Buffering issues

[Kix]

While this game is really great and stuff, I and a few others have noted that the input feels kind of stiff. I'm guessing there is zero frame buffer, except on perhaps defensive maneuvers (I'm not sure so let me know). It's been a while now but I noticed a high-ish level match vid where one player (a Fox, I think) was doing a bunch of stuff and suddenly was just not moving and got hit and killed at that point. I'm thinking this is the same issue that I'm having where I'm trying to do something like Melee and I find my character just sitting there with no attack coming out.

I'm using Riivolution to load the game so I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the problem. If this is the way things are intended, I recommend tweaking the way you can buffer things (a frame or two buffer or buffers on specific things maybe if it's a less general issue). It's really causing a lot of annoyance with us and we didn't have this problem in Melee.

 

[Paradoxium]

There is a buffer option, when transitioning from brawl to pm it really helped me out, it is in yhe normal game options

 

[Kix]

Wow, surprised I missed it. I'll have to try it and see how it works out.

Is this the default for tournaments? If it is I'd still say this needs to be tweaked.

 

[MonkUnit]

The usual default for tournaments is playing with no buffer.

 

[DrinkingFood]

The game feeling stiff isn't a lack of buffer, it's a lack of practice.

 

[AlgonquinArto]

The game feeling stiff isn't a lack of buffer, it's a lack of practice.

I don't know how much the original poster spends on the game but this is usually the case.

 

[Kix]

If myself and others are trying to play the game the way we play Melee and it feels stiff and we're not getting inputs coming out, then I'd say it isn't just not practicing--it's a notable difference. One that feels bad and unresponsive in comparison.

Also if there's a buffer on defensive maneuvers the difference would be all the more obvious.

 

[Rarik]

P:M has 0 buffer except on Rolls/SpotDodge/Jump OoS with the C-stick, which is the same as Melee.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Technically Melee had a 1 frame buffer, which is pretty insignificant. PM has no buffer at all.

 

[Strong Badam]

Melee did not have a universal 1 frame buffer.

 

[ELI-mination]

Ever stop to think that maybe its just psychological? And that you have the capability of being wrong/mistaken?
I know that people also think the opposite; that P:M feels a lot more smooth and melee feels more stiff. (Myself included)
So it really is just what you're more used to.

 

[Amazerommu]

Ever stop to think that maybe its just psychological? And that you have the capability of being wrong/mistaken?
I know that people also think the opposite; that P:M feels a lot more smooth and melee feels more stiff. (Myself included)
So it really is just what you're more used to.

I felt the same way. Having played P:M faithfully since 2.0 and not touching Melee until a few days ago... it felt waaaay awkward. Couldn't do any of the things I used to be able to do in Melee consistently. I kept messing up inputs, attacks wouldn't come out when they normally would've in P:M... You're probably having the same issue OP. I do know that for P:M, tilts are much less sensitive than in Melee (at least it feels like it to me)... I think it's a Brawl thing that may or may not be alterable by the PMBR... No idea. I'm betting that's part of your issue... also as they said... Adjust to it. Once it feels familiar to you, you'll be saying what you're saying now about Melee most likely... just like me heheh

 

[Kix]

Eli,

Let's try being more charitable. Even you're noting people notice the game feels different (by what I'm assuming to be inputs/buffering as that's the topic). I never intended (nor had any reason) to believe this was an issue until I (and not just my group--I also think that match vid the guy didn't stop his movements for a period of time after doing them consistently all match for no reason when this is similar what happens to us) happened to consistently experience it. Of course there COULD be another cause (which is why I mentioned Riivolution and was trying to see if anybody had similar issues) but with the three-frame buffer my group didn't have these issues anymore (but we only played with it for about two hours yesterday after learning about this).

Intuitively, a lower frame buffer is the way to go but I'm not sure if there are any issues with a 1-3 frame buffer that would mess anybody up (while having people not miss inputs they would have gotten from playing Melee) but I could be wrong (I'm suspecting if that's the case it's on the higher end of the buffer scale). There are much higher level players than us and a lot of them generally don't seem to be having a problem (apart from possibly in a few instances in a few vids I've seen across time) so that's why I wondered if it was due to Riivolution.

Amazerommu,

That might make sense if I were getting some input at all in some cases. I didn't just jump to assuming it was a glitch or anything, my best guess was still that it's due to lower buffering and I'm just noting that it would make sense that if you could buffer some things in Melee in and they're not coming out here it would feel clunky in comparison and more than just me is missing inputs, which never happened in memory in Melee (I don't know how tighter buffer would feel smoother beyond perhaps with certain characters more buffer, even slight, causes unwanted inputs--e.g. Fox?).

 

[Kati]

Yeah the melee purists at my local smash centre complain about P:M having buffer, meanwhile, my P:M friends say that melee is clunky compared to P:M's "smoothness."

Did 2.6 eliminate the training buffer option..?

 

[Medaka444]

I remember playing Melee after a month of Brawl: performing moves felt stiff as a wooden plank. I think a large part of it was being unable to use the C-stick for some unfathomable reason. I eventually got used to it, so P:M didn't feel so bad. My discomfort was from a lack of practice, but Melee requiring more practice than Brawl so that basic controls don't feel strange is still a point off from Melee.

I could never find the buffer option. Where is it? Maybe then I will be able to wavedash faster than rolling.

 

[GaretHax]

If you are talking about c-stick inputs seemingly not registering (in PM) it's worth mentioning that you have to let the stick fall back to neutral after after each input otherwise it won't read further inputs at all. Be it asdi, mashing moves out, doing aerials, or trying to buffer a roll, the stick MUST return to neutral (no rolling the stick) (Yay Brawl!). Aside from that you may want to try to load PM the hackless gekoOS route and see if you encounter the same issues, probably won't change anything, but throwing a control variable into the mix never hurts anything. You may also want to check the TV you are playing on for lag, I've encountered a few that simply don't like wii's using component cables, or vice-versa, and would lag (be sure you are not using component cables with built in split inputs for different consoles as these can also cause lag). You may want to format your sd/usb as well just to be safe. Overall the different camera and appearance of PM can actually throw player off more than you may think, many muscle memory inputs still rely on visual cues, especially with games like melee, you may simply not be used to the appearance of the game yet. Hope something in this mess of a post helps you out.

 

[Medaka444]

@Garet: I was referring more to how vanilla Melee didn't let you use the C-stick for smash attacks for some unfathomable reason. Thanks for the advice anyway.

I found the buffer option. In Versus mode. Not Training mode, where you'd expect to be able to train with that option. This makes no sense.

 

[GaretHax]

Uhm yes it does, training mode and single player do not. I was responding to the op.

 

[Kati]

Medaka they can't just add options to a menu. They have to replace ones that are already there. And yeah, Melee has c-stick smashes, but not in single player.

 

[GHNeko]

Yeah the melee purists at my local smash centre complain about P:M having buffer, meanwhile, my P:M friends say that melee is clunky compared to P:M's "smoothness."

Did 2.6 eliminate the training buffer option..?

No. In Versus mode you can turn on input assist by going into options.

There never was a buffer option for 1P Training however.

 

[Kati]

ahhh input assistance, that's it.