Different experience in learning

[TheFifthMan]

I have been playing serious Smash for about a month now, and I was aware of the advanced techniques for about 2 months beforehand because I didn't own the game and would watch videos before I actually gained ownership of a Gamecube and Smash. Curiously, I have become a walking testament to AlphaZealot's statement (which is paraphrased for the purposes of this thread), which is:

"Advanced Techs do not mean immediate ownership of your friends."

In my experience, learning to SHFFL and wavedash as I started to learn the basic techniques have put me on an odd matchup against my friends who have played for years and were completely unaware of the intricacies of competitive Smash. I am a Marth player, and while I could perform a Dair spike on the opponent's recovery jumps, shield grab, and spam SHFFLed Nairs on them, they would always beat me with simple rollsmashes, because they'd roll circles around me as I tried to land a utilt.

I know about these techniques and I practice them, but I am still far from mastery. Is there anyone that had a screwy beginner time like mine and would like to share their experience?

 

[Peaches]

Yeah, it took me a while to really implement anything useful into my game, so I got scrubbed over for a while and they didn't think that the techniques were any use.

It's a vicious circle, because if you only play your friends, odds are that advanced techs won't change much because they'll keep you stuck in old habits.

 

[Aiko]

Yeah your skill level does seem to go down abit.
When I played with my friend before advanced techniques I used to win by 1 or 2 stock with an occasional loss. Once I started implementing advanced techniques, it was him who was beating me on a regular basis. But but after consistant practice, I played him last night and won pretty much every game again, but this time i was consistantly 2-3 stocking him. I've only been doing advanced techniques for about a month. Although I'm not completely fluent yet, theres already a noticable difference.

I think having an experience of a weaker style shows how much an improvement advanced techniques are. I would say you don't have the experience of rolling and smashing to know its limitations, but thats to be expected since you only recently got the game. Just keep going the way you are and don't learn bad habits. You may be getting kicked now but sooner or later you'll get ahead.

 

[purekorea]

More than techs it's your habits that need to change. Advance tech will change the habits but it will take time. My friend and I go even when we play normally, but I'm more technically sound (he can't even shl with falco more than three times in a row while I can do it during and entire match and different heights); however, due to the fact that my habits are still the same he still exploits them.

Also I don't know if you have this problem, but be confident you can do the advance techs. For me I'm not really confident I can wavedash all over the place on command so I find myself rolling instead, but recently I've been just going at it, not caring if I mess up and I've gotten alot of cheap kills wavesmashing and forcing whiffs.

Oh and don't force advance techs, sometimes a simple "beginner tech" will work.

And if they are rolling around you from one side to the other again and again just fsmash or utilt in your case, in the same direction twice. My friends do that and I've learned to wait for them to roll past me and just turning and grabbing them. Rolls are easy to abuse if you can get their roll patterns down.

 

[Sensai]

I mained Fox when I discovered advanced techs, meaning my skill not only dropped, it SHOT downwards. Realizing that Fox was too quick for me, I dropped him and went to the less quick Ganon.

Now you have to understand: WDing with Ganon is not necessary (or, as Aniki would argue, with any character). It's more of a minor mindgame/minute spacing thing. So, when I first picked him up, I would attempt to WD everywhere only to get owned. Then, I loosened up and now I'm much much better.

That's my advice to you: loosen up a bit. Sure, advanced techs are great things (L-Cancelling is a must), but (with the afore mentioned exception) they're not always necessary. Just concentrate on one tech at a time, and go from there. Start with L-Cancelling. Once you have that down, then go to WDing.

 

[Ronin686]

When I first learned to SHFFL, it would make me a lot worse. I would try do do it at the wrong times, etc. Although advanced techniques are very useful, you can never forget about basic smash techs.

 

[Fletch]

Advanced techniques only improve your game after a while, when you truly learn how to implement them. At first, they do seem to make you worse.

 

[Edg]

When u learn AT's you really do get worse.. even if u can execute them perfectly u dont have experience to know when to use them. After practice you impliment them into your game and you get better at the same rate as you got worse really.

 

[Blackshadow]

Took me about 2 months before I adapted to the advanced techniques, which meant being constantly owned for 2 montha But afterwards I owned my friends

 

[Airo]

Its not about knowing HOW to use them... Its about knowing WHEN to use them.
just keep playing, from a continuous build up of experience, you will learn the appropriate applications of advance tecniques.

 

[Giggidax]

i have jus recently got a gamecube and ssbm hmm say 5 days ago, and im trying to learn advance teching and shffling etc. all my skills are horrible as of now, but every once in a blue moon i can pull off some fancy lookin stuff. lol but other then that im hopeless.

 

[Keige]

I never use SHFFLing, but I can beat my friends in a 3 on 1 match. It was on Super Sudden Death, but still. I beat 3 people. Simple techs can work better since I have serious trouble short hopping.

 

[Sky2042]

With Marth, wouldn't it be easy to dsmash to stop a roller? Or am I totally like, on crack?

Lol, SSD. Fsmash ftw!

 

[Zink]

I'm pretty sue the roll's invincibility frames could block the dsmash. Plus if you time it wrong they just go by without getting hit. I prefer dtilt. Or jumping.

 

[Tyson651]

i seriously was in the same situation as u too.

personally, i got the game on christmas, 1 week after getting smash, i found this website (as u can see im january 2006) so i pretty much just started fresh, while trying to learn how to air dodge, and spot dodge, while trying to dashdance and wavedash at the same time.

it really had me in a bad position since i started learning the basic techniques AND advanced techniques at the same time.

which obviously, some of my friends who been playing this game for a few years already, can easily beat the bloody pulp out of me.

but just keep practicing with both of them, that way, u wont create any bad habits such as spamming rolls, when wavedash is there, or continuous smashing, when shuffl'ing is there.

it builds skill for both sides of the coin, and personally i learned very quickly, and after 2 months, i can beat all my friends, using both basic and advanced techniques ive learned.

id say it was a rather hard road to go through, but if u only concentrate on improving and not winning, u can easily spot techniques to replace, and trial and error methods to improve.

EDIT: btw, about the rolling around u in circles or w/e, just do a shuffl'd nair, while DI'ing backwards, therefore ur spacing ur self away from them, and if they tried to roll behind u, they get hit, and they roll away, well, at least u got ur space between u and him, marths need spacing, so always keep him on the tip of ur sword, since thats where its most strongest.

 

[Sushiman]

I'm in the same situation you are. I learned about Advanced Techniques about one month before I got myself a copy for Christmas. I practiced a whole bunch of wavedashing and shffls, but I would still always lose to my friends. After a while, I noticed that I would keep doing those same advanced techniques at the wrong time, and I would get pwnd. I need to practice a lot more before I get better.