Theory on yet unrevealed characters and the WiiU/Future Unannounced DLC Discussion

[Joeyd123]

You can't remove it. Otherwise they're no placeholder for the data to go onto. You can only encrypt it hard, but we're going to hack the whole game, so I highly doubt it's possible to encrypt it well enough. Nothing will be hidden from us.

But could they add a placeholder via an update?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

But could they add a placeholder via an update?

As I said earlier, yes. But it's not in the hard copy that we have found, so unless we do, we can kiss that theory good bye.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

The game is being data mined?

Can anyone fill me in on what's been found so far?

 

[Ganonthegreat]

This whole idea has pretty much been busted now, we've seen the hidden data and there is nothing. In order for characters to be "transferable" they would have to be on the cartridge.

What I do believe is possible however, is for the Wii U version to unlock a DLC download on the eShop. Maybe also to make it fair they could let the player pay a small fee for the characters if they don't have a Wii U. Alternatively the DLC pack could be time locked for people without the Wii U version, then be available for free.

Of course this is just speculation of what could be possible. I think we'll see extra characters but it's mainly for me about how they will be distributed and when.

 

[MajorMajora]

Congradulations, HyperFalcon, you've successfully proven no new characters are on the hard copy. The point I made in the OP, though, was simply about new characters being added. Through what method I saw no real indication.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Congradulations, HyperFalcon, you've successfully proven no new characters are on the hard copy. The point I made in the OP, though, was simply about new characters being added. Through what method I saw no real indication.

Well, yeah. One theory is probably dead. I never said the other isn't. But it practically kills one leak, heh.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Alright guys, the Data Transfer theory is not possible.

You see, we've seen the full victory theme list. It had all unique ID numbers. Every character will be there, including those who would be locked on-disc. Fighter data would never show anything different.(if it does, it'll be let known here) That encryption theory is not possible either. Everything was encrypted, and they decrypted it to get all of this information.

It's DLC or none now. Besides conflicting new data dumps.

You realize patches add more stuff not seen in the data files right?

It adds more stuff to the file so more themes would be added to the data if a patch came in

Also known as updates.

In other words yes that is everything in it but when patches also known as updates additional stuff gets added

For example in burnout paradise for the ps3 would you find the big surf island data before that update even appeared

 

[CapnMuffin]

Hmm. Not sure how "important" not having a Ridley trophy is without context...

What Metroid trophies ARE there?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Dude do you even know how patches work?

It adds more stuff to the file so more themes would be added to the data if a patch came in

Also known as updates.

In other words yes that is everything in it but when patches also known as updates additional stuff gets added

Try again my man

Oh, wow. Did you fail to read a thing I said?

That leak did not mention a patch first. So it's irrelevant. It presumes straight out the data transfer does it, but there is no placeholders for the data to go to. It's fake or they got ahold of the Wii U data and it has more than the 3DS. Either, or.

Until a patch is downloaded(which I mentioned was possible myself, if you tried to read better, you'd know this), we can't have this as an option. I acknowledged that factor a long time ago. Meaning that it's patch or nothing.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Oh, wow. Did you fail to read a thing I said?

That leak did not mention a patch first. So it's irrelevant. It presumes straight out the data transfer does it, but there is no placeholders for the data to go to. It's fake or they got ahold of the Wii U data and it has more than the 3DS. Either, or.

Until a patch is downloaded(which I mentioned was possible myself, if you tried to read better, you'd know this), we can't have this as an option. I acknowledged that factor a long time ago. Meaning that it's patch or nothing.

Ooooooooh ok sorry about that.

Diden't catch that.

But yes i read your comment to a T

I thought you mean't because we found nothing of the 4 mystery characters not in the file a patch cannot add stuff

Does that make sense of what i thought?

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Oh, wow. Did you fail to read a thing I said?

That leak did not mention a patch first. So it's irrelevant. It presumes straight out the data transfer does it, but there is no placeholders for the data to go to. It's fake or they got ahold of the Wii U data and it has more than the 3DS. Either, or.

Until a patch is downloaded(which I mentioned was possible myself, if you tried to read better, you'd know this), we can't have this as an option. I acknowledged that factor a long time ago. Meaning that it's patch or nothing.

Why couldn't the update from the Wii U version create the placeholders or a place to put the characters in general? Link the Wii U to 3DS version, it updates and creates the placeholders, then adds the characters. I don't see why this is impossible.

 

[Ganonthegreat]

Okay this is something for the data miners to check if they have the time. It's to support or deny Ridley as DLC.

Is it possible to see a list of all the animations each character possesses? If so is there an unused animation for being grabbed in the air? The Ridley shadow seemed to do this so I assume each character would need this animation. If it's possible to check the animation if it's found then it's worth collecting the Pikachu animation to compare to the shadow.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Ooooooooh ok sorry about that.

Diden't catch that.

But yes i read your comment to a T

I thought you mean't because we found nothing of the 4 mystery characters not in the file a patch cannot add stuff

Does that make sense of what i thought?

The Wii U transfer probably would not. A patch outside of it, yes. But that's all theory. It could very well add it. Maybe if there's a huge hole in the data or obviously a patch dlc adds the files.

I should've replied better earlier, though. I did snap at you. Apologies for that. Forgiven too, but yeah, my bad.

Why couldn't the update from the Wii U version create the placeholders or a place to put the characters in general? Link the Wii U to 3DS version, it updates and creates the placeholders, then adds the characters. I don't see why this is impossible.

There has to be a placeholder for the placeholders to be put into. Data Transfers are different from DLC. Although most DLC has placeholders too. It's strange. So I'm sure there is a spot in the data for any and all transfers, it's just not found. We have to have one for the current transfer to work, after all.

Okay this is something for the data miners to check if they have the time. It's to support or deny Ridley as DLC.

Is it possible to see a list of all the animations each character possesses? If so is there an unused animation for being grabbed in the air? The Ridley shadow seemed to do this so I assume each character would need this animation. If it's possible to check the animation if it's found then it's worth collecting the Pikachu animation to compare to the shadow.

We've seen all the Textures. There is zero for Ridley. DLC can blatantly add the textures, or the data transfer could, I guess. But note what I said above. It's an odd situation, so we can't do more than speculate right now. We don't have hard data to prove it completely wrong(but make it unlikely so far), just theories.

 

[Tumbleweed Tuner]

Have you guys examined Sneaky Spirits files yet? Strange that a Rhythm Heaven Fever foe appears in Smash Run.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Have you guys examined Sneaky Spirits files yet? Strange that a Rhythm Heaven Fever foe appears in Smash Run.

There is a Chorus Kids trophy. It has no series symbol.

Whether characters were planned or not, Sakurai did a damn good job of removing most of the holes. We've only found a "Nana! Popo!" cheer taunt file and that's it. But he made their cut no secret, so...

 

[Tumbleweed Tuner]

There is a Chorus Kids trophy. It has no series symbol.

Whether characters were planned or not, Sakurai did a damn good job of removing most of the holes. We've only found a "Nana! Popo!" cheer taunt file and that's it. But he made their cut no secret, so...

So the thread where people thought they heard the cheering is true?

I know about the Trophy, but was wondering if the Sneaky Spirit file had some sort of wording like "Matt's Enemy" or anything like it.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So the thread where people thought they heard the cheering is true?

I know about the Trophy, but was wondering if the Sneaky Spirit file had some sort of wording like "Matt's Enemy" or anything like it.

Yes. To clarify, the first video posted was horrid. The second one was very clear.

Maybe. I didn't look at those files and there's only a Chorus Kids trophy alone. I don't know. I never linked the full trophies list, so...

 

[VenomSymbiote]

The Wii U transfer probably would not. A patch outside of it, yes. But that's all theory. It could very well add it. Maybe if there's a huge hole in the data or obviously a patch dlc adds the files.

I should've replied better earlier, though. I did snap at you. Apologies for that. Forgiven too, but yeah, my bad.


There has to be a placeholder for the placeholders to be put into. Data Transfers are different from DLC. Although most DLC has placeholders too. It's strange. So I'm sure there is a spot in the data for any and all transfers, it's just not found. We have to have one for the current transfer to work, after all.


We've seen all the Textures. There is zero for Ridley. DLC can blatantly add the textures, or the data transfer could, I guess. But note what I said above. It's an odd situation, so we can't do more than speculate right now. We don't have hard data to prove it completely wrong(but make it unlikely so far), just theories.

I'm sorry I keep going back to this but I just don't understand. Why is it impossible for the data transfer to act like it's DLC? If both games are programmed to act as if the transfer is dlc, or if the data being shared just straight up adds things that are not there, I don't see why it's at all different. I'm not trying to go around in circles with this, I just don't get why it has to be so different. One is downloading data from the internet, the other is "downloading" data from the Wii U version of Smash. Both are just taking data from one place and putting it somewhere else. Regardless of how it happens I don't see why it can't just be done via the Wii U. I mean it could just straight up be programmed to add it to the 3DS' SD card right?

Again I'm not trying to argue I just don't see why this is impossible. Like why can't the link up act as it's own version update to the game where it adds certain files that just don't exist there, placeholder or not?

As for the Nana and Popo cheer, couldn't that mean that they could still show up on the Wii U? They seemed to have been far enough along that they had cheering, and Sakurai stated they were working just fine on Wii U. From what I read about his Famitsu quote it seemed like he didn't outright deconfirm them for the Wii U, just the 3DS. Or am I mistaken?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'm sorry I keep going back to this but I just don't understand. Why is it impossible for the data transfer to act like it's DLC? If both games are programmed to act as if the transfer is dlc, or if the data being shared just straight up adds things that are not there, I don't see why it's at all different. I'm not trying to go around in circles with this, I just don't get why it has to be so different. One is downloading data from the internet, the other is "downloading" data from the Wii U version of Smash. Both are just taking data from one place and putting it somewhere else. Regardless of how it happens I don't see why it can't just be done via the Wii U. I mean it could just straight up be programmed to add it to the 3DS' SD card right?

Again I'm not trying to argue I just don't see why this is impossible. Like why can't the link up act as it's own version update to the game where it adds certain files that just don't exist there, placeholder or not?

Well, people who are more experienced in programming made it clear that you need to have a placeholder for Data Transfers to work.

I'd like to be wrong, but I dunno.

I don't believe it'll work, but I could be wrong. I don't think I can explain it any better. Since I can't explain it well enough(maybe I should ask my source to do so?), I'm the worst person to ask. Basically, I can't answer you, I might be wrong. Let's leave it at that.

 

[AbioFlesh]

Well, people who are more experienced in programming made it clear that you need to have a placeholder for Data Transfers to work.

I'd like to be wrong, but I dunno.

I don't believe it'll work, but I could be wrong. I don't think I can explain it any better. Since I can't explain it well enough(maybe I should ask my source to do so?), I'm the worst person to ask. Basically, I can't answer you, I might be wrong. Let's leave it at that.

I'm pretty sure place holders are installed onto the software before the actual downloading begins. I am assuming this because I have some Steam games installed, and when the game is about to update you can find the placeholder files.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'm pretty sure place holders are installed onto the software before the actual downloading begins. I am assuming this because I have some Steam games installed, and when the game is about to update you can find the placeholder files.

Interesting. Well, I guess we'll see what happens?

 

[VenomSymbiote]

I'm sorry I keep going back to this but I just don't understand. Why is it impossible for the data transfer to act like it's DLC? If both games are programmed to act as if the transfer is dlc, or if the data being shared just straight up adds things that are not there, I don't see why it's at all different. I'm not trying to go around in circles with this, I just don't get why it has to be so different. One is downloading data from the internet, the other is "downloading" data from the Wii U version of Smash. Both are just taking data from one place and putting it somewhere else. Regardless of how it happens I don't see why it can't just be done via the Wii U. I mean it could just straight up be programmed to add it to the 3DS' SD card right?

Again I'm not trying to argue I just don't see why this is impossible. Like why can't the link up act as it's own version update to the game where it adds certain files that just don't exist there, placeholder or not?

Well, people who are more experienced in programming made it clear that you need to have a placeholder for Data Transfers to work.

I'd like to be wrong, but I dunno.

I don't believe it'll work, but I could be wrong. I don't think I can explain it any better. Since I can't explain it well enough(maybe I should ask my source to do so?), I'm the worst person to ask. Basically, I can't answer you, I might be wrong. Let's leave it at that.

Ok, thanks man. I was starting to worry you'd think I was trying to be aggressive or something when really I seem to just be as confused as you haha. So I guess it boils down to maybe more characters! That's good enough for me! XD

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2gpoyh/images_of_interest_from_the_ssb3ds_rom/

Look at the character select icon section

Look at the green arrow and the yellow/gold arrow those are on the character select screen

I think im starting to smell dlc stuff for smash 4

 

[PeterJude]

http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2gpoyh/images_of_interest_from_the_ssb3ds_rom/

Look at the character select icon section

Look at the green arrow and the yellow/gold arrow those are on the character select screen

I think im starting to smell dlc stuff for smash 4

It does seem to suggest that they have, at some point at least, considered fitting more characters into the CSS. Whether that means they've planned it or not is another beast all together.

 

[XLIFE]

http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2gpoyh/images_of_interest_from_the_ssb3ds_rom/

Look at the character select icon section

Look at the green arrow and the yellow/gold arrow those are on the character select screen

I think im starting to smell dlc stuff for smash 4

Could've been a scrapped version of a smaller CSS, but if it were to incorporate DLC how would both arrows work? One to access DLC and one to go back? If so why are they different colors? And how does the all slot factor into all of this?

Edit: I just read on Reddit (Redundancy is redundant) that the yellow one was apparently linked to the SSS while the green one was to the CSS. Still think it was an earlier design choice tho.

 

[Weiro_O]

Would be great if any of these rumors are true, but if not, at least, like many have said, we have an excellent roster.

 

[Tumbleweed Tuner]

Would be great if any of these rumors are true, but if not, at least, like many have said, we have an excellent roster.

The most shocking thing, to me, that could happen is that Wii U gets no replacement mode or anything new to contrast from the current 3DS. I would sooner believe these arrows mean something epic.

 

[Weiro_O]

The most shocking thing, to me, that could happen is that Wii U gets no replacement mode or anything new to contrast from the current 3DS. I would sooner believe these arrows mean something epic.

That would be shocking and disappointing. I at least hope we get Tourney mode back since I used that mode a ton when friends were over.

 

[Ganonthegreat]

We've seen all the Textures. There is zero for Ridley. DLC can blatantly add the textures, or the data transfer could, I guess. But note what I said above. It's an odd situation, so we can't do more than speculate right now. We don't have hard data to prove it completely wrong(but make it unlikely so far), just theories.

Yeah, but the. Ridley character files can be added later as DLC. I was wondering if there was a specific animation for each character that looks like them being grabbed in the air. If there's an animation in there like that and it's not used anywhere else then that would be very good news for Ridley.

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Yeah, but the. Ridley character files can be added later as DLC. I was wondering if there was a specific animation for each character that looks like them being grabbed in the air. If there's an animation in there like that and it's not used anywhere else then that would be very good news for Ridley.

Well even if there isn't all the files needed for such a thing could be on the Wii U version ready to be added to the 3DS when linked, or as you said dlc. I don't think searching the files will mean much if there's some missing. Obviously if there's some there it could be good news, but things not being there don't exactly mean bad news either.

As stupid as it may be, deep down in the pit of my way too optimistic gut, I'm hoping they have a trailer before the Wii U release that shows off some characters that will launch initially with the Wii U version that will be added to the 3DS at some point later, and two of them being shown off being Ridley and Mewtwo. You gotta admit, it would generate more marketing buzz than if Nintendo tried to market the game without them at all.

 

[Ganonthegreat]

Well even if there isn't all the files needed for such a thing could be on the Wii U version ready to be added to the 3DS when linked, or as you said dlc. I don't think searching the files will mean much if there's some missing. Obviously if there's some there it could be good news, but things not being there don't exactly mean bad news either.

As stupid as it may be, deep down in the pit of my way too optimistic gut, I'm hoping they have a trailer before the Wii U release that shows off some characters that will launch initially with the Wii U version that will be added to the 3DS at some point later, and two of them being shown off being Ridley and Mewtwo. You gotta admit, it would generate more marketing buzz than if Nintendo tried to market the game without them at all.

A fair point, I was mainly looking at it to help Ridley rather than deny him. It's very much true the files could be added later, but it would be harder to add the animations to each character file. I know Brawl had one file for each character that contained all their animations (The fitmotion.pac files). So I'd imagine all the animations a character is ever going to have will be in a very similar single file.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Could've been a scrapped version of a smaller CSS, but if it were to incorporate DLC how would both arrows work? One to access DLC and one to go back? If so why are they different colors? And how does the all slot factor into all of this?

Edit: I just read on Reddit (Redundancy is redundant) that the yellow one was apparently linked to the SSS while the green one was to the CSS. Still think it was an earlier design choice tho.

Just a note the stage select has the arrows too

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Just a note the stage select has the arrows too

These arrows intrigue me. I'm guessing it's possible these arrows are used to scroll to another page of characters or even stages? If this is the case, perhaps linking the 3DS and Wii U version will fill up the 3DS versions 900mb of space the game sets aside to fill up with characters and stages?

Though I thought I read a rumor before that playable boss hazards would be highlighted in yellow or something, and that yellow arrow could be that. Hopefully this is not the case, as how the boss hazards work in this Smash I just don't think they'd be fun to play as at all.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

These arrows intrigue me. I'm guessing it's possible these arrows are used to scroll to another page of characters or even stages? If this is the case, perhaps linking the 3DS and Wii U version will fill up the 3DS versions 900mb of space the game sets aside to fill up with characters and stages?

Though I thought I read a rumor before that playable boss hazards would be highlighted in yellow or something, and that yellow arrow could be that. Hopefully this is not the case, as how the boss hazards work in this Smash I just don't think they'd be fun to play as at all.

For the CSS, imagine scrolling to another one while somebody is trying to choose their character. Not an issue in the 3DS version, but the Wii U is different. I think they could pull off a Mii Fighter icon with that CSS icon, where you choose your character in a list essentially.

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Oh I doubt they'd need to worry about that with the Wii U version. If the characters are there in the Wii U version already they'd be accounted for. I was more so talking about their use for the 3DS.

You're right though, down the road for the Wii U version they may go with the Mii Fighter way of selecting. That or just tweak and resize the css as need. Many possibilities.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Oh I doubt they'd need to worry about that with the Wii U version. If the characters are there in the Wii U version already they'd be accounted for. I was more so talking about their use for the 3DS.

You're right though, down the road for the Wii U version they may go with the Mii Fighter way of selecting. That or just tweak and resize the css as need. Many possibilities.

Indeed. Then again, I want a Mii Sorcerer. >_>

 

[MagnesD3]

Indeed. Then again, I want a Mii Sorcerer. >_>

As long as we got all the important characters that are missing is be totally down for Mii Sorcerer

 

[gameb0ybryan]

As long as we got all the important characters that are missing is be totally down for Mii Sorcerer

Like Isaac and Ray 01?

 

[MagnesD3]

Like Isaac and Ray 01?

Like Wolf, Mewtwo, Ridley, ice Climbers , Lucas, Dk Rep, Zelda Rep, and Snake.

The 2 you mentioned would be cool but are low priority.

 

[gameb0ybryan]

Like Wolf, Mewtwo, Ridley, ice Climbers , Lucas, Dk Rep, Zelda Rep, and Snake.

The 2 you mentioned would be cool but are low priority.

I know, twas satire haha