1.1.0 Captain Falcon changes

[Ryukred]

Patch just came out like 10 minutes ago(from what I've seen). This is just a thread on what changes have been made on Falcon.

Bair got nerfed and now does 13% instead of 14%, late is still 8%.

 

[Space Stranger]

I haven't gotten the recent patch yet but I can give some percentages from 1.0.9 if needed.

 

[N7S]

Rumors are saying Falcon's Bair got nerfed from 14%-13%. Just rumors though.

 

[Ryukred]

Rumors are saying Falcon's Bair got nerfed from 14%-13%. Just rumors though.

Yeah, that's true, I tested it and it only did 13% ;_;

 

[LinkoHakurei]

First up air and now bair, what's up with these random nerfs? Does it have any new uses now with that 1% nerf?

 

[Marusero]

I just tested and can confirm that Bair does 13% now, sourspot 8%

 

[Levateinn]

i couldn't care less about individual % but I care extremely about knockback and hitstun, can anyone comment on these things in 1.1.0?


edit: this can actually be good as it adds a little more range to bair as a jab lock starter. but again as long as the kb and hitsun isnt screwed over.
edit2 Knockback significantly reduced. hitstun seems the same so maybe comboing is slightly improved but man....Dthrow>RAR used to KO at the edge at like 65% ....now its 83% and it barely combos.

Also jablocks could be started at 19% with a bair now its at 22% before (dark pit in this case) can enter freefall. This lock caps out at 23%, after that F-tilts dont lock..hoop-de-doo a whonder full 2% window.

Hitstun appears unchanged atm, but its not like B-air did much with knees or stomps without a Frame cancel anyways..so the kb nerf doesnt seem to help much here.

 

[Silvalfo]

Bair was our best kill move, by far. However, it was already unsafe on shield against characters like Little Mac, now the reduced damage implies reduced shield stun and makes it even less safe.

Also damage is directly related to knockback according to the KB formula, so our only kill move which doesn't rely on relatively hard reads has been nerfed.

Falcon wasn't even good to begin with. In how many major tournaments have Falcons been getting top 8, let alone winning? And yet he's getting repeatedly nerfed.

I'm salty as hell. As in desperately salty.

Anyway, this is Falcon's changelog:
http://opensa.dantarion.com/s4/raw/diff-128-144/captain.html

The only change I can identify is his bair damage nerf, all others are gibberish to my eyes.

 

[Levateinn]

Also damage is directly related to knockback according to the KB formula, so our only kill move which doesn't rely on relatively hard reads has been nerfed.


...salty...

huh, well I guess I will take the middle route and care moderatley about both.(on a serious note I wasn't aware thats how the KB was calculated, learnsomethingnew)

also, yes indeed, salt

Spoiler: wait a sec

do you mean damage a character has already taken or damage that the move applies affects the knockback?

if its the former well yea I knew that but if its the latter then I didn't

 

[Barhos]

I could be completely slow and maybe I just didn't notice this before, but down throw to knee at around 70 (Lucina) is extremely easy to land a true combo on. No DI applied as I'm doing this in training but worth a look

Perhaps there is more hitsun on down throw now?

 

[Sunnysunny]

Spoiler: wait a sec

do you mean damage a character has already taken or damage that the move applies affects the knockback?

if its the former well yea I knew that but if its the latter then I didn't

Heyyya. Just dropping by to say yup, the damage of a move affects the knockback formula of said move. I don't know the exact formula but it does **** with shield stun and knockback oddly enough.

Apologies.
Not a cap main, but I came to stare in bewilderment at the fact that falcon got randomly nerfed again.
Seriously wtf?

 

[Silvalfo]

Spoiler: wait a sec

do you mean damage a character has already taken or damage that the move applies affects the knockback?

if its the former well yea I knew that but if its the latter then I didn't

The latter is true.

Edit: Sunnysunny just said that as I was typing, k den.

 

[Barhos]

Update: ignore what I said. Seems to only work on Lucina. Not sure why though. Too good to be true

 

[drogoth232]

I have a good background in brawl modding so I can read the code to some degree, here's the changes that are on Dantarion's mastercore. Just giving general stuff, nothing specific until I get more time.

Rapid Jab: Has less KB? Can't really tell
055: No idea what it is in hex. It corresponds to brawl's down tilt, but the damage doesn't make sense. It has some values at the end got reduced, but I have no idea what it is
effect: a value got reduced, but don't know what it is
Back air: Has 1% less damage on all hitboxes.

You guys can choose to believe me or not, but I implore you guys to check out my background in brawl coding both on Smashboards and KCMM.

 

[Silvalfo]

Rapid Jab finisher got a range nerf.

 

[drogoth232]

I have a good background in brawl modding so I can read the code to some degree, here's the changes that are on Dantarion's mastercore. Just giving general stuff, nothing specific until I get more time.

Rapid Jab: Has less KB? Can't really tell
055: No idea what it is in hex. It corresponds to brawl's down tilt, but the damage doesn't make sense. It has some values at the end got reduced, but I have no idea what it is
effect: a value got reduced, but don't know what it is
Back air: Has 1% less damage on all hitboxes.

You guys can choose to believe me or not, but I implore you guys to check out my background in brawl coding both on Smashboards and KCMM.

Went back and checked 055. Just realized that rapid jab was 054 so logically 055 would be the finisher. It has reduced range by 4 units in z along with possibly having its' gfx moved as a result (what the effect value is, I'm still not sure what it is for).

 

[TheSausXL]

I can confirm that bair knockback was nerfed decently. Pre-patch, it killed Robin at 128 percent in the middle of FD with no rage. Post-patch it killed Robin at 138 under the same conditions. I really don't think this is something to worry about, it's only a minor nerf.

 

[TheGreatBrawler]

Nerfing Falcon instead of Sheik or Luigi? That seems illogical to me... I'm not asking for anyone to be nerfed but if Falcon is going to be nerfed then characters like those two need to be nerfed too. I main Luigi but I believe he needs nerf not buffs. Now Falcon's back air knockback got reduced... Would have been fine if it was just damage. Now I'm going to have harder time.

 

[Lionman]

Falcon is the new Irelia

 

[TheGreatBrawler]

Falcon is the new Irelia

More like Greninja

 

[LinkoHakurei]

Nerfing Falcon instead of Sheik or Luigi? That seems illogical to me... I'm not asking for anyone to be nerfed but if Falcon is going to be nerfed then characters like those two need to be nerfed too. I main Luigi but I believe he needs nerf not buffs. Now Falcon's back air knockback got reduced... Would have been fine if it was just damage. Now I'm going to have harder time.

Actually those 2 DID get a nerf so...

 

[TheGreatBrawler]

Actually those 2 DID get a nerf so...

Did they really? Maybe it wasn't major

 

[DynaStyl3]

Did Bair always combo into u-air at mid percents? Because it seems to combo now on mid-high weights.

 

[Great Apple]

Remember how Falcon and his opponent would both slide off the stage if he dash grabbed and pummeled?

It's back.

 

[teluoborg]

Remember how Falcon and his opponent would both slide off the stage if he dash grabbed and pummeled?

It's back.

Just tested it and I can confirm, what the hell samurai. This probably has other implications for other characters, I remember Yoshi not being able to slide off with his up B in 1.0.8

 

[Devil G.]

I knew they would nerf the Captain again. I knew it. I didn't complain much about his previous nerfs but come on, this wasn't even remotely necessary :I

 

[teluoborg]

It's just 1% on Bair, meaning it'll probably kill 5% than normal. It's no big deal really

 

[Levateinn]

the fact that its roughly .92 times as good as it used to be is a pretty crappy thing. This means that a lot of things that used to KO reliably will do so 1.08 times later.

It may not seem like much, but bassically the bair won't KO 1/10 times that the edge guard would have succeded in the past. Meaning in whole that to be just as succesful, we got to put in 10% more work each stock(if we are looking to end with a Bair)

so it is a decent deal at the very least.

 

[Silvalfo]

Not to mention bair is less safe on shield now, which is a pretty big deal.

 

[TheSausXL]

Not to mention bair is less safe on shield now, which is a pretty big deal.

This too. I really don't know what's with all the C.Falcon nerfs when there are other characters that need it more...

 

[Ryukred]

Remember how Falcon and his opponent would both slide off the stage if he dash grabbed and pummeled?

It's back.

That's better than just grabbing someone at the edge and them not receiving the pummel damage.

 

[King Omega]

Has it always been possible to cancel the landing lag from down-air off the edge of a platform?

 

[Captain Farukon]

Bair was our best kill move, by far. However, it was already unsafe on shield against characters like Little Mac, now the reduced damage implies reduced shield stun and makes it even less safe.

Also damage is directly related to knockback according to the KB formula, so our only kill move which doesn't rely on relatively hard reads has been nerfed.

Falcon wasn't even good to begin with. In how many major tournaments have Falcons been getting top 8, let alone winning? And yet he's getting repeatedly nerfed.

I'm salty as hell. As in desperately salty.

Anyway, this is Falcon's changelog:
http://opensa.dantarion.com/s4/raw/diff-128-144/captain.html

The only change I can identify is his bair damage nerf, all others are gibberish to my eyes.

I know right? ****ing sakurai and his team dont even know how to proper balance a fighting game i am sick of watching Falcon getting nerfed time and time again, im gonna sell the ****ing game and buy something for the ps4...o rather use the money for Street fighter 5

 

[TheGreatBrawler]

I know right? ****ing sakurai and his team dont even know how to proper balance a fighting game i am sick of watching Falcon getting nerfed time and time again, im gonna sell the ****ing game and buy something for the ps4...o rather use the money for Street fighter 5

Well he only got nerfed once... His up air change was more of a buff in my opinion.

 

[Captain Farukon]

Well he only got nerfed once... His up air change was more of a buff in my opinion.

you r kidding right ? i used to kill a lot with the U air and they nerfed it that was some plain bull**** but this is unnaceptable , the game has no balance or respect for an already hard to master character, Nintendo and sakurai dont know how to do a proper fighting game and im sick of it , not gonna keep watching how they keep making my fvorite character ****ier and ****tier every "balance patch"

 

[apparently fuz]

you r kidding right ? i used to kill a lot with the U air and they nerfed it that was some plain bull**** but this is unnaceptable , the game has no balance or respect for an already hard to master character, Nintendo and sakurai dont know how to do a proper fighting game and im sick of it , not gonna keep watching how they keep making my fvorite character ****ier and ****tier every "balance patch"

So you're saying that Sakurai his team don't know how to "do a proper fighting game" because they nerfed your main?
Sure, the nerf wasn't warranted at all, but they have made some positive improvements to some characters, such as Kirby, Ike, Marth etc.
They didn't even nerf u-air, it was changed so that in return, it could combo much more effectively, prolonging strings and setups into knee.
You're seriously overreacting. Hell, you're not even a position to complain about how 'bad' your character is when characters like Samus exist, who hasn't even been touched in this patch.
If your character gets changed, then you have to swallow it up, and make an effort to adapt to what is new. Not whine continuously, and creating unnecessary threads like you did yesterday. Grow up.

 

[Captain Farukon]

So you're saying that Sakurai his team don't know how to "do a proper fighting game" because they nerfed your main?
Sure, the nerf wasn't warranted at all, but they have made some positive improvements to some characters, such as Kirby, Ike, Marth etc.
They didn't even nerf u-air, it was changed so that in return, it could combo much more effectively, prolonging strings and setups into knee.
You're seriously overreacting. Hell, you're not even a position to complain about how 'bad' your character is when characters like Samus exist, who hasn't even been touched in this patch.
If your character gets changed, then you have to swallow it up, and make an effort to adapt to what is new. Not whine continuously, and creating unnecessary threads like you did yesterday. Grow up.

i dont care about what they add to other characters, Captain Falcon was perfect before, he `s already the hardest character to master and his recovery and lack of projectiles makes hard to approach but he had power and speed, now he`s lacking more and more power im going to put an example just to shut you up...in Street fighter IV and every revision of that game Akuma has incredible juggles, priority, moves for every situation but he has low health and reduced stun , thats a good balance , you just dont keep nerfing a character because you are too dumb to think how to make other characters keep up with him
Why would i have to "adapt" to this kind of crap? hahaha no thank you i had enough of sakurai and this game, this is not a real fighting game is more like a damn prototype that keeps changing irrationally , remember the Vectoring??? hahaha i do
You are just a noob a blind fanboy defending that idiot and his crappy designs

 

[Fandangox]

he `s already the hardest character to master

What. Lots of characters are a lot harder to master than Falcon. Shulk, Duck Hunt Duck, Samus, Olimar, Bowser, Mewtwo, I could go on.

True mastery of any smash 4 character is hard (unless you are sonic kappa) but I don't think Captain Falcon is the hardest.

 

[Captain Farukon]

What. Lots of characters are a lot harder to master than Falcon. Shulk, Duck Hunt Duck, Samus, Olimar, Bowser, Mewtwo, I could go on.

True mastery of any smash 4 character is hard (unless you are sonic kappa) but I don't think Captain Falcon is the hardest.

Falcon is the hardest most people will agree on that even ZeRo said it....

 

[Swagmaster]

I didn't realize the update needed him so much. Maybe that's why I've been losing a lot lately. He doesn't need to be nerfed! What he needs is a Falcon Punch buff!