Am I the only one who thinks Bower is OP'd here?

[DarkFlame]

Seriously, noone else really has super armor like his, only other character is Squirtle, but I think almost the only thing that doesn't penetrate his super armor is Fox's Blaster, but even then, that Blaster can't even make ANYTHING flinch. So, uh, yeah, if someone is fast enough with Bowser, they can be basically untouchable, and I really don't see anyone who could have a chance against a pro Bowser in this game.

 

[DarkFlame]

Of course, if you agree or disagree, please, feel free to tell me, just, of course, don't be rude about it, but I don't see very many rude people so far here in Smashboards, so that's good.

 

[Frost | Odds]

Yes, I'm pretty sure you're alone. Bowser's attacks are easy to avoid and super laggy+easy to punish, and he can't approach or use projectiles.

 

[DarkFlame]

Yeah, that's no real surprise. Besides, this is all from my own experience. My friend likes using Bowser now because of the super armor, and, yeah, I think it kinda cheap. There's not very many chances that I personally get to even flinch him, but then again, I always think I suck at video games, so... Heck, I was surprised when I went through a small singles Brawl tournament undefeated as Marth, and I wasn't really trying any more than I usually do.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Introduce your friend to the grab button.

 

[DarkFlame]

Yeah, that's no real surprise. Besides, this is all from my own experience. My friend likes using Bowser now because of the super armor, and, yeah, I think it kinda cheap. There's not very many chances that I personally get to even flinch him, but then again, I always think I suck at video games, so... Heck, I was surprised when I went through a small singles Brawl tournament undefeated as Marth, and I wasn't really trying any more than I usually do.

And this was all against human players, no computers, this was not a big tournament, but it wasn't the tournament mode, me and my friend had to sign in, and all the matches were set up by use of dice with all of us having a certain number assigned to us, and all that.

 

[Xenozoa425]

Learn the matchup and don't just mindlessly rush in.

 

[DarkFlame]

Introduce your friend to the grab button.

Ok, that was hilarious how you put that! XD

So, unfortunately, I don't use grabs much, but, yeah, I think next time I go over to his place, which could be quite a while due to weather, and the fact that I haven't my own Wii, I certainly will introduce him to the grab button! XD

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

For extra effectiveness, try Ganon and Flame Choke.

Just don't be surprised when he quits Smash, or punches you in the face. Or both.

 

[DarkFlame]

Learn the matchup and don't just mindlessly rush in.

Thing is, I do not like to rush in, but then I find that when I try to plan it out, everything works out for my friend, who certainly does just rush in mindlessly! Irony! But I don't really know any styles that I'm good at that are good against Bowser. Can you give me a few characters? I usually play as Squirtle, Roy, or sometimes Lucario. I just really like their styles.

 

[DarkFlame]

For extra effectiveness, try Ganon and Flame Choke.

Just don't be surprised when he quits Smash, or punches you in the face. Or both.

Unfortunately, I don't use the big burly guys much, I just find them a tad too slow for my liking, but as usual, I still like how you put that! XD

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Roy filets Bowser on his sword for breakfast. I think I'm exaggerating, but only slightly.

Keep your spacing in mind. Nair and fair are great tools, Roy's grab range is A++ and he has decent if not Marth-like follow-ups. His FSmash and BAir also kill much better at high percents than Marth could ever hope to, and you could stand in the middle of the stage spamming F-Tilt all day and still beat a Bowser that doesn't space properly. But most importantly, grab. Shield dash attack and grab. Spotdodge and grab. Down-throw into a SideSmash. Upthrow into nair or Uair. Fthrow into Nair or Fair. Get him into the sky, watch out for dair or nair combo breakers, space smartly and you'll be comboing him for days.

Also remember that Bowser offstage is a very vulnerable and usually very dead character. His Up-B has ridiculous priority and the trick is knowing which of your moves beats it out to effectively toast him. With Roy I find taking a flying leap offstafe with a Neutral B and screaming "WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW" seals the deal against the Whirling Fortress of Doom. I think the yell is optional.

 

[Mera Mera]

Thing is, I do not like to rush in, but then I find that when I try to plan it out, everything works out for my friend, who certainly does just rush in mindlessly! Irony! But I don't really know any styles that I'm good at that are good against Bowser. Can you give me a few characters? I usually play as Squirtle, Roy, or sometimes Lucario. I just really like their styles.

I will say, planning on doing something ahead of time is a bad idea, and rushing down mindlessly is a bad idea. Having an idea of what your safe options are is not the same thing as committing to said plan prematurely. You want to know your options (and his) and react to anything he commits to as well as take advantage if he lets you get a little too close.

And to give you an idea of what your safe options are, pretend that he does the perfect response to your attack. What happens? If his perfect response would put you in a bad position (e.g. you lose being closer to center stage or you are above him), or if he can hit/grab you to punish, then you didn't attack safely. either space your aerials so you hit when you're landing and at a distance that's outside of his Out of Shield (OoS) options, or hit the shield late and follow up with low start and end lag ground moves like jab combo's and maybe mix in a grab attempt.
Note: unless maybe you're Jiggs or Wario, hitting people in the air when you're not near the ground to L cancel it asap, is probably not safe. Another exception would be multi-hits, only because you could continue to apply pressure until you land (assuming you land around when it ends or before).

Also Bowser sucks at approaching, so if you force him to approach via a projectile, and then you just get ready to react and punish (probably by shield grabbing most of the time), then he'll have a really hard time.

Bowser is only hard in that if you don't take him seriously, even for a brief moment, you can take massive damage or lose a stock. But if you always respect his options, it'll be damn near impossible for him to hit you.

Also Lordling's advice was good. The only thing he got wrong was that the yell is not optional. The yell will crush his spirit, allowing you to take two stocks with one strike.

 

[Frost | Odds]

The yell is not optional.

 

[DarkFlame]

Roy filets Bowser on his sword for breakfast. I think I'm exaggerating, but only slightly.

Keep your spacing in mind. Nair and fair are great tools, Roy's grab range is A++ and he has decent if not Marth-like follow-ups. His FSmash and BAir also kill much better at high percents than Marth could ever hope to, and you could stand in the middle of the stage spamming F-Tilt all day and still beat a Bowser that doesn't space properly. But most importantly, grab. Shield dash attack and grab. Spotdodge and grab. Down-throw into a SideSmash. Upthrow into nair or Uair. Fthrow into Nair or Fair. Get him into the sky, watch out for dair or nair combo breakers, space smartly and you'll be comboing him for days.

Also remember that Bowser offstage is a very vulnerable and usually very dead character. His Up-B has ridiculous priority and the trick is knowing which of your moves beats it out to effectively toast him. With Roy I find taking a flying leap offstafe with a Neutral B and screaming "WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW" seals the deal against the Whirling Fortress of Doom. I think the yell is optional.

As usual, perfectly worded, absolutely hilarious, but still nice advice. I will TRY to remember all of this in time for whenever the crap I can get back to my friend's place. Snowing and freezing, Joel, snowing and freezing... -_-

 

[DarkFlame]

The yell is not optional.

XD That made my day!

 

[DarkFlame]

I will say, planning on doing something ahead of time is a bad idea, and rushing down mindlessly is a bad idea. Having an idea of what your safe options are is not the same thing as committing to said plan prematurely. You want to know your options (and his) and react to anything he commits to as well as take advantage if he lets you get a little too close.

And to give you an idea of what your safe options are, pretend that he does the perfect response to your attack. What happens? If his perfect response would put you in a bad position (e.g. you lose being closer to center stage or you are above him), or if he can hit/grab you to punish, then you didn't attack safely. either space your aerials so you hit when you're landing and at a distance that's outside of his Out of Shield (OoS) options, or hit the shield late and follow up with low start and end lag ground moves like jab combo's and maybe mix in a grab attempt.
Note: unless maybe you're Jiggs or Wario, hitting people in the air when you're not near the ground to L cancel it asap, is probably not safe. Another exception would be multi-hits, only because you could continue to apply pressure until you land (assuming you land around when it ends or before).

Also Bowser sucks at approaching, so if you force him to approach via a projectile, and then you just get ready to react and punish (probably by shield grabbing most of the time), then he'll have a really hard time.

Bowser is only hard in that if you don't take him seriously, even for a brief moment, you can take massive damage or lose a stock. But if you always respect his options, it'll be damn near impossible for him to hit you.

Also Lordling's advice was good. The only thing he got wrong was that the yell is not optional. The yell will crush his spirit, allowing you to take two stocks with one strike.

Well, I never play as Jigglypuff or Wario, heck, neither me nor my friend like Wario, anyway! We always play against him during our matches. XD

So, yeah, my main would probably be Roy, maybe Lucario after some training, and secondary being Squirtle, maybe Charizard, 'cause he's pretty fun, too. Mostly, I play as the balanced-speed characters like Lucario or the kinda fast but still pretty strong Roy. Besides, I LOVE his FS! That is just epic! Lucario's chain-on-hit and super move style is not really something I'm good at, but it is still fun to use, something that I certainly wish I was better with, and basically the only advanced move I do is a dash-dance. I don't really know why I dash-dance a lot, but, yeah.

 

[Fortress]

Hi, Bowser, my name is shield grabbing.

 

[dRevan64]

grab
use the gun

 

[DarkFlame]

Hi, Bowser, my name is shield grabbing.

Nice! XD

 

[Chaos_Blasta]

*opens thread*
*scrolls to bottom*

yes

 

[DarkFlame]

*opens thread*
*scrolls to bottom*

yes

I'm glad you enjoyed reading through this!