Are plasma TVs as good as CRTs?

[HeavyLobster1120]

I have a flat screen plasma TV and from what I can tell is there is the same amount of delay on a CRT and projectors compared to LCD TVs

 

[Dolla Pills]

I have a flat screen plasma TV and from what I can tell is there is the same amount of delay on a CRT and projectors compared to LCD TVs

There may be some rare cases of flatscreens having low lag, but believe me when I say CRT's are better. If you're new to competitive smash you might not notice, but there's a reason we lug around tons of huge CRT's to tournaments and smash fests.

 

[necroTaxonomist]

Plasma TVs are good.
I know a guy who has one and he says it's pretty sweet.

 

[Get Low]

Plasma screens are just about as good as CRTs for Melee, and they make the game look nicer. Wouldn't recommend taking one to a tournament though.

 

[Haaaaadoken]

Any practice that isn't on a CRT is bad practice. The amount of lag that you'll have to adjust to even on a "low lag flatscreen" will be insurmountable. Just get a CRT if you want to practice in the same conditions that standard tournaments have.

 

[HeavyLobster1120]

Plasma screens are just about as good as CRTs for Melee, and they make the game look nicer. Wouldn't recommend taking one to a tournament though.

Alright thanks. I'm not going carry a huge plasma TV to tournament, I was just wondering if there's a

Any practice that isn't on a CRT is bad practice. The amount of lag that you'll have to adjust to even on a "low lag flatscreen" will be insurmountable. Just get a CRT if you want to practice in the same conditions that standard tournaments have.

Is there a way to test this? Because I feel no difference on a CRT

 

[N7Kopper]

Is there a way to test this? Because I feel no difference on a CRT

The easiest way to test it (or at least the way I test it) is to use a Wii U.
Find any Wii U software where the TV and GamePad play the same sound, turn them both up.
If there's any audio desync, it's more than likely you've got some lag - as the GamePad has lag comparable to a CRT. (everything has lag, but the lag on a CRT is less than what humans can percieve, and certainly less than a 60th of a second) I should know, because I compared it to a CRT.

If you don't have a Wii U? Hmm, I wouldn't know. That testing method is too reliable for me to know any others

If you have a WiiU, and have homebrew on it's vWii (you should) use this. http://junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php/240p_test_suite - it has a mode designed specifically to check frame lag.

 

[artifice]

Plasma is the worst option available, generally they will have 3x the lag a decent LCD will have.. Thats on an average, and the Plasmas that compete with LCDs on input/display lag are newer and more expensive.

Neither of them compare with CRTs or projection TVs though. Saying plasma is about as good as a CRT is a ludicrous statement.

 

[rivers]

Plasma screens are just about as good as CRTs for Melee, and they make the game look nicer. Wouldn't recommend taking one to a tournament though.

wat

uh no. we don't lug around CRTs to every event to get sick biceps. the lag might not be noticeable to a new player, and it can be adjusted to, but it's not worth it for tournaments. like, sometimes my casual roommate wants to play on our large hd tv, so I'll deal with the lag, but I'd never play a serious tournament set on it.

 

[Get Low]

wat

uh no. we don't lug around CRTs to every event to get sick biceps. the lag might not be noticeable to a new player, and it can be adjusted to, but it's not worth it for tournaments. like, sometimes my casual roommate wants to play on our large hd tv, so I'll deal with the lag, but I'd never play a serious tournament set on it.

Plasma screens =/= LCDs (which is what you are probably referring to with your roommates hd tv).
I mean obviously the lag on LCDs is unbearable, anyone who grew up playing Smash on a crt knows this. But the OP is asking about plasma screens, which were commonly made before LCDs, and don't have any noticable lag.

 

[TuukkaTime]

uh no. we don't lug around CRTs to every event to get sick biceps.

speak for urself m8

 

[HeavyLobster1120]

The easiest way to test it (or at least the way I test it) is to use a Wii U.
Find any Wii U software where the TV and GamePad play the same sound, turn them both up.
If there's any audio desync, it's more than likely you've got some lag - as the GamePad has lag comparable to a CRT. (everything has lag, but the lag on a CRT is less than what humans can percieve, and certainly less than a 60th of a second) I should know, because I compared it to a CRT.

If you don't have a Wii U? Hmm, I wouldn't know. That testing method is too reliable for me to know any others

If you have a WiiU, and have homebrew on it's vWii (you should) use this. http://junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php/240p_test_suite - it has a mode designed specifically to check frame lag.

I have a WiiU so I'll give it a try

 

[thf24]

So much myth and false information in this thread, as it tends to go whenever this topic comes up in our community. The only truth is that while general types of monitors tend to have more display lag than others (LCD's), all monitors are different, and you can't really know for sure without testing them against each other. Not even all CRT's are created equal; some can be noticeably laggy just like modern HD monitors, contrary to popular belief. I can set my HD low-latency computer monitor up with a lagless hdmi adapter to have less lag than any CRT, although the difference is undetectable. In general, any medium to large HD TV (30+ inches) is going to have noticeable display lag, but there can always be exceptions. Another thing to note is the connection method; sometimes an HD monitor itself can be fine, but noticeable lag can result if you're using HDMI without a good adapter. At the end of the day, I personally think it's better to play/practice on a big laggy TV than not to practice/play at all if those are your only two options (shouldn't take more than 30 minutes or so of friendlies to adjust in a tournament setting), but to each his own. If you want to be completely on the safe side, just find a thrift shop near you and they've probably got a decent CRT for $15-20.

 

[ph00tbag]

Plasma screens do tend to have less latency than LCDs/LEDs, and their high refresh rates make fast-moving images crisp and fluid, however, static images tend to burn in, making Plasma screens less preferred. It is possible to find flatscreens of both varieties that utilize minimal digital signal processing to keep latency below the dreaded 16 ms that will cause one frame of delay, and because LCDs have no burn-in, and are reaching the 120Hz refresh rate point consistently now, they are pretty much the industry standard for screens in gaming.

So why aren't either used in Melee? These methods all require the use of high grade HDMI cable, and the Gamecube came out a year before the first HDMI standard. Indeed, the Gamecube's highest quality output is A/V Composite Cable with a 360p signal. Many high-end screens don't even have Composite input jacks, and most of those that do don't really have a fast way to convert the signal to digital, then upconvert that 360p digital signal to 720p. The rare flatscreen that can display GC output with less than a frame of delay cost a solid 10 times as much as a functional CRT you can find in the thrift shop. Put more simply, the Gamecube was not designed with HD flatscreens in mind. It was made for the CRT, and since CRTs are dirt cheap, that's what we continue to use.

 

[Synnett]

If you want to test the lag, pick up Bowser and go do some wavedashes on a crt, then switch to the screen you want to test. The input required to wavedash with Boozer is too slow for muscle memory to really work (9 frames), so you have to rely on visual cues. And yep, on laggy stuff it's unbearable.

As far as I know, the best are the CRT, but some of them may lag. Then there are some lag-less monitors, and then you have those LCD, where you have enough time to go make a sandwich after each inputs.