Are these viable ledge recovery options?

[L33thal]

Sometimes I'd get wrecked by Marths when I'm trying to get back on stage. As in, I'd be grabbing the edge and the Marth (or any other character, for that matter) would zone me out and cover my options of getting back on stage. So I thought about some weird recoveries and I just want to get some input/advice about them:

(Assume you're grabbing the edge and the other guy is close enough to punish your recovery)

1. Fastfall -> Shine -> Jump out of shine -> Waveland : For smoother wavelands on stage
2. Fastfall -> Shine -> Turnaround -> Jump out of shine -> Waveland : To waveland behind your opponent
3. Fastfall -> Shine -> Turnaround -> Jump out of shine -> Bair : To hit them if they're too close
4. Fastfall -> Immediate walljump -> Waveland : To maximize invincibility
5. Fastfall -> Shine -> Jump out of shine (face the edge but jump away from it) -> Super-spaced double laser onto stage

I don't know about frame data or any of that stuff, but from my observations it seems like Falco's waveland is different from Fox's due to the different timings for their wavedashes. So I was just kind of thinking about ways to maintain invincibility and extend/get smoother movement.



Also, let's say you're doing the Marth-killer and the Marth made it back on stage and you're on the edge now. Can you smooth waveland onto the stage to down smash before he has a chance to shield or whatever?

 

[Splice]

1 and 2 are viable but will only work if the opponent is completely not ready for it. Worth pulling out on occasion.
3 is quite useful and the one I've seen the most out of these.

4 don't know how good this is or how different it is from just a waveland recovery which is common and good. I think it's slower overall so rarely better. You can do an immediate walljump and then do a rising diagonal airdodge to land on platforms though which is useful. You don't want to sacrifice speed for minor invincibility increases usually.

5. If you just drop down and DJ you can get finely spaced lasers anyway. If they are so close to you that they can hit you while you're offstage then your option isn't going to either. As long as the first laser hits if they're that close both options will be rather safe and if the first laser misses than both of these are dangerous options.

If you do the marth Killer and he lands on stage the easiest thing to do is edge-drop DJ Bair. If you wavelanded fast enough I'm sure you can get a Dsmash out, he lags a fair bit when he lands.

You basically have to not get read at the same time as choosing an option that's taking into account what they're thinking of and what they can punish, you really always have to mix it up. Double Ledge Hop Lazer is a go to option but is incredibly dangerous if they anticipate it and know how to deal with it. I find myself DoubleJump airdodging into marth and then trying to cross up which side I land on so I don't get grabbed.

When you're recovering to the edge, try and SDI into the wall as you rise from UpB so it's easy to tech the hit if Marth hits you out of UpB and then hold up so you rise and SideB immediately. That's one of the free-est ways to recover if you pull it off but I don't think all of Marths edgeguard options can be teched, to be honest.

 

[mooki]

1, 2, and 4 are all inferior to the standard waveland from the edge. You'll be losing invincibility with all three. 3 could be useful. I don't really understand 5. As for your question about punishing Marth's up-b, yes, you'll have plenty of time to d-smash if you waveland on.