Best follow up after Dash Attack

[jmjb]

Dash Attack (aka Little Mac's whole game)
When Little Mac runs up to an opponent and hit A, little mac performs his swing punch. whats the best follow up you've found when they shield or dodge? Up 'til now I've been dodging back once or twice, but I found if you immediately spam A, his forward tilt can attack through some of his swing punch's frames early (this can be done forward or backwards).

what have you found is the best follow up after they shield or dodge/sidestep your Dash Attack?

 

[cardboardowl]

if you think macs dash attack is is whole game you are playing a weak mac.

I don't dash attack unless i know it's going to hit.

tilt.

 

[cot(θ)]

Reading the title, I thought it was going to be about follow-ups to a successful dash attack. My typical follow-up to a failed dash attack is either
- Get grabbed by the enemy
- Get tilted by the enemy

If I land the dash attack however, one of my favourite tricks is to dash behind them and catch their landing with a pivot smash. Almost nobody is expecting a pivot smash - usually they'll do something to defend against a possible up-smash, typically leaving them vulnerable to the f-smash.

 

[PHYTO-1]

sometimes i just do another dash attack lol.

 

[Dagon97]

in the occasion when i do dash attack i normally dsmash if they are infront of me and turnaround fsmash or a counter if they are behind me. most people will jab at you back with sheik for example do counter that

 

[ndayday]

pray I make it back?

 

[warriorman222]

The only correct answer is Dash Attack.

 

[NairWizard]

There needs to be a concerted effort to educate new Little Mac players on the notion that dash attack is literally the worst thing you can do as Mac unless you jump into the air. Dash attack is awful.

 

[thatoneguy1]

aside from the fact that dash attack is punishible as hell, if you manage to land it try running up smash and if possible follow that with an up b. Simple string that does decent damage but has to be done at right percents otherwise you can get punished for your up special.

 

[Doruge]

There needs to be a concerted effort to educate new Little Mac players on the notion that dash attack is literally the worst thing you can do as Mac unless you jump into the air. Dash attack is awful.

Dash attack isn't awful at all, just don't use it on a shield. It's certainly better than neutral b.

 

[NairWizard]

Dash attack isn't awful at all, just don't use it on a shield. It's certainly better than neutral b.

Neutral b is worse, granted.

 

[EvilDaniel]

If you were to use AND WHIFF your dash attack, I suggest using jolt haymaker to go back to where you came from: It may catch your opponent off guard, and, even if you miss again, it gives you JUST the right amount of space to get back up and try a different strategy.
Just, be careful with the edges, or you will look like a total jackass as you fall into oblivion

 

[CCCM89]

dash->side tilt if they spot dodge or roll behind.
dash->dash->running up-smash if it hits and on other side of stage(at low to mid percentages)
dash-> Down-special if dodge roll away from you(and character's roll is short)
dash->up smash/up tilt if they jumped(up smash only if they're about to attack for the super armor)
dash-> dodge roll back for all other cases.

 

[KingTeo]

There needs to be a concerted effort to educate new Little Mac players on the notion that dash attack is literally the worst thing you can do as Mac unless you jump into the air. Dash attack is awful.

I have a pretty solid Mac and dash attack is 70% of my game. It's pretty good and regarding the OP,

On a blocked dash attack I start hammering A. The window to grab Mac before he hits you with a jab is small enough to where it works a good portion of the time.

384

 

[KingTeo]

If you were to use AND WHIFF your dash attack, I suggest using jolt haymaker to go back to where you came from: It may catch your opponent off guard, and, even if you miss again, it gives you JUST the right amount of space to get back up and try a different strategy.
Just, be careful with the edges, or you will look like a total ******* as you fall into oblivion

Using a side B to get you space will get you punished by any character that's even remotely fast.

383

 

[NairWizard]

I have a pretty solid Mac and dash attack is 70% of my game. It's pretty good and regarding the OP,

On a blocked dash attack I start hammering A. The window to grab Mac before he hits you with a jab is small enough to where it works a good portion of the time.

384

Dash is one of Mac's most punishable/obvious approaches. If you are using 70% dash attacks, then I would suggest that your Mac isn't as good as you think it is at decent levels of play. Not to be offensive. A good Mac does indeed use some dash attacks, but your main objective should be to play careful footsies and avoid getting grabbed. D-tilt, f-tilt, jab are your go-tos, not dash attack.

Also this doesn't work against a competent opponent offline. Maybe it works with input lag online, but the window between dash attack and jab is more than sufficient to punish. You can also just jump above the dash and land with an aerial.

 

[KingTeo]

Dash is one of Mac's most punishable/obvious approaches. If you are using 70% dash attacks, then I would suggest that your Mac isn't as good as you think it is at decent levels of play. Not to be offensive. A good Mac does indeed use some dash attacks, but your main objective should be to play careful footsies and avoid getting grabbed. D-tilt, f-tilt, jab are your go-tos, not dash attack.

Also this doesn't work against a competent opponent offline. Maybe it works with input lag online, but the window between dash attack and jab is more than sufficient to punish. You can also just jump above the dash and land with an aerial.

Maybe input lag is what's playing a factor in spamming jab out of dash attack but I'm still confident that my Mac is at least a B-rank fighter. Especially considering that most of my dash attacks are preceded by dodges and/or purposefully whiffed dash attacks to bait an attack(that will then be punished by a dash attack)

I'd say in total my gameplay consists of 70% dash attack, 10% jab spam to catch rolls, 10% Fsmash, 9% Other, and 1% up B to get the kill. Dash attack may be obvious but it's definitely not particularly punishable.

If you have a WiiU version I'd like to play you and hopefully learn some new tricks. 381

 

[NairWizard]

Maybe input lag is what's playing a factor in spamming jab out of dash attack but I'm still confident that my Mac is at least a B-rank fighter. Especially considering that most of my dash attacks are preceded by dodges and/or purposefully whiffed dash attacks to bait an attack(that will then be punished by a dash attack)

I'd say in total my gameplay consists of 70% dash attack, 10% jab spam to catch rolls, 10% Fsmash, 9% Other, and 1% up B to get the kill. Dash attack may be obvious but it's definitely not particularly punishable.

If you have a WiiU version I'd like to play you and hopefully learn some new tricks. 381

I'd say that to be a tournament-level Mac you'd need more like 20% d-tilt (it combos into KO punch), 20% d-smash/f-smash, 20% f-tilt and jab, 20% defensive options like shield and roll and spotdodge and counter, and 20% other (miscellaneous based on your opponent's attacks, including dash attack).

I do have a Wii U, but I don't play Little Mac. I play Pikachu.

 

[KingTeo]

I'd say that to be a tournament-level Mac you'd need more like 20% d-tilt (it combos into KO punch), 20% d-smash/f-smash, 20% f-tilt and jab, 20% defensive options like shield and roll and spotdodge and counter, and 20% other (miscellaneous based on your opponent's attacks, including dash attack).

I do have a Wii U, but I don't play Little Mac. I play Pikachu.

That's fine. it's to test my little mac anyways. Never had a wiiu before so i dont know how playing with specific people works.380

 

[NairWizard]

That's fine. it's to test my little mac anyways. Never had a wiiu before so i dont know how playing with specific people works.380

Will PM you.

 

[KingTeo]

Will PM you.

Alright that's fine. But someone who doesn't play the charater shouldn't think they know more than someone who actually does. 379

 

[NairWizard]

Alright that's fine. But someone who doesn't play the charater shouldn't think they know more than someone who actually does. 379

Whoa now. Not playing Little Mac doesn't mean that I can't judge how good his dash attack is. I've played against good (and bad) Little Macs. If you are using dash attack 70% of the time against me or any competent player, you will not do very well, that's just an objective fact. I'm not saying I am better; I am saying that this tactic will not work on me or any player past a certain level. Guaranteed. If I see Little Mac dashing at me (which he has to do to do a dash attack), I'm going to sit there and not do anything about it? Why would I do that?

I don't want to be antagonistic here and start something, but I suggest that you try to play a tournament-level player and see if your dash attack strategy works out. Basically, if you don't believe me, try it against someone who knows what he's doing. If it works, then good, you've come up with a new viable strategy that no one thought would work.

 

[KingTeo]

Whoa now. Not playing Little Mac doesn't mean that I can't judge how good his dash attack is. I've played against good (and bad) Little Macs. If you are using dash attack 70% of the time against me or any competent player, you will not do very well, that's just an objective fact. I'm not saying I am better; I am saying that this tactic will not work on me or any player past a certain level. Guaranteed. If I see Little Mac dashing at me (which he has to do to do a dash attack), I'm going to sit there and not do anything about it? Why would I do that?

I don't want to be antagonistic here and start something, but I suggest that you try to play a tournament-level player and see if your dash attack strategy works out. Basically, if you don't believe me, try it against someone who knows what he's doing. If it works, then good, you've come up with a new viable strategy that no one thought would work.

I seriously think you're doubting the dash attack. There's a thing called dominant strategy and that's why it makes up most of my game. I use it because it works. The only two tools I need to win a game is Mac's quick dodge and his almost instant dash attack that's quick enough to catch a lot of actions on cooldown. Then it just turns into a game of bait-and-punish and the outcome relies on my reaction time and my ability to read my opponent more than anything.

The only times I feel like I need to switch up my strategy is against characters that have horizontal projectiles. 378

 

[NairWizard]

I seriously think you're doubting the dash attack. There's a thing called dominant strategy and that's why it makes up most of my game. I use it because it works. The only two tools I need to win a game is Mac's quick dodge and his almost instant dash attack that's quick enough to catch a lot of actions on cooldown. Then it just turns into a game of bait-and-punish and the outcome relies on my reaction time and my ability to read my opponent more than anything.

The only times I feel like I need to switch up my strategy is against characters that have horizontal projectiles. 378

In neutral, no one is going to use actions that have enough cooldown for you to dash attack in. If you're playing players who will just throw out laggy attacks like that, you're playing punishable players. Dash attacks are meant to be punish tools. If you are punishing 70% of the time, then your opponent is making mistakes. Against an opponent who doesn't make mistakes in neutral (which is most players above a certain level; mistakes are made during exchanges, not during neutral), dash attack is usually a weak option.

As Pikachu, the only way I'll be getting hit by dash attack is if I accidentally SH t-jolt instead of FH t-jolt. The rest of the time, there won't be an attack punishable enough for you to dash attack me during cooldown. SH f-air autocancels, FH t-jolt isn't punishable on landing, d-tilt is certainly not punishable, etc.

Anyway, words are only going to do so much to convince you. You should watch some tournament Mac videos or play some other Mac players on the Mac forums.

 

[KingTeo]

In neutral, no one is going to use actions that have enough cooldown for you to dash attack in. If you're playing players who will just throw out laggy attacks like that, you're playing punishable players. Dash attacks are meant to be punish tools. If you are punishing 70% of the time, then your opponent is making mistakes. Against an opponent who doesn't make mistakes in neutral (which is most players above a certain level; mistakes are made during exchanges, not during neutral), dash attack is usually a weak option.

As Pikachu, the only way I'll be getting hit by dash attack is if I accidentally SH t-jolt instead of FH t-jolt. The rest of the time, there won't be an attack punishable enough for you to dash attack me during cooldown. SH f-air autocancels, FH t-jolt isn't punishable on landing, d-tilt is certainly not punishable, etc.

Anyway, words are only going to do so much to convince you. You should watch some tournament Mac videos or play some other Mac players on the Mac forums.

Cooldown isn't the only thing that creates opportunity. That's what mindgames are for. Sometimes when something is moving fast enough and throwing out enough fakes you won't be able to react correctly even if you're using zero-cooldown moves. You should realize that just because something goes against what you personally think should work, especially when you aren't even comfortable or experienced enough with little Mac to play as him, doesn't mean that you're right.

I can already tell you that as Pikachu the only problem I would have fighting you is neutral B spam and maybe down smashes.

Do you know why your words aren't very convincing? Because personal experience and success is more so. I'm not a world class player by any means but as far as one trick ponies go, Mac's dash attack is as good as it gets. 376

 

[NairWizard]

You should realize that just because something goes against what you personally think should work, especially when you aren't even comfortable or experienced enough with little Mac to play as him, doesn't mean that you're right.

Alright, I don't play Little Mac; if that is the crux of your argument here, then let me summon someone who does play him pretty often. I do want you to improve, after all; I'm not just saying this to make you upset or angry, I am saying this so that you play a better game and vary your punishes and options in neutral; everyone has a good dash in this game, it is NOT 70% of Mac's game. I legitimately want Mac players to be good, at all levels.

@NAKAT , @Pierce7d , @ Bwett , one of you guys, please weigh in.

 

[KingTeo]

Alright, I don't play Little Mac; if that is the crux of your argument here, then let me summon someone who does play him pretty often. I do want you to improve, after all; I'm not just saying this to make you upset or angry, I am saying this so that you play a better game and vary your punishes and options in neutral; everyone has a good dash in this game, it is NOT 70% of Mac's game. I legitimately want Mac players to be good, at all levels.

@NAKAT , @Pierce7d , @ Bwett , one of you guys, please weigh in.

You not playing little mac wasn't the crux of anything. my main point was and still is that Mac's dash attack is his bread and butter. Maybe it's unsatisfying to accept the notion that Mac can coast by and win most matches online with just a single move but that'sjust a fact. The only variety that I ever use is the whens and wheres of when i side dodge. Other than that, dash attack is completely efficient enough to rack up damage and side B or up B is good enough to finish the job. No one has a dash attack as good as Mac's. My skill level is just below tournament level and I'd say my Mac is one of the best ones at that level. In fact I'd be even better if I didn't have to deal with input delay online since I'd be able to react more precisely.

I repeat myself and say all that to sum it up for the guys you just called. I'm ready any time to have a match with any character to prove my point or be taught a lesson. 374

 

[EvilDaniel]

You not playing little mac wasn't the crux of anything. my main point was and still is that Mac's dash attack is his bread and butter. Maybe it's unsatisfying to accept the notion that Mac can coast by and win most matches online with just a single move but that'sjust a fact. The only variety that I ever use is the whens and wheres of when i side dodge. Other than that, dash attack is completely efficient enough to rack up damage and side B or up B is good enough to finish the job. No one has a dash attack as good as Mac's. My skill level is just below tournament level and I'd say my Mac is one of the best ones at that level. In fact I'd be even better if I didn't have to deal with input delay online since I'd be able to react more precisely.

I repeat myself and say all that to sum it up for the guys you just called. I'm ready any time to have a match with any character to prove my point or be taught a lesson. 374

I really hope youre not serious

 

[KingTeo]

I really hope youre not serious

no not entirely. i really hammed it up especially toward the end to make people want to fight me but my main point still stands

373

 

[Bwett]

Little Mac's dash attack is a punish move. His bread and butter are his down tilt and his forward tilt. Down tilt is your safest option from neutral. Ftilt can be punished on shield, but Dtilt is very hard to be punished when spaced properly. You mix up this bread and butter with grabs and jabs.

Down smash is your quick and strong punish, preferably used when your opponent is on the ledge. Forward smash is your very strong punish, used in conjunction with up smash, depending on where the character is in relation to you.

You can use dash attack as a very quick replacement for up smash when someone is landing with a laggy move or in the air in general, but it isn't very safe of an option. It doesn't have the safety net of super armor, and despite it's low cooldown, it is punishable.

All of this is based off of top tournament play. As you go down the ranks, other strategies become immediately viable and very strong, mostly because the act of punishing certain moves require stronger fundamentals in the game. Use whatever strategies allow you to win, but do so with eyes wide open and examining when you lose.

 

[EvilDaniel]

Little Mac's dash attack is a punish move. His bread and butter are his down tilt and his forward tilt. Down tilt is your safest option from neutral. Ftilt can be punished on shield, but Dtilt is very hard to be punished when spaced properly. You mix up this bread and butter with grabs and jabs.

Down smash is your quick and strong punish, preferably used when your opponent is on the ledge. Forward smash is your very strong punish, used in conjunction with up smash, depending on where the character is in relation to you.

You can use dash attack as a very quick replacement for up smash when someone is landing with a laggy move or in the air in general, but it isn't very safe of an option. It doesn't have the safety net of super armor, and despite it's low cooldown, it is punishable.

All of this is based off of top tournament play. As you go down the ranks, other strategies become immediately viable and very strong, mostly because the act of punishing certain moves require stronger fundamentals in the game. Use whatever strategies allow you to win, but do so with eyes wide open and examining when you lose.

An amazing answer. Didnt know about Dtilt, thanks!

 

[Quisciens]

The Jolt Haymaker can be particularly useful in this scenario at low percentages, especially when facing larger-hitbox characters.