Best character per stage?

[krazyzyko]

Title.

Stage:
- Character (votes)

Battlefield:
- Fox (4)
- Puff (1)
- Sheik (1)

Dreamland:
- Fox (3)
- CF (2)
- Puff (2)
- Peach (1)

Final Destination:
- Marth (5)
- Fox (2)

Fountain of dreams:
- Fox (3)
- Sheik (1)

Kongo Jungle:
- Peach (3)
- Fox (2)

Pokémon Stadium:
- Fox (4)
- Marth (1)

Yoshi's Story:
- Marth (4)
- Fox (3)

Discuss who do you think has the main advantage in each legal stage and why.

 

[Flippy Flippersen]

I vote fox for dreamland as well. The stage gives him a lot of room to move around. Due to the size it is harder to keep pressure, meaning the match will easier reset to neutral after getting comboed. Fox neutral is outstanding so that is good. One of the best anti foxes (marth) blows on this stage. (Falco also doesn't do as good here imo) I think that's all he needs tbh.

 

[pershona]

I would say for YS might also be best for since you his range is excellent for this stage and you basically get free tippers.
For KJ since you can practically just stall in the upper part with turnips against most characters.

 

[Spak]

I actually usually counter pick DL for Fox because other than shinespiking, a majority of his KO options are off the top. I would put Peach for DL because it's so hard to kill her.

 

[krazyzyko]

I actually usually counter pick DL for Fox because other than shinespiking, a majority of his KO options are off the top. I would put Peach for DL because it's so hard to kill her.

I cp peach and marth to DL if they ban PS because Fox can laser camp here well and the platforms are higher so it's harder for them to combo you.
Tbh if Peach can't chaingrab, she's better going to FoD because the moving platforms doesn't affect her game at all since she doesn't depends on shffling, it has the 2nd highest ceiling and she has an easier time chasing the opp down.

 

[EddyBearr]

Fox for every stage. I'd rather be a Fox on FoD than a Peach on FoD unless I know that my opponent is playing Ice Climbers or etc.

 

[gmBottles]

Jigglypuff for Dream Land and Battlefield. FoD is great for her too but I wouldn't call it the best.
If we're talking each character's best stage, Bowser's best is Yoshi's, but Marth definitely rules that stage.

 

[Bismo Funyuns]

Except for FD, which is Marth, and Kongo, which is only legal in doubles and thus hard to analyze, You could very easily argue and win that on every other stage the best is Fox, simply because Fox is really good. Battlefield is the most balanced and mirrors the tier list the most, so advantage Fox. PS is incredibly unbalanced for Fox, I don't even need to argue. Yoshi's gives him really early kills and walls to hug for recovery, advantage Fox. FoD, is an interesting one, since the high ceiling hurts him a lot, but of all the characters that can go even with Fox, do any of them get substantial benefits on FoD to tip the scales? I don't know. Dreamland gives Fox a lot of room to run away, so, except maybe with Peach and all of her benefits on that stage, advantage Fox. In other words, Fox is a damn beast.

 

[AirFair]

Marth for FD and Yoshis
Fox for Pokemon Stadium
Falcon for Dreamland
I don't know where Falco would be best. Maybe PS and Battlefield?

 

[EddyBearr]

Fox gets more from FD than Marth does imo. Fox has better movement, lasers, the same 0-deaths on spacies as Marth (maybe even better), and honestly isn't even that bad on FD against Marth.

[collapse="I don't care which I am vs 47% of opponents"]
Fox: 18.2% of opponents
Falco: 14.0%
Marth: 14.0%
G&W: 0.5%[/collapse]
[collapse="I'd rather be Fox vs 31% of opponents"]Sheik: 11.3%
Captain Falcon: 8.0%
Jigglypuff: 5.3%
Ganondorf: 3.0%
Link: 1.2%
Zelda: 0.6%
Young Link: 0.5%
Kirby: 0.4%
Bowser: 0.4%[/collapse]
[collapse="I'd rather be Marth vs: 14% of opponents"]
Peach: 6.9%
Ice Climbers: 3.0%
Dr. Mario: 2.1%
Pikachu: 0.8%
Mario: 0.7%
Roy: 0.5%
Ness: 0.3%
Pichu: 0.1%[/collapse]
[collapse="Not sure who I'd rather be vs 8% of opponents:"]
Samus: 3.6%
Luigi: 3.0%
Donkey Kong: 0.7%
Mewtwo: 0.3%[/collapse]

 

[ObdurateMARio]

BF- Fox. You could argue Sheik here, but I'll stick with Fox.

DL- I'm gonna go outside the box and say Captain Falcon. His usually crummy recovery can actually be good here, because of the falcon kick refresh that you're gonna get more often due to huge blast zones. I think Fox not killing off the top isn't a HUGE issue tbh, but it is significant enough.

FD- Marth. His juggles are incredible. Chaingrabs are goat.

FoD- Sheik. Smallish side blastzones, negating her poor recovery, yet high ceiling, helping her survive a while off the top. The platforms help with her needles and cancelling aerials, etc.

KJ- I vote Peach. But I don't have a lot of experience here, I don't play doubles.

PS- Fox wins on a couple of the transformations, but I'm going to vote Marth. The side platforms for neutral are PERFECT for tech chasing with uair, finishing with tipper, juggling with utilt. Fox wins Rock/Fire, I'd say the others are even/Marth wins. But the neutral PS is definitely Marth. It's like FD with two combo friendly side plats, and no upper platform for enemies to run to.

TL;DR Marth

YS- I'm gonna go with Fox, since he can kill so easily, and, more importantly, has immense safety from the ledge. Fox can get SO MUCH for free off the ledge that once he gets it, he can freely reset neutral upon proper execution.

 

[Bismo Funyuns]

Fox gets more from FD than Marth does imo. Fox has better movement, lasers, the same 0-deaths on spacies as Marth (maybe even better), and honestly isn't even that bad on FD against Marth.

[collapse="I don't care which I am vs 47% of opponents"]
Fox: 18.2% of opponents
Falco: 14.0%
Marth: 14.0%
G&W: 0.5%[/collapse]
[collapse="I'd rather be Fox vs 31% of opponents"]Sheik: 11.3%
Captain Falcon: 8.0%
Jigglypuff: 5.3%
Ganondorf: 3.0%
Link: 1.2%
Zelda: 0.6%
Young Link: 0.5%
Kirby: 0.4%
Bowser: 0.4%[/collapse]
[collapse="I'd rather be Marth vs: 14% of opponents"]
Peach: 6.9%
Ice Climbers: 3.0%
Dr. Mario: 2.1%
Pikachu: 0.8%
Mario: 0.7%
Roy: 0.5%
Ness: 0.3%
Pichu: 0.1%[/collapse]
[collapse="Not sure who I'd rather be vs 8% of opponents:"]
Samus: 3.6%
Luigi: 3.0%
Donkey Kong: 0.7%
Mewtwo: 0.3%[/collapse]

FD is a great stage for Fox when he's facing anyone other than Marth, but Fox vs. Marth on FD is arguably even in Marth's favor.

 

[EddyBearr]

FD is a great stage for Fox when he's facing anyone other than Marth, but Fox vs. Marth on FD is arguably even in Marth's favor.

I think it's only even on FD. Marth beating fox on FD was more of an M2K-era mindset. In recent years it became "Marth2King on FD" is advantageous against spacies, but.. I think the meta has evolved to it not being significantly advantageous to Marth. The best we have is Leffen losing to M2K on FD and losing to PPMD on FD, but the games were both very close and arguably cases where Leffen didn't clutch it out (stock advantage, % lead, etc.)

 

[Bismo Funyuns]

I think it's only even on FD. Marth beating fox on FD was more of an M2K-era mindset. In recent years it became "Marth2King on FD" is advantageous against spacies, but.. I think the meta has evolved to it not being significantly advantageous to Marth. The best we have is Leffen losing to M2K on FD and losing to PPMD on FD, but the games were both very close and arguably cases where Leffen didn't clutch it out (stock advantage, % lead, etc.)

I mean if its an advantage its 52:48 at most against Fox. I think they can go negligibly close to, but not quite exactly even on Yoshi's, but that is entirely player dependent, as some Foxes are great on Yoshi's and others never go there. Fox wins solidly on every other stage. But FD is definitely Marth's best stage against spacies.

 

[anikom15]

Fox is the best on every stage.

 

[Spak]

Fox is the best on every stage.

But a skilled Roy can beat any Fox, so every stage should be in favor of A Skilled Roy.

 

[anikom15]

I am serious.

 

[Spak]

I am serious.

I was joking.

 

[krazyzyko]

It seems I should get a Marth as secondary B)

 

[The Prince L]

Puff for Dreamland.

Marth for FD.

Fox for Stadium.

Marth for Yoshi's.

 

[Spak]

I think it's Marth for FD unless you're going against Puff. In that MU, I usually go Roy.

 

[FreezeWaffle]

I'd say...
•Puff basically auto-wins on Dreamland becuase it's so suportive of floaties.
•Falco is best on Yoshi's story because he benefits most from tiny boundaries.
•Sheik is best on FoD because of insane gimping options and the stage favoring her recovery.
•Fox is best on Stadium because of his great mobility there, waveshining is easier there than on most stages, and certain spots allow him to rack up crazy amounts of damage.
•Fox is also best on battlefield becuase he's just the best character in the game and that stage is the most basic stage
•Marth is best on Final Destination because his good range is harder to get around there, the "hey, hey, hey" chain throw is harder to interrupt there, and Marth has the godliest 0-to-death comboes there.

 

[Clint Jaguar]

I really believe that Pokemon Stadium is a good stage for Captain Falcon. He has a lot of space to move around and the designs of the stage and it's many changes allow for some creative combos. Maybe not THE best, but definitely up there.

 

[Spak]

I really believe that Pokemon Stadium is a good stage for Captain Falcon. He has a lot of space to move around and the designs of the stage and it's many changes allow for some creative combos. Maybe not THE best, but definitely up there.

I agree, but rarely go Stadium vs Marth because the platform height is just asking for Marth's opponent to be tippered or U-Tilted.

 

[1MachGO]

I think it's only even on FD. Marth beating fox on FD was more of an M2K-era mindset. In recent years it became "Marth2King on FD" is advantageous against spacies, but.. I think the meta has evolved to it not being significantly advantageous to Marth. The best we have is Leffen losing to M2K on FD and losing to PPMD on FD, but the games were both very close and arguably cases where Leffen didn't clutch it out (stock advantage, % lead, etc.)

That's not looking at all the details. You say Leffen didn't clutch it out. I say M2K and PP didn't take each zero to death opportunity as far as they could. Marth literally only has to get 4 grabs to win a match on FD whereas Fox would need roughly two or three times as many openings. You can't even use the neutral game argument anymore since PPMD has proven that their neutrals are basically deadlocked on that stage.

 

[FreezeWaffle]

Marth literally only has to get 4 grabs to win a match on FD whereas Fox would need roughly two or three times as many openings. You can't even use the neutral game argument anymore since PPMD has proven that their neutrals are basically deadlocked on that stage.

Yes! I completely agree with this. There was a very crucial point in the PPMD vs Leffen match at APEX where PPMD was about to lose on FD but then did an amazing 0-to-death that Marth could have only done on FD and won the match. If Marth wasn't that broken on FD, it's very likely Leffen would have won that set. Furthermore, M2K said himself "If Final Destination was the only stage in Melee, then Marth would be hands down the best character overall, no contest."