair combos and the chainthrow) but Fox isn't in his favor. It isn't Doc's worst matchup by far but... Seriously, what? You're just spouting off gibberish.

 

[SPAWN]

Gea, you pwn. Tell me how to fight Falcons. /misses after your absence for a little while

Also, I disagree with you about upthrow to upair. I usually nair and they don't get to me and yes I've been playing good foxes. They sometimes wait though and use uptilt. So maybe dair works? I haven't tried it.

The only reason I'm afraid of the shine is from watching LuninSpectre **** some really good Docs with infiniting. It was amazing. He does it to Bob$ in some matches. Look for Getyourtournament..I'll link you if you can't find it.

Also, I saw Bob$ going even with Lunin and some Falco... who was really good. It can't be that bad of a matchup (Doc vs Fox or Doc vs Falco).

 

[Gea]

My advice for Falcon is to learn some godly DI and then take him to FoD. Falcons actually fear Doc too, according to their board. We all should know how to gimp Falcon's recovery... but on the stage its a bit tougher. You have to play very carefully. Use pills only when Falcon isn't in a position to get to you before you can at LEAST put up your shield.

Nair kinda works... differently against Falcon. If he jumps at you, you just wanna jump right at him and try to nair before he can aerial. It sounds dumb (and you actually have to be smart about this, seeing as you can eat many a knee this way) but it works. Wall of bairs can also be effective as long as you don't make it predictable (once again, knees) and uairs work great at disrupting combos.

Try not to CC too much either, or you'll find yourself down a stock when you get knee'd and you slide right off the stage. Hmm... Pressure on Falcon is great but kinda hard to do. Fulljumping dairs -> bairs work great, and double jumping reverse fairs can be awesome too. Short WDs with utilts can mess up Falcon as well....

I unno how to be much more specific. Comboing Falcon really isn't a problem (you can chain usmashes and etc) but its that once you start to get combo'd it can be ridiculously tough to get out. If you are ANYWHERE near the edge try to keep your second jump for as long as possible.

 

[BigRick]

Isn't Doc/Mario vs Falcon an even matchup?

Dude doesn't seem to like pills... he can't passively dodge them cause they move too slow. Doc has relatively an easier time escaping Falcon's combos. Also, Doc's aerials can beat his if you come from the right angle... plus he has all the great stuff we already know about: CGs, juggles, cape and bair.

Doc is like my best char vs Captain Falcon

EDIT: Gea is too right... one of the key to beating Falcon's aerials is to hit him before they come out (cause they don't come out that fast)

 

[SPAWN]

Thanks a lot Gea!

I wish there were some videos.. >.>

 

[BigRick]

Thanks a lot Gea!

I wish there were some videos.. >.>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xN2xvmNNEag

from the best

EDIT: I feel that Mario is better in this matchup because the lower KO power can be compensated by the easy edgeguarding and the better recovery helps alot when you get kneed.

 

[SPAWN]

Thank-you!