• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Brick Walls

global-wolf

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Messages
2,215
Location
Northern Virginia
Link to original post: [drupal=4884]Brick Walls[/drupal]



I just went through a bunch of stored-away items in my basement. My motivation for this was to find a measuring tape, because I wanted to see what size I was for a website's clothing. I ended up finding an assortment of things that I had completely forgotten about, including erasers, hairclips, pencil pouches, and art. There were also a stack of papers from various TJ (a magnet school) prep classes. These were from 7th grade to early 8th grade. Some of the doodles on them made me seriously appreciate my improvement since. I looked through some of them, then I opened a binder that contained the assignments from one particular writing class. I will never forget that class. It shaped my writing in significant ways (thought I am not sure if I still keep those changes.)

I read the first essay, a response to a prompt stating that brick walls exist to let us show how much we want something, and asking us to write about what brick walls have been in our life. This is from the fall of 8th grade, which was 2 years ago. I will copy it here:


[collapse=Brick Walls]There is nothing in my life that I metaphorically associate with brick walls. I understand the meaning of the quote, but I do not think it is a very good one.

First of all, the only reason for a real brick wall is to show boundary lines; to keep people out. There is no reason for a person meeting a brick wall to want something, except to get to the other side, and for that there are gates; if there are no gates, then the person can walk around the wall. The reason for using brick walls in the quote is because brick walls are supposedly solid and unyielding. That does not support what the quote said about showing "how badly we want something." The closest brick walls come to the quote is "keeping us from getting what we want."

The only relation I have with brick walls is the tiny one in front of my house. It is two feet high, and certainly as not made me want anything.
[/collapse]

Underneath it the teacher of the writing class wrote a couple sentences of how she enjoyed my contrariness, and that she believed that the teachers at TJ would love having me in their classes.

While I was copying the whole thing, I kept thinking about how my perceptions of metaphors and meanings has changed since then. I don't remember the last time I thought of "brick wall" as a bad metaphor. In my recent memory, brick walls have stood for what they were intended to stand for. I remember a few months ago I was thinking back to this essay, and I knew I had a very good reason for thinking what I did, but I couldn't remember for my life why exactly the brick wall metaphor was so bad.

Even now as I read it again, I struggle to understand what I had said. And even more than that, I wonder at how swiftly I had to managed to arrive at my conclusion. My perspective of things has changed hugely since I wrote the essay; I can see that my viewpoint then dove into the core of meanings, and while I believe my viewpoint now still does that, there are more bridges and more layers of film that cover up holes in the skeleton. (Just by using these metaphors I am showing the difference in my thought. I had a dislike of most metaphors when I was younger because I would see all the problems with them.)

My writing then was extremely calculated. I was never a natural writer, but I could recognize incongruous ideas and bad sentence structures. So I would painstakingly formulate my sentences to say exactly what I needed in the shortest amount of lines possible. That characteristic of my writing has stayed with me up until maybe as recently as a month ago. But while my clogged-up flow of ideas to paper didn't change, my clarity of view did. I would still take five minutes just to come up with a single sentence, but each sentence would be short and ugly and disconnected. Because I was BS'ing everything. I did not have the understanding to write something meaningful, and I did not have the skill to write something beautiful.

My teachers in the writing classes had thought I was a wonderful writer, but for unexplained reasons people connected to school did not. I always got papers back with "B" on them and no explanation of why. (One teacher even told me my tense agreement was bad, and would not tell me where.) I got only a passing score on standardized writing tests. I didn't get in TJ because of the writing part of the application, because it obviously wasn't the testing part (I got 97/100 and people with scores in the 70's got in.) And now my current English teacher gives me a B on a paper that I worked 8 hours on, and then tells my dad I am a good writer. I don't get it. Now I'm starting to not care if my ideas are hole-free and my sentences perfect, so I can write more.

I think my train of thought has now totally gone off track. It is rumbling off into the woods and I don't wish to bring it back.
 

Vinylic.

Woke?
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
15,864
Location
New York, New York
Switch FC
SW-5214-5959-4787
Schools can sometimes be such a ***** in everyone's lives.


Until then, it's best to move on to something worthy of what we can manage to do.
 

alex6309

Smash Ace
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
754
Location
In a trunk, off a cliff.
NNID
Dr.Dom
School: A waste of time after 6th/7th grade (maybe 8th). Namly Social Studies(you all know how pointless it is.)
Supspensions: A bigger waste of valuable time that could be used for learning.
Expulsion:Yaaaaaay!!! NO SCHOOL!!!!!
Detention: A waste of valuable time (On Halloween: I gettin' Ma *** killed)
Math: Gets pointless to learn in Middle School
ELA: I dont need an expansive Vocabulary(Very Large)
Social Studies: In what way is it useful?
Science: Be a scientist
 

Zatchiel

a little slice of heaven 🍰
Joined
May 27, 2009
Messages
11,088
Location
Georgia
NNID
Zatchiel
Switch FC
SW-0915-4119-3504
I can relate to the last bullet, but I'd rather hold my tongue on anything before that.:applejack: My thoughts on those are... odd.
 

global-wolf

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Messages
2,215
Location
Northern Virginia
School: A waste of time after 6th/7th grade (maybe 8th). Namly Social Studies(you all know how pointless it is.)
Supspensions: A bigger waste of valuable time that could be used for learning.
Expulsion:Yaaaaaay!!! NO SCHOOL!!!!!
Detention: A waste of valuable time (On Halloween: I gettin' Ma *** killed)
Math: Gets pointless to learn in Middle School
ELA: I dont need an expansive Vocabulary(Very Large)
Social Studies: In what way is it useful?
Science: Be a scientist
I have no problem with school itself, it helps you get a bigger view of the world. I do wish we had more choice in subjects though.

My name is Rick Perry and I approve of this meesage.
ehehe
 
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
1,017
Location
Austin, Texas
Grading Writing is a very touchy subject really. There's no limit to the amount of creativity you could write or draw on a single piece of paper unlike say Math where it's just a system of *Hey here's the problem, now find the answer*. It just can get really... opinionated (Not a word probably, but you know where I am getting at.)

I wouldn't really take any grades you get from writing to heart, though they might have some bearing if the teachers gives reasons.
 

global-wolf

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Messages
2,215
Location
Northern Virginia
I agree about math and similar things being much easier to grade. If only there was a clear-cut right or wrong for every school problem....

I'll try not to. Hopefully my english teacher this year will actually give understandable explanations ._. (and opinionated is a word xD)
 

Jim Morrison

Smash Authority
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
15,287
Location
The Netherlands
I don't understand America. AFAIK, a B equals an 8 over here. If I got a B, I'd be ecstatic. Is a B just like "oh that's normal and average"

If so, the grading system seems so odd.
 

PersonallyIPreferDair

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 11, 2011
Messages
184
Location
It varies
I understand your problem Global.(Or maybe I don't lol)

I am in no way a good writer, nor do I plan to ever become one.
In my sophmore year of high school, my teacher explained to us that inside of essay writing, you decide what's right and what's wrong. We were graded on how well we presented our argument and backed it up, rather than "getting the answer right". This allowed us to actually see what we did wrong with arguing our point and how we could argue it correctly.
It was my first experience with thesis writing, as my english classes up until then were just writing an essay with no specific format.

Now that I take AP classes, I feel like students up until junior year in high school are being denied an actual education that will help them in College and life on their own...but that's off topic.
 

global-wolf

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Messages
2,215
Location
Northern Virginia
I don't understand America. AFAIK, a B equals an 8 over here. If I got a B, I'd be ecstatic. Is a B just like "oh that's normal and average"

If so, the grading system seems so odd.
A C is supposed to be average, but in my experience this is because of the people that don't do anything and fail every class. I'm pretty sure you need to have at least a B average if you want to get in anything that's not community college, and for me personally (and lots of other people) A is the only grade I'll be happy with.

I understand your problem Global.(Or maybe I don't lol)

I am in no way a good writer, nor do I plan to ever become one.
In my sophmore year of high school, my teacher explained to us that inside of essay writing, you decide what's right and what's wrong. We were graded on how well we presented our argument and backed it up, rather than "getting the answer right". This allowed us to actually see what we did wrong with arguing our point and how we could argue it correctly.
It was my first experience with thesis writing, as my english classes up until then were just writing an essay with no specific format.

Now that I take AP classes, I feel like students up until junior year in high school are being denied an actual education that will help them in College and life on their own...but that's off topic.
That's interesting, even in 2nd grade I remember teachers requiring a very specific format, or else they would take points off. Now I remember that was one of the things I hated about essay writing, because you HAD to have a "hook," a thesis statement, a list of 3 reasons to support your thesis, 3 main paragraphs, etc....

I'm taking one AP class this year (my school does IB.) And I think it's the first time ever that we're not required to format essays in a specific way. You just have to make your answer understandable. I like it so much.
 

PersonallyIPreferDair

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 11, 2011
Messages
184
Location
It varies
Well, my schools just made us go crazy with it. The thesis' that I had to do last year, though, had a degree of structure, but the rest was free writing.

I would be in AP english if I wasn't so lazy...
I was supposed to take 4 APs this year but I ended up with 2.
 

Jim Morrison

Smash Authority
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
15,287
Location
The Netherlands
A C is supposed to be average, but in my experience this is because of the people that don't do anything and fail every class. I'm pretty sure you need to have at least a B average if you want to get in anything that's not community college, and for me personally (and lots of other people) A is the only grade I'll be happy with.
I think it's one of the main flaws in American education (CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG PLEASE) to keep both the smart students and the dumbest in the same class. Sure, you have AP, but it's a lot different. Over here, you get classified for 9th grade and forward in 3 (sometimes 2) different categories, which resemble the level of education.
It's a very effective system and a C (6) at the highest level would represent the average of the highest students, who would get nothing but A's (9's?) on the lowest level of education.
In America, where such a division is not made, I can understand why you want A's (you seem like a smart person!). I think it's just the problem of getting A's, they are the highest achievable, which means it wasn't perfect. Perfection in school work is incredibly hard (or can you get an A at literally everything except this?), in my expierence.


I think you're on the right track right now, judging of your OP (or at least what I made of it). You went from being a very calculated writer who wanted to make sure the sentence were correct and formed a coherent story, to taking a more 'free' approach to writing. Just an example, I really think your OP was well-written.

Wondering, have you ever written poetry or had any form of interest in it?
 

global-wolf

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Messages
2,215
Location
Northern Virginia
Well, my schools just made us go crazy with it. The thesis' that I had to do last year, though, had a degree of structure, but the rest was free writing.

I would be in AP english if I wasn't so lazy...
I was supposed to take 4 APs this year but I ended up with 2.
Haha, I wish the teachers in my schools would just let us write whatever. AP is hard stuff! 2 is pretty good. :)

I think it's one of the main flaws in American education (CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG PLEASE) to keep both the smart students and the dumbest in the same class. Sure, you have AP, but it's a lot different. Over here, you get classified for 9th grade and forward in 3 (sometimes 2) different categories, which resemble the level of education.
It's a very effective system and a C (6) at the highest level would represent the average of the highest students, who would get nothing but A's (9's?) on the lowest level of education.
In America, where such a division is not made, I can understand why you want A's (you seem like a smart person!). I think it's just the problem of getting A's, they are the highest achievable, which means it wasn't perfect. Perfection in school work is incredibly hard (or can you get an A at literally everything except this?), in my expierence.


I think you're on the right track right now, judging of your OP (or at least what I made of it). You went from being a very calculated writer who wanted to make sure the sentence were correct and formed a coherent story, to taking a more 'free' approach to writing. Just an example, I really think your OP was well-written.

Wondering, have you ever written poetry or had any form of interest in it?
We actually have a division system too, after middle school there are regular and "honors" classes for each subject. You select all your classes individually, so it's possible to have some honors and some non-honors classes. I've never been in any "regular" classes for subjects that have an honors option, but even some of my honors classes are ridiculously easy (in my opinion, because some people do badly in them) so it depends a lot on the teacher. AP (and IB) is another level above honors classes, they're meant to be taken in the 3rd and 4th year. You don't really need a test or anything to get in, but generally if a person is taking AP courses they're probably smart enough to breeze through the regular classes.

For me personally, how well I do in a class depends mostly on the teacher, because I usually get high scores on tests. The teachers vary a lot, and if the teacher is the kind that gives out a bunch of long and tedious assignments and grades them harshly, then it's really hard for me to get an A. I think if you put effort into everything and turn in all your assignments and make time to study then you'll have no problem getting an A, but not too many people do that. x__x

And thank you :D And I used to dislike poetry a lot, because the teachers would make us pick poems apart and try to conjecture meanings from them. Though I do hope I'll be able to start enjoying them.
 

PersonallyIPreferDair

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 11, 2011
Messages
184
Location
It varies
I'm actually really glad I didn't take those other two courses lol
I'm already taking the two hardest APs in my school. And the other APs that I didn't take are still absolutely crazy.
My US teacher holds a grudge against people who drop her AP class.
 

Vermanubis

King of Evil
BRoomer
Joined
Jun 12, 2008
Messages
3,399
Location
La Grande, Oregon
NNID
Vermanubis
3DS FC
1564-2185-4386
Never take the machinations of public education or public anything as an affront. I submitted a paper regarding formal logic systems vs. natural language in my English class and received a 92 based purely on the skeleton of the paper rather than the meat and flesh (I made formatting errors). The teacher's comments on the paper were nauseatingly disingenuous and almost patronizing: "Very thought provoking! Have you considered taking Philosophy 101?"

Teachers aren't paid to nurture and cultivate excellence (not to imply that I fit that criteria in light of the above anecdote lol), rather, they're paid to observe rubrics (in public schools, anyway)
 
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
7,190
I understand your problem Global.(Or maybe I don't lol)

I am in no way a good writer, nor do I plan to ever become one.
In my sophmore year of high school, my teacher explained to us that inside of essay writing, you decide what's right and what's wrong. We were graded on how well we presented our argument and backed it up, rather than "getting the answer right". This allowed us to actually see what we did wrong with arguing our point and how we could argue it correctly.
It was my first experience with thesis writing, as my english classes up until then were just writing an essay with no specific format.

Now that I take AP classes, I feel like students up until junior year in high school are being denied an actual education that will help them in College and life on their own...but that's off topic.
What? You don't have to wait to be in your junior year to start taking AP. My first AP classes were Algebra and earth science in freshman year, and now in junior year I'm taking AP French III, AP bio II, AP bio lab, APUSH, and AP English comp. My only Pre-AP classes are chemistry because I hadn't taken a chemistry course before, and pre cal, because I wasn't sure I wanted to make the jump to AP Cal yet. Point is you can start taking AP classes as soon as you start high school, possibly even in middle school... or do things work differently across states?
 

Spelt

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Feb 6, 2009
Messages
11,841
It's different depending on the schools/districts, yeah.
 

Jim Morrison

Smash Authority
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
15,287
Location
The Netherlands
For me personally, how well I do in a class depends mostly on the teacher, because I usually get high scores on tests. The teachers vary a lot, and if the teacher is the kind that gives out a bunch of long and tedious assignments and grades them harshly, then it's really hard for me to get an A. I think if you put effort into everything and turn in all your assignments and make time to study then you'll have no problem getting an A, but not too many people do that. x__x[/color]
Yup.

The problem is, in an objective class with a test like a math's test, it's very simple to determine a grade, and if you got everything right and you get an A, it's simple as that and you deserve that and the teacher will be able to acknowledge that. If it's something subjective, especially creative writing, which THEY have to judge by their criteria, then they judge a lot harsher and try to go the average of the class with your grade. It's hard to give someone an A and say "you did it perfectly well". You have to find the few flaws and take some points for that. Subjective grading will always be unbalanced and something I very much dislike, because teachers often like to go back to objective things like format, lay-out, length of your paper, etc. to judge it by. Stuff like that costs so many points.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2008
Messages
19,345
Never take the machinations of public education or public anything as an affront. I submitted a paper regarding formal logic systems vs. natural language in my English class and received a 92 based purely on the skeleton of the paper rather than the meat and flesh (I made formatting errors). The teacher's comments on the paper were nauseatingly disingenuous and almost patronizing: "Very thought provoking! Have you considered taking Philosophy 101?"

Teachers aren't paid to nurture and cultivate excellence (not to imply that I fit that criteria in light of the above anecdote lol), rather, they're paid to observe rubrics (in public schools, anyway)
That might be too much of a generalization of the individual. As a system as a whole, I agree that public schools are mostly required to dish out knowledge rather than help promote the best possible experience.

I have had teachers who fit your description. They only follow the guidelines and do not evolve much of an experience of students who wish to excel beyond what they are currently doing.

However, I have meet a few teachers who are willing to spend extra time to promote a students interests. A quick example is that an AP level physics course was not offered at my school because the regular physics did not go into much depth. However, the teachers who taught physics were willing to put in extra time to see students and help them prepare for the examination.

To me, it seems highly dependent upon your instructor whether or not you can get the most enriching experience possible in a public school.
 

Vermanubis

King of Evil
BRoomer
Joined
Jun 12, 2008
Messages
3,399
Location
La Grande, Oregon
NNID
Vermanubis
3DS FC
1564-2185-4386
That might be too much of a generalization of the individual. As a system as a whole, I agree that public schools are mostly required to dish out knowledge rather than help promote the best possible experience.

I have had teachers who fit your description. They only follow the guidelines and do not evolve much of an experience of students who wish to excel beyond what they are currently doing.

However, I have meet a few teachers who are willing to spend extra time to promote a students interests. A quick example is that an AP level physics course was not offered at my school because the regular physics did not go into much depth. However, the teachers who taught physics were willing to put in extra time to see students and help them prepare for the examination.

To me, it seems highly dependent upon your instructor whether or not you can get the most enriching experience possible in a public school.
It is a generalization, primarily because of the education system and how it's run. I would never say that you can't land an awesome teacher, but in the grand scope of the public education system, teachers are encouraged to meet a standard and aren't given incentives outside of personal enrichment to provide a rich learning experience.
 
Top Bottom