GP&B
Ike 'n' Ike
Only TL's physics and Nair was changed to be like YL's. TL is too floaty for Melee's physics (hell, I found him way too floaty in Brawl+ too).
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Project M Social Thread
- Thread starter Project M
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hotdogturtle
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
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A clone engine video perhaps? IIRC Dantarion turned Marth into Jigglypuff in one of his early tests.
Luxor
Smash Champion
I was thinking of MarfJiggs too, but I figured everyone saw that =/
D
Deleted member
Guest
Well its both her floaty physics and her short hop that makes her SHFFLs worse than other characters. Change either one and she can do more with aerials.
She also can't combo easily at all. Her missiles even while at a high rate of fire with missile cancelling can be destroyed with tilts or aerials rendering them null. She has difficulty approaching too.
Like Stevo said, tweaking hitboxes like fair and up smash will definitely help her.
curry9186
Smash Journeyman
A good improvement for the missiles would be for them to behave more like all the other bombs in the game (i.e. hitting them is not a good idea.)
Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
Samus is really solid in Melee; she just has a crazy learning curve. I don't think she needs much improvement. Maybe a few tweaks could be made to make the Marth match-up more manageable, but you'd probably need to ask actual good Samus players about that.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
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- 26,545
lack of quick, powerful moves, below-average ledge-game, and overall speed inferiority in comparison to good characters.
GP&B
Ike 'n' Ike
Give Samus her 64 Dair.
Insta-top tier.
Insta-top tier.
Stevo
Smash Champion
actually, speeding up how quick her homing missiles fire might be a good idea (from melee that is, brawl it is already faster I think)
then you could short hop them.... I dunno.
Her ground game is great, other than her grab game, but jumping in the air is a lot more dangerous than other characters. Hugs pressures with ground spacing to use Samus well.
then you could short hop them.... I dunno.
Her ground game is great, other than her grab game, but jumping in the air is a lot more dangerous than other characters. Hugs pressures with ground spacing to use Samus well.
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
So. 'Bout that DI.
Shadic
Alakadoof?
Fly_Amanita
Master of Caribou
Randomly buffing faulty aspects of characters is a lousy approach to balance that can lead to all sorts of bad match-ups popping up in weird places. When fixing a character, you should consider explicitly what characters gave him/her/it a hard time and see if you can make those match-ups more manageable without breaking some other match-ups in the process. It's not easy, but just saying "Hey, let's make this bad aspect of this character good" for every character that isn't top tier already will almost inevitably yield bad results.
The reason I brought up Marth in particular is that, going by Hugo's numbers, he is Samus' only really significantly bad match-up and I give his opinions about Samus more credence than those of anybody else.
The reason I brought up Marth in particular is that, going by Hugo's numbers, he is Samus' only really significantly bad match-up and I give his opinions about Samus more credence than those of anybody else.
stingers
Smash Obsessed
hey I said this exact same thing like 6 months ago
lets see if people agree with you this time
The King Of Hearts
Smash Journeyman
Hurry buff her taunts! thats what the cool kids want come on! COME ON!!!!
Btw Joe... look up an advance tech vid on samus and maybe a vid of wes vs germ. Im old but I remember wes was pretty crazy
Also ronnins and mankosuki!
JOE!
Smash Hero
wait, are you saying the Super Missile was an AT? XD
Stevo
Smash Champion
perhaps a quick pivot grab would help against marth
cause the issue there (I think) is samus cannot out spacing marth and can't crouch him cause of disjointedness and good grab. (Im guessing, I dont play samus)
actually nevermind, Im not sure what that would add that waveslide back doesnt already do....
maybe missiles that cannot be attacked like someone mentioned IS the solution. Force marth to commit and approach a bit more, but wouldnt affect other matchups too much.
But anyway, Samus shouldnt need too much tweaking, since she could, for the most part, keep up with high tiers at a very high level of play.
I like melee samus as a character, she has a unique playstyle that still functions
cause the issue there (I think) is samus cannot out spacing marth and can't crouch him cause of disjointedness and good grab. (Im guessing, I dont play samus)
actually nevermind, Im not sure what that would add that waveslide back doesnt already do....
maybe missiles that cannot be attacked like someone mentioned IS the solution. Force marth to commit and approach a bit more, but wouldnt affect other matchups too much.
But anyway, Samus shouldnt need too much tweaking, since she could, for the most part, keep up with high tiers at a very high level of play.
I like melee samus as a character, she has a unique playstyle that still functions
LiQViD
Smash Cadet
I don't know if the dev's saw this during the stream (Dant went for a walk...), so I wanted to post it here.
To fix the diagonal stick DI problem in a smooth manner without complex code I suggest approximating a circle with an octagon and adjusting the X and Y stick values to match it.
Pseudo-code is as follows:
sum = abs (x) + abs (y)
if (sum > 1) then
x = x - (x * (0.292893 * (sum - 1)))
x = y - (y * (0.292893 * (sum - 1)))
end if
That'll adjust the given stick X and Y values so that they approximate a circle (instead of a square). It is accurate enough I think, and it shouldn't involve too many lines of ASM.
The alternative (much more accurate but very slow) solution is:
total = sqrt ((x * x) + (y * y))
if (total > 1) then
x = x / total
y = y / total
end if
To fix the diagonal stick DI problem in a smooth manner without complex code I suggest approximating a circle with an octagon and adjusting the X and Y stick values to match it.
Pseudo-code is as follows:
sum = abs (x) + abs (y)
if (sum > 1) then
x = x - (x * (0.292893 * (sum - 1)))
x = y - (y * (0.292893 * (sum - 1)))
end if
That'll adjust the given stick X and Y values so that they approximate a circle (instead of a square). It is accurate enough I think, and it shouldn't involve too many lines of ASM.
The alternative (much more accurate but very slow) solution is:
total = sqrt ((x * x) + (y * y))
if (total > 1) then
x = x / total
y = y / total
end if
D
Deleted member
Guest
Stevo, Samus in PM would have that nice zair to compete with Marth's spacing.
I like the idea of missiles not being destroyed by the attacks, but personally, I'd relegate that only to the homing missiles.
The idea of Samus's power missiles acting like Falco's lasers with no destroyable hitbox is disgusting lol.
On what Stingers said, the weaknesses and vulnerabilities compared to the strengths defines a character. What I notice though is high tier Melee characters have options to be good enough to compete with those weaknesses at a high level.
Ganon in PM is one of the most interesting characters done. He just about keeps all of his weaknesses and gains side-b as a strong option. A new strength is created without significantly covering his weaknesses of being slow and easy to combo.
It's disputable on what is and what is not an acceptable weakness to reconstruct. M2's tail hurtbox and lightweight, Ness/Yoshi being restricted by DJC come to mind as being good things to change.
I like the idea of missiles not being destroyed by the attacks, but personally, I'd relegate that only to the homing missiles.
The idea of Samus's power missiles acting like Falco's lasers with no destroyable hitbox is disgusting lol.
On what Stingers said, the weaknesses and vulnerabilities compared to the strengths defines a character. What I notice though is high tier Melee characters have options to be good enough to compete with those weaknesses at a high level.
Ganon in PM is one of the most interesting characters done. He just about keeps all of his weaknesses and gains side-b as a strong option. A new strength is created without significantly covering his weaknesses of being slow and easy to combo.
It's disputable on what is and what is not an acceptable weakness to reconstruct. M2's tail hurtbox and lightweight, Ness/Yoshi being restricted by DJC come to mind as being good things to change.
5ive
Smash Champion
PM me if you want PM.
stingers
Smash Obsessed
from my experience, it's better to charge money when you make posts like these, because people will respond anyway.
5ive
Smash Champion
The King Of Hearts
Smash Journeyman
Yes.... lols no. I ment to catch up on the lingo and know a lot about samus...
It still surprises me that people are still learning the extended/homing laso grab and yet they know the SWD. ...
hey... will I be able to fish with samus agian??? <3
I rather wait for the complete game
But while I wait.... 1980s after school specials time coolface.gif
jahkzheng
Smash Lord
I'm not gonna lie, I'm interested... but what King of Hearts said...
Also... the suddenness and frankness of the offer makes it seem less than genuine...
I am conflicted though... it would be good fun to try out...
Edit:
...and Why? lol
Shadic
Alakadoof?
On a different note, G&W is basically done. It's a lot easier to finish Melee characters than it is to rework Brawl ones.
The King Of Hearts
Smash Journeyman
standardtoaster
Tubacabra
With link: Moonwalk -> grab
Great grab to beat spotdodges
Great grab to beat spotdodges
Shadic
Alakadoof?
Link would moonwalk pretty awesome with some hover boots.
Hoverboots confirmed for P:M.
standardtoaster
Tubacabra
Give him luigi friction and he'll slide far enough he won't need hover boots. 
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Link w/ Luigi's Friction confirmed for P:M.
Shadic
Alakadoof?
Then we'd have to give Luigi bomb jumping.Give him luigi friction and he'll slide far enough he won't need hover boots.
The King Of Hearts
Smash Journeyman
Possible super bomb jumping like links super bomb jump in melee!? hover boots Moonslide + hookshot sounds broken... you should buff itThen we'd have to give Luigi bomb jumping.
Shadic
Alakadoof?
We're working on it. Got a few ideas, actually. We're currently using one of the "GHZ2.0" stages, but I want to do a complete new idea when I have the time.
Wanna slap hookshots?
hotdogturtle
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,503
Dojo update? :D
Shadic
Alakadoof?
Dant already showed off what he's working on.
It's way better than a Dojo update.
jahkzheng
Smash Lord
good times come to those who like soft core baseball
Am I to assume "like soft core baseball" is synonymous "wait"?
...and why not just say "softball"... unless you just wanted an excuse to say "soft core"...
...
Shadic
Alakadoof?
Probably because hardcore...and why not just say "softball"... unless you just wanted an excuse to say "soft core"...
...
would be too intense to handle.Alakadoof confirmed for P:M.
hotdogturtle
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,503
Add a new section on the PM website for Dantjo updates.
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