As a rule, I generally don't like to have discussions with people who end their counterpoints with "lmao" or some type of variant. It's just a way of being condescending while trying to demean the other participant. All it actually does is make the user look bad when you're failing to fully see the argument I'm presenting.
Apologies. i like to express myself, you dont have to interpret it as condescending because it's only intended to be playful. attaching music to my posts was made in the same vein
I know that you're specifically talking about DJC. I'm saying that you can use short hop>AC aerials to supplement that component of the game.
sh dair is the only thing that would change and doesn't cover any more options that sh fair/nair would unless the opponent is CCing
I watched your videos. What I see is a significant degree of inexperienced play. Why are these people jumping OoS at you when you very obviously dair above them? When your opponent option selects poorly, it doesn't make the move good.
that's not the purpose of the video. its to show the movement possible, and i said dair isnt good in melee. i said 20 frames is unrealistic. if you can only focus on the skill level of an old video then go ahead. my skill shouldnt be in question here, and if it is im happy to refer to reputable people i've played against and performed at an "acceptable" level.
You're saying that Ness can tech chase if you "press dair earlier if the start up is increased lmao." This gives your opponent a lot more time to react to the position that you put yourself in.
you also have more time to drift control and change the position before committing to a direction, which i've also addressed, and this gives you an option that seemingly gives the opponent time to react to but in reality its just as much as a read as if they were expecting the current dair anyway. the only information they get is that you're going to use dair. with <15 frame startup its not reactable anyway.
Remember, good players don't necessarily need to react to the move, only the position (hence why full hop is countered by run up shield, because all landing options are covered).
no, not all landing options are covered by a run up shield. especially when you can use magnet to alter momentum before a DJC from which you can alter momentum again and retreating fair/dair, FF nair, wavebounce PKF, anything really.
By leaving dair alone, your tech coverage options have more built in mix up potential. I'd rather this than careening above my opponent where I have less access to my options.
dair as it is only limits ness' movement and tech coverage when compared to the proposed version, since fair/nair/uair/bair/mag can be used to cover anything that dair would normally cover.
Yes, you're right that the hitbox would be in different places based on the static simulation that you proposed. You do have the maneuverability of DJC to work around this though. Plus, with your frame five dair that has fairly active hitboxes, you can place the move wherever you really choose. If you're having a problem with that, it says to me that you do not have adequate control over PM Ness' DJC mechanic.
never said i had a problem with it. i've only said that the change allows ness to access more DJC movement which is currently not possible. wow
Regardless of how you're trying to justify this, it is still an objective nerf. You're not buffing his neutral game. Any good player would swat you out of the start up of that dair. You, as you stated, are nerfing his punish game. It's a nerf all around. I did read you post, and consider it, and yes, I dismissed it, because it is misinformed.
incredible. the evidence is there as to why its useful and why it buffs neutral game. the references to good players just assumes im not aware of high level play, nor capable of it. but does that even matter. pretending if i was aware of it, i dont see how my points become any more legitimate anyway because i've addressed and shown im aware of the pros and cons.
It's great that you feel qualified to speak on how melee Ness operates in the melee environment. I encourage you to continue to explore that. However, this is not melee Ness, and the tools that may work for you there do not necessarily translate and work here, especially when better options are available.
you're right, the characters are in
no way comparable to each other. ness' aerials and djc in pm are
literally alien compared to melee. it seems you really dont want to even dicuss this because you're just questioning and condescending me at this point and the contention is being ignored, when i've tried to address all of your counterpoints with responses detailing potential option coverage, movement, what aspects are lost/buffed, how it effects the mixup game of ness in the air while nerfing punish game, etc. but yeah, feels like this is all pretty pointless so last post i promise. sorry that you think i've never been exposed to a good player and practiced what im preaching, even though i dont see how it's neccessary - only supportive.
