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Additions to the Character Moveset

Parasol

Smash Cadet
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I apologize if a thread for this already exists; I did try searching.

Do you expect to see any additions to the character moveset in the upcoming Smash Bros.? So far we can observe the following pattern: +1 special attack per new game. (Melee came with the side-special, and Brawl came with the Final Smash.) Do you anticipate another addition, multiple additions, or none at all? Would you want these additions? What about adding on more standard attacks?

Possibilities:
  • Dash Special
  • Backward Special
  • Throw Special
  • Glide Special

Discuss! (Meh.)
 

Big-Cat

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There are lots of possibilities really. It depends on how much they want to expand the combat.

I personally want to see the chain attacks you see in fighting games. Everyone would still have same basic format for their moveset, but you add these chains and command normals AROUND the moveset. We already have something like this with Marth's Sword Dance and especially the Links' FSmash.

I strongly believe that the addition of these kinds of moves would allow for a larger diversity and even allow them to add/remove/replace moves for the sake of balance.
 

Pichu4SSB4

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I'd love to see areal smash attacks being implemented into the mechanic. Performing them might over prioritize regular areals because of the fact that players usually tap the analog stick to perform them.

One thing i had in mind is the input required to do areal smashes is the second analog stick, Wii U Pro controller or the GamePad. I assume the second analog stick those controllers have will act similar to the C-Stick from the GCN controller. Now as for the Wiimote, double tapping the D-Pad would be the most reasonable way to perform areal smashes. Just like how it works with dashing.
 

Alianjaro

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These are the things I want to see in the next Smash Bros.
1. Three Final Smashes
2. Air Grab? (for a VERY short split second)
3. As KumaOso said, more combos
4. 4th taunt (we all love em!)
5. As an alternative to Final Smash, there would be rage mode

Lookin good eh?
 

Big-Cat

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Rage mode would be interesting, especially if it works like Tekken Tag where you only have it for a period of time so that it's not like SF4's Ultras which can be used whenever once you've fulfilled the initial conditions.

That being said, I'd rather they go the route of supers (perhaps called Super Smashes) as an alternative and turn the Final Smash into a Fatality type move, meaning it's a flashy last life kill that you don't necessarily need to win - just something extra.
 

Baskerville

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Reverse Zairs
Cancelable Moves
Chaining Tilt attacks

This is just from the top of my head
 

Ove

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Super combos: similar to those in SF4.
Tilt links: similar to the links in SF4. That encourages learning your character to the fullest and adds a deeper gameplay.

Now when I think about it, how are links going to work? When the opponents damage racks up, so does the knockback. That means links will be limited by percentage. Super combos should be in, nevertheless!
 

Big-Cat

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One thing would be to have moves that are % independent as a property.
 

Vkrm

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If you grab some one holding an item (links bombs, peaches' turnips) you ought to be able to steal said item before throwing the poor sod. Then use it on em.

:phone:
 

SmashShadow

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Special alternative attacks: Moves where if you press B and A you do a different attack than just when you press B.
 

Big-Cat

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Special alternative attacks: Moves where if you press B and A you do a different attack than just when you press B.
This reminds me of something I was thinking of last night. Virtua Fighter has only three buttons: Punch (P), Kick (K), and Grab (G) and your attacks are directions and button presses like P, K, P+K, P+G(Grabs), K+G, and P+K+G (seemingly stance shifts).

What if Smash Bros. did something similar with ATK 1, ATK 2, Special, Shield, and Jump? These could correspond with:

A: ATK 1
B: Special
X: ATK 2
Y: Jump
 

Ember Reaper

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I like the A+B attacks, the dash special grab in mid air, and grab item steal. Just after skimming this
 

Vkrm

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Do you have a reason think that sakurai is aware of how bad tripping is? I Haven't seen any interviews where he directly says, "tripping is dumb and I mucked up, sorry y'all." FYI that's definitely how he would say it

:phone:
 

PsychoIncarnate

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I'm up for attacks that chain unless they are like Killer Instinct combos where you just sit there while the opponent pummels you helplessly
 

Johnknight1

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If too many attacks are added, it will cut the roster size down.

Really, the only things I would add for now would be:
-Give everyone a Z-air (instead of for only a few characters).
-Add a 4th taunt (herpa derpa obvious).
-Kill random tripping (tripping as a direct result to an attack or getting hit by particular objects can stay).
-(I don't see this for several games down the road, but) a 5th special (back special).
 

JOE!

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Here's my little list, copy/pasted from my most recent MYM project:


SMASH 4 CHANGES:

This being in SSB4 General and all, I feel as if I should point out that Ace Trainer JOE! will be incorporating some features I'd like to see in the next installment to the Smash series, such as the universal removal of random tripping :mad:. Some moves will still cause tripping to create a sort of "prone" status to abuse, however.

SUPER SMASHES: :bbutton:+:abutton:

In Brawl, when you broke the smashball you lost the use of your Neutral Special since that then activated your Final Smash. This is alleviated in SSB4 by mapping it to the simultaneous B+A input as well as introducing the Super Smash, a powerful but limited special move, to be used when you do not have a Final Smash handy.

Super Smashes are generally limited by either Ammunition (noted by a counter next to the character portrait, showing how many Armor Pieces ZSS can throw before she's used up her Super Smash), a Timer (Mario's FLUDD Spray/Hover Super Smash can only be used when a bar under his character Portrait is full, with each use draining it only to refill with time), or when a Special Condition is met (such as when Olimar has 3 or more Flower Pikmin, allowing him to perform his "Pikmin Carry" Command-Grab), but a few Super Smashes here and there are a combination of the 3 mentioned here and often vary in power depending on the amount of Ammo (lower ammo = higher power, dont waste it!), Time to recharge (longer recharge, better power) and the Condition that needs to be met (the harder/more situational, the better the reward).

As for Ace Trainer JOE!, each of his Pokemon have a Team Combo as their Super Smash, that both requires Team1 and Team2 to be within a character length of each other to perform (Solo Pokemon lack a Super Smash), as well as usually a timer or other effect between uses. Each different pair has their own unique Super Smash, mix and match Pokemon to see all 15!

DYNAMIC AIR-DODGE:

A compromise between Brawl and Melee, you may only air-dodge once but do not go into special fall afterwards unless you press a direction with it. Pressing :rtrigger: without :stick5: input will do a Brawl Air Dodge, following your momentum. Pressing :rtrigger: and :stick6: on the other hand will do a Directional Air Dodge, which stops any momentum you had prior as you shift mid-air, but also means you have to try and DI back to safety while in special fall. Due to Directional Air Dodge returning, Wavedashing/Wavelanding also comes back via :xbutton:+:rtrigger:+:stick1:/:stick3: close to the ground, allowing for precise spacing while moving between platforms or simply while in combat on the ground. Remember, while only a few characters -really- benefit from Wavedashing, Wavelanding is a handy technique on most stages for proper spacing and evasion.

SMOOTH LANDING:

While most Aerial moves Auto-Cancel when you land with them, some come with landing lag that can range from mild heavily punishable. This is alleviated in Smash4 with the ability to Lag Cancel Aerials by pressing a :ltrigger:/:rtrigger: during the landing lag of a move. Depending on when you press the input, you can reduce the landing lag by 1/4th or even 1/2 the normal time! This makes heavier moves a bit less risky to perform close to the ground when you finally master the timing and spacing for the cancel, and faster moves a tad less overwhelming as it'll be much harder to get their 1/2 lag sweet-spot.

HIT-STUN CANCEL THRESHOLD:

In Brawl, you could cancel hit-stun very early by pretty much any action, where in Melee you couldn't really cancel it until the stun was over (and don't even mention 64's crazy hit-stun). Smash4 introduces a threshold to cancel hit-stun once you are hit hard enough to start leaving a smoke trail as you fly through the air, you can cancel the stun with any action. There is a bit of a catch, however: the harder you are hit/higher %, the harder it is to cancel the stun, acting like escaping a grab in some ways in how you have to mash the input you want to cancel with slightly to escape before it's too late. The new threshold both allows for offensive comboing to take place at low-mid% without it being easily interrupted as in Brawl, as well as survival to be a bit easier once flung off-stage at higher% (with skill) than it was in Melee. On the topic of survival, it should be mentioned that fall-speed in Smash4 is much like 64 in that it is between Melee and Brawl, allowing for a bit more air fighting than melee, but keeping a bit faster pace than Brawl.

UNIVERSAL Z-AIR:

No longer limited to those with tethers, every character has access to a Z/Grab move once airborne. While there are no "throws" from the air, some characters do have a special throw of sorts instead of an attack (Such as Lucario doing a Grab-Only Force Palm that meteors opponents downwards, or Captain Falcon doing his UpB Grapple Attack with 1/2 the damage and Knockback, and no explosion or added movement), others can transition their Z-Air directly into their standard grab by holding on and pummeling the opponent as they fall back to the ground (Such as Diddy's Zair where he pummels the foe like with Side B until they either escape or touch ground), and others merely have an attack like Link or Samus for theirs. Unlike Link or Samus, non-tether Z-Airs do not extend the range of which you can grab an edge. It's a nice addition for most characters, but then again a lot of their Aerials are more reliable to land and/or more rewarding than their Z-Air, but you can always find a use for it with practice!

 

Johnknight1

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@ JOE! (well, only kinda sorta at JOE!; this is more inspired by JOE! than directed at him)
That reminds me of my idea (dating back to the pre-Brawl announcement days) that there should be two "super attacks" for each character. One is a transformation (think Bowser becoming Giga Bowser, Diddy Kong getting his jetpack and guns, ROB in his super gyro mode, and the Space Animal's Landmasters) and one is a super attack (think of Mario's super fireball, the Links Triforce slash, Captain Falcon's Blue Falcon, and Marth's Critical Hit).

So basically, all the Final Smashes would return, but each character would get another one on top of that. Mario could turn into Fire Mario (or another form), Link could turn into some super Triforce God mode, Toon Link could turn into Fiery Deity Link (YES!!!), Ganondorf could be a controllable Beast Ganon, the Space Animals could all summon a brigade of Wolfen/Arwings, ROB could fire a super laser, and Diddy Kong could rock out on his guitar!
 

Big-Cat

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I get the strong feeling that would end either ungodly good or horrifically bad.
 

Vintage Creep

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Final smashes can stay, but like half of them needs to be changed and balanced.
I mean Lucario... Why did they give him something THAT bad?

Also some of them have to change completely in my opinion. **** Giga Bowser, I want him on the Koopa Clown Car throwing bo-bombs and **** on people. Triforce slash? They can do better for one of the most iconic character of Nintendo's history. Negative Zone? Lol. Three Landmasters? Uberlol.

Playstation All-Stars did something right: the final system is interesting, and building up three levels of super seems fun. Obviously something similar would seem like copying, but who cares they did it first.

Also, obviously, NO MORE RANDOM TRIPPING.

The aerial grab looks awesome, I want that. And real combos too. The gliding should be done better.
Also, I didn't like the meteor jump that much. I mean for some characters like Mario, jumping on people's heads it's OK, but not everyone if you ask me. It should be only for some restricted characters.
 

JOE!

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I get the strong feeling that would end either ungodly good or horrifically bad.
which is why I suggest final smashes remain an item-based thing, and have supers in the form of Super Smashes, which'd be like weaker, balanced, Final Smashes.
 

Big-Cat

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which is why I suggest final smashes remain an item-based thing, and have supers in the form of Super Smashes, which'd be like weaker, balanced, Final Smashes.
I was thinking of making the final smashes cinematic K.O.s, but your idea is about the same as mine.
 
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