DG's Lucario Specific Tech Skill Brief

[Darkgun]

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Lots of new Lucario players surfacing as of late! That's exciting!
Lots of questions surfacing that have been answered plenty of times! Not quite as exciting.
So rather than answering the questions new players have on a case by case basis, I'll just make this thread to try to help a bit.

Read this thread over before you ask questions, as you may find the answer in here.

A note about this thread: it is not a "this links into this" thread. You'll find the tools to do that here, but you'll have to make the other things happen on your own. This will also be primarily focused on Lucario specific tech skills, so it isn't the best place to look for global tech.

Format: • Name -- Acronym -- Input -- Description -- Example(s)
• Aura Sphere Cancel -- ASC -- B+L[Shield] -- A universal linking move. ASC is commonly performed directly after an attack that would most benefit from either an earlier attack in the chain or a safe option. ASC, essentially, allows you to more quickly return to a neutral character state than waiting on endlag or any other special. The animation following the shield input is freely interruptable. -- jab>utilt>ASC>ftilt>usmash; dthrow>fair>ASC>fair.

• Aura Sphere to Shield -- AStS -- B+L[Shield]+Direction -- A nuance of ASC, performed by holding a direction before canceling Aura Sphere. Lucario will skip the IASA frames of Aura Sphere Cancel and immediately shield, tilting the shield in the direction held. The direction of facing may be buffered during Aura Sphere's startup, or after (though it must be entered slow enough to avoid rolling). Note: If Tap Jump is disabled and up is held, Lucario will not AStS.

• Aura Sphere Pivot Cancel -- [none] -- B+Backwards+L[Shield] -- A nuance of ASC. Performed by inputting the opposite direction of facing before the shield input. Causes Lucario to Aura Sphere Cancel and pivot to face backwards and shield immediately, giving Lucario access to his traditional options while shielding. The direction of facing may be buffered during Aura Sphere's startup, or after (though it must be entered slow enough to avoid rolling).

• [Buffered] Aerial Double Team Cancel -- aDTC -- dB+A[Hold as soon as; before intangible.] -- Most commonly used to recover or for surprise approaches, as it makes Lucario go fast, so to speak. The attack input can be buffered (holding down A right after inputting down B) such that the cancel will occur as soon as possible. dair causes Lucario to travel on a different trajectory. -- On high recovery: aDTC>nair/fair/uair/bair; on ledge height recovery: aDTC>dair.

• Aerial Force Palm -- aFP -- sB[In air.] -- A bit tricky to learn at first due to the 12 frame startup, the move throws opponents down-downforward as a meteor. The easiest ways to learn spacing would probably be trying to grab a training character set to jump or grabbing a character standing on a platform. Aerial Force Palm has a slightly larger vertical grab box than it's grounded counterpart.

• Extreme Speed Cancel -- ESC -- uB+A[During Extreme Speed] -- Extreme Speed Cancel allows Lucario to cancel ES at any time and perform any action that could normally be performed while not in special fall. It should be noted that the cancel hitbox does not count as a hitbox for the purposes of cancels, and ESC does not reset Lucario's midair jump. Additionally, Lucario can ESC>ES if Extreme Speed is started on the ground, where as if started in the air, Lucario must connect with an aerial to cancel into ES. -- jab>utilt>usmash>JC>ESC>fair>ES; SHFFLbair>rDTC>jab>jab>dtilt>ESC>ES.

• Up Smash Jump Cancel -- usmash>JC -- usmash+jump[On/after 3rd, 4th, or 5th/last hit.] -- On hit or on shield, Lucario can jump cancel Shoryuken towards the end of the move. This uses your double jump. -- usmash>JC.

• Waveland Out of Up Smash -- [none] -- usmash+WD[Right before touching the ground.] -- At the very end of Shoryuken, Lucario is still in the air, and thus can air dodge at the end of the move. This is more of a defensive or movement option, to my knowledge (as I've never seen or considered it for an option in punish.)

• To sweetspot the ledge with Extreme Speed, Lucario must be pointing downwards near it (I refer to it as "nose down" personally). This makes it nearly impossible (with some extremely rare exceptions) to sweetspot the ledge from directly below.

• Things that can be bReversed (and therefore also wavebounced): Aura Sphere, Double Team, Force Palm.
• Multihit moves (which can therefore be cancelled before the last hit): Shoryuken (uSmash), Tatsu (nair), dair.
• Lucario can Moonwalk.
• Lucario can Wall Jump.
• Bair, unless canceled (OHC/l-cancel), will reverse Lucario's facing.

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Got any other questions that aren't answered here? Ask!
Think of some Lucario specific tech skill I forgot? Mention it and I'll add it!

 

[AkashSky]

You should include extreme-speed cancels and the various options out of that.

 

[Darkgun]

You should include extreme-speed cancels and the various options out of that.

I was just going to answer this as a question rather than add it to the brief and move on, but Extreme Speed Cancels apparently are... intuitive, but still somewhat complex. You can now find that up above. Thanks for the suggestion!

 

[ManaX]

Aerial Aura Sphere Cancel is so good. It sets up for such a nice hadoken chase or follow up aerial.
Also you can jump out of shoryu if you hit shield, so you won't have to go through the end lag and get grabbed.
Lucario is all about quick reaction time and nimble fingers.

 

[Risky]

It wouldn't hurt to include strong DT cancel options, such as grounded DT -> dtilt, grounded DT -> Fsmash to cover a lot of distance, and the like.

 

[Darkgun]

So this may not happen immediately, but next chance I get to sit down and lab it out, I'm going to figure out the details and explain the momentum carrying options that Lucario can utilize. And that'll include DTC options, both grounded and aerial.

 

[Omega Male]

Why is this not pinned?

 

[Chocolatnave]

What does OSC stand for? I see it mentioned in Lucario threads, too often to be a typo of ASC.

 

[artofskjet]

What does OSC stand for? I see it mentioned in Lucario threads, too often to be a typo of ASC.

Probably meant One Hit Cancel (OHC) is not I don't know what OSC means

 

[SwiftOfDaSouth]

My god...I really enjoy playing Lucario for all his street fighter callbacks and just general coolness, but when I see tech like this that goes on for like a page that I haven't mastered...discouraging is the only word that comes to mind

 

[Darkgun]

My god...I really enjoy playing Lucario for all his street fighter callbacks and just general coolness, but when I see tech like this that goes on for like a page that I haven't mastered...discouraging is the only word that comes to mind

If it helps any, most of this stuff is somewhat easy to execute, on a technical level. Where to use it is a bit more complicated, of course, but honestly difficult execution with Lucario comes in the form of putting it all together where necessary in a combo.

Why is this not pinned?

Well, you have my vote. Probably make it much easier for new players to find the thread that way.

 

[Thor]

So ASC is essentially starting an aura sphere charge and shield-cancelling it immediately? Can we hit both buttons simultaneously, hold L in the lag of another aerial and hit b to execute the cancel immediately (i.e., can I do a fair, hold L during the fair animation, and if it hits, hit the B button to immediately ASC as long as I've held L (or R) long enough to go through the cancel and startup of aura sphere), or do I have to hit B, then hit L/R?

 

[Darkgun]

So ASC is essentially starting an aura sphere charge and shield-cancelling it immediately? Can we hit both buttons simultaneously, hold L in the lag of another aerial and hit b to execute the cancel immediately (i.e., can I do a fair, hold L during the fair animation, and if it hits, hit the B button to immediately ASC as long as I've held L (or R) long enough to go through the cancel and startup of aura sphere), or do I have to hit B, then hit L/R?

O.K, so I got a chance to sit down and test this out, and yes, this does indeed work. To clarify, if you are inputting a shield input during the frame in which Aura Sphere cancels, Lucario will ASC. This is independent of when you started to hold the shield input.

This is great to find out, as it offers yet another alternative to inputting actions with Lucario. However, it is important to note that globally you can also buffer shield with this method, meaning that if, for some reason, you are on the ground as you ASC, inputting any action during the IASA frames will result in a shield option as normal (or alternatively, if you are holding shield and a direction, you will immediately enter shield). This might make aerial ASC aided combos easier, as there is no need to press an extra button (as it is already held), and this should prevent accidental air dodges (as you cannot buffer an air dodge), but since it doesn't apply to grounded combos, using this method might also add excess complication to input methods.

Edit: Also, added Aura Sphere to Shield (AStS) to the brief. Yaaay mid-combo countermeasures!

 

[Thor]

O.K, so I got a chance to sit down and test this out, and yes, this does indeed work. To clarify, if you are inputting a shield input during the frame in which Aura Sphere cancels, Lucario will ASC. This is independent of when you started to hold the shield input.

This is great to find out, as it offers yet another alternative to inputting actions with Lucario. However, it is important to note that globally you can also buffer shield with this method, meaning that if, for some reason, you are on the ground as you ASC, inputting any action during the IASA frames will result in a shield option as normal (or alternatively, if you are holding shield and a direction, you will immediately enter shield). This might make aerial ASC aided combos easier, as there is no need to press an extra button (as it is already held), and this should prevent accidental air dodges (as you cannot buffer an air dodge), but since it doesn't apply to grounded combos, using this method might also add excess complication to input methods.

Edit: Also, added Aura Sphere to Shield (AStS) to the brief. Yaaay mid-combo countermeasures!

ASIS sounds good to me for two things - 1) making Lucario combos safer during 2V1s (there is an option besides dsmash for protecting yourself from both sides) and 2) getting those grabs mid-combo - I may try using this to get jab -> ftilt -> shieldgrab -> etc.

Part of why I asked about all this instead of testing myself is because I live in an area where PM occurs, but I myself do not have my PM setup on me at the moment (college and parents not letting me bring it with me). Thank you for testing and answering my questions.

 

[Thor]

Also this should be pinned.

 

[Darkgun]

Going to be honest: not sure who to ask about getting this pinned. That said, I suspect once Risky gets the guide he's cooking up published it will most certainly be sticky'd.

 

[Risky]

Going to be honest: not sure who to ask about getting this pinned. That said, I suspect once Risky gets the guide he's cooking up published it will most certainly be sticky'd.

This is a long time coming.

 

[Stryker]

So, I wasn't sure whether to post these questions here or in the other thread, but I have some curiousities. I just picked up this characters about two weeks ago.What a brutal character.
He kind of feels like fox where you kind of have those glimpses of godhood every once in a while.

1. How useful is ASC in linking grounded moves? I've seen people link tilts by using ASC and I was wondering if this actually safe to do/if it links properly.
2. Is it worth it to Double Team Cancel any Ariel that you aren't ASC'ing? The only difference I can see thus far is that ASC'ing an ariel seems to allow for close range followups faster, while double team cancelling allows you to follow them if they get sent really far.
3. Grounded ASC sets up for a normal grab. Is it ever better to grab normally in the midst of a combo as opposed to his command grab?
4. Is First hit Dair to ariel command throw a weight/fallspeed dependent finisher, or is it just spacing dependent?
5. Cancelling Up Smash into the Ariel Spike throw seems to work pretty consistently on spacies. Given the tech opportunity, is this safe? I've been trying to cover with nair, but I haven't gotten to test this enough on people.
6. When do you use ftilt in grounded strings? Dtilt seems to be good at covering shield options, and utilt hits behind you, but what good is ftilt? Range?

Lastly, any suggestions on what to lead in with when using a double team cancel as an approach. I feel like it's a great approach, but aura is just such a a precious resources, I haven't gotten to mess around with it as much as I'd like. Though, I do like using utilt out of it.
Sorry for the nooby questions! ^.^ I tried digging around but couldn't exactly find the info I was looking for.

Edit: Is Dash Attack into ASC a thing that gets used? If so, why? I think I keep seeing it/something similar in videos.

 

[itz_Landry]

At what point does Extreme Speed spike when off stage/in air, and how do you need to hit the opponent to make the spike? I've done it many times on accident, but I'm starting to integrate ES into my combos, and this would be something nice to know.

 

[THEDADPOOL]

At what point does Extreme Speed spike when off stage/in air, and how do you need to hit the opponent to make the spike? I've done it many times on accident, but I'm starting to integrate ES into my combos, and this would be something nice to know.

extremespeed doesn't "spike" it has what people call a "wind box"

So, I wasn't sure whether to post these questions here or in the other thread, but I have some curiousities. I just picked up this characters about two weeks ago.What a brutal character.

1)very useful
2)dont understand to much but what i can tell you is that if your going for a kill with like nair you should dt instead of asc because they can sdi into the aura sphere so they dont go flying
3)normal up throw has far more combo pontential then fp
4)do that instead of fair-fp(only do this if you know they di is in)
5)let me save you some time don't do upsmash to sideb
6)ftilt is bad try not to use so much unless your trying to get enough reach to get upsmash but even then try not to use this move there is usually a better option you can do(im not sure if you watch Ipk stream but we play alot) most of the time if we do ftilt it was usually supposed to be a da or a certain smash attack.
hope i was helpful

 

[Stryker]

1)very useful
2)dont understand to much but what i can tell you is that if your going for a kill with like nair you should dt instead of asc because they can sdi into the aura sphere so they dont go flying
3)normal up throw has far more combo pontential then fp
4)do that instead of fair-fp(only do this if you know they di is in)
5)let me save you some time don't do upsmash to sideb
6)ftilt is bad try not to use so much unless your trying to get enough reach to get upsmash but even then try not to use this move there is usually a better option you can do(im not sure if you watch Ipk stream but we play alot) most of the time if we do ftilt it was usually supposed to be a da or a certain smash attack.
hope i was helpful

Thannnkkk yooouuu

But #5 looks sooo goood. JK. Thanks for the advice though. I was worried I just wasn't going to get a response D:
I actually had the feeling that Ftilt was useless, but I always was worried it was used for something I couldn't think of. I've been watching a decent amount of IPK and he is pretty good. I saw the MM with his vs AMSA and it was hyyyyypppeee. I wish they could do another on 3.5

Any tips on getting consistent with ESC combos? I find it difficult to get the precision I need when going for things like ESC>Doublejump> Uair (Or ESC>First hit dair>Sideb) kills or things of that nature. I imagine it's just that I need to grind a few more hours into it though.

Thanks again!

 

[THEDADPOOL]

No problem and yeah watch his stream or past broadcast/youtube it can help give you an idea of how to play the character and what is typicAlly good to go for, also were pretty sure amsa doesnt play pm anymore, and for extreme speed stuff again look at ipk stuff he does it a lot more then i do but i still do it

 

[atara]

A tech I've been using but still can't hit consistently:

* trans-platform dair. While standing on a platform, tap down and immediately as Lucario starts to fall tap A to perform a dair. Dair will hit through the platform but Lucario rises slightly as he performs it and will land where he started. Allows you to sort-of-safely attack an opponent ever-so-slightly below the platform, generally useful (in rare situations) on larger characters or FoD.

 

[Firebolt]

I'm new to the forum here so hi everyone! But I have been practicing Lucario for about a month now and I was wondering if there were other things I need to practice besides this stuff?