Prepare to be Astounded One Last Time: Wiseguy’s Brawl Predictions THE FINAL VERSION!

[Vali]

And don't tell me that you don't see Toshiyuki Sudo (the Everyone Votes channel guy) as conclusive proof that Mii is in Brawl.

Not really. While I know it's a small (very small) step in favour of the Mii, I think his inclusion is more in the case of creating the lobby music for online play. I can't imagine a full orchestral score to trying to find a match, whereas the Wii channel scores (Everybody votes, weather, shop etc.) are much more suited to their activities.

No word on a Metal Gear Wii game yet (tragically...) and Metal Gear Solid 4 is supposed to be the final chapter in the series. That kinda ruins your whole argument right there, huh?

It wasn't an argument for Snake being in, it was a "we included you in Brawl now make us a da mn Wii MGS". While i know that there's obviously a huuuge amount of fans of MGS, I'm a bit impartial to it since Sons of Liberty (just don't really like the combat which is what it's all about) and it's not exactly my fanboy's wet dream to play as him. There are those that feel that way about him but i'd still like to see a decent MGS game on Wii so his inclusion wasn't a total waste.

Metroid Prime, Fire Emblem, Paper Mario, Advance Wars, Battalion Wars and Super Smash Bros Melee all disagree with your assessment. All these Nintendo published games were made by Retro Studios, Intelligent Systems, etc.

2nd party aren't they? That's practically 1st.

That is a possibility. But as long as the third party character is in the same league as Solid Snake and all the major Nintendo franchises are represented (as I think they are on my list) I'm good with it.

"Go Olimar go" is all i can say to that .

Two or three retro characters are good candidates for a single guest appearance, but never at the expense of contenporary Nintendo characters - in my view.

And it's a good view.

Sora over Captian Olimar?! Not on your life!

It was a bit unfair of my to use the beloved Captain Olimar for that example, but it's slightly depressing how many 3rd party fanboys would want to put <insert 3rd party lame character choice> over him (well, lame in comparison).

I hate it how da mn (such a mild swearword) is filtered. Really takes the passion out of my arguments :x

 

[Drascin]

Nice list there, Wiseguy. I like it a lot, and find it pretty thought out. I do disagree in some points, but hey, it's to be expected.

My main disagrees would be:

-I feel the Smash team would have to be EXTREMELY pressed for time before they considered Midna as a clone instead of giving her a unique moveset. She's the most important character in the newest LoZ, game, and that gives her a bit of leeway. Of course, if the release date starts to close in too quickly, you'll be right, but I honestly doubt it will happen like that.
-Axing Metwo. I dunno, he's still extremely popular with most pokémon fans, and even most of the newer kids will probably be able to name Mew and Mewtwo even if they never played Red and Blue. I'd say he's easily in the top 5, or even 3, of the probable pokemon picks. So, although I wouldn't be oppossed to replacing him with Deoxys, and it is also likely since Deoxys had pretty much the same role as Mewtwo's original one (very much secret, very strong monster) it is undeniable Mewtwo had a heck of a lot more style (and also a personality, which is always a plus ) which could sway it a bit in his favor.
-Black Knight. Yeah, he's a possibility, but what about the chars of the ported GBA games? It might be possible that we see the likes of Lyn or Sephraim in the space next to Ike (who, you're right, is all but confirmed). Of course, this might be wishful thinking, because I think having Lyn would be totally awesome, but it might be. I know that, at least in here in Europe, the GBA games sold pretty darn well. So I'd say it's not yet decided. 65-35 I'd say, with the 65 going for the Knight.
-Samurai Goroh. I dunno, it would be just filler, I don't think anyone cares enough for him to bother creating the models and all other stuff for him. Of course, in this opinion there's also a heavy factor of "Please, be wrong. Not that I have anything against you, but here I want you to be wrong. If Goroh is there at the expense of some other character, I'll cry myself to sleep for several days. I'd take Pichu over him anyday!".
-Sora. As much as I like Kingdom Hearts (those games andthe Nippon Ichi Disgaea games (which is the awesomest SRPG ever, leaps beyond even Fire Emblem itself) are pretty much the only use I've gotten from the PS2 my mom gave me as a present), I feel Sora doesn't have a chance in hell. Also, it is not nice to want t hurt the Sony fans. Leave them be, it's not their fault they are like that .
-Ridley. Don't misunderstand me. I want him to be in, I want it with every fiber of my being. But I dunno. As a boss-type, like Master Hand? Sure. But as a PC? I can't really picture it. But I keep hoping you're right and they do come with a nice moveset for him. It would give me a third char to alternate with Pit and Meta Knight.

And, as to my personal dislikes and likes (since nice and accurate are not always the same thing):

-Yeah, Tom Nook has a good chance. But I still wouldn't like him in, tbh. But wishes and chance are not the same thing. I can say, however, that if he is indeed in, I will take immense pleasure in pummeling him repeteadly.
-Please be right about Dedede. That would be awesome. I'd even manage to override my innate allergy of big characters for him.
-Megaman... well, I know, if there's a representative of the saga, it should be the Blue Bomber himself. But I'll admit I'm much more partial to Zero, especially his new body from the GBA Zero saga. Mega, in all of his incarnations (Rock, X and EXE) tends to be pretty irritating. I'd still play him a bit, because I'm a sucker for megaman games, but if Zero is in instead of Mega, I'd have reached my Nerdvana, sitting atop a platform of pure extasis held by four avatars of kickass, Pit, Meta, Zero and Ridley, cruising the universe of pure bliss atop a giant SSBB case.
-Given that I hated the treatment Ganon got in TP (really, Nintendo, you don't need to have Gnon pop up in every single game if he's not needed. Zant worked just fine) I'd actually prefer to see him WW-style, wielding twin swords with amazing skill, but I know it's not happening, EVER. Ganon is there, and it's going to be TP ganon. Ah well, I'll simply ignore him. (and for the record, I do think WW's final fight was a bit more interesting or at least more spectacular than TP's. Of course, not that I cared amidst the bloodred veil of rage caused by Midna's apparent death)

And finally, to the people who don't think Mii's could work, what would you say of having them as substitutes of the wire guys from the 100-man melee and such? They'd make a cute replacement, and beating yourself and your friends up could prove surprisingly cathartic . Generic moveset, and you could even use them in regular melee! (though they'd likely suck )

 

[Vali]

And finally, to the people who don't think Mii's could work, what would you say of having them as substitutes of the wire guys from the 100-man melee and such? They'd make a cute replacement, and beating yourself and your friends up could prove surprisingly cathartic . Generic moveset, and you could even use them in regular melee! (though they'd likely suck )

I like the wire frames, honestly. I think they're perfect as a sort of VR simulated opponent and that non-personal endless stream of wireframes fits the 100 man/15 min/endless Melee mode fine. Mii's would just be a tacky cash-in and while beating it out of your custom Mii's could have appeal to some, I think the novelty would wear off pretty quickly and would just become a useless addition.

 

[Joka]

The only other 3rd party character I want is Klonoa.

 

[Icy_Eagle]

Nooooooooooooooooo
why isn't bomberman on your 3rd party list. He's classic, retro, fun, adorable, uses bombs, has an upcoming game for the wii, has tons of games on nintendo and blows things up.





with bombs

but seriously where is the bomberman support?

 

[Joka]

^If Klonoa is in Brawl, this could be a good grab move for him.

^This would also be a good taunt

 

[Wiseguy]

Not really. While I know it's a small (very small) step in favour of the Mii, I think his inclusion is more in the case of creating the lobby music for online play. I can't imagine a full orchestral score to trying to find a match, whereas the Wii channel scores (Everybody votes, weather, shop etc.) are much more suited to their activities.

Yeah, I know. I wasn't serious. I just found it hilarious that some poor sap's only game experience is the Everyone Votes Channel.

"Oh, so you guys worked on games like Crono Trigger and Guns of the Patriots eh? Well I worked on the Everyone Votes Channel. BEAT THAT!"

It wasn't an argument for Snake being in, it was a "we included you in Brawl now make us a da mn Wii MGS". While i know that there's obviously a huuuge amount of fans of MGS, I'm a bit impartial to it since Sons of Liberty (just don't really like the combat which is what it's all about) and it's not exactly my fanboy's wet dream to play as him. There are those that feel that way about him but i'd still like to see a decent MGS game on Wii so his inclusion wasn't a total waste.

No one wants a Metal Gear Wii game more than myself, but as far as this argument is concerned: Snake's inclusion demonstartes that a 3rd party character without a recent Nintendo relaease can still appear in Brawl. Not everyone agrees that this should be the case, but it is what it is.

2nd party aren't they? That's practically 1st.

Practically, but not exactly. That was just a minor clarification. Sorry for nit-picking.

For the record, I also have little patience for people who expect dozens of 3rd party characters, or really lame ones. I just think 6 is a nice compromise between those people and purists who are still opposed to Snake's inclusion.

-Nice list there, Wiseguy. I like it a lot, and find it pretty thought out. I do disagree in some points, but hey, it's to be expected.

Thank you, I'm glad you like it.

I welcome different points of view. If we all agreed, this would be a pretty boring thread.

-I feel the Smash team would have to be EXTREMELY pressed for time before they considered Midna as a clone instead of giving her a unique moveset. She's the most important character in the newest LoZ, game, and that gives her a bit of leeway. Of course, if the release date starts to close in too quickly, you'll be right, but I honestly doubt it will happen like that.

Yeah, it could go either way. I figured the only way I could justify as many as 45 characters was to include as many clones as I could. Either way, I think Midna is a worthy inclusion.

-Axing Metwo. I dunno, he's still extremely popular with most pokémon fans, and even most of the newer kids will probably be able to name Mew and Mewtwo even if they never played Red and Blue. I'd say he's easily in the top 5, or even 3, of the probable pokemon picks. So, although I wouldn't be oppossed to replacing him with Deoxys, and it is also likely since Deoxys had pretty much the same role as Mewtwo's original one (very much secret, very strong monster) it is undeniable Mewtwo had a heck of a lot more style (and also a personality, which is always a plus ) which could sway it a bit in his favor.

Pokemon isn't really my forte', but I suspect Deoxys would have a far more interesting moveset as he has the ability (from what I understand) to alter his form to optimize attack, defence and agility.

-Black Knight. Yeah, he's a possibility, but what about the chars of the ported GBA games? It might be possible that we see the likes of Lyn or Sephraim in the space next to Ike (who, you're right, is all but confirmed). Of course, this might be wishful thinking, because I think having Lyn would be totally awesome, but it might be. I know that, at least in here in Europe, the GBA games sold pretty darn well. So I'd say it's not yet decided. 65-35 I'd say, with the 65 going for the Knight.

The problem with the GBA games is that, while extrmely popular in places like North America, they are poorly regarded by Japanese FE fans. The reason I chose two characters from PoR (not from any of the Japanese games or the GBA games) is because it is the only Fire Emblem loved by Fire Emblem fans around the world. Of course, a character from the upcoming Goddess of Dawn is also a possibility...

-Samurai Goroh. I dunno, it would be just filler, I don't think anyone cares enough for him to bother creating the models and all other stuff for him. Of course, in this opinion there's also a heavy factor of "Please, be wrong. Not that I have anything against you, but here I want you to be wrong. If Goroh is there at the expense of some other character, I'll cry myself to sleep for several days. I'd take Pichu over him anyday!".

C'mon man, some of us still care about the F-Zero series. Goroh is Cpt. Falcon's main rival -and he would likely be included as his clone, which would take a fraction of the time that an original character would. And how can you go wrong by including a cheesy eighties rockstar on steriods?

-Sora. As much as I like Kingdom Hearts (those games andthe Nippon Ichi Disgaea games (which is the awesomest SRPG ever, leaps beyond even Fire Emblem itself) are pretty much the only use I've gotten from the PS2 my mom gave me as a present), I feel Sora doesn't have a chance in hell. Also, it is not nice to want t hurt the Sony fans. Leave them be, it's not their fault they are like that .

Sora does stand a snowball's chance in hell, if only. He was included on Sakurai's poll, after all. I know its improbable, but he seems like the kind of curve ball that Sakurai would like to send our way (ie: Snake).

It's not that I want to hurt Sony fanboys. On the contrary, I want Sora in Brawl so that they will come over to our side. That this would also hurt Sony's evil empire is just a happy side effect.

-Ridley. Don't misunderstand me. I want him to be in, I want it with every fiber of my being. But I dunno. As a boss-type, like Master Hand? Sure. But as a PC? I can't really picture it. But I keep hoping you're right and they do come with a nice moveset for him. It would give me a third char to alternate with Pit and Meta Knight.

Have faith Drascin. Ridley is a highly requested character (if Sakurai's poll is any indication) and he would be incredibly original. I have no doubt he'll make it.

-Yeah, Tom Nook has a good chance. But I still wouldn't like him in, tbh. But wishes and chance are not the same thing. I can say, however, that if he is indeed in, I will take immense pleasure in pummeling him repeteadly.

It might not be as easy as you think. Only fools dare face the wrath of Nook's Racoon Goons!

-Please be right about Dedede. That would be awesome. I'd even manage to override my innate allergy of big characters for him.

Don't worry. Dedede was created by Sakurai himself and is the most requested characteron Sakurai's poll. He's a safe a bet.

-Megaman... well, I know, if there's a representative of the saga, it should be the Blue Bomber himself. But I'll admit I'm much more partial to Zero, especially his new body from the GBA Zero saga. Mega, in all of his incarnations (Rock, X and EXE) tends to be pretty irritating. I'd still play him a bit, because I'm a sucker for megaman games, but if Zero is in instead of Mega, I'd have reached my Nerdvana, sitting atop a platform of pure extasis held by four avatars of kickass, Pit, Meta, Zero and Ridley, cruising the universe of pure bliss atop a giant SSBB case.

To be honest, I can't tell which Megaman is which anymore. My inclination is the Zero version as he would be more unique from Samus, but I don't really care either way.

-Given that I hated the treatment Ganon got in TP (really, Nintendo, you don't need to have Gnon pop up in every single game if he's not needed. Zant worked just fine) I'd actually prefer to see him WW-style, wielding twin swords with amazing skill, but I know it's not happening, EVER. Ganon is there, and it's going to be TP ganon. Ah well, I'll simply ignore him. (and for the record, I do think WW's final fight was a bit more interesting or at least more spectacular than TP's. Of course, not that I cared amidst the bloodred veil of rage caused by Midna's apparent death)

I thought the WW Gannondorf had greater character depth, but for sheer awesomeness my nod goes to TP Gannondorf.

And finally, to the people who don't think Mii's could work, what would you say of having them as substitutes of the wire guys from the 100-man melee and such? They'd make a cute replacement, and beating yourself and your friends up could prove surprisingly cathartic . Generic moveset, and you could even use them in regular melee! (though they'd likely suck )

PREACH IT BROTHER!

I like the wire frames, honestly. I think they're perfect as a sort of VR simulated opponent and that non-personal endless stream of wireframes fits the 100 man/15 min/endless Melee mode fine. Mii's would just be a tacky cash-in and while beating it out of your custom Mii's could have appeal to some, I think the novelty would wear off pretty quickly and would just become a useless addition.

Miis will never get old. Ever. Just when we start to tire of them, someone will think: "who would win in a fight between Mr. Rogers, Chewbacca, Agent Smith and Naruto?" and a new wave of creativity will arise.

Nooooooooooooooooo
why isn't bomberman on your 3rd party list. He's classic, retro, fun, adorable, uses bombs, has an upcoming game for the wii, has tons of games on nintendo and blows things up.

with bombs

but seriously where is the bomberman support?

Meh. Bomerman is boring. Samus and link already use bombs, Snake's moveset is based almost entirely on explosives and there will undoubtably be numerous bomb related items and stage hazzards. Simply put, he brings nothing new to the roster. Still a possibility, though.

^If Klonoa is in Brawl, this could be a good grab move for him.

^This would also be a good taunt

Klonoa (along with Viewtiful Joe, Earthworm Jim and Bonk) would be prefect for Smash. Unfortunatly, since they are neither owned by Nintendo nor represent major franchises, I don't think these awesome characters stand much of a chance. Dare to dream, Joka, dare to dream.

 

[Johnknight1]

Alrite, time to insult Wiseguy, I bet he's excited! I'm going a little out of order=heads up!


Alrite my complaints:
1.Mario series: Bowser Jr. is the only argueable one, but he'll most likely not make it. I give him a 40% chance at being in Brawl, but that's not a big deal, so idc that much.

2.Donkey Kong series: What about our 3rd DKC heroin Dixie Kong, who is clearly more important that King K. Rool. But I'd say it'd be DK, Diddy, Dixie, and then possibly King K. Rool.

3.tLOZ: Here's the big stuff, and I'll repeat myself again, Midna (Twili form) isn't going to happen, but here imp form, or Midna with Wolf Link could and one of those two probably will. I still don't see why you think there will be so many clones when this is Nintendo's biggest project, and Nintendo is backing this up more than any project in the past, just look at the musical talents! The one thing that I really like is that you got my top pick WW Link in there=o ya!

4.Pokemon: You stole that pic of Deoxys from one of my previous posts, didn't you=?, because I used to use that pic! Anyways, do I need to raise the Mewtwo arguement again, in the fact that Mewtwo is up there competing for the 2nd most popular Pokemon character, and he is the only real villian Pokemon in the Pokemon series, and we don't want to lose villains, now do we=? They keep the world nice and safe! Also note as Nintendo's #2 selling series, and the #2 selling series of all time, 4 characters is not enough!

5.Metroid: I agree with everything, and I'm pretty sure Zamus and Samus will be in diffrent character slots, not like the Zelda/Shiek transformation, considering the suit coming off came from Zero Mission, where the suit sheded off.

6.Kirby: 100% agreed, and they'll all own since Sakurai made all three of them!

7.Star Fox: I have to tell you that only the Mario, Pokemon, LOZ, Donkey Kong, and Metroid are the only Nintendo series to sell more units than Star Fox. All of them got 4 (exxcept Donkey kong), and considering Wolf and Krystal are some of the most desired characters for Brawl, I see no reason why both of them can't be in, when they are far more important that Bowser Jr., Twili Midna, and Sora, so why not Wolf=?

8.Fire Emblem: Marth, Marth, Marth=a huge character to the series. Why did you put the black knigh up there, when Marth is the most important character to the series with Ike or course. Roy can go either way, but I think for the 3rd slot we'll most likely go to either Sigurd, Roy, or Hector.

9.F-Zero: Agree 100%, but Samurai Goroh should be original, there is no excuse for any clones.

10.Earthbound/Mother: I've played Earthbound since last time, and I know how much you hate Japan only characters, but if a Mother 2 character made it along with Ness, it would be Paula, and if not Jeff, and if not Poo, but most likely Paula. Funny note, Ness doesn't even know PK Thunder or PK Fire, he stole those moves in SSB from Paula! She should steal some of Ness' moves to get revenge, but I'm still for Lucas in Brawl, just as long as he doesn't replace my main man Ness!

11.Other Nintendo characters: Mii's wouldn't be worth the work, and they would take soo much longer to make than other characters. Also Tom Nook can't fight, and if any Animal Crossing character made it, it would be Reseti (the mole). The characters in AC can be done in the Mii's, exactly (the Mii's are AC characters with customization and some new looks). Drop Tom Nook and Mii', in the end they just aren't worth it (funny Mii pics though).

3rd Party: Sakurai said it himself he only plans to have 1 or 2 other 3rd party characters other than Snake, and I say 4 is the max. Belmont is a no, we don't want Koonami being favoritized by Nintendo, plus there are a ton more desired characters. Sora was only in a mediocore KH GBA game (in which I want the PS2 remake, RE-Chains of Memories, which is in 3D, and is a Japan only title=the ultimate evil with Mother 1 and 3! ).

Other than that, Sonic, Megaman, and Geno (in that order) should be the only 3rd party characters we should expect, and no more than 4, in which even I make somewhat of a strech, but Geno was in a Mario game, so that could sneak him in Brawl

I still can't explain how much just because a character is old, doesn't mean they suck. SSB is about fighting with Nintendo's best and a few 3rd party characters, and besides the Ice Climbers are on Ice Climber, which is now on the Wii Virtual Console=awsome game=SMB orignal backup on the NES. Also G&W really helped start Nintendo off in video gaming, and for that reason alone he should be in, not to mention he's awsome. Still, I would like him to actually be 3D this time, even if I like the retro 3D look.

Pichu and Doc I agree (even if I like Doc), but Doc can be preserved without leaving! Simply put, have him as a Mario outfit, and have his fireballs changed to capsules, but still do the exact same thing, that way Doc is never truely gone! Roy can go either way IMO, and I'm not sure what will happen to him. I want him to return (with everyone else), but since he's one of my 6th best character, (I'm only better with Link, Fox, Falco, Peach, and YLink) so I do not want to see him go, bu I want him to be Luigified, minus the insane WD of course!

Now for Shiek, she has a bit less of a chance than Roy (I give her 30% at the most. Sure Zelda will be updated, but Shiek could be here own character, and own character slot. She doesn't have to be as "cheap" as you say, but then again, isn't Falco top tier (tied my 2nd best with Fox)=? Marth won't go, unless Sakurai wants to suck all the fun out of tournaments...who next Falco=???? Anyways, the thread where I yell and complain the most is back, and better than ever=yae!

@ Wiseguy
-"So uh, you know I'm the most famous video game music conductor of all time, I did the music for all the Final Fantasy games after all"
-"Well I did Chrono Trigger, which is one of the greatest games of all time"
-"I did the music since the begining with Mario and Zelda"
-"I did almost all the music in the Star Fox and Pikmin series"
-"Well uh...I did the Everybody Votes Channel Music, I OWN YOU ALL!" (crowd breaks out laughing)

 

[Vali]

Even if you could make a Chewbacca Mii (I have an undying love for wookies) I wouldn't want to hurt him Naruto on the other hand...

With the wireframes for example, who you got would be completely random and while depending on how Mii happy you are you might get someone interesting to smash off stage there's a very high chance there'll be a large bank of pre-generated Mii's to randomise them from. Instead of getting to smash Naruto repeatedly in the face, instead you'd get to smash "Chris" and "Kate" and "Bob" and a whole lot of other randomly generated weird looking people which you have to admit just wouldn't be as much fun. How would the Mii character select work anyone? Browse over the Mii character icon and it'll pop up with a list of Mii's to choose from? As I said there'd have to be pre-generated ones for the extremely unlikely cases that the person won't have created any Mii's and what would happen in the case of one of those people that goes Mii-crazy, spends all day not playing Zelda for the past 7 months creating Mii's instead and then goes and trades a whole bunch more with their Mii-happy friend who's done the same. How many pages of a possible Mii pop-up character selection would there have to be!?

Can just imagine all of the composers working with this huge orchestra then the EVC composer comes along and it'll be like

EVC: "I need you, you, you and you." *points at 4 people*
4 Orchestra guys: "What for?"
EVC: "The piece, obviously."
Rest of this huge orchestra: "What about us?!"
EVC: "Erm...go home?"
RofO: "Do we still get payed?"
EVC: "...No."
RofO: *Goes off grumbling*"Not a real composer"*grumble*

 

[Fawriel]

Yeah, I know. I wasn't serious. I just found it hilarious that some poor sap's only game experience is the Everyone Votes Channel.

"Oh, so you guys worked on games like Crono Trigger and Guns of the Patriots eh? Well I worked on the Everyone Votes Channel. BEAT THAT!"

But you have to admit that the music is simply supremely funky.

Naruto on the other hand...

=<

 

[Drascin]

Thank you, I'm glad you like it.

I welcome different points of view. If we all agreed, this would be a pretty boring thread.

Yeah. And after all, none of us know what's going through Sakurai's head, so hey, as long as it's reasonable, anyone's guess is as good as everyone else's, right?

Yeah, it could go either way. I figured the only way I could justify as many as 45 characters was to include as many clones as I could. Either way, I think Midna is a worthy inclusion.

Yes, yes she is. As the single best character in a Zelda game in ages, I will weep if she's not in in some way. Weep, and then go to the studios and start gutting people with a spoon.

Pokemon isn't really my forte', but I suspect Deoxys would have a far more interesting moveset as he has the ability (from what I understand) to alter his form to optimize attack, defence and agility.

Notice I said Deoxys was indeed the only possible replacement. He is a cool monster, but I am not that sure that he can really stand to Mewtwo's popularity.

Besides, Mewtwo needs a bit of a new moveset anyway. It just doesn't feel fine that the pokemon who was widely regarded as so powerful it was "cheap" (seriously, Mewtwo > anything else from Red and Blue) would be so weak.

But who knows, it might be a bit of a way to publicize the new guy, too .

The problem with the GBA games is that, while extrmely popular in places like North America, they are poorly regarded by Japanese FE fans. The reason I chose two characters from PoR (not from any of the Japanese games or the GBA games) is because it is the only Fire Emblem loved by Fire Emblem fans around the world. Of course, a character from the upcoming Goddess of Dawn is also a possibility...

Ahmmm... I didn't know that, tbh. If they are really so unpopular, guess that shoots my theories just in the flotation line. Pity. I still say lady Lyndis would have made an amazing addition. And it would add to gender parity

C'mon man, some of us still care about the F-Zero series. Goroh is Cpt. Falcon's main rival -and he would likely be included as his clone, which would take a fraction of the time that an original character would. And how can you go wrong by including a cheesy eighties rockstar on steriods?

Oh, I care about the F-Zero series, I like it. But Goroh is just insufferable. And his ship sucks horribly too .

Sora does stand a snowball's chance in hell, if only. He was included on Sakurai's poll, after all. I know its improbable, but he seems like the kind of curve ball that Sakurai would like to send our way (ie: Snake).

It's not that I want to hurt Sony fanboys. On the contrary, I want Sora in Brawl so that they will come over to our side. That this would also hurt Sony's evil empire is just a happy side effect.

Heh. Who knows. But I still stand by my opinion that he's extremely unlikely. He would be easy to adapt to Brawl, that much is true (B: Any of the three magics. Piro most likely. Up B: Upwards hit whose name in English I don't know. Down B: parry/counter. Forward B: Power Slide) but I'm not sure Ninty is willing to go through all the processes needed for it. I'm not sure it would be worth it, mostly.

But hey, if he's indeed in, i'm not complainin'. KH were some mighty nice games, even if Sora was a complete idiot himself (worrying trend in Square's games: the mains are usually insufferable, and the secondaries rock. Examples: Cloud: angsty idiot. Tidus: Girly idiot. Sora: Goodie-two-shoes (and what shoes ) idiot. Vaan: exasperating idiot. And I could go on). In fact, there are only two things that could ever persuade me to buy a PS3. One of them would be Disgaea 3 (please, Nippon Ichi, start doing games for the Wii!), and the other one KH3. That should be telling of just how much I like KH.

Have faith Drascin. Ridley is a highly requested character (if Sakurai's poll is any indication) and he would be incredibly original. I have no doubt he'll make it.

I do not have faith. Faith leads to hope, hope leads to expectations, expectations lead to dissapointment, dissapointment leads to anger, and after anger I'm sure you can piece the rest yourself .

Now seriously, I prefer to not have too many hopes. Being a pessimist is win-win: when things go badly, you're prepared for it, and when things go well, you're pleasantly surprised. I win either way . And if you feel Midna is too time consuming, how can you expect Ridley? I mean, he's going to take some mighty tweaking to work.

It might not be as easy as you think. Only fools dare face the wrath of Nook's Racoon Goons!

Pssshh. I fear them not, for in my side is the light and pure badassnes that the Chosen of Palutena represents. Bring on your beasts, and the light in my bow will pierce their hearts one by one.

Don't worry. Dedede was created by Sakurai himself and is the most requested characteron Sakurai's poll. He's a safe a bet.

Hoping you're right here.

To be honest, I can't tell which Megaman is which anymore. My inclination is the Zero version as he would be more unique from Samus, but I don't really care either way.

Oh, they're easy to recognize. Here you have some pointers (I'll link the images to avoid filling the post):

Megaman: This is Rock, the base Megaman, a normal robot. Notice the kiddy build he has, as Light created him to be pretty much his son.
X, or Megaman X: X is Light's last project, a Reploid (robot with independent intelligence). As Light already had faced many battles with Mega, he built X to be combat-capable from the start. Notice the more adult shape.
Megaman EXE: Not a true Mega, but simply a Navi (Navigator sentient interface) in some kid's super-PDA. Pretty bleh.
Original Zero: Created by Wily basically to oppose X, he ends up being his best friend. Yeah, irony's a ***** . Unlike X, he is primarily a melee combatant, and usually more agile too.
Future Zero: Zero's new body in a distant future. Fast, versatile, adaptable, and pretty darn stylish. This would be my personal preference. And more swordsmen are never bad .

I thought the WW Gannondorf had greater character depth, but for sheer awesomeness my nod goes to TP Gannondorf.

I dunno, I didn't find him that awesome, actually. He just felt... tacked on. WW's final battle, with the world going down around you while you have to fight (and Zelda actually being able to, y'know, aim. If you're taking the bow from me, at least learn to shoot it!) was much more awesome. And Tetra is the best Zelda ever.

PREACH IT BROTHER!

I'll be honest, I like the Wire guys too, I was merely expressing a way in which the Miis could reasonably be used. I'll probably use it very little if the feature is there, maybe just for laughs with my family. But given all miis share an animation skeleton, it would be amazingly easy to add the feature and make it optional for people who still want the wireguys. They'd share moves anyway, so it would be pretty much the same.

 

[Wiseguy]

Morning all. True to his word Sakurai gave us another juicy update, putting to rest the widespread fear that Mario and Link would be cut for Brawl. Oh well, if Sakursi continues the trend of giving profiles for two characters every weekday, at least we'll see someone new eventually...

Alrite, time to insult Wiseguy, I bet he's excited! I'm going a little out of order=heads up!

Do your worst.

Alrite my complaints:
1.Mario series: Bowser Jr. is the only argueable one, but he'll most likely not make it. I give him a 40% chance at being in Brawl, but that's not a big deal, so idc that much.

I don't don't know, I'd give Bowser jr. a little higher than that (55% maybe) as it seems only fair that the Mario series gets as many reps as Zelda. He just seesms like the most worthy addition after all the usual suspects (Mario, Luigi, Peach and Bowser).

2.Donkey Kong series: What about our 3rd DKC heroin Dixie Kong, who is clearly more important that King K. Rool. But I'd say it'd be DK, Diddy, Dixie, and then possibly King K. Rool.

How exactly is Dixie more important that K.Rool? Sure, she was playable in two DKC games, but K.Rool has been with the series. If they have to design another Dk character with an original moveset, I think K.Rool would be a more unique addition than another monkey.

3.tLOZ: Here's the big stuff, and I'll repeat myself again, Midna (Twili form) isn't going to happen, but here imp form, or Midna with Wolf Link could and one of those two probably will. I still don't see why you think there will be so many clones when this is Nintendo's biggest project, and Nintendo is backing this up more than any project in the past, just look at the musical talents! The one thing that I really like is that you got my top pick WW Link in there=o ya!

Fact: clones require far less time to program into the game than original characters. I've heard it estimated that three clones can be included in the time that one orginal could be included.

Fact: regardless of how long the Smash team has to work on the game, their time is finite. They are working on a squedule. Maybe (as they led us to believe) they are going to release the game this year. Maybe later than that. But they are working under deadlines and time constraints.

Fact: the Smash team could include far more characters if they included some clones than if they didin't. I know some have argued that the Smash team could simply take as long as they need to design unique movesets for all their characters, but regardless how much time they have, they could still include more characters if they included some clones in those final few months. If clones do, in fact, take only a third of the development time then (using my list as an example) it will come down to a decision of either including 39 original characters total or (as I predicted) 36 originals and 9 clones for a total of 45 characters. So, while making Midna, Goroh and Dark Samus as clones may leave bad taste in some people's mouths it also allows six more characters to be included. More characters=more choice=more fun.

4.Pokemon: You stole that pic of Deoxys from one of my previous posts, didn't you=?, because I used to use that pic! Anyways, do I need to raise the Mewtwo arguement again, in the fact that Mewtwo is up there competing for the 2nd most popular Pokemon character, and he is the only real villian Pokemon in the Pokemon series, and we don't want to lose villains, now do we=? They keep the world nice and safe! Also note as Nintendo's #2 selling series, and the #2 selling series of all time, 4 characters is not enough!

Don't blame me, blame google image search.

Although I don't have tremendously strong feelings about Mewtwo or deoxys, I do think that including as many new characters as possible is a must. Unfortunatly, that means characters like Mewtwo (who was big in the anime', from what I here, but no longer that important in the games) will likely be replaced.

5.Metroid: I agree with everything, and I'm pretty sure Zamus and Samus will be in diffrent character slots, not like the Zelda/Shiek transformation, considering the suit coming off came from Zero Mission, where the suit sheded off.

Nope. Sakurai's official site stated that Zamus was not a "pure character addition" but instead is playable only under "certain conditions" upon which time Samus would remove her suit. Too bad, becuase I think two character slots would be the way to go as well.

7.Star Fox: I have to tell you that only the Mario, Pokemon, LOZ, Donkey Kong, and Metroid are the only Nintendo series to sell more units than Star Fox. All of them got 4 (exxcept Donkey kong), and considering Wolf and Krystal are some of the most desired characters for Brawl, I see no reason why both of them can't be in, when they are far more important that Bowser Jr., Twili Midna, and Sora, so why not Wolf=?

In my list, I gave the Starfox series three character slots - two original characters and one clone. With Fox confrimed and Krystal a safe bet, it come down to either Falco or Wolf being Fox's clone. Four characters would be stretching it, in my view, as Starfox doesn't deserve the same level of representation as Pokemon or Metroid. Three is a fair number.

8.Fire Emblem: Marth, Marth, Marth=a huge character to the series. Why did you put the black knigh up there, when Marth is the most important character to the series with Ike or course. Roy can go either way, but I think for the 3rd slot we'll most likely go to either Sigurd, Roy, or Hector.

Marth, a huge character in the Fire Emblem series? Far from it. Marth is not Fire Emblem's answer to Link because he hasn't starred in a Fire emblem game in over a decade. Even worse, his two games will never be played by the majority of Fire Emblem fans because they have never been released outside Japan. Sorry to burst your bubble, but FE ain't what it usded to be inside Japan. Currently, far more FE games are sold in the rest of the world (ie: North America, Europe, Australia, etc.) than inside the Land of the Rising Sun.

Let's be clear: Ike (the character with the original moveset) is my predicted replacement for Marth. The Black Knight (the clone) is who I believe will replace Roy. On Sakurai's poll, Ike was by far the most requested FE character (the second highest out of all the characters listed) and the majority of the other FE characters listed were also from PoR (Soren, Mia and the Black Knight). This demonstrates that PoR is beloved by fans in Japan as well as the rest of the world, so having Ike as the new FE representative just makes more sense.

9.F-Zero: Agree 100%, but Samurai Goroh should be original, there is no excuse for any clones.

Would it really be so bad? clones like Luigi, Ganondorf and Young Link are drastically different from the characters they are based on. When done correctly, a clone can be just as fun to play as as the original.

10.Earthbound/Mother: I've played Earthbound since last time, and I know how much you hate Japan only characters, but if a Mother 2 character made it along with Ness, it would be Paula, and if not Jeff, and if not Poo, but most likely Paula. Funny note, Ness doesn't even know PK Thunder or PK Fire, he stole those moves in SSB from Paula! She should steal some of Ness' moves to get revenge, but I'm still for Lucas in Brawl, just as long as he doesn't replace my main man Ness!

Its hard to say, really. Any of the possibilites you mentioned could happen. I'll stick with my prediction, though, until reality proves me wrong.

11.Other Nintendo characters: Mii's wouldn't be worth the work, and they would take soo much longer to make than other characters. Also Tom Nook can't fight, and if any Animal Crossing character made it, it would be Reseti (the mole). The characters in AC can be done in the Mii's, exactly (the Mii's are AC characters with customization and some new looks). Drop Tom Nook and Mii', in the end they just aren't worth it (funny Mii pics though).

How would Mii take longer? The only thing customizable would be their face, and all the facial characteristics are already made for them in the Mii Channel.

Tom Nook has never thown a punch in his life (that we know of...) but that never stopped Fox, Capt. Falcon and Sheik from being included.

3rd Party: Sakurai said it himself he only plans to have 1 or 2 other 3rd party characters other than Snake, and I say 4 is the max. Belmont is a no, we don't want Koonami being favoritized by Nintendo, plus there are a ton more desired characters. Sora was only in a mediocore KH GBA game (in which I want the PS2 remake, RE-Chains of Memories, which is in 3D, and is a Japan only title=the ultimate evil with Mother 1 and 3! ).

Yeah, my 3rd party predictions are pretty optimistic. I chose the characters I think Sakurai would like to include, based on his poll.

Belmont is actually even more likely than Sonic, becuase Konami has demonstrated that they are willing to include thier characters in Smash Bros. I justified including two konami and Square Enix characters becuase those companies lack a mascot like Sonic or Megaman. So, I chose one retro character from their past partnerships with Nintendo (Simon B. and Geno) as well as one of their currently popular characters that is more commonly associated with Sony (Snake and Sora).

Just as Snake was included after a single gamecube port, Sora could potentially be inlcuded as well - even though his claim to fame is his PS2 games.

Other than that, Sonic, Megaman, and Geno (in that order) should be the only 3rd party characters we should expect, and no more than 4, in which even I make somewhat of a strech, but Geno was in a Mario game, so that could sneak him in Brawl

The message I got from Sakurai's quote was that he wasn't sure if he could cut through the red tape required to get companies like Sega, Capcom and Square on board. If only three characters get in Brawl, expect all of them to be owned by Konami (ie: Snake, Belmont and *shudders* Bomerman.)

I still can't explain how much just because a character is old, doesn't mean they suck. SSB is about fighting with Nintendo's best and a few 3rd party characters, and besides the Ice Climbers are on Ice Climber, which is now on the Wii Virtual Console=awsome game=SMB orignal backup on the NES. Also G&W really helped start Nintendo off in video gaming, and for that reason alone he should be in, not to mention he's awsome. Still, I would like him to actually be 3D this time, even if I like the retro 3D look.

ICs & G&W don't suck, they were awesome guest characters. I just want a new pair of obscure Nintendo characters to take their place.

Pichu and Doc I agree (even if I like Doc), but Doc can be preserved without leaving! Simply put, have him as a Mario outfit, and have his fireballs changed to capsules, but still do the exact same thing, that way Doc is never truely gone! Roy can go either way IMO, and I'm not sure what will happen to him. I want him to return (with everyone else), but since he's one of my 6th best character, (I'm only better with Link, Fox, Falco, Peach, and YLink) so I do not want to see him go, bu I want him to be Luigified, minus the insane WD of course!

What's the point in including Doc at all if not as a clone? Having his as a pill-less alternate costume would just remind us of what he could have been. Beisdes, 70% of the time neccessary to program Dr. Mario is likely his appearance, so if they decided to go that route, why not go all the way and give him his pill attack and his own charcater slot?

Now for Shiek, she has a bit less of a chance than Roy (I give her 30% at the most. Sure Zelda will be updated, but Shiek could be here own character, and own character slot. She doesn't have to be as "cheap" as you say, but then again, isn't Falco top tier (tied my 2nd best with Fox)=? Marth won't go, unless Sakurai wants to suck all the fun out of tournaments...who next Falco=???? Anyways, the thread where I yell and complain the most is back, and better than ever=yae!

Tournaments are fun in spite of Marth, Sheik, Fox and Falco - not becuase of them. I think most people would prefer that Brawl be a balanced game like SSB 64 where no character gives the player a huge advatange. Expect to see Fox and Falco nerfed to pieced, Ike included as a slower and less cheap Marth replacement and Sheik purged from existance for all time.

Even if you could make a Chewbacca Mii (I have an undying love for wookies) I wouldn't want to hurt him Naruto on the other hand...

What do you mean "if"?

With the wireframes for example, who you got would be completely random and while depending on how Mii happy you are you might get someone interesting to smash off stage there's a very high chance there'll be a large bank of pre-generated Mii's to randomise them from. Instead of getting to smash Naruto repeatedly in the face, instead you'd get to smash "Chris" and "Kate" and "Bob" and a whole lot of other randomly generated weird looking people which you have to admit just wouldn't be as much fun. How would the Mii character select work anyone? Browse over the Mii character icon and it'll pop up with a list of Mii's to choose from? As I said there'd have to be pre-generated ones for the extremely unlikely cases that the person won't have created any Mii's and what would happen in the case of one of those people that goes Mii-crazy, spends all day not playing Zelda for the past 7 months creating Mii's instead and then goes and trades a whole bunch more with their Mii-happy friend who's done the same. How many pages of a possible Mii pop-up character selection would there have to be!?

In games like Wii Bowling, all the spectators watching your character bowl are randomly generated from your Mii channel. Likewise, unless your plaza is an empty room, the Miis you fight in Brawl could be taken directly from the Mii chanel.

But you have to admit that the music is simply supremely funky

=<

Sakurai must have thought so too, since he put the guy on his staff. Maybe he's in charge of the music for a Mii-themed stage? Although, I don't even know what that could be... Mii Plaza?

Yeah. And after all, none of us know what's going through Sakurai's head, so hey, as long as it's reasonable, anyone's guess is as good as everyone else's, right?

True enough.

Oh, I care about the F-Zero series, I like it. But Goroh is just insufferable. And his ship sucks horribly too .

Well, at least you'd have another character to enoy beating the crap out of...

Heh. Who knows. But I still stand by my opinion that he's extremely unlikely. He would be easy to adapt to Brawl, that much is true (B: Any of the three magics. Piro most likely. Up B: Upwards hit whose name in English I don't know. Down B: parry/counter. Forward B: Power Slide) but I'm not sure Ninty is willing to go through all the processes needed for it. I'm not sure it would be worth it, mostly.

But hey, if he's indeed in, i'm not complainin'. KH were some mighty nice games, even if Sora was a complete idiot himself (worrying trend in Square's games: the mains are usually insufferable, and the secondaries rock. Examples: Cloud: angsty idiot. Tidus: Girly idiot. Sora: Goodie-two-shoes (and what shoes ) idiot. Vaan: exasperating idiot. And I could go on). In fact, there are only two things that could ever persuade me to buy a PS3. One of them would be Disgaea 3 (please, Nippon Ichi, start doing games for the Wii!), and the other one KH3. That should be telling of just how much I like KH.

So far, my Square Enix RPG experience is limited to Dargon Quest VIII (awesome game, by the way) as I don't own my own PS2 ( I just borrowed my friend's last summer...) but if Sora was included, and enough KH fans bought a Wii as a result, we could expect to see a lot more RPGs on Wii.

I know its improbable, I've got this feeling...

I do not have faith. Faith leads to hope, hope leads to expectations, expectations lead to dissapointment, dissapointment leads to anger, and after anger I'm sure you can piece the rest yourself .

Now seriously, I prefer to not have too many hopes. Being a pessimist is win-win: when things go badly, you're prepared for it, and when things go well, you're pleasantly surprised. I win either way . And if you feel Midna is too time consuming, how can you expect Ridley? I mean, he's going to take some mighty tweaking to work.

I try to keep my expectations in check, but fail every time. I'm a hopeless optimist.

Its not that Midna would be too time consuming to be included, its just that she has the potential to be included as a clone (if they go with her Twili version, that is). It would be a lot harder to make Ridley a clone of another character. He's also a lot more important to his respective series thatn Midna is to hers.

Oh, they're easy to recognize. Here you have some pointers (I'll link the images to avoid filling the post):

Megaman: This is Rock, the base Megaman, a normal robot. Notice the kiddy build he has, as Light created him to be pretty much his son.
X, or Megaman X: X is Light's last project, a Reploid (robot with independent intelligence). As Light already had faced many battles with Mega, he built X to be combat-capable from the start. Notice the more adult shape.
Megaman EXE: Not a true Mega, but simply a Navi (Navigator sentient interface) in some kid's super-PDA. Pretty bleh.
Original Zero: Created by Wily basically to oppose X, he ends up being his best friend. Yeah, irony's a ***** . Unlike X, he is primarily a melee combatant, and usually more agile too.
Future Zero: Zero's new body in a distant future. Fast, versatile, adaptable, and pretty darn stylish. This would be my personal preference. And more swordsmen are never bad .

Thanks for that history lesson. I'm not sure which character Sakurai would go with, although one of them is all but guaranteed if they can negociate a deal with Capcom.

I dunno, I didn't find him that awesome, actually. He just felt... tacked on. WW's final battle, with the world going down around you while you have to fight (and Zelda actually being able to, y'know, aim. If you're taking the bow from me, at least learn to shoot it!) was much more awesome. And Tetra is the best Zelda ever.

Tetra was far more interesting, I'll give you that. TP Zelda might be the most boring Zelda ever.

I'll be honest, I like the Wire guys too, I was merely expressing a way in which the Miis could reasonably be used. I'll probably use it very little if the feature is there, maybe just for laughs with my family. But given all miis share an animation skeleton, it would be amazingly easy to add the feature and make it optional for people who still want the wireguys. They'd share moves anyway, so it would be pretty much the same.

I couldn't agree more. I don't get the apparent anti-Mii setiment of that many people on Smash Boards seems to have. Miis would be prefect for Brawl. There is no reason for them NOT to be included - if you ask me.

 

[Icy_Eagle]

Meh. Bomerman is boring. Samus and link already use bombs, Snake's moveset is based almost entirely on explosives and there will undoubtably be numerous bomb related items and stage hazzards. Simply put, he brings nothing new to the roster. Still a possibility, though.

So by your logic Ike shouldn't make it in because we already have Link and dedede shouldn't either since he has floating, swallowing and spitting like Kirby.
And whether you find him boring or not doesn't affect his chances (if you were saying that) he does have quite a few things that could boost his chances.

Tom Nook has never thown a punch in his life (that we know of...) but that never stopped Fox, Capt. Falcon and Sheik from being included.

True, but capt.falcon is a bounty hunter, fox got his excuses too and sheik is trained as a sheikah which are ninja like race. Tom nook on the other hand is a store keeper so he does make less sense than the other 3. I wouldn't really mind him though.

 

[Wiseguy]

So by your logic Ike shouldn't make it in because we already have Link and dedede shouldn't either since he has floating, swallowing and spitting like Kirby.
And whether you find him boring or not doesn't affect his chances (if you were saying that) he does have quite a few things that could boost his chances.

True, my opinion is irrelivant to this discusion. But I think that Bomberman's moveset, objectivly speaking, doesn't bring anything new or exciting to the table that would prompt Nintendo to pay give a big fat check to Hudson for the right to include Bomerman. Simply put: it would be alot of time and effort just for another bomb themed character. If he were already owned by Nintendo, or if Hudson approaches Nintendo becuase THEY want to increase his profile, then he would stand a shot. As it stands, I doubt it.

 

[Icy_Eagle]

You're probably right about the hudson thing. But concerning his moveset it can easily be made unique, just like every other characters can. I think he would be much more crazier than link in bomb using and he could have multiple types of bombs from his games, like ice bombs for example.

Meh. I guess I just want Bomberman too badly to be in the game

You got to admit he's pretty cool

 

[Wiseguy]

You're probably right about the hudson thing. But concerning his moveset it can easily be made unique, just like every other characters can. I think he would be much more crazier than link in bomb using and he could have multiple types of bombs from his games, like ice bombs for example.

Meh. I guess I just want Bomberman too badly to be in the game

You got to admit he's pretty cool

Bomberman's inclusion certainly isn't impossible. Hudson is owned Konami, which also owns Solid Snake. However, while Bomerman certainly could be made unique, he just doesn't seem to have the same potential for an utterly unique moveset like Sonic or Simon Belmont. Still, he has his iconic status going for him, so maybe I'll be proved wrong in the weeks to come...

 

[Vali]

Morning all. True to his word Sakurai gave us another juicy update, putting to rest the widespread fear that Mario and Link would be cut for Brawl. Oh well, if Sakursi continues the trend of giving profiles for two characters every weekday, at least we'll see someone new eventually...

I actually would've prefered the Janitorial staff. What I don't get is everyone is saying "Be grateful we're getting frequent updates." but we're getting frequent updates on freakin' nothing. I don't see why they couldn't just have given us a new trailer and update the site regularly too. Just something to tide over the people that have been waiting 6 months since the last actual update with some news instead of that website stuff. I know that nothing but a major website update was promised but they knew full well that they were doing a huge countdown to it 6 months after our last update which was 6 months after the one before it.

Nope. Sakurai's official site stated that Zamus was not a "pure character addition" but instead is playable only under "certain conditions" upon which time Samus would remove her suit. Too bad, becuase I think two character slots would be the way to go as well.

My betting is Samus' super move will be that attack we saw in the first trailer, armour gets blown off, voila Z.Samus. Don't know why they'd show the armour getting blown off that way otherwise, maybe just to tease us about a super charge shot.

On Sakurai's poll, Ike was by far the most requested FE character (the second highest out of all the characters listed)

Ah, but Marth wasn't there, so you couldn't use that to compare their popularity. Marth was top of Melee's poll too, so sucks to Ike .

The message I got from Sakurai's quote was that he wasn't sure if he could cut through the red tape required to get companies like Sega, Capcom and Square on board.

With Konami on board with Snake boosting his reputation through quite possibly the most anticipated/hyped game ever, I think Sega/Capcom/Square would have to be pretty stupid to deny their characters a chance of showing if requested. If that's what you meant by "cut through the red tape required"

What do you mean "if"?

That ain't Chewy, that's some freak-faced guy ;_; Chewy would never wear a shirt and trousers!

In games like Wii Bowling, all the spectators watching your character bowl are randomly generated from your Mii channel. Likewise, unless your plaza is an empty room, the Miis you fight in Brawl could be taken directly from the Mii channel.

Doesn't address my concern of having to flick through a possibly infinite menu of Mii's to find the one character you want. That'd suck for Miithusiasts.

Sakurai must have thought so too, since he put the guy on his staff. Maybe he's in charge of the music for a Mii-themed stage? Although, I don't even know what that could be... Mii Plaza?

Online lobby room, online lobby room, online lobby room, online lobby room. Mii-themed stage? Gah!

I couldn't agree more. I don't get the apparent anti-Mii setiment of that many people on Smash Boards seems to have. Miis would be prefect for Brawl. There is no reason for them NOT to be included - if you ask me.

My main objection with them is them as a playable character. While I wouldn't particularly like to see them added instead of the now-classic wireframe, I wouldn't have as many gripes with it as if they were implemented as a playable character. Smash Bros. is all about your favourite videogame characters duking it out, and I for one wouldn't consider the Mii to be a videogame character.

I think Mii more represents the casual crowd of gaming than the more hardcore crowd and unquestionably Smash Bros. is aimed at the latter. That is just my opinion though, I'm sure there's plenty of casual gamers that are looking forward to Smash Bros. and lots of hardcore players that love Mii's but nevertheless I for one would prefer a serious VC added in instead.

Mii vs Mii, <whoever the hell you make> vs <whoever the hell you want to fight him with>, has limited appeal to me. While others would surely enjoy that option I do stand by my belief that it'd end up pretty boring quite quickly especially considering the fact that all Mii's will have the same generic moveset. To quote your previous post of yours on this subject:

"who would win in a fight between Mr. Rogers, Chewbacca, Agent Smith and Naruto?"

Yes while having them fight would certainly be appealing to people, you can't truly tell me that Naruto will fight exactly like Agent Smith and that Chewbacca would use the same moves as Mr. Rogers. Instead of getting a fight between them you'd end up with all the fighting styles bundled into one Mii-specific generic moveset losing the uniqueness and style that would make people want to have them fighting in the first place. After all, who the hell wants to fight Chuck Norris if Chuck Norris fights the same as Santa Claus or some randomly generated girl? There'd really be no point to it.

Mii's as an avatar for online i can agree with and it'd be another awesome way to show off your inventive Mii's to the world(/smash community) or just represent who you are. Wireframe replacement? More meh. Playable character? No thanks.

On an entirely different note this seems to be the only place left on SWF where there's a good debate to be had. Since the Brawl countdown was coming near an end, character discussion has been much more of a ghost town and even then the relatively structured, articulated debates have all but vanished. Long live this thread?

(have to say though, thinking up decent arguments against Mii's is quite a bit harder than most suggestions i've disagreeed with so far)

 

[Icy_Eagle]

I think Mii more represents the casual crowd of gaming than the more hardcore crowd and unquestionably Smash Bros. is aimed at the latter. That is just my opinion though, I'm sure there's plenty of casual gamers that are looking forward to Smash Bros. and lots of hardcore players that love Mii's but nevertheless I for one would prefer a serious VC added in instead.

With about 7 millions copies of melee being sold, I really doubt that the smash bros is aimed at the hardcore players. Besides nintendo states that the game is supposed to be easy to pickup and play which doesn't sound so hardcore.

 

[Wiseguy]

I actually would've prefered the Janitorial staff. What I don't get is everyone is saying "Be grateful we're getting frequent updates." but we're getting frequent updates on freakin' nothing. I don't see why they couldn't just have given us a new trailer and update the site regularly too. Just something to tide over the people that have been waiting 6 months since the last actual update with some news instead of that website stuff. I know that nothing but a major website update was promised but they knew full well that they were doing a huge countdown to it 6 months after our last update which was 6 months after the one before it.

I couldn't have said it better myself. Sakurai must have known we would go nuts the moment that countdown went up. Here's hoping we get some new info pronto.

My betting is Samus' super move will be that attack we saw in the first trailer, armour gets blown off, voila Z.Samus. Don't know why they'd show the armour getting blown off that way otherwise, maybe just to tease us about a super charge shot.

That's my inclination as well, though that would sure suck for people who only want to play as Zamus...

Ah, but Marth wasn't there, so you couldn't use that to compare their popularity. Marth was top of Melee's poll too, so sucks to Ike .

Yeah, your right. But my point is that it wouldn't be a total snub to Japanese FE gamers, because they love Ike as well. I say only one blue haired, sword weilding Fire emblem lord with a cape per Smash Bros instalment.

With Konami on board with Snake boosting his reputation through quite possibly the most anticipated/hyped game ever, I think Sega/Capcom/Square would have to be pretty stupid to deny their characters a chance of showing if requested. If that's what you meant by "cut through the red tape required"

If I know anything, its never underestimate human stupidity.

That ain't Chewy, that's some freak-faced guy ;_; Chewy would never wear a shirt and trousers!

Picky picky.

Doesn't address my concern of having to flick through a possibly infinite menu of Mii's to find the one character you want. That'd suck for Miithusiasts.

Okay, every Smash save file has a maximum of five Mii slots that can be selected when you put the cursor over Mii on the character select screen. You can choose any 5 from your Mii Channel at one time. Everyone wins.

My main objection with them is them as a playable character. While I wouldn't particularly like to see them added instead of the now-classic wireframe, I wouldn't have as many gripes with it as if they were implemented as a playable character. Smash Bros. is all about your favourite videogame characters duking it out, and I for one wouldn't consider the Mii to be a videogame character.

I suppose its a matter of perspective. Some see Mii as a character, others don't. Will Sakurai? I hope so.

I think Mii more represents the casual crowd of gaming than the more hardcore crowd and unquestionably Smash Bros. is aimed at the latter. That is just my opinion though, I'm sure there's plenty of casual gamers that are looking forward to Smash Bros. and lots of hardcore players that love Mii's but nevertheless I for one would prefer a serious VC added in instead.

Like I said, Smash has always welcomed a diverse group of videogame fans. Including the Wii Sports/Brainage crowd is the next logical step, the way I see it.

Mii vs Mii, <whoever the hell you make> vs <whoever the hell you want to fight him with>, has limited appeal to me. While others would surely enjoy that option I do stand by my belief that it'd end up pretty boring quite quickly especially considering the fact that all Mii's will have the same generic moveset. To quote your previous post of yours on this subject:

Yes while having them fight would certainly be appealing to people, you can't truly tell me that Naruto will fight exactly like Agent Smith and that Chewbacca would use the same moves as Mr. Rogers. Instead of getting a fight between them you'd end up with all the fighting styles bundled into one Mii-specific generic moveset losing the uniqueness and style that would make people want to have them fighting in the first place. After all, who the hell wants to fight Chuck Norris if Chuck Norris fights the same as Santa Claus or some randomly generated girl? There'd really be no point to it.

Mii's as an avatar for online i can agree with and it'd be another awesome way to show off your inventive Mii's to the world(/smash community) or just represent who you are. Wireframe replacement? More meh. Playable character? No thanks.

Inevitably, not all the characters in Smash are going to appeal to all people. I may not care to play as a Pokemon. Someone else may hate Olimar (although I can't imagine why ) But I think there are enough Mii fans out there that would enjoy his/her inclusion that he/she would be a worthy addition to the roster.




(Dang it! I was sure that the Chewbacca would convince him.)

On an entirely different note this seems to be the only place left on SWF where there's a good debate to be had. Since the Brawl countdown was coming near an end, character discussion has been much more of a ghost town and even then the relatively structured, articulated debates have all but vanished. Long live this thread?

(have to say though, thinking up decent arguments against Mii's is quite a bit harder than most suggestions i've disagreeed with so far)

I'm glad you feel that way. The problem with many topics on the Character discussion forrum is that people will snap at you if you get off topic, so it winds up being the same three people exchanging insults. In a thread like this, the topic is anything Brawl character related, so it makes for a more interesting discussion.

On that note, I'm off to work. Wiseguy out.

 

[Joka]

Klonoa (along with Viewtiful Joe, Earthworm Jim and Bonk) would be prefect for Smash. Unfortunatly, since they are neither owned by Nintendo nor represent major franchises, I don't think these awesome characters stand much of a chance. Dare to dream, Joka, dare to dream.

Well, is Snake owned by Nintendo? And if Snake can get in the game, then so can Klonoa! I mean, Klonoa has games on the GBA! I know that doesn't mean much, but it's a start! Really, Klonoa will be a great addition to Brawl!

 

[Vali]

That's an unhealthy obsession you have going there. Just a tip, don't post "Nominate Klonoa" on the "Which characters are going to return from Melee?" thread.

 

[Smady]

That would be a silly thing to do.

 

[Joka]

Sorry...

Klonoa is one of my most requested characters (besides Dedede, Lucario and Stafy), and he needs more respect in his series. He looks like a well rounded character and can fight really well! (I mean, he was in Namco X Capcom)

 

[Smady]

Klonoa's a lot like Tombi, extremely under-rated. Tombi! and that game Klonoa's in are the greatest games of their genres but got little attention and lacking sequels. They need to make another Tombi!

 

[Joka]

Well, Klonoa has had more games than Tombi (Tombi's that jungle guy, right?)! His last game was a full-out RPG on the Game Boy Advance, which is a bit outstanding in the series. But still, Klonoa is an athletic character, good with jumps and a decent fighter.

 

[Vali]

That doesn't qualify him for "Returning Melee character" unfortunately.

 

[Smady]

Klonoa has a bigger chance because his series died long after Tombi (let's face it) and Tombi was a Sony exclusive. Tombi would be better for 'Brawl, though. He swings, climbs and has many weapons.

 

[Joka]

Klonoa has a wind ring, a wind sword, a hammer, a parasol, a boomerang and arm maces, all which appeared in the RPG. But Klonoa's series hasn't died out, since he's in the DS game QuickSpot.

 

[Vali]

I'd hardly call that a continuation of the series. More a cameo.

 

[Joka]

Well, it proves Klonoa hasn't been forgotten.

 

[Smady]

Tombi > Klonoa.

 

[Vali]

Only if he comes with the series antagonist "The Real Evil Pig". He just sounds...awesome.

 

[Smady]

I never finished Tombi. I played it every day for hours and hours though... I got it recently and plan to finish it this summer.

 

[Joka]

Meh...I'm still hoping on Klonoa.

 

[Vali]

Still no pictures of the Janitorial staff, why must Sakurai keep us in suspense like this? I'm not even a huge fan of items and this latest one doesn't exactly enthrall me. Someone posted a link from GoNintendo too about something like "There won't be any major Brawl or Galaxy news until E3" meaning that basically the Nintendo Summit embargo thing was on pretty much nothing major (big surprise there) and we're probably gonna have to wait around 2 months for any decent Brawl news? Sounds like fun to me.

http://gonintendo.com/?p=18398

 

[Wiseguy]

Klonoa (along with Viewtiful Joe, Earthworm Jim and Bonk) would be prefect for Smash. Unfortunatly, since they are neither owned by Nintendo nor represent major franchises, I don't think these awesome characters stand much of a chance. Dare to dream, Joka, dare to dream.

Well, is Snake owned by Nintendo? And if Snake can get in the game, then so can Klonoa! I mean, Klonoa has games on the GBA! I know that doesn't mean much, but it's a start! Really, Klonoa will be a great addition to Brawl!

Snake obviously isn't owned by Nintendo - but he does represent one of the most popular and critically acclaimed video game franchises. Klaona? Not so much, unfortunatly.

Two items on the agenda today:

1) New information on Smash Dojo! O.k, I know most of you won't find the Gooey Bomb that exciting (since practically everyone has a cronic fear of items that prompts them to turn them off - even during casual play). C'mon people, items are one of the best parts of Smash and the Gooey Bomb actually looks like a pretty fun addition. However, I think this update proves that Sakurai is intent on dispensing his information in tiny, bite sized peiced from now, until the end of time (or, you know, Brawl is actually released. Whichever comes first.) I want predictions: what will be revealed next? With it be a list of the janitoral staff, or the entire character roster? I'm guessing somewhere in between....

2) Since the thread is starting to diminish again, it's up to me to take desperate messures in order to keep my thread alive. So, rather than have people simply rate my character predictions, I issue the following challenge: tell me how YOU would arrange the character roster in 40 or less characters. The catch: an original character counts for one character slot while a clone counts for 1/3 (assuming that they take a third of the development time, for the sake of argument). For example: my roster has 45 characters total, but since 9 of them are clones the actual total is 39. It can be a wishlist, or an educated guess on what you think the roster will be. Let's see who's up to the challenge...

 

[Vali]

That means you still have 1 pick left Wiseguy, throw another one in there.

 

[Wiseguy]

That means you still have 1 pick left Wiseguy, throw another one in there.

Geez, way to put me on the spot! Okay, I'll get on it right now (these things take time. I need to find a picture, and think of witty commentary....) but I better start seeing some character lists pronto!

 

[Vali]

Geez, way to put me on the spot! Okay, I'll get on it right now (these things take time. I need to find a picture, and think of witty commentary....) but I better start seeing some character lists pronto!

What were you thinking about list-wise anyway? Do you want a full-blown list with pictures and explanations like your first post or just a simple list stating the characters?

 

[Wiseguy]

Just a simple list. Waiting for everyone to find 40-45 pictures with long comments on all of them would take forever...