Bayonetta patch 1.1.5

[shadowdude]

I didn't see a thread for this so here's one. If there are any changes post them here

 

[Masque]

• Heelslide hit 2 Endlag: Increased
• Witch Time Endlag: Increased

That's all for now, according to the Official Patch Notes.

 

[Bowserboy3]

I saw a post in the patch notes thread mentioning that some of her moves deal less damage, namely Fair and Witch Twist... true or not?

 

[Xpwnage123]

I main Bayonetta and think these nerfs are completely reasonable. All this will do is cut down on the FG noobs that spam Side B and Witch Time. If you're a good player, you probably weren't doing that too much anyways.

 

[HakuryuVision]

^ Agreed.
Don't really see these nerfs hurting her that much.

 

[Top Boss]

The hitbox on hit 2 of heel slide should be smaller in the back, honestly. She could have used some landing lag, but this will do. She's still solid, but more manageable.

 

[ElMoro995]

my favourite early combos are removed, now heel slide doesn't even combo with uptilt at low%

 

[MrListerTheSisterFister]

Could someone test her dash attack and see whether or not you can act out of it faster?

 

[an1bal]

on the bayo discord group we are agreeing on a nerf on her dair, specifically her FAF (firs acting frame). you cant cancel out of it as early as you could before.

 

[Pancracio17]

Tons of her moves got a 1% nerf like the fair combo and i think gorunded side b and up b

 

[shadowdude]

Tons of her moves got a 1% nerf like the fair combo and i think gorunded side b and up b

Well if you or someone else gets the exact percent change I'll add them

 

[shadowdude]

Ok I really feel like dash attack was changed,am I crazy?is this placebo? I feel like I can act out of it sooner

 

[MrListerTheSisterFister]

Ok I really feel like dash attack was changed,am I crazy?is this placebo? I feel like I can act out of it sooner

Yeah that's what I'm saying. I feel the endlag (and speed?) got buffed. I really don't think its placebo. I've noticed this first during Pink Fresh's bout with Nairo earlier today.

 

[Philos-kun]

First of all, hi! I'm new here in Smashboards!.

I've been maining Bayo since release and definitely her dash has less endlag, since a lot of people have been mentioning it. Second, I've noticed that Witch Twist has slightly more endlag (placebo) and people keep saying that deals less damage (before patch, the standard Heel Slide -> Witch Twist -> 2ABK -> Bair combo did 49 in total and now it does 44). I can't tell which move got nerfed but seems that points to WT.

 

[Ijuka]

First of all, hi! I'm new here in Smashboards!.

I've been maining Bayo since release and definitely her dash has less endlag, since a lot of people have been mentioning it. Second, I've noticed that Witch Twist has slightly more endlag (placebo) and people keep saying that deals less damage (before patch, the standard Heel Slide -> Witch Twist -> 2ABK -> Bair combo did 49 in total and now it does 44). I can't tell which move got nerfed but seems that points to WT.

Everything does the exact same damage as before. My long 50-60 damage combos do the exact same amount of damage in training mode as before. Also, that combo never did 49 in total and I don't even get bair to combo after that most of the time.

If the nerf to forward B recovery is true, you most likely miss the first hit of up B if you can't properly double jump into it in time which costs 3 damage.


On the other hand, did her jab combo get nerfed? 16 dmg does seem pretty low for it but then again I almost never used it. Alright, it does 21 or so damage still, it just shows 16 in the training mode.

 

[Robert J King]

Has Neutral B, Bullet Climax, been changed at all? Higher trajectory? Less hitstun?

 

[Philos-kun]

Not really. Neutral B seems just as before.

What I can confirm is that Dair has more endlag because I used to spam that moves on ledges and now I die if I use it. Is not that big of a deal actually because you can short hop near the ledge and Dair.

 

[Glamdalf]

The changes to her dair are really messing me up ;_;

 

[Skyfox2000]

I've noticed that now whenever I go for a Dair off stage I barely have enough time to recovery was this patch out or something? Also, was any of Bayonetta's combos nerfed? Does Witch Twist do less damage now.

 

[Pancracio17]

yes and yes, her combos keep working though (thank god)
And can anyone confirm that fair 123 does 12 now and that full heel slide does 14 now?

 

[Skyfox2000]

yes and yes, her combos keep working though (thank god)
And can anyone confirm that fair 123 does 12 now and that full heel slide does 14 now?

I think that her Fair is still the same....


I really didn't like these nerfs that happen to Bayonetta. She not like she was in the pre-patch and I feel like Bayonetta is even harder to play after the nerfs lol. Also, did anything change with Bayonetta's Dash Attack?

 

[MrListerTheSisterFister]

I think that her Fair is still the same....


I really didn't like these nerfs that happen to Bayonetta. She not like she was in the pre-patch and I feel like Bayonetta is even harder to play after the nerfs lol. Also, did anything change with Bayonetta's Dash Attack?

No one has confirmed it yet but its pretty obvious that you can act out of dash attack quicker. If it has always been that way no way would it be considered a bad move.

 

[Lunais]

Honestly, not counting less time to confirm off Witch Time (you can still kill off it easy) and you cant spam it as often (if you were into that kind of thing) she is the same thing. Side-B was already punishable by grabs before and it was risk/reward anyways. Bayonetta is perfectly fine still, chill for those who are worried.

 

[pikazz]

Honestly, not counting less time to confirm off Witch Time (you can still kill off it easy) and you cant spam it as often (if you were into that kind of thing) she is the same thing. Side-B was already punishable by grabs before and it was risk/reward anyways. Bayonetta is perfectly fine still, chill for those who are worried.

unless you count that her smash attack kills now 2-5% lower than normal, it shouldnt be any problem! she is just the same now as I have play her before!

but the DAir FAF from 44 to 48 took me by surprice ;-;

 

[KingCapital]

Honestly, not counting less time to confirm off Witch Time (you can still kill off it easy) and you cant spam it as often (if you were into that kind of thing) she is the same thing. Side-B was already punishable by grabs before and it was risk/reward anyways. Bayonetta is perfectly fine still, chill for those who are worried.

I def agree with this. I also have something to say about the dair issue. On some stages like smashville and FD(only ones I've tested/seen it done on), you can still recover if you don't short hop over ledge. I've been able to do it with the double jump cancel witch twist as well as without it by finishing the recovery with an abk(more riskier though). Has anyone else here done this and if so have you found any other stages this works on?

 

[HoboJoe]

These changes to bayo really don't mean anything. Weirdly enough I think the Dair change hurts the most, it's still a pretty effective edge guard, and jump backwards dair is still great at catching those 2 frames of ledge grab vulnerability, but now my go to edgeguard is nair, and I only use dair when I'm above someone and I make a really hard read on an air dodge. There is still the insanely powerful landing hitbox that remains unchanged, so we still have it as a great on stage tool. Drop through platform dair is still a great mixup against players inexperienced with the matchup. Aside from that, nobody should be using witchtime more than once or twice a match anyway, so the change doesn't really affect us, and the heel slide change is meaningless since all the good players in my region started to grab me out of it anyway (even without the kick). It wasn't safe to begin with, and now it's even less so. It's still a really good option at covering getup options, mixups off of short hop nair, and tech chases. Bayo made it out fine this patch. The only thing that really got nerfed was just one of her many really good edge guarding tools.

 

[pikazz]

These changes to bayo really don't mean anything. Weirdly enough I think the Dair change hurts the most, it's still a pretty effective edge guard, and jump backwards dair is still great at catching those 2 frames of ledge grab vulnerability, but now my go to edgeguard is nair, and I only use dair when I'm above someone and I make a really hard read on an air dodge. This is still the insanely powerful landing hitbox that remains unchanged, so we still have it as a great on stage tool. Drop through platform dair is still a great mixup against players inexperienced with the matchup. Aside from that, nobody should be using witchtime more than once or twice a match anyway, so the change doesn't really affect us, and the heel slide change is meaningless since all the good players in my region started to grab me out of it anyway (even without the kick). It wasn't safe to begin with, and now it's even less so. It's still a really good option at covering getup options, mixups off of short hop nair, and tech chases. Bayo made it out fine this patch. The only thing that really got nerfed was just one of her many really good edge guarding tools.

^this

it feels more like small tweaks instead for pure nerfs

 

[KingCapital]

So far there hasn't been anything damaging to her that has been found so I'm glad. One thing that I wish we would get would be warnings or dates about patches so they don't come out of nowhere so we can actually have a clue about what will/might happen. I feel this patch has been one of the wackiest especially because of the stuff that happened to shiek, meta knight, cloud, etc.

 

[Luig]

I need to practice bayonetta more. I'm pretty sure she's the best character in the game now btw.

 

[BJN39]

I've been hearing reports of things like damage nerfs, etc.

I've got some of the confirmed stuff already, but with such a big following, I'm surprised there aren't more people doing hard searching for changes!

I'll be adding changes in the data thread when I have them all together and confirmed.

 

[pikazz]

I've been hearing reports of things like damage nerfs, etc.

I've got some of the confirmed stuff already, but with such a big following, I'm surprised there aren't more people doing hard searching for changes!

I'll be adding changes in the data thread when I have them all together and confirmed.

bayonetta was one of the first that got datamined. the only thing that isnt really "datamined" is FAF and start/endlag as they supposely doesnt have any commands by default

 

[Flawed]

I'd be 100% Ok if Witch time got nerfed a ton and Side b + dair stayed the same.

I lost my favorite followup out of side b (nair)

Still a great character

 

[Ghidorah14]

I'd be 100% Ok if Witch time got nerfed a ton and Side b + dair stayed the same.

I lost my favorite followup out of side b (nair)

Still a great character

So losing her best kill confirm would be worth some lame low % combo and a cheesy edgeguard move?

No.

 

[Quantumpen]

Just curious -- it seems like most Bayo mains her aren't too worried about her nerfs. I don't really play Bayo a lot (I just do her sick combos in training mode to relieve stress) but to me the Witch time nerf seems pretty significant. She had a lot of really disgusting options out of witch time before (at low %'s especially) and now it barely seems to last long enough to do anything except forward smash.

So why the calm? =p

 

[Skyfox2000]

I've been maining Bayonetta since day 1 and I have got to say I think this patch has definitely affected her a little bit. Witch Time getting nerfed and more lag to Heel Slide. Is it me or does it seem harder to get the Heel Slide into Witch Twist combo? It use to be her basic bread & butter. It seems like it's been nerfed.

 

[Burgundy]

I'm never gonna complain about Witch Time nerfs because of just how ridiculous the move is. It's literally a free kill at high percents lmao. A small time reduction on WT isn't a big deal at all.

 

[HoboJoe]

So losing her best kill confirm would be worth some lame low % combo and a cheesy edgeguard move?

No.

The move isn't gone at all, just earlier I killed someone at 30% with it by setting them up for a dair spike after back airing them, and in the few hours I played today I can thank probably around 20-30% of my kills to witch time, about what it was before. Only difference is, the move isn't as safe or as spammable anymore (though, arguably it wasn't that spammable to begin with, everyone in my region got really good at punishing it). I still use witch time almost the exact same way I've always used it, nothing really changed. The extra end lag sucks, but the startup hasn't changed, so as long as you still make the right reads or don't flub your off stage Witch time edge guards you should be fine, just don't get predictable with it.

Is it me or does it seem harder to get the Heel Slide into Witch Twist combo? It use to be her basic bread & butter. It seems like it's been nerfed.

Heel slide was definitely nerfed to some extent, but the move was already unsafe on sheild. As for combos from heel slide kick into up b, they can jump out or air dodge before you can up b at really early percents if they DI away, but at mid-to-late percents, it's about as good as it's always been. Also definitely don't treat her heel slide into up b as her bread and butter. It's not safe on shield at all, and can be brutally punished when playing against the right players. The move is best used for tech chases, mixups, and catching getup options, outside of that I don't touch it too much. Her bread and butter is more her down tilt or up throw into her up b shenanigans. Neither of which got nerfed, so we're good.

 

[Ghidorah14]

The move isn't gone at all

I never said it was. Just that I dont agree that trading witch time length for endlag on 2 moves being worth it.

 

[HoboJoe]

I never said it was. Just that I dont agree that trading witch time length for endlag on 2 moves being worth it.

My bad for misinterpreting what you wrote then!

 

[HuntarBarbarian]

Just curious -- it seems like most Bayo mains her aren't too worried about her nerfs. I don't really play Bayo a lot (I just do her sick combos in training mode to relieve stress) but to me the Witch time nerf seems pretty significant. She had a lot of really disgusting options out of witch time before (at low %'s especially) and now it barely seems to last long enough to do anything except forward smash.

So why the calm? =p

It's not like the move is even bad now. It just that it isn't spammable and requires you to be more efficient.