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Rate Their Chance Returns! Day 13 - Bowser Jr.

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Nu~

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Pac-Man

Likelihood: 85% sakurai was even interviewed by someone who wanted pac-man and sakurai asked him for ideas on pac-man

Want: 100% awesome character, I hate the overly popular Lloyd, has triple the amount of moveset potential that every one thinks he has, has as much history with Nintendo as megaman, and he's the first video game mascot (first Icon)
toon link: 20%
 

Toxicroaker

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By the way, for those that give ANY third party character anything over 50%, I really hope all of you choke on a chicken bone. You're really pushing the envelope if you're expect any non-Nintendo character to have a really high chance of showing up in Super Smash Bros.
ikr?
 

Nu~

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credit to :Rosalina suporter

Iv not seen any one do this yet so I thought id make a list of all the Pac-Man History that has been on the Nintendo Console.

Pac-Man 1984 Nintendo Entertainment System.

(Pac-Attack - 1993, Super Nintendo Entertainment System-1994 Game Boy,2008 Wii).

Pac-Man 2: The New Adventures 1994 – Super Nintendo Entertainment System).

Pac-In-Time – 1994 Super Nintendo Entertainment System.)

Pac-Man Fever 2002 – Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man World 2 2002 – Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man Vs. 2003 – Nintendo GameCube,2007 - Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World 2004 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac-Pix 2005 – Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man Pinball Advance 2005 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac 'n Roll 2005 – Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World 3 2005 – Nintendo GameCube,Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World Rally 2005 - Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man Party 2010 – Wii, Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures Wii U And 3DS Coming Soon Fall 2013.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pac-Man Collection 2001 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac-Man & Galaga Dimensions-2011 – Nintendo 3DS included are the original Pac-Man, Pac-Man Championship Edition, and Pac-Man Tilt (a game that's new to this compilation). The collection also includes three games in the Galaga series.
Namco Museum 64 1999 – Nintendo 64.)
Namco Museum: 50th Anniversary 2005 – GameCube, Game Boy Advance.)
Namco Museum Remix 2007 – Wii.)
Namco Museum DS 2007 – Nintendo DS.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Racing game's developed jointly by Namco and Nintendo,Includes Pac-Man, Ms. Pac-Man, and Blinky as playable characters.
Mario Kart Arcade GP 2005 – Arcade.)
Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 2007 – Arcade.)
Mario Kart Arcade GP DX 2013 – Arcade.)



It may not be as much as megaman but its close enough for me
 

Aqua Rock X

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Pac-Man
Chances: 50% - That factors in the leak because as convincing as it is, I'm not ready to buy into it just yet. To me Sakurai seems a little too conservative towards 3rd parties and I can't help but feel that his repeated emphasis on Megaman as a "special case" implies that.

Want: 0% - I commend the Pac-Man fanbase for being such good people in the face of such animosity toward their character. That said, however, I'm one of the last people you'd come to for Pac-Man support. I'm sorry, but I've never played a Pac-Man game that I enjoyed.

Toon Link Prediction: 32% His appearance in the Spirit Tracks stage doesn't look good for some people.

Nominations:
Krystal x5
 

Steelia

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Pac-Man
Likelihood: 50%
It's all up to Namco and Sakurai. Had Namco not been helping out with this next Smash (and for that interesting "leak" a while back), this rating would be much lower.

Want: 0%
Sorry... Not interested in him ): His games are good, though.

Toon Link: 20%
Wind Waker being around the corner helps him a bit. But seeing him as apart of the background in the 3DS version, as well as Sakurai's ever-strengthening policy to remove clone characters, lessens his chances significantly.

Nomination: Mewtwo x5
 

FalKoopa

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Iv not seen any one do this yet so I thought id make a list of all the Pac-Man History that has been on the Nintendo Console.​
Pac-Man 1984 Nintendo Entertainment System.
(Pac-Attack - 1993, Super Nintendo Entertainment System-1994 Game Boy,2008 Wii).
Pac-Man 2: The New Adventures 1994 – Super Nintendo Entertainment System).
Pac-In-Time – 1994 Super Nintendo Entertainment System.)
Pac-Man Fever 2002 – Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man World 2 2002 – Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man Vs. 2003 – Nintendo GameCube,2007 - Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World 2004 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac-Pix 2005 – Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man Pinball Advance 2005 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac 'n Roll 2005 – Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World 3 2005 – Nintendo GameCube,Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man World Rally 2005 - Nintendo GameCube.)
Pac-Man Party 2010 – Wii, Nintendo DS.)
Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures Wii U And 3DS Coming Soon Fall 2013.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pac-Man Collection 2001 – Game Boy Advance.)
Pac-Man & Galaga Dimensions-2011 – Nintendo 3DS included are the original Pac-Man, Pac-Man Championship Edition, and Pac-Man Tilt (a game that's new to this compilation). The collection also includes three games in the Galaga series.
Namco Museum 64 1999 – Nintendo 64.)
Namco Museum: 50th Anniversary 2005 – GameCube, Game Boy Advance.)
Namco Museum Remix 2007 – Wii.)
Namco Museum DS 2007 – Nintendo DS.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Racing game's developed jointly by Namco and Nintendo,Includes Pac-Man, Ms. Pac-Man, and Blinky as playable characters.
Mario Kart Arcade GP 2005 – Arcade.)
Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 2007 – Arcade.)
Mario Kart Arcade GP DX 2013 – Arcade.)



It may not be as much as megaman but its close enough for me
List of MegaMan games on Nintendo systems yet. Recommended for your pleasure.

[collapse=Huge List]
  1. Mega Man (Rockman) – Famicom/NES, 1987 (US, JP)
  2. Mega Man 2 (Rockman 2: The Enigma of Dr. Wily) – Famicom/NES, 1988 (JP), 1989 (US)
  3. Mega Man 3 (Rockman 3: The End of Dr. Wily) – Famicom/NES, Arcade, 1990 (US, JP)
  4. Mega Man 4 (Rockman 4: A New Ambition) – Famicom/NES, 1991 (JP), 1992 (US)
  5. Mega Man 5 (Rockman 5: Blues' Trap) – Famicom/NES, 1992 (US, JP)
  6. Mega Man 6 (Rockman 6: The Greatest Battle in History) (Japan/US only) – Famicom/NES, 1993 (JP), 1994 (US)
  7. Mega Man 7 (Rockman 7: Fated Confrontation) – Super Famicom/Super NES, 1995 (US, JP)
  8. Mega Man 9 (Rockman 9: Revival of Ambition) – WiiWare, PlayStation Network, Xbox Live Arcade, 2008
  9. Mega Man 10 (Rockman 10: Threat from Outer Space) – WiiWare, PlayStation Network, Xbox Live Arcade, 2010
  10. Mega Man & Bass (Rockman & Forte) – Super Famicom, 1998 (JP); Game Boy Advance, 2002 (US, JP)
  11. Mega Man: Dr. Wily's Revenge (Rockman World 1) – Game Boy, 1991
  12. Mega Man II (Rockman World 2) – Game Boy, 1991
  13. Mega Man III (Rockman World 3) – Game Boy, 1992
  14. Mega Man IV (Rockman World 4) – Game Boy, 1993
  15. Mega Man V (Rockman World 5) – Game Boy, 1994 (had additional Super Game Boy support)
  16. Wily & Right no RockBoard: That's Paradise (Japan only) – Famicom, 1993
  17. Mega Man Soccer (Japan/US only) – Super NES, 1994
  18. Mega Man X (Rockman X) – Super Famicom/SNES, PC, Virtual Console, 1993
  19. Mega Man X2 (Rockman X 2 versus the X-Hunters) – Super Famicom/SNES, Virtual Console, 1994
  20. Mega Man X3 (Rockman X 3) – Super Famicom/SNES, PC, PlayStation, Sega Saturn 1995,1996
  21. Mega Man Xtreme (Rockman X: Cyber Mission) – Game Boy Color, 2000
  22. Mega Man Xtreme 2 (Rockman X: Soul Eraser) – Game Boy Color, 2001
  23. Mega Man X: Command Mission (Rockman X: Command Mission) – GameCube, PlayStation 2, 2004
  24. Mega Man X Collection (US only) – GameCube, PlayStation 2, 2005/2006 – A collection featuring the first six Mega Man X titles and Mega Man Battle & Chase.
  25. Mega Man Legends/Mega Man 64 – PlayStation, Nintendo 64, PC, PlayStation Portable (Japan only), 1997, 1998
  26. Mega Man Battle NetworkGame Boy Advance, 2001
  27. Mega Man Battle Network 2Game Boy Advance, 2001
  28. Mega Man Battle Network 3 WhiteGame Boy Advance, 2002
  29. Mega Man Battle Network 3 BlueGame Boy Advance, 2003
  30. Mega Man Battle Network 4 Red SunGame Boy Advance, 2003
  31. Mega Man Battle Network 4 Blue MoonGame Boy Advance, 2003
  32. Mega Man Battle Network 5: Team ProtomanGame Boy Advance, 2004
  33. Mega Man Battle Network 5: Team ColonelGame Boy Advance, 2005
  34. Mega Man Battle Network 5: Double Team DSNintendo DS, 2005
  35. Mega Man Battle Network 6: Cybeast FalzarGame Boy Advance, 2005
  36. Mega Man Battle Network 6: Cybeast GregarGame Boy Advance, 2005
  37. Mega Man Network TransmissionGameCube, 2003
  38. Mega Man Battle Chip ChallengeGame Boy Advance, 2003
  39. Rockman EXE 4.5 Real Operation (Japan only) – Game Boy Advance, 2004
  40. Rockman EXE Operate Shooting Star (Japan only) – Nintendo DS, 2009 - An enhanced port of the first Mega Man Battle Network title.
  41. Mega Man ZeroGame Boy Advance, 2002
  42. Mega Man Zero 2Game Boy Advance, 2003
  43. Mega Man Zero 3Game Boy Advance, 2004
  44. Mega Man Zero 4Game Boy Advance, 2005
  45. Mega Man Zero CollectionNintendo DS, 2010 – A collection featuring all four Mega Man Zero titles.
  46. Mega Man ZXNintendo DS, 2006
  47. Mega Man ZX AdventNintendo DS, 2007
  48. Mega Man Star Force: PegasusNintendo DS, 2006
  49. Mega Man Star Force: LeoNintendo DS, 2006
  50. Mega Man Star Force: DragonNintendo DS, 2006
  51. Mega Man Star Force 2: Zerker × SaurianNintendo DS, 2007
  52. Mega Man Star Force 2: Zerker × NinjaNintendo DS, 2007
  53. Mega Man Star Force 3: Black AceNintendo DS, 2008
  54. Mega Man Star Force 3: Red JokerNintendo DS, 2008
[/collapse]
 

Erimir

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and seriously people should really do a little research before saying Pac-Man has no history with Nintendo. u couldnt be more wrong.
History, yes. Relevancy, no.

He has appeared on Nintendo consoles. But most of those were multi-platform games.

When I think of the NES, Mega Man and Simon Belmont are a couple of the non-Nintendo characters I think of. When I think of the Wii or the SNES era, I think of Sonic. When I think of the NES and SNES, I have to think about the Final Fantasy games. Pac-Man isn't as relevant to Nintendo.

Sure he's had ports and collections of the arcade game on Nintendo consoles. But so did other consoles. And it's the arcade he's famous for, not the Nintendo port. Pac-Man World games? Appeared on and sold better on other consoles.

When I think Pac-Man, I don't think of Nintendo. And vice versa.


But the fact is that Snake is even worse, seeing as he's primarily associated with Playstation, and has even appeared on Xbox more than Nintendo consoles. So this obviously doesn't make him impossible. But it's why I don't want him (and why I'd be fine with Snake being cut), in addition to his general blandness.

For the Mega Man comparison, look at the previous post:
List of MegaMan games on Nintendo yet. Recommended for your pleasure.
What do you notice about that?

There's 24 Pac-Man games + 3 appearances in Mario Kart arcade games (none on a console).

About the Mario Kart appearances - note that Mario Kart doesn't require Pac-Man to be Pac-Man. He just needs to sit in a Kart. Also it puts him in the company of such luminaries as Koopa, Baby Daisy and Toadette. I don't think the criteria for inclusion are quite so stringent in Mario Kart games as in Smash. It does help him out a bit, but a Mario Kart appearance is minor league compared to Smash.

Anyway, there are 24 Pac-Man games. But how many of them originally appeared on a Nintendo console? By this I mean it's not a port of a game that appeared elsewhere significantly earlier (including a port as part of a collection).

13 Pac-Man games that appeared on a Nintendo console at their time of first release.

And how many of those were exclusive to Nintendo at release? 6 games.

I can tell you without even looking at the list that Mega Man already beats that just counting Mega Man's NES games.

But for comparison, there are 54 Mega Man games on Nintendo consoles.

43 of those released on Nintendo consoles for their original release. For this, I'm not even counting different versions of the same generation of Battle Network etc. as separate games.

38 of those were Nintendo exclusives at release (and a large portion of those are STILL Nintendo exclusives, primarily the handheld games).

There's no comparison of how associated Mega Man is with Nintendo compared to Pac-Man. Don't even speak Pac-Man's name in the same breath.

But again, Snake shows that this doesn't mean he won't get in by any means.

But in my opinion - Mega Man is worthy, Pac-Man and Snake are not.

ETA: One more note about their associations - Mega Man got his start on Nintendo. Pac-Man did not.

Also most Mega Man sub-series started on Nintendo as well. Mega Man Classic, Mega Man X, Mega Man Battle Network, Mega Man Zero, Mega Man ZX, Mega Man Star Force all started on Nintendo. The only Mega Man sub-series that did not start on Nintendo is Mega Man Legends.

Mega Man is an important part of Nintendo history, and Nintendo is an even more important part of Mega Man history.
 

Shadow312

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Pac-Man-40% (based on the interview)

Want-10% (I feel non 3d pac-man is cooler/iconic, and we'd obviously get 3d)

Toon Link-40%

Noms: Krystal x5
 

SmashChu

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Likelyhood: 15%

Sakurai has come out and said that he wont add another third party character except is a special situation and Namco characters get no special treatment. Pac-Man is low on the popularity polls and ranks #18 on Shortie's most recent poll. In Japan, there is no consensus on which Namco character should be in. Given this, Pac-Man has no reason to be in.
 

Banjodorf

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Likelyhood: 15%

Sakurai has come out and said that he wont add another third party character except is a special situation

Don't twist words around man, it makes things look as bad as those phony gaming journalists.

And to supplement FallKoopa's Megaman Games post, I also include the multitude of Wii VC ports on there, as those also technically count as a seperate game. So that's several more in Mega Man's favor over the Pacster. Although it really wasn't a competition in the first place.
 

Nu~

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Don't twist words around man, it makes things look as bad as those phony gaming journalists.

And to supplement FallKoopa's Megaman Games post, I also include the multitude of Wii VC ports on there, as those also technically count as a seperate game. So that's several more in Mega Man's favor over the Pacster. Although it really wasn't a competition in the first place.
Exactly! just because megaman had more games on the Nintendo system doesn't mean that he's anymore deserving than pac-man. aslo, just because pac-man doesn't rank high in a forum that overall bashes him altogether doesn't mean he's the least wanted. he's more wanted than tekken characters and klonoa so as a Namco character he has a chance, and people love pac-man and not just for his arcade game (something you all need to hear). Just because megaman is a so called "God" in most of your eyes doesn't mean he is better than pac-man IMO. But none of you probably wanted to hear this this post probably doesn't even matter...
 

SmashChu

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Don't twist words around man, it makes things look as bad as those phony gaming journalists.
Here is what he said:


Smash Bros. can still be considered as an all-star collection of Nintendo characters. Just like with Mega Man or any other third-party character, it would have to be a very special situation.
 

Banjodorf

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Here is what he said:

Which doesn't disconfirm any pre-existing third parties. Saying things like that with blanket wording only fuels amateur sites spewing nonsense. (Not to mention every single uninformed person on the net.)
 

SmashChu

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Which doesn't disconfirm any pre-existing third parties. Saying things like that with blanket wording only fuels amateur sites spewing nonsense. (Not to mention every single uninformed person on the net.)
CAN YOU NOT READ!?

He's saying that if he's going to add a third party character, it's going to be a special situation. In the same article, he says this.

Adding third-party characters should be considered a very special case.
Which reflects what I'm saying.
 

Banjodorf

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CAN YOU NOT READ!?

He's saying that if he's going to add a third party character, it's going to be a special situation. In the same article, he says this.


Which reflects what I'm saying.

Right, but I'm not really getting what that adds to the situation. Of course a third party has to be of value. Sonic and Snake were "special cases" in Brawl and will be again. Were you just making a comment about Namco characters not getting special treatment and therefore not being eligible? I don't think that's a correct correlation, honestly, but I still find a Namco rep unlikely.
 

SmashChu

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Right, but I'm not really getting what that adds to the situation. Of course a third party has to be of value. Sonic and Snake were "special cases" in Brawl and will be again. Were you just making a comment about Namco characters not getting special treatment and therefore not being eligible? I don't think that's a correct correlation, honestly, but I still find a Namco rep unlikely.
I think you didn't understand what I was saying. This is what you said.
Don't twist words around man, it makes things look as bad as those phony gaming journalists.
Which you now agree with.
 

Curmudgeon

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I think you didn't understand what I was saying. This is what you said.

Which you now agree with.


"Sakurai has come out and said that he wont add another third party character except is a special situation"
is not the same as
"Just like with Mega Man or any other third-party character, it would have to be a very special situation."

See the difference?
Learn to read
 

Erimir

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Exactly! just because megaman had more games on the Nintendo system doesn't mean that he's anymore deserving than pac-man.
Well, then I have to wonder how you're determining what's a "deserving" character. Mega Man, as I pointed out, started on Nintendo, has most of his series important games on Nintendo consoles, and was a classic figure associated with the NES in pop culture. The game is about Nintendo's all-stars, not just any video game all-stars, and given that, it makes sense that their association with and history with Nintendo has to be very relevant.

Is just being a famous video game character enough to make you "deserving" in your view? Do they have to appear on a Nintendo console? What kind of appearance do they have to make? The game is about Nintendo's all-stars, not video game all-stars. Are Cloud Strife and Sephiroth deserving characters? They have both appeared on a Nintendo console before, they're certainly very famous and popular. You could say they're gaming icons. Is Mega Man more deserving than them or not? Why not? Is Pac-Man more deserving than them? If so, why?
aslo, just because pac-man doesn't rank high in a forum that overall bashes him altogether doesn't mean he's the least wanted.
You're probably referring to other people, but I didn't say he wasn't wanted. But he does seem to have more opposition than other characters even so (he's more polarizing than many other characters).

But the general public also wants Batman and Master Chief to be in the game...
and people love pac-man and not just for his arcade game (something you all need to hear).
That's fine, but we all know that he's primarily famous for the arcade game. I'm not saying he has had no other games of note or no other games that were fun, but when people are talking about how massively famous and popular he is worldwide - it's almost entirely about the arcade games (Pac-Man and Ms. Pac-Man). If Pac-Man supporters are going to refer to a survey of the general public, they have to acknowledge that the general public doesn't really know any of his other games. We all know he didn't get up to 94% recognition with Americans (vs. 93% for Mario) on the basis of Pac-Man World.

And that's all I'm saying - his massive popularity is due to the arcade games. Not ALL of his popularity.
 
D

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I am ending this day now and will start updating. Currently seeing if Pacman9 and Gamer09e are the same people...
 

SmashChu

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"Sakurai has come out and said that he wont add another third party character except is a special situation"
is not the same as
"Just like with Mega Man or any other third-party character, it would have to be a very special situation."

See the difference?
Learn to read
They are saying the same thing in different orders. The only difference is I use the word "not" though the meaning is the same. Anything beyond that is semantics.
 

Xenigma

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And that's all I'm saying - his massive popularity is due to the arcade games. Not ALL of his popularity.
Pac-Man being possibly the most famous arcade character of all time is kind of the point. Remember, the Donkey Kong arcade game was Nintendo's first major success in the video game world, competing in an arcade market crowded with Namco hits highlighted by Pac-Man (which was released just one year earlier). Pac-Man would fill a very similar role to Sonic in Brawl, except while Sonic highlights Nintendo's competition on consoles, Pac-Man symbolizes their competition in the arcades.
 

Groose

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It's a bit disappointing to see the very negative response to Pac-Man. I think he's a character who'd be better recieved by a more casual group of gamers---even I must admit he would add only a little in the way of movepool.
 

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It's a bit disappointing to see the very negative response to Pac-Man. I think he's a character who'd be better recieved by a more casual group of gamers---even I must admit he would add only a little in the way of movepool.

I do agree with this. I think there's a great deal of "casual" gamers who tend to not be so aware of how rosters are structured, that might have thought Pac-Man was likely for nearly every game, and just now would go "About time! He's a video game icon!" I'm sure he'd be popular among the casual set. I just...can't bring myself to care...

I did really enjoy Pac-Man and Pac-Man World 2 though!
 

Erimir

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Pac-Man being possibly the most famous arcade character of all time is kind of the point. Remember, the Donkey Kong arcade game was Nintendo's first major success in the video game world, competing in an arcade market crowded with Namco hits highlighted by Pac-Man (which was released just one year earlier). Pac-Man would fill a very similar role to Sonic in Brawl, except while Sonic highlights Nintendo's competition on consoles, Pac-Man symbolizes their competition in the arcades.
I was saying that specifically in response to arguments on the basis of his other games. I agree with you - the arcade game would be the point of including Pac-Man. The fact that he's had a few games that appeared on Nintendo since then doesn't really make him worthy aside from fulfilling the basic criteria of appearing on a Nintendo console.

But I dunno, I don't feel that Pac-Man was seen as Donkey Kong's/Mario's rival in the way Sonic was. I remember back in the early 90s, there were ads on TV of Sega mocking Nintendo and vice versa, and they were both in the home console market and Mario and Sonic were clearly rivals. And I'd say that since then, Sonic has become an even better fit with the high-selling Mario & Sonic games and other Nintendo-exclusive appearances by Sonic.

I mean, I get that he's a very famous character and he competed with Mario and all, but I don't think that makes Pac-Man particularly deserving. He is iconic, but I don't think he's iconic in relation to Nintendo even to the extent that Sonic is.
 

Groose

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IBut I dunno, I don't feel that Pac-Man was seen as Donkey Kong's/Mario's rival in the way Sonic was. I remember back in the early 90s, there were ads on TV of Sega mocking Nintendo and vice versa, and they were both in the home console market and Mario and Sonic were clearly rivals.
This is true. Remember kids----SEGA does what Nintendon't!
 
D

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Going back to comment on some things:

@Opossum: You only had nine nominations, not ten.
@Z1GMA: You have to give an exact percentage for the character or it won't count.
@Banjodorf: Day 8 was not the day to rate Toon Link. Day 9, however, will be.

Day is halfway finished, still need to average percentage and do flavor.
 

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No, Nintendo's rivalry with Namco certainly wasn't as dramatic as their infamous rivalry with Sega. That's why Sonic being in Brawl was a big deal and why he's still the single most important third party character they could include in SSB4. The challenge becomes figuring out what's next. Mega Man certainly makes sense for inclusion as the biggest third party character born on Nintendo consoles. On the other hand, Pac-Man returns to the idea of what makes Sonic's inclusion so exciting: competition with other gaming icons. Nintendo exists as we know it today because of the success of Donkey Kong against the titanic strength of Pac-Man and the rest of Namco's arcade line-up. It may not have been as heated or iconic a rivalry as Nintendo versus Sega, but it's still a major part of Nintendo history, and now that Namco is on friendly terms with Nintendo, it's one well worth revisiting in the Smash format. We've been told that a third party inclusion has to be a very special exception, and nearly as I can tell there are few characters as worthy of such an exception as Pac-Man.
 

Gam3rALO

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It's a bit disappointing to see the very negative response to Pac-Man. I think he's a character who'd be better recieved by a more casual group of gamers---even I must admit he would add only a little in the way of movepool.
I agree. I thought Pac Man would get more positive response. If PAC man is in the game I think Sakurai will do an amazing move set like the other 3rd party characters. Moveset potential isn't an issue in my opinion. I think Sakurai can easily make Pac man's move set exciting and fun with all the games PAC man has been in. Finally he is very retro and the most original game character ever.
 

Erimir

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No, Nintendo's rivalry with Namco certainly wasn't as dramatic as their infamous rivalry with Sega. That's why Sonic being in Brawl was a big deal and why he's still the single most important third party character they could include in SSB4. The challenge becomes figuring out what's next. Mega Man certainly makes sense for inclusion as the biggest third party character born on Nintendo consoles. On the other hand, Pac-Man returns to the idea of what makes Sonic's inclusion so exciting: competition with other gaming icons. Nintendo exists as we know it today because of the success of Donkey Kong against the titanic strength of Pac-Man and the rest of Namco's arcade line-up. It may not have been as heated or iconic a rivalry as Nintendo versus Sega, but it's still a major part of Nintendo history, and now that Namco is on friendly terms with Nintendo, it's one well worth revisiting in the Smash format. We've been told that a third party inclusion has to be a very special exception, and nearly as I can tell there are few characters as worthy of such an exception as Pac-Man.
This is my final thought about this before the new day...

I don't think either of us was really there for the pre-NES days of Donkey Kong and Mario Bros (I myself only remember the tail-end of the NES era), but it doesn't seem to me that there would've been much of a rivalry at all. The difference between arcades and home consoles is that with a home console, you make a commitment. Those consoles were expensive (in inflation adjusted dollars, NES was $400 at launch, an SNES was $330, a Genesis $345) and for a lot of people, that meant that was the one you were stuck with. And psychology being the way it is, that breeds loyalty. People don't want to feel that they bet on the wrong horse, so you've gotta defend your team.

Arcade games don't have that. Why would I care about whether someone likes Donkey Kong while I like Pac-Man? And I can easily play both, I don't have to choose. Spend my quarters here, spend my quarters there. I can play one game while the other is busy.

I wasn't there, so I can't say, but I'd be very very surprised if people had much of any association of Pac-Man and Mario being rivals, at least, any more than any one game in the arcade competes against any other game. Certainly not in the same league as the Mario vs. Sonic rivalry. Because why would they? It'd be like saying that Altair and Kratos are big rivals, or Mega Man and Rayman are big rivals. Sure, they compete in the sense that they're video games and people have to sometimes decide which one they'll get, but nobody thinks of them having any particular rivalry.
 
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Will get flavor up eventually, no time to do so now.
Pac-Man has scored a 57.62% in overall likelihood with Smashboards giving him a 54.99% and GameFAQs a 64.29%. As for want, Pac-Man has a 39.71% in overall want with Smashboarsd giving Pac-Man a 34.79% while GameFAQs gives him a 53.94%.

Day 9 begins! Today, you will be rating Toon Link's likelihood and how much you want Toon Link along with predicting Mewtwo's score for tomorrow. You also have five nominations at your disposal today. The day will end at 11 PM on July 3rd, 2013.

Sid-cada has won five extra nomination for being the closest to predicting Pac-Man's score. Shortiecanbrawl and Venus of the Desert Bloom still have extra nomination they can use.

GameFAQs Variation is in here.
 

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鉄腕パドル!
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Toon Link - 80%
Want - 90%
+ Veteran of arguably two games
+ Stands out more than other possible "Child" Link due to art-style
+ Could arguably return in the form of yet other "Child" Link variation (Young/Classic?)
+ Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks, Wind Waker HD arguably help his staying power
- Easiest Nintendo character cut to make
- Possibly already de-confirmed due to Spirit Tracks stage

Tough to talk about due to possible variations, but my personal variation of choice is Toon due to standing out more.
 

Erimir

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Ah, the first veteran.

Alrighty...

Popularity: Well, I guess I don't really know how much people want him. But Wind Waker and the DS games are well-received and sold well.

Relevancy: The next handheld Zelda game doesn't feature him BUT Wind Waker is getting an HD remake. He is a pretty significant part of Zelda though. IMO, if Sakurai wants two versions of Link, Toon Link is a better choice than Young Link since he's more visually distinct. Unless he wanted to go with the Majora's Mask Link, but that's really like adding multiple characters so unlikely. Of course, Sakurai could add some other Zelda character instead. Who knows.

Design: Well, we've already seen how Sakurai would do him. He plays pretty differently from Link, but he's still a semi-clone. However, there's definitely potential to make him more unique if Sakurai wanted to with items like the Deku Leaf or the Skull Hammer, etc. But overall he's not terribly unique as he appeared in Brawl and it seems to a certain extent that Sakurai doesn't like changing the characters too radically (considering how little he changed Ganondorf, the character who needs it the most).

Roster considerations: Well, some people might think two Links is a bit much. But there aren't a whole lot of potential Zelda reps that aren't relatively obscure. Link, Zelda and Ganondorf are (kinda literally) the trinity of Zelda.

Sakurai statements/revealed info/etc.: Well, Sakurai seems to be emphasizing uniqueness a bit, and then there's the big thing.

The Spirit Tracks stage. It has Toon Link on it already. Now, I don't think that proves that he's not in. But it does say at least no engineer alternate costume! (Although that would've been cute.) But I do think that it makes him pretty unlikely. Were it not for that, I'd think he'd have a pretty good chance of returning (all of the Brawl characters I think have at least a pretty good chance).

He would look different from the Spirit Tracks Link, true. But it still seems odd to have him as a stage element if he's also a playable character. The closest to this is Donkey Kong in the classic DK stage, but that feels different since that's the original DK design which is so different and also you couldn't really have that stage without putting DK in it.

Toon Link chances: 23%

Toon Link want: 72%
I like him. He's cute. I might want some other Zelda characters more, but I think they're mostly unlikely.

Mewtwo prediction: 75%
I think people are going to take his veteran status, the fact he almost made it into Brawl, his prominent role in the new Pokemon game and Sakurai's comments as strong indicators.

Nominations:
Simon Belmont x5

Gonna keep on with the same... might as well.
 

Alban712

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Toon Link

Likelihood: 35% : Considering ssb4's roster size will likely not surpass 45 characters slots beacuse of the 3ds limitations, we'll definetly see some cuts in the brawl's roster and, at least to me, the more obvious choices are the less unique characters and Toon Link is, by far, the least. Futhermore, the appearance of one of his incarnations in a stage reduces his chances even more

Want: 30% : I don't like the idea of two versions of the same characters occupying two slots in a fighting game and I don't like his desing and gameplat at all

Mewtwo: 82,43%

Nominations
Krystal 2x
Lyn 2x
Sonic 1x
 
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