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baiting

XxDarkzeroxX

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 20, 2009
Messages
15
i've been trying some new ways of baiting people but I was wondering what do you guys look for when you bait and how do you "make" them do it. for example I try to bait rolls dodges and shield grabs. when I approach I usually approach with lazer lazer then shine/dair depending on where I am but to bait a roll/dodge I would lazer lazer dash up to them run back and then jab/grab. but I was playing a good player the other day and he never falls for that kinda stuff just wanna know what you do in higher level play
 

Hostility

Smash Ace
Joined
May 16, 2007
Messages
552
Location
Concord CA
People roll or don't roll in different situations. there's nothing you can do to "make someone roll". If they don't roll much keep that in mind for when you pressure and it will be one less thing you have to look for
 

Deathgazer

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
534
Location
England Milton Keynes
try reading their initial reaction to a Dthrow?
I think applying pressure on them is the key.
when youre facing towards the edge and do a Dthrow, the initial reaction would be to roll in the center hoping to get to a safe place or stay in the same place. they hardly roll towards the edge. you just have to think of the probability and chances they go the direction you want.

Situation 1:
When theyl about to land on the ground from an attack and you run towards them, theres a higher chance theyl tech-roll/ roll behind you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFAQcm09SWk
(just a random video I found in the other thread)

But notice in the first game, most of the time PC runs towards to falco at a certain distance, hel always roll towards PC which is what PC expects him to do.

In 0:08 PC expected him to roll behind him so he wavedashes and stops for a breif moment before relying on his reaction to chase the roll
0:49, 1:11, 1:58, 2:02 are all examples of rolling behind him and he does it everytime in that game. But you get what I mean.


Same with when youre facing away from the edge and Dthrow them near the edge, they are more likely to roll away into a larger space than roll behind you into the edge because it leaves them more open from the rolling animation and you have a shorter distance to travel to.

Those are the initial reactions to how people would react, but better players would do all sorts of different things.
As long as you apply enough pressure on them by keep chasing them up with more attacks, keep lasering, shield pressuring, attacking them really fast (but make sure youre accurate) etcetc. eventually, all they want to do is escape so theyl tech/roll/ react in more obvious ways (more chances of them to react to the initial reactions) They also panic so they make rash decisions and not think about things as much.

Situation 2:
you just have to remember the initial reactions would be in situations:
If theyre hanging on the edge and you run towards them, initial reaction would be attack with either aerial or getting attack, or roll into center stage.

Like as Dashizwiz does, after a big combo, and he dairs you near the edge of the stage, hel always try to Fsmash towards to the center stage hoping youl roll to center stage because thats the most obvious reaction, and sometimes people fall for it because theyre put under enough pressure.

However, dont abuse it and keep doingthe same things because the other player will see this and avoid the problems.

Or even at lower percentages, keep doing the same thing that doesnt work hoping the other player will pick on that mistake but you have to remember their reaction to that mistake because they are likely to do that again next time when they get in a habit. and when theyre at a higher percentage avoid that mistake and find a way of following them as there is a higher chance they will react in the same way.

Situation 3:
D throw and shield straight away, first few times theyl probably do the getting up attack your shield and punish them by attacking them after. but eventually theyl learn and roll away from you or behind you. You just have to predict where theyl go bearing in mind the position of the stage you are on. when theyre at a higher percentage, so it again and predict where theyl roll and just run to the direction theyre rolling into and Dsmash them. However, there is a low percent that theyl react in a different way (spot tech, delay get-up) so dont expect them to do it all the time, so you might have to rely on your reaction for them situations.

It also depends on their percentage as people play more defensive or start thinking more when their percentage is high so they try to do different things.

I could expand on so much more, but itl probably get boring for you lol. I dno if this works for most people but this is what I use to how to predict peoples reactions lol. hope it helped :)

EDIT: this mainly works on FD, for stages with platforms, it is slightly different and there are more options to react. but you can use the same kinda concept and interpret to your own mindgames.
 

Kawasari Mimoto

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 28, 2010
Messages
69
Location
playing Touhou 10.5: Scarlet Weather Rhapsody!
I just spam lasers all day til they get mad and come over to me, and if they're stupid, they'll either:

a) Attempt to grab
b) Smash head-on

I'll use the chance to either grab+fthrow2dair or shine2dair and just take an instant stock off of them. Against really good people though, uhh.. This doesn't work. I just laser all day if they let me, but if they don't, I don't bother baiting and just short-hop laser towards them and do a quick nair or two. :/
 

Doomblaze

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
412
Location
Shanghai, China
Pressure C. Falcons shield from behind him and he'll roll 95% of the time.
Shinegrabbing them is great for conditioning because then they start spotdodging after your shine and you can combo them.
Watch how they roll as you play them and predict it, everybody is different.

Baiting lower level players is way too easy because they all try to shieldgrab you and get shineraped, but i dont play against higher level players much so idk.
 
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