An idea to counter fox....

[_Phloat_]

It seems there are no characters in the game that give fox much more trouble than he gives them, and he usually wins all of his matchups if the player is of equal skill, or even a little less skill...

So, maybe, just maybe, the way to counter fox is with a good stage.... I personally like a green greens/ captain falcon combo, because the sides there are so close that the knee is a major pain, even at low %. Also, because the sides are so close, it seems that recovery is not that important, meaning that the shinespikes value decreases, although it is still a pain...

So, what do you think, and Suggestions for more stage/character combos would be awesome, and what are the banned stages?

 

[Silent Wolf]

Green Greens is one of Fox's best stages, and would give him a way bigger advantage than it would to Falcon, not to mention the fact that Fox is on top of that way too good against Falcon. try someone that's alright against Fox if polayed right ike Peach or Marth and use a stage with a high ceiling. Or just get pro at chain throwing and mind gaming in grabs and counter FD with Doc/Marth/Peach/etc. Or out-gay the Fox.

 

[_Phloat_]

But why is fox good at green greens...

I am good with Dr. Mario, but I thought that a good fox ***** Dr. Mario....


I am ok at chainthrowing

 

[Silent Wolf]

Why isn't Fox good at Green Greens. He kills people off the top at like 40%, and he can camp unbelievably well there with back aerials and shine. Just controlling a smaller platform. His lasers reach the whole stage while standing and shooting from a side platform. Basically low ceiling though. Fox can stay in the center and not get killed by knee ever too. Just hold down. Unless tere's no blocks or something.

 

[Mew2King]

Here you wanna know the REAL way to **** fox

1) edge *** him

2) grab him and kill him

3) hop back while attacking

4) WD back and do certain moves, like sheik forward tilt and marth up tilt -> dair near the edge.

5) when fox laser camps you short hop at him, and then keep doing double jumps back while fairing. Not just that, do other things to mix it up, but what I just named is easy to react to since double jump in air is instantaneous. Fox doesn't like being cornered at the edge (who does), the only Fox risky enough to continue spamming lasers at the edge is ken, but for every laser they shoot they risk being attacked at the edge. Fox is vulnerable to attack after a full jump anything. Dash dance grab does good vs Fox after he full jumps (unless he randomly doesn't fast fall like a noob, in which case you should always prepare a CC grab incase you miss). Most Fox's wont take that kind of a risk and will try to get away from the edge.

6) block his nair, block the shine, then Fox will probably full jump after shine. Do a shield hop Uair with Marth/Sheik/some other characters. This is a good strategy to start with against Fox since most Fox's full jump after a shine.

Fox lacks priority besides like Bair and Up Smash and stuff, so many of his attacks are easily ourprioritized, that's a big weakness of him.

 

[Shmooguy]

Here you wanna know the REAL way to **** fox

1) edge *** him

2) grab him and kill him

3) hop back while attacking

4) WD back and do certain moves, like sheik forward tilt and marth up tilt -> dair near the edge.

5) when fox laser camps you short hop at him, and then keep doing double jumps back while fairing. Not just that, do other things to mix it up, but what I just named is easy to react to since double jump in air is instantaneous. Fox doesn't like being cornered at the edge (who does), the only Fox risky enough to continue spamming lasers at the edge is ken, but for every laser they shoot they risk being attacked at the edge. Fox is vulnerable to attack after a full jump anything. Dash dance grab does good vs Fox after he full jumps (unless he randomly doesn't fast fall like a noob, in which case you should always prepare a CC grab incase you miss). Most Fox's wont take that kind of a risk and will try to get away from the edge.

6) block his nair, block the shine, then Fox will probably full jump after shine. Do a shield hop Uair with Marth/Sheik/some other characters. This is a good strategy to start with against Fox since most Fox's full jump after a shine.

Fox lacks priority besides like Bair and Up Smash and stuff, so many of his attacks are easily ourprioritized, that's a big weakness of him.

Awesome, thanks. Does Sheik's uptilt go through Fox's Nair? I used to WD back to Ftilt a lot, but now a lot of Fox users just shorthop Nair behind me and shine behind me instead, so they still hit me if i wavedash back. I haven't had a chance to try the uptilt, but seeing as it goes through Fox's Dair I'm thinking it should work for all moves.

Maybe I have slow reaction time, but Fox is pretty fast, and it's hard to react to a quick Nair. Do I just jump up and Fair, hoping (predicting) that they jump up to attack me? Thanks again, you're a big help.

 

[technomancer]

Peach, Mute City. Downsmashes and chainthrows, and cars will mess up the Fox if he tries to do something silly. Peach can also recover without getting edgeraped or recieving damage and stall if she doesn't like a part of the stage.

Oh and print out M2K's post and stick it to your wall.

 

[_Phloat_]

Thanks for the lengthy response Mew2king, and Ill try that, Hopefully I will destroy my friend's fox ^_^

 

[Randomg]

(unless he randomly doesn't fast fall like a noob, in which case you should always prepare a CC grab incase you miss)..

psh, maybe they're just smash geniuses that mix in non fast falls to mix people up...

 

[Chunkyturd007]

Not that good of a counter, but for people who can chainthrow Fox could pick FD. Of course this would only help if it was easy to grab him :/

 

[_Phloat_]

^^ I agree, whenever I think I have a shield grab, Shink, there is the shine

 

[Brookman]

I didn't read the first post, but if it doesn't say play fox it's wrong.

 

[OmegaXangel]

Kirby 64(forgot the name) is actually a good stage to counter fox. Since it makes vert kills a little harder.

I actually think Samus has a slight advantage over fox(fox throw to whatever doesn't work on Samus) and if she's on Kirby 64, she already has the upperhand.

 

[IceCleaners]

Here you wanna know the REAL way to **** fox

1) edge *** him

2) grab him and kill him

3) hop back while attacking

4) WD back and do certain moves, like sheik forward tilt and marth up tilt -> dair near the edge.

5) when fox laser camps you short hop at him, and then keep doing double jumps back while fairing. Not just that, do other things to mix it up, but what I just named is easy to react to since double jump in air is instantaneous. Fox doesn't like being cornered at the edge (who does), the only Fox risky enough to continue spamming lasers at the edge is ken, but for every laser they shoot they risk being attacked at the edge. Fox is vulnerable to attack after a full jump anything. Dash dance grab does good vs Fox after he full jumps (unless he randomly doesn't fast fall like a noob, in which case you should always prepare a CC grab incase you miss). Most Fox's wont take that kind of a risk and will try to get away from the edge.

6) block his nair, block the shine, then Fox will probably full jump after shine. Do a shield hop Uair with Marth/Sheik/some other characters. This is a good strategy to start with against Fox since most Fox's full jump after a shine.

Fox lacks priority besides like Bair and Up Smash and stuff, so many of his attacks are easily ourprioritized, that's a big weakness of him.

Do you have any tips if you are using link against fox? or is link screwed?

 

[Brookman]

Do you have any tips if you are using link against fox? or is link screwed?

Just jump off the stage before the fox gets a hit, including lasers, and you win.

 

[BrTarolg]

play on FoD or FD.

its not necessarily a counterpick, but its definately a stage where the ceilings are higher.

or, practise in a lesser, countrepick stage, and play there.

 

[Ipwn]

Final destination.. SHL untill he is dead.

 

[Sol]

marth does very well against fox if you can grab alot

 

[Brookman]

marth does very well against fox if you can grab alot

marth does very well against fox if you can grab alot know hot to dash dance camp and chain grab and edge guard like a pro. Smash DI'ing up airs sure helps a ton, poor ken.

 

[Mr. Derp]

pick falco

not even kidding though, us fALcos have even learned to get out of fox's chaingrab super early, if you wanna see an example check out the PC vs. M2K matches from fc6. but now foxes are starting to do throw combos, look at KSN, he maybe chaingrabs twice than does u-tilts, d-tilts, uairs, etc. but I still say falco counters fox. the only reason why it seems so even with the pros is because pros make every character middle tier and up competition worthy (at least if they main em')

 

[Mr. Derp]

pick falco

not even kidding though, us fALcos have even learned to get out of fox's chaingrab super early, if you wanna see an example check out the PC vs. M2K matches from fc6. but now foxes are starting to do throw combos, look at KSN, he maybe chaingrabs twice than does u-tilts, d-tilts, uairs, etc. but I still say falco counters fox. the only reason why the match seems so even between the pros is because pros make every character middle tier and up competition worthy, especially a good character like fox. Shine combos are always nice too.

 

[_Phloat_]

I like brinstar / Samus....

If you knock a fox out there, the acid is gonna hurt him a lot, and it is as hard as hell to combo a samus....

I know that the ceiling is low, and he can destroy me when the acid comes up and he stays on the tiny platform and shines, but there is a chance that the fox does not know that...

No..One...Likes...Brinstar...

 

[Peppers]

if the fox knos anything about the stages he plays that is a terrible pick especially wit samus
shine spikes will **** a samus ther

 

[Sinz]

Moonwalk to make em suicide its a mad mindgame.
Or just wait til they kill em selves.

 

[ThatGuy]

I'd just like to point out that Fox counters Falcon, and Green greens is a TERRIBLE stage for Falcon. It's so bad. Those blocks just murder you.