Corrin Approach options?

[McZaxon]

Hello!

So in general, I've kind of always been bad at approaching. it seems to me that I can't really play mind games because I don't really know how to. I use dash dancing to my advantage, but that seems to be read half the time. I'm generally an aggressive player, so charging in is something I do quite often. Most of the time this isn't the best thing to do.

But I was just curious as to how some of you guys handle approaching with Corrin. What do you do against certain players or characters? Do you play offensively or defensively? I also would love to get better at reading, but that's a whole different discussion.

Any feedback is appreciated! thank you!

 

[Arrei]

From the ground, I usually focus on getting into range then spacing with SH Fairs, Instant Lunge, Jab, or Dtilt. From the air, it's either RAR Bair, jumping behind them then using Bair, or landing on them with Fair and Nair if I have an opening. Throw in the occasional mixup with tomahawking, or landing then using jab or Dtilt to keep them guessing between the two. I may also fake out an approach when anticipating an aggressive response from my opponent, then jump back into DFS to fish for setups or kills.

 

[Kodystri]

I am in general is a defensive player. But, I can play aggressive. The biggest thing is, knowing your opponents options and your options. What move is safe while what option(s) does it cover? just think of your options

 

[Skitrel]

Corrin's best approaching option is her presence and not her moveset. If she's in range to use her lance in any way then the opponent MUST do something about it, and what they can't do is simply shield. If they pick any option with even a small amount of lag then a perfectshield IP is usually guaranteed, then the strings flow out of her like crazy once she gains an advantage state of the edgeguard situation.

Pin on shield and waiting until the move cancels itself actually appears to have some useful properties too. Much of the cast can't do something oos without getting punished by a kick so it forces them to just keep shielding. This shield damage then leads to tippers at their unprotected feet and elsewhere. I'm also a fan of IP>kick against shield when it will send Corrin offstage because of the massive shield damage. IP>kick>BreverseDFS can apply a touch more shield damage and stop an attempted edgeguard. The shield is basically at less than 15% remaining after this so you've put the fear of god into them.

Corrin can be terrifying. Using that terror gives you a huge amount of control. When you take that mental control of the situation opponents break down and start making terrible decisions.

 

[Garde Noir]

Skitrel says it best, but I'll try and add some things that aren't quite on the list.

The best way to play mind games is to influence how your opponent thinks.
For example, everyone facing a Corrin knows how strong F Smash is. Use it once or twice when you know the opponent will dodge it to see how they react. Yes, you'll lose the brief exchange, but a well-timed Fair or Counter can get you back to neutral, and gained you some knowledge -- not only do you know how they will react to a forward Smash, but you've implanted the mindset into your opponent that you WILL forward smash, giving them the habit of their reaction, which you can counter.

I do this often vs characters that cannot outright kill me early game: hit a Fair, land and try and forward smash. Most of the time they're in landing anyways, so they won't get hit, but sometimes they do, and even more sometimes, they'll either roll or jump. I them will do this 2 more times or so, making my opponent think it's a habit, but instead forcing them into habits. If it's a consistent jump 2 out of the 3 times, instead, I'll Nair where I would have forward Smashed. If it's a roll, downsmash punishes.

This can be done with any move, or set of moves, but the best way to play mindgames if you're not a learning software like M2K is to create the situations in which your opponent will create habits, instead of finding them right off the bat.

As per approaching, your two best approach options are short hop Fair and DL Spikes. Mix them up, but with Corrin's range and aerial mobility, you can afford to wait a second or two to see what the opponent is doing before committing to full-aggro mode.

 

[Amadeus9]

Why approach when u can throw out nair and autowin neutral

100% serious

 

[WondrousMoose]

Why approach when u can throw out nair and autowin neutral

100% serious

I was just about to say that. Nair comes out relatively quickly, surrounds Corrin with great disjoint, and stays out for a long time. You're basically turning Corrin into a large, round hitbox.

 

[Trash Boat]

To approach with Corrin, I usually try to space with perfect pivot tilts and b-reversed Chomps. Also like Moose stated; her nair does come out quickly and has a disjointed hitbox, as well as being quite a large hitbox. It combos into other moves too. Don't forget about the range

 

[mdoepker]

I was just about to say that. Nair comes out relatively quickly, surrounds Corrin with great disjoint, and stays out for a long time. You're basically turning Corrin into a large, round hitbox.

Not that Nair is a bad option (because it isn't), but it also isn't safe on shield, so you need to make sure you're spacing it correctly. I do us Nair to approach quite frequently. I also find it quite beneficial to add in SH Fairs, and attempt to use (RAR) Bairs when I can. I should keep Tomahawking in mind, as it will be a great mixup addition to my playstyle.

However, when it comes to Corrin approaching characters like Toon Link (and others who can easily camp us out), how do you approach? I know the patient game of slowly approaching and perfect shielding is the best, but I'm relatively new and have little to no experience with that. Is it just something I need to get better at?

 

[Ingoro]

Not that Nair is a bad option (because it isn't), but it also isn't safe on shield, so you need to make sure you're spacing it correctly. I do us Nair to approach quite frequently. I also find it quite beneficial to add in SH Fairs, and attempt to use (RAR) Bairs when I can. I should keep Tomahawking in mind, as it will be a great mixup addition to my playstyle.

However, when it comes to Corrin approaching characters like Toon Link (and others who can easily camp us out), how do you approach? I know the patient game of slowly approaching and perfect shielding is the best, but I'm relatively new and have little to no experience with that. Is it just something I need to get better at?

Yeah, that's something you need to get better at, I believe it's a mindset thing. A lot of players have the tendency to just continue approaching without breathing phases in their game, a prime example would be landing into your opponent after you've just been combo'd or stringed, don't do that. . Keep in mind that a projectile camper such as Toon Link has a weak grab, it's highly punishable if it misses, so make sure you have a good patience shield game for those kind of match ups.

 

[Absol]

I like to do SH fair on their shield, then DJ bair to push me past them and cross up.

 

[mdoepker]

Yeah, that's something you need to get better at, I believe it's a mindset thing. A lot of players have the tendency to just continue approaching without breathing phases in their game, a prime example would be landing into your opponent after you've just been combo'd or stringed, don't do that. . Keep in mind that a projectile camper such as Toon Link has a weak grab, it's highly punishable if it misses, so make sure you have a good patience shield game for those kind of match ups.

Yeah that's what I figured about my playstyle in the MU. I'm still relatively new to the game, so I figured I was just screwing it up. Out of curiosity though, is the MU against projectile based characters (such as Tink) in our favour if both sides are ideally played?

 

[Amadeus9]

If youre finding a way to use nair unsafely, you are somehow using nair wrong.

 

[WhiteMageBD]

use all this to apply mix ups on your opponent. When approaching i do
Grab( silly me, how could i forget this one)
Dash atk (use rarely)
Running shield.
Running spotdodge.(sometimes)
instant pin lunge
Sh Fair
Sh nair
rar bair
rar uair or falling uair. (sometimes)
Tomahawk( in occasion)
sh DFS or just do it on the ground
I learned that if you do a sh airdodge, you still have enough time to still use air dragon lunge to really cross them up.
Combine this with Corrin retreating options and your foe will have a hard time reading you. there are more mixups to make this strategy even better though. Let me know.

 

[Ingoro]

Yeah that's what I figured about my playstyle in the MU. I'm still relatively new to the game, so I figured I was just screwing it up. Out of curiosity though, is the MU against projectile based characters (such as Tink) in our favour if both sides are ideally played?

Bit hard to say, in general characters who have good and fast approach options struggle a lot less against projectile characters. Corrin's running speed isn't great and neutral B clashes with a lot of stuff so it's a bit early to tell.

In general (and this applies to every approaching character really) keep in mind to NOT use your second jump if you're approaching with an aerial, as a veteran smash player this is such an easy thing to punish with shield grabs.

 

[mdoepker]

In general (and this applies to every approaching character really) keep in mind to NOT use your second jump if you're approaching with an aerial, as a veteran smash player this is such an easy thing to punish with shield grabs.

That's actually something that people have mentioned to me occasionally, but nobody has ever explained what it means, so thanks

It's mostly passing comments such as, "You sometimes double jump when you're under pressure," which I didn't realize in itself was a bad thing. I just thought people were picking up on my habits. That's apparently something I need to work on.

 

[Arrei]

No advice is always absolute, though. Double jumping can end up being a mixup if your opponent is fooled by it. I've baited opponents into making moves I can punish by acting like I'm going for a landing aerial or tomahawk, then double jumping into a FF aerial when they commit to something. With Corrin, I've used this to land a tipper DL for a kill.

 

[Saclam]

The go to approach for me is short hoping for mind games and trying to studying my opponent's reactions.if they try to rush me down,sh nair covers a lot of space and a good starter for fair strings.rolling away?reverse bair,fair,and dragon lunge got me covered.

In short,nair,fair,reverse bair(the push back is pretty useful for closing the gap for a dash grab)and side b are usually the go to approach options.

 

[Zephil]

nair is love, nair is life. You can mix it up and try to hit the opponent with one of the many different hitboxes the move has. Also the move is great to sh and land behind the opponent.

I also try to approach after a DFS as the opponent is dealing with it.

Is not so much about approaching actually and more about maintaining the space you want from your opponent.

 

[mdoepker]

No advice is always absolute, though. Double jumping can end up being a mixup if your opponent is fooled by it. I've baited opponents into making moves I can punish by acting like I'm going for a landing aerial or tomahawk, then double jumping into a FF aerial when they commit to something. With Corrin, I've used this to land a tipper DL for a kill.

Oh of course, but I assume that if people are mentioning it, it likely means that it's somewhat of an "issue" I need to practice my DL tippers more, that's for sure. It's so potent for killing, and I don't use it enough. And that includes getting the tip to go through the ledge.

 

[Opana]

Majority of my approach involves spacing shff autocancel fairs mixed with throws. Sometimes I'll sh fair or sh airdodge into dragon lunge, if they shield I kick away. Full hop dragon lunge is another option I use to mix things up, either landing with dragon fang shot or fair to minimize landing lag.

Imo though the most important thing is to mix in grabs regardless of what you do, don't let them feel safe in it despite his throw being kinda sucky. It'smore about conditioning them to dodge so we can get a better punish.

My approach is pretty much that, pretty basic but effective done right.

 

[Ingoro]

Also Back-air, it's safe on shield and allows us to effectively poke in the neutral.

 

[Chief Hotsuin]

l love Corrin's bair. lt works wonderfully with crossing up on offense and defense, poking, and edgeguarding. The Swiss Army Knife of the moveset. You can't combo, but that's why literally every other move you have sends upwards.

DL generally forces some type of option when the enemy is caught prone. Can they wait it out for you to drop, assuming you DL only a small bit of time after they fall prone?

Nair, when combined with dtilt, other aerials, and some jab shenanigans, sounds like a great way to force your opponent into shield, leading into a possible tomahawk (not much you can get out of it before 150%)

Fox-trotting feels really easy with all of the new DLC characters. l know Corrin's dash speed is too slow to pressure with this like someone like Cloud can (l'm being serious, Melee-esque dash-dancing has gotten me some nice dash grabs/attacks, or even FTs at some points, but you don't care), but l really want to be proven wrong. Fox-trot dtilt/ftilt?

Not much really sets up for zone-breaking, but Corrin's own zone is so massive and threatening that people will probably respect it, unless they're beating you in the neutral. Corrin is more a melee camper, like most swordsmen. "Why should l move in when l can whittle you down from 5 feet away? l'll take what l've learned in my threatening you and actually do something when l know it'll work." That sort of thing.

 

[Zionaze]

Which move has better front range? Nair? Fair?

 

[WhiteMageBD]

Which move has better front range? Nair? Fair?

fair

 

[Goulmania]

The only time you need to approach as corrin is when you face projectile zoners, in which case you need to slowly box them to the edge with your big hitboxes since you melee range has a greater reach than theirs.

Just walk up to them shielding their stuff, they'll be forced to engage you in melee sooner or later. If they throw projectiles too close you can instant pin out of shield.

Avoid Bair if they're heavy zoners since it spaces you to far from them and you'll have to run back part of the way, I favor reverse falling Uair and max range Fair.

Against melee zoners you can force them to approach with neutral B just be careful not to get hit through it since it has no priority.

PS: if you're playing from behind and your opponent is just waiting for you, you can pressure him with Bairs and mix-up grabs and side-Bs (do not commit on shield unless you're sure they're going to drop it)

 

[MockRock]

Well, Corrin's a spacing character, so range is your primary advantage. You generally want to be hitting with the tip of whatever move you throw at them. As for more specific options:

Bair: I think that a short hop RAR bair is possibly Corrin's best option for approaching. It's his one move that's truly safe on shield, plus it has ridiculous range, auto spaces, and has high knockback and damage.

Instant Dragon Lunge: Against a lot of the roster, this is a decent approach if you aim for the tip. You have several options to escape if you get blocked, and staying in place can apply shield pressure. Just be aware that really fast dashers can be a problem; if you miss and then lunge forwards or backwards a Falcon or Mac will always catch you.

Fair: It's not truly safe on shield, but if you space it correctly it's pretty difficult to punish for most characters. It's also one of Corrin's best combo starters.

Dragon Fang Shot: The quick -> quick version of this attack puts out multiple hitboxes and doesn't have too much end lag. For an interesting mixup, try approaching, fade away short hopping, then b-reversing a DFS.

Those are some of the best approaches I can think of for Corrin.

 

[MockRock]

If youre finding a way to use nair unsafely, you are somehow using nair wrong.

I don't actually agree with this. Nair only hits your opponent once and lasts a long time, so it's actually VERY unsafe on shield.

 

[Chief Hotsuin]

Well, Corrin's a spacing character, so range is your primary advantage. You generally want to be hitting with the tip of whatever move you throw at them.

To be more specific on this, abuse your long reach not just by poking people's shields, but also by being able to cut off an option form afar.

For example, if you know a TL always shoots an arrow from some distance and your Fsmash happens to be within that range, why not drive a stick through his abdomen once or twice? He'll get the message. (Just an example due to a lack of a much better one of the top of my head, do not fsmash small Heroes of Time in neutral)

Falcon dashing in? You can stuff it out from farther away than others, so a smart Falcon will work around that (smart Falcons don't just dash in haphazardly with absolutely no data on your habits, making the example half invalid, so....).

You use reach to camp like a projectile-based character would.

Oh, and birch is right about nair. Moving in with it instead of spacing makes it very unsafe. Also applies to fair and uair (and bair, theoretically, but it spaces itself).

 

[MockRock]

Oh, and birch is right about nair. Moving in with it instead of spacing makes it very unsafe. Also applies to fair and uair (and bair, theoretically, but it spaces itself).

Bair actually is always technically safe if it lands on shield (gives +1 frame advantage). The fact that it pushes you back means that it's also harder to get punished from spot dodges and perfect shields, and its reach is absolutely enormous. The timing for a short hop bair is a bit weird with Corrin, but it's definitely worth mastering as it's by far his least punishable approach option.

 

[Chief Hotsuin]

(and bair, theoretically, but it spaces itself).

The fact that it pushes you back

 

[Skitrel]

I don't actually agree with this. Nair only hits your opponent once and lasts a long time, so it's actually VERY unsafe on shield.

This really sounds like misuse is the problem, nair is definitely safe on shield. It's safe when performed while rising over an opponent's shield and it's safe when performed with simple spacing. There simply isn't enough lag on the end of it for anyone to punish it.

How exactly are you getting punished when you use nair? What is being used to punish you?

Fair and nair are really only punishable when they're used with poor spacing. My preference is fair for followups but nair is significantly easier to space safely.

 

[Amadeus9]

This really sounds like misuse is the problem, nair is definitely safe on shield. It's safe when performed while rising over an opponent's shield and it's safe when performed with simple spacing. There simply isn't enough lag on the end of it for anyone to punish it.

How exactly are you getting punished when you use nair? What is being used to punish you?

Fair and nair are really only punishable when they're used with poor spacing. My preference is fair for followups but nair is significantly easier to space safely.

I thought this was pretty self evident

Corrin has a pretty damn good degree of safety on everything she does.


I see this kind of thread/question fairly often and I'm always like, OK this person is basing all their gameplay on misconceptions. If you're having issues approaching maybe you shouldn't approach? You've gotta play your neutral and understand what's safe/what isn't, it seems like most newer smash players think that holding side on the analog and mashing their face on the buttons is how to play this game, no slow down a little bit and learn some fundamentals. You can do an absurd amount with just how good your movement is and predicting opponent's movement, and if you know what your opponent will do/where they will be before they commit to that action suddenly an unsafe option becomes an optimal one.

What's most frustrating is when people who have no understanding of footsies/neutral say a character has "no neutral" because of lack of a sh aerial or spammable projectile, no see the issue is you have no neutral, and don't know how to space yourself.

Then because I'm an MK main and it's in the job description I make vague/passive aggressive posts and elaborate later

But again, real talk, wtf are these character's aerials. I can't get over how good they all are.