Prepare to be Astounded One Last Time: Wiseguy’s Brawl Predictions THE FINAL VERSION!

[Brawlmatt202]

Don't worry about it.

Okey-dokey, then.

You know, I should make my own list, now that I think about it. Several other people have made some, but I'll have to make mine GOOD! With good reasons for my ideas.

 

[Johnknight1]

Okey-dokey, then.

You know, I should make my own list, now that I think about it. Several other people have made some, but I'll have to make mine GOOD! With good reasons for my ideas.

Ya I was thinking the exact same thing, but I wonder what it would look like. It probably would be very simliar to my previous list, but I think I could definitely improve it. Seeing your list would be very intresting Brawlmatt.

 

[Wiseguy]

Okey-dokey, then.

You know, I should make my own list, now that I think about it. Several other people have made some, but I'll have to make mine GOOD! With good reasons for my ideas.

Ya I was thinking the exact same thing, but I wonder what it would look like. It probably would be very simliar to my previous list, but I think I could definitely improve it. Seeing your list would be very intresting Brawlmatt.

Great idea guys. I'll look forward to seeing your character lists. I would love to see a resurgence in charcater prediction threads.

Also, a special thanks to Mendez for keeping my thread alive with his Meat Knight joke.

 

[Chief Mendez]

I do what I can.

 

[Johnknight1]

Chief I think a list of your SSBB choices would be very intresting as well. I seriously wonder what it would look like, ever thought of making a thread with that, lol? I couldn't imagine what your list would look like=? It was easily be...very intresting to say the least.

 

[insobias]

this is pretty awesome

 

[Wiseguy]

this is pretty awesome

Thanks (I'll assume you are referring to my charcater list and not Mendez's skill with Microsoft paint).

Not to be a wet blanket, but it makes for more interesting discussion if you elaborate on what you find so awesome. Just a suggestion.

 

[Nietendodude]

I like your list very good.

 

[Meta_Owns_Ur_Dad]

i dont if this has been said but Sora IS impossible, he did not originate on a nintendo console. I'm giving this a 5/10 because half of them are good and the other half....bleh.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

They only have to have appeared on a Nintendo console, otherwise using your logic Sonic wouldn't be able to get in then either.

 

[Banks]

people should stop making lists, because you can say anyone from any nintendo game. basically we are just seeing who can name the most nintendo characters.

 

[Wiseguy]

I like your list very good.

Thabk you. Glad you enjoyed it.

i dont if this has been said but Sora IS impossible, he did not originate on a nintendo console. I'm giving this a 5/10 because half of them are good and the other half....bleh.

Like Luke said, a character only has to have appeared on a nintendo console at some point to be eligable. Sora stared in his own GBA game, so he fits the bill.

As for your grade, I repsect your decision - but would you mind getting into specifics? Which half of my charcaters should appear and which should not?

people should stop making lists, because you can say anyone from any nintendo game. basically we are just seeing who can name the most nintendo characters.

Maybe character lists don't solve world hunger or cure diseases (which is clearly what all your threads must do) but I'd see them as any more pointless than any other kind of thread. We're just killing time between Smash trailers making some harmless speculation about who will and won't appear in the game. That's the point of the charcater discussion forums.

Yeah, your right that anyone can just make a list of videogame characters and call it a charcater list, but the one's worth their salt actually give justifications for their choices and and devise a list that is as close as possible to what the real thing might be, given the information available. If you'd care to tell me how I failed in this regard, feel free to point out how.

 

[Johnknight1]

people should stop making lists, because you can say anyone from any nintendo game. basically we are just seeing who can name the most nintendo characters.

not really...this is character discussion! It is one thing to make a list another to make a list and back up your reasoning. It isn't naming who the most Nintendo characters, it is thinking of the most logical Nintendo characters, with maybe 10 or so 3rd party characters, and coming up with who has the best shots, why, and who you think will make it in, and who won't.

Then you must justify your reasoning and say why you think so and so should or is highly probably to make a appearance to SSBB. You can do what you want, and this is what we want to do, you can go on all the other threads and go do what you want to do. O, and prove how we are naming the most Nintendo characters=owned!

 

[Chief Mendez]

Chief I think a list of your SSBB choices would be very intresting as well. I seriously wonder what it would look like, ever thought of making a thread with that, lol? I couldn't imagine what your list would look like=? It was easily be...very intresting to say the least.

Uh, well, the thing is...that would require time. Time that I fortunately lack because Pokemon Diamond.

But in the future? Probably.

 

[Joka]

I can really see Dedede and either Lucario or Deoxys in the game. But what about other third party characters? Like Klonoa?

 

[Fawriel]

Wasn't Klonoa a character from the same firm that made Pacman? I'd say if they get to have a representative in Brawl, he's the best choice that *isn't* ********.

 

[Smady]

I liked quite a few of your choices, but nearer the end when you started requesting characters like Sora to spite Sony fanboys, you went a little too far. Sora... In 'Brawl? You mention Sora over Skull kid? That's awful.

But everything else was great, nothing really to complain about. I couldn't possibly pick a single suggestion that I disagree with drastically.

 

[Vali]

Seems like a well thought list, 8/10, the smart choices speak for themselves so I'll just take a little time to point out where I necessarily don't agree you with.

Mario

You seriously even considered that he had a chance in getting in brawl? Speak about unrealistic...

Midna (twili form)

While obviously since we know practically nothing about the true form of Midna she would technically have a limitless moveset, I think that it takes away from the originality that Midna embodies in Imp form. Another humanoid probably magic caster? As you said, it smacks of being a Zelda clone and I personally believe that no clones will be included in Brawl. Bit controversial for me since your list contains 9 clones, which isn't unrealistic to believe since a roster of 45 unique characters would be hard to put out but again I think Sakurai's team is up to the challenge, especially with no pressure of a release date (yet, come on monday!). Thus if Midna was to be included, it'd be in her Imp form with or without Wolf Link (her only problem i could see would be the limitations of her Imp body for A attacks, but Wolf Link could solve that).

Deoxys AND Lucario

I know you won't particularly care, since it's Pokemon, but as a Mewtwo fan I think he won't be getting the axe anytime soon so either Deoxys or Lucario will be added (most likely Lucario) but not both. Then again, 5 Pokemon doesn't seem all that unlikely either if they really want to give rep to the newer Pokemon generation while retaining the old.

Dark Samus

I can see it happening I really can, but I haven't played Prime 2 to know how different Dark Samus would really play from regular Samus (even though i've read several times that she'd play differently) and once again with my differing stance on clones, as much I love badass villains I can't see her getting in before some of the more popular choices. Sorry DS fans <3.

Mii

Ugh, just a terrible terrible choice I'm afraid. Yes Mii's are very popular, but Nintendo won't ruin Brawl just to cash in on that popularity.

Sora

While I'm all in favour of driving a stake through the heart of Sony (particularly their little fanboys) I feel Sora would just ruin the game. It's all that needs to be said really.

Absence of...

Wolf

Seriously between Wolf and Krystal it's pretty much a coin flip, and on my own list I'd probably put both additions down as they both have very good reasons for being in Brawl. Actually I'm very surprised you didnt jot Wolf down on the list as a Fox clone (although he obviously has the potential to be a lot more). Also I noted you put Krystal down as the "only staff wielder in Brawl", but also put down Bowser Jr. which I think would probably play a lot like a staff user with his paintbrush.

Marth

You left Marth off of the list? ;_; Ike and the Black Knight are indeed very good choices and I wouldn't mind ripping it up as the latter, but Marth is incredibly popular and represents the earlier part of the FE franchise and I doubt he'd be scrapped in favour of 2 late releases. With the increased roster number and the plethora of suitable candidates to choose from from the series i can see 3 likely candidates being added for Brawl and Marth would certainly be in those 3.

Lucas

Again, no bad picks to represent the Earthbound series, I just felt Lucas should be there instead of either Ness or Poo (preferably Poo, although I'm sure he's awesome I just can't take a contender seriously with a name like that)

Game + Watch

Unpopular in Melee due to his lack of overall anything competant in a moveset, but still very fun to play. I think with a big buff to some of his moves power and effects Game + Watch could come back in a very big way, and his inclusion in Brawl would take pretty much 0 effort since his moveset is already far too unique and original to change. He even has a _turtle_ for an attack, something beyond awesome.

Aaaaaaaand that's about it. Kudos on the list Wiseguy, especially with ol' Nookie in there. To any non-believers, go search VG cats for episode 174, I'd post a link but I'm not sure on the outside website linking rules on this forum.

 

[Wiseguy]

wHet noOb wote this???!?!?? Wherres Mostaer Cheif!???? where iz cloUd????? Wehre Spidermann???%!?? Thes liSt PHAILS!!!!!!!!

....Wait.... You say I wrote that list? Uhhh... disregard my previous statment.

I can really see Dedede and either Lucario or Deoxys in the game. But what about other third party characters? Like Klonoa?

Dude, thanks for resurrecting my thread! Its always depressing to put a lot of work into a thread like this only to see it vanish into obscurity a few weeks later.

I agree with you that 3rd party characters have the potential to add a lot to Smash Bros. When Snake was confirmed for Brawl, I was thrilled that my favorite character was appearing in my favorite series. Although I would be content if he were the only 3rd party who makes the cut, I think the Sonic, Megaman and Kingdom Hearts fans deserve to have the same anticpation for Brawl that Metal gear fans like myself are experiencing. Most people say that my prediction of 6 third party characters is overly optimistic - and they're right. But my intention was to give a nod to the non-Nintendo characters who I think sakurai would put in if he could (based mostly on his Japanese poll).

As for Klonoa, I haven't played his games - but I did research him as a possible character for my list after Nintendo Power listed him as one of the characters they most wanted to see in Brawl. Although I see the potential, I think he would have had to appeared in a groundbreaking, genre defining game in more recent years for him to be considered as a Namco rep over Pacman. Still, its not impossible.

I liked quite a few of your choices, but nearer the end when you started requesting characters like Sora to spite Sony fanboys, you went a little too far. Sora... In 'Brawl? You mention Sora over Skull kid? That's awful.

But everything else was great, nothing really to complain about. I couldn't possibly pick a single suggestion that I disagree with drastically.

Thanks for the input Smash Daddy.

I would have loved to include Skull Kid on this list - but this was intended as a prediction of what the final roster will be, not a wish list. Skull Kid is by far my favorite Zelda character, but I don't think I could have realistically given the Zelda series any more representation than I did. The way I see it, the two big series (Mario and Zelda) deserve five reps, Pokemon and Metroid deserve four, and so on.

So, yeah. I would rather see Skull Kid, but I think that (if Sakurai can attain the rights to character) Sora stands a better shot. Sora was on his poll, while Skull Kid wasn't.

Seems like a well thought list, 8/10, the smart choices speak for themselves so I'll just take a little time to point out where I necessarily don't agree you with.

Mario

You seriously even considered that he had a chance in getting in brawl? Speak about unrealistic...

What can i say? I'm an optimist.

Midna (twili form)

While obviously since we know practically nothing about the true form of Midna she would technically have a limitless moveset, I think that it takes away from the originality that Midna embodies in Imp form. Another humanoid probably magic caster? As you said, it smacks of being a Zelda clone and I personally believe that no clones will be included in Brawl. Bit controversial for me since your list contains 9 clones, which isn't unrealistic to believe since a roster of 45 unique characters would be hard to put out but again I think Sakurai's team is up to the challenge, especially with no pressure of a release date (yet, come on monday!). Thus if Midna was to be included, it'd be in her Imp form with or without Wolf Link (her only problem i could see would be the limitations of her Imp body for A attacks, but Wolf Link could solve that).

It all depends. If Clones aren't included, then you are correct that Midna will most likely be included wth an original moveset.

However, I think its a safe bet that some clones will appear. Clones require far less time to mprogram into the game than characters with original movesets - so regardless of how long sakurai and crew have to work on Smash they will be able to included more characters within that time frame if they include clones.

If, as many people assume, Brawl is going to be released this year then the only way we can realistically expect more than 40 characters is if a large number of them are clones. To be frank, I'd say 35 original characters total isn't out of the question - in which case characters like Midna may not make the cut at all.

Deoxys AND Lucario

I know you won't particularly care, since it's Pokemon, but as a Mewtwo fan I think he won't be getting the axe anytime soon so either Deoxys or Lucario will be added (most likely Lucario) but not both. Then again, 5 Pokemon doesn't seem all that unlikely either if they really want to give rep to the newer Pokemon generation while retaining the old.

Yeah, you're right. I don't particularily care.

Dark Samus

I can see it happening I really can, but I haven't played Prime 2 to know how different Dark Samus would really play from regular Samus (even though i've read several times that she'd play differently) and once again with my differing stance on clones, as much I love badass villains I can't see her getting in before some of the more popular choices. Sorry DS fans <3.

You should definitly play MP2. Its just as polished and incredible as the first.

Although DS could potentially have a unique moveset (she has dramically different abilities than Samus) she just doen;t have a prayer as a non-clone. The Metrois fans in Japan can be counted on one hand, so I doubt that the Smash team will spend their valuable time on yet another original moveset after Samus, Zamus and Ridley are included.

However, if they get pressed for time as they did in Melee DS as a Luigified Samus clone stands a great chance. Including a major villain from a key Nintendo franchise who would take a third of the development time as aa original character seems like a no-brainer to me.

Mii

Ugh, just a terrible terrible choice I'm afraid. Yes Mii's are very popular, but Nintendo won't ruin Brawl just to cash in on that popularity.

Just how would Mii "ruin" Brawl? Would their presence in the game be so offensive to you that you would refuse to buy it even if all your favorites were included?

Miis have the potential to add considerably to the Brawl experience. Or don't you want to see a fight to the death between Chuch Norris and Mr. T?

Sora

While I'm all in favour of driving a stake through the heart of Sony (particularly their little fanboys) I feel Sora would just ruin the game. It's all that needs to be said really.

Again with the ruining of the game. Would it really be that bad if some spiky haired kid with a giant key made the cut? Seriously, I want to know what people find so offensive about the character (I Still havn't played any of his games for the record). Any character who would bring joy to legions of RPG nuts while simultaneously giving Sony a solid kick in the shins is O.K. in my book.

Absence of...

Wolf

Seriously between Wolf and Krystal it's pretty much a coin flip, and on my own list I'd probably put both additions down as they both have very good reasons for being in Brawl. Actually I'm very surprised you didnt jot Wolf down on the list as a Fox clone (although he obviously has the potential to be a lot more). Also I noted you put Krystal down as the "only staff wielder in Brawl", but also put down Bowser Jr. which I think would probably play a lot like a staff user with his paintbrush.

I think Krystal is all but guaranteed. The real coin flip is whether Faclo or Wolf will be included as Fox's clone.

Marth

You left Marth off of the list? ;_; Ike and the Black Knight are indeed very good choices and I wouldn't mind ripping it up as the latter, but Marth is incredibly popular and represents the earlier part of the FE franchise and I doubt he'd be scrapped in favour of 2 late releases. With the increased roster number and the plethora of suitable candidates to choose from from the series i can see 3 likely candidates being added for Brawl and Marth would certainly be in those 3.

3 characters is possible, but i doubt that Marth will be one of them. Marth's games are only popular in Japan, and contrary to popular belief, the character Marth in Melee isn't that popular at all. His powerful moveset is.

In my opinion, Japanese-only characters have no place in Brawl. Only representatives from games that are available worldwise deserve to be considered.

Lucas

Again, no bad picks to represent the Earthbound series, I just felt Lucas should be there instead of either Ness or Poo (preferably Poo, although I'm sure he's awesome I just can't take a contender seriously with a name like that)

Ditto. Until Nintendo decides to grace us with a localized Mother 3, I don't think Lucas stands a chance.

Game + Watch

Unpopular in Melee due to his lack of overall anything competant in a moveset, but still very fun to play. I think with a big buff to some of his moves power and effects Game + Watch could come back in a very big way, and his inclusion in Brawl would take pretty much 0 effort since his moveset is already far too unique and original to change. He even has a _turtle_ for an attack, something beyond awesome.

G&W is certainly awesome, but there are plenty of other awesome characters who could take his place. In addition to Geno and Tom Nook, characters like Skull Kid and Commander Kaun (from Elite Beat Agents) would be perfect for Smash. Bottom line: G&W had his moment in the sun. Now its time for another forgotten character to get a guest appearance.

Aaaaaaaand that's about it. Kudos on the list Wiseguy, especially with ol' Nookie in there. To any non-believers, go search VG cats for episode 174, I'd post a link but I'm not sure on the outside website linking rules on this forum.

Glad you liked it Vali. Thanks for taking the time to give a well reasoned and intelligent analysis.

 

[Vali]

Would probably get round to play MP2 if I didn't already need to brush up on Melee as well as revise for exams (first one tomorrow morning :/) but I've read what a fantastic game it is. My gripe with Mii's generally is that they aren't Nintendo all-stars and apart from being a fun and quirky and most of all personal addition to the Wii they haven't particularly done much for me. I don't care for Mr. Chuck Norris or Mr. T and whether or not people want to see them fight also falls into the not really caring category. Brawl should really be reserved for proper videogame characters and their time could be much better spent on a character that deserves to be added.

On Marth, I think his inclusion in the game was largely due to popularity in Japan in the first place coming top of the wanted polls and since he was pretty overpowered in Melee as you said he's amassed quite a following. I wouldn't be too upset if he was replaced with any suitable Tales of Symphonia characters or some decent FE candidate such as Hector, that axe looks like fun, but replacing him certainly wouldn't be too popular due to his now larger-than-just-Japan fanbase.

With Sora, maybe "ruining the game" was a bit too harsh but I wouldn't be too pleased to see him in there. As fun as I'm sure his games are (not played them either ) I just don't see him that...Nintendo to be honest and with the limited amount of 3rd party slots his addition is extremely unlike all the same. However I do respect your choices for picking him (killing Sony, would make a good brawler, killing Sony). Bring KH3 to Wii with decent graphics and some fun swing the Wii-mote to slash the badguys function and i might be persuaded for Smash Bros. 4.

I'm all for Commander Kahn for Brawl, I took the time on EBA to unlock him (as well as that last rank bonus picture, such a fantastic game). I guess I have a hard letting time letting go of Game + Watch due to that turtle, it's seriously awesome .

Edit: I mean just think about it, you'd want to play a fun online game and say you did some "random battling" assuming they introduce a random matchup and you'd just get thousands of little 13-15 year olds with their poorly made Chuck Norris Mii's >.> It'd be hell I tell ya!

 

[Smady]

Thanks for the input Smash Daddy.

I would have loved to include Skull Kid on this list - but this was intended as a prediction of what the final roster will be, not a wish list. Skull Kid is by far my favorite Zelda character, but I don't think I could have realistically given the Zelda series any more representation than I did. The way I see it, the two big series (Mario and Zelda) deserve five reps, Pokemon and Metroid deserve four, and so on.

So, yeah. I would rather see Skull Kid, but I think that (if Sakurai can attain the rights to character) Sora stands a better shot. Sora was on his poll, while Skull Kid wasn't.

Thanks for the gratitude, most would have ripped right into me and said that Sony sucks, Kingdom Hearts make them erect etc.

I don't see Sora having any chance to be honest. He's not impossible, but that's a big group. Every unconfirmed character is "not impossible", after all. Chain of Memories may be on a Nintendo handheld but that seems to be the only game that has any relation to Nintendo at all. The KH series creator, whom I forget the name of, has only ever had one of his main designed games on a non-Sony console with CoM. No joke. There almost seems to be bad blood, seeing as he started work on the FF series at FFVII all the way up to FFX when the series was off the Ninty radar. He's also at work on FFXIII, another PS3-exclusive that probably won't be on the Wii in anything better than a spin-off.

As far as rights go, this creates possibly the biggest barrier ever. Solid Snake is in solely on Kojima's efforts, so will Nomura (just remembered his name) make the same efforts? I doubt it. He has as much of a chance as Cloud in my opinion.

Skull kid, on the other hand, is owned by Nintendo. That's a big plus. He's also in one of their biggest franchises. Another big plus, if it weren't for the numerous other deservant characters. The accessibility of Skull kid compared to Sora surely makes him more likely. But I'm not here to argue against your opinion on this one - Sora won't happen s'all. If anyone but you would have suggested it you know they wouldn't survive very long.

 

[Fawriel]

Dude, thanks for resurrecting my thread! Its always depressing to put a lot of work into a thread like this only to see it vanish into obscurity a few weeks later.

You don't say.

Just how would Mii "ruin" Brawl? Would their presence in the game be so offensive to you that you would refuse to buy it even if all your favorites were included?

Miis have the potential to add considerably to the Brawl experience. Or don't you want to see a fight to the death between Chuch Norris and Mr. T?

The reason why so many are opposed to Miis is that it goes against the principles of the game. Not only is it an "All-Star" Brawl, the characters you play in Smash have personalities, many of them seem more like actual people who you know and love ( or hate ) than characters of other fighting games who were created for the sake of being characters in a fighting game.
On the other hand, it depends on HOW they're implemented. An epic battle where Chuck Norris slaps Hitler around with a tennis racket is considerably less awesome in my book.
The only way I COULD really see them working well is if they were no character in themselves, but a possible alternate model for the existing characters. What I mean to say is that you could, for example, create a Mii, then enter it into Brawl, giving it the moveset of a present character. The Miis could be some sort of special option in the character select screen or so. Then they could be banned from certain tournaments, not end up dominating the tiers and not take the space of actual rightful characters.

 

[Wiseguy]

My gripe with Mii's generally is that they aren't Nintendo all-stars and apart from being a fun and quirky and most of all personal addition to the Wii they haven't particularly done much for me. I don't care for Mr. Chuck Norris or Mr. T and whether or not people want to see them fight also falls into the not really caring category. Brawl should really be reserved for proper videogame characters and their time could be much better spent on a character that deserves to be added.

Edit: I mean just think about it, you'd want to play a fun online game and say you did some "random battling" assuming they introduce a random matchup and you'd just get thousands of little 13-15 year olds with their poorly made Chuck Norris Mii's >.> It'd be hell I tell ya!

The reason why so many are opposed to Miis is that it goes against the principles of the game. Not only is it an "All-Star" Brawl, the characters you play in Smash have personalities, many of them seem more like actual people who you know and love ( or hate ) than characters of other fighting games who were created for the sake of being characters in a fighting game.
On the other hand, it depends on HOW they're implemented. An epic battle where Chuck Norris slaps Hitler around with a tennis racket is considerably less awesome in my book.
The only way I COULD really see them working well is if they were no character in themselves, but a possible alternate model for the existing characters. What I mean to say is that you could, for example, create a Mii, then enter it into Brawl, giving it the moveset of a present character. The Miis could be some sort of special option in the character select screen or so. Then they could be banned from certain tournaments, not end up dominating the tiers and not take the space of actual rightful characters.

From what I can gather, the main argument for why Miis don't deserve a spot alongside legends like Mario, Link and Solid Snake is because many people don't see them as an "all star" character in their own right, but rather a video game feature. In short, they see them as generic - like goombas.

However, the Smash team has already shown that including generic characters is acceptable when an important series needs representing. I'm thinking, of course, of Pokemon. Even though there is no Pikachu "character" per say (just a bunch of generic electric rats) the Smash team decided to make an exception and include Pikachu as a character in order to represent an important series. Similarly, Miis represent Nintendo's newest high profile series of games. From the ultra fun lauch title Wii Sports and the somewhat lame (but ridiculously popular) Wii Play to the highly anticipated titles Wii Music and Wii Fitness, Miis are quickly becoming Nintendo's new mascot for the casual gamer crowd.

My prediction is that a character with the name "Mii" and a generic appearance will be the final unlockable character in Brawl. He will then be given a Game & Watch-esque moveset that pays tribute to all the Mii game to date (ie: Boxing glove punch, bowling ball attack, cow riding, Duck Hunt rifle, a Tank super move, etc.) and players will be able to alter their appearance as they see fit by uploading custom Miis from the Mii channel.

Vali is correct that many of the Miis we encounter over Wi-fi will be poorly made. However, if one in every twenty of the Miis is an awesome caricature of Mr. Burns from the Simpsons or The Thing from the Fantastic Four, then it will be completly worth it.

Thanks for the gratitude, most would have ripped right into me and said that Sony sucks, Kingdom Hearts make them erect etc.

I don't see Sora having any chance to be honest. He's not impossible, but that's a big group. Every unconfirmed character is "not impossible", after all. Chain of Memories may be on a Nintendo handheld but that seems to be the only game that has any relation to Nintendo at all. The KH series creator, whom I forget the name of, has only ever had one of his main designed games on a non-Sony console with CoM. No joke. There almost seems to be bad blood, seeing as he started work on the FF series at FFVII all the way up to FFX when the series was off the Ninty radar. He's also at work on FFXIII, another PS3-exclusive that probably won't be on the Wii in anything better than a spin-off.

As far as rights go, this creates possibly the biggest barrier ever. Solid Snake is in solely on Kojima's efforts, so will Nomura (just remembered his name) make the same efforts? I doubt it. He has as much of a chance as Cloud in my opinion.

Skull kid, on the other hand, is owned by Nintendo. That's a big plus. He's also in one of their biggest franchises. Another big plus, if it weren't for the numerous other deservant characters. The accessibility of Skull kid compared to Sora surely makes him more likely. But I'm not here to argue against your opinion on this one - Sora won't happen s'all. If anyone but you would have suggested it you know they wouldn't survive very long.

I'll level with you: I have this suspicion that no more third party characters will make the cut - including characters most people have bet the farm on appearing like Sonic and Megaman. This is because the team likely made their final decision on the roster back when sakurai clodes his poll. So, obviously Sora is less likely than Skull Kid - who is, as you pointed out, 100% owned by Nintendo.

However, when making my 3rd party party predictions I decided to disregard the inevitable red tape that comes from attaining the rights to non-Nintendo characters and just went with my inclination of what 3rd party characters Sakurai would include if he could. So I looked at the list of characters Sakurai refered to on his online poll, and chose the three that belonged to critically and comercially successful games popular worldwide (Sora, Simon Belmont, and Mega Man) and threw in Geno (who also appears on the poll and gets the obscure, retro characters vote) as well the the most requested new character outside Japan: Sonic. Its a stretch to assume that all these characters will make it, but I wanted to make my predictions as optimistic as possible in this department - becuase no matter who i choose it will be a stretch.

Regardless, I doubt it would ever come down to a question of including either Skull Kid or Sora. Sora is an ultra popular character that Nintendo would undoubtably like to see in Brawl as it would convince a ton of Square Enix fanatics to buy their game (and console). His inclusion is contingent on how receptive Square and Disney are to the idea. He might not be very "Nintendo", but that's what everyone said about Solid Snake before he was confirmed.

Conversly, Skull Kid is the villian in the unjustly underrated masterpiece Majora's Mask - a game that is becoming more and more overshadowed as the years press on and juggernauts like Twilight Princess get all the press. There is also the question as to whether Sakurai would feel compelled to use the more current TP model of the character (which doesn't hold nearly the same potential for a unique moveset).

Please don't misunderstand: I sincerely hope that I am wrong and Skull Kid gets a proper tribute (I'd personally be in favor of cutting all the Pokemon if I thought it made SK more likely...) but Sakurai hasn't said mum on the character - so I'm concerned that he may have never been considered at all.

But's that's just one guy's opinion. Come Monday, everything I've posted could be proven false: www.smashbros.com

 

[Vali]

From what I can gather, the main argument for why Miis don't deserve a spot alongside legends like Mario, Link and Solid Snake is because many people don't see them as an "all star" character in their own right, but rather a video game feature. In short, they see them as generic - like goombas.

However, the Smash team has already shown that including generic characters is acceptable when an important series needs representing. I'm thinking, of course, of Pokemon. Even though there is no Pikachu "character" per say (just a bunch of generic electric rats) the Smash team decided to make an exception and include Pikachu as a character in order to represent an important series. Similarly, Miis represent Nintendo's newest high profile series of games. From the ultra fun lauch title Wii Sports and the somewhat lame (but ridiculously popular) Wii Play to the highly anticipated titles Wii Music and Wii Fitness, Miis are quickly becoming Nintendo's new mascot for the casual gamer crowd.

Oh. Oh bad pick. I can't blame you though as I'm sure you've yet to lay an eye on the Pokemon anime (lucky guy, lucky lucky guy), there was a singular Pikachu which was the main guy's companion. Had you picked Pichu or Jigglypuff you would've been more correct in that they're generic, although I'm pretty sure there was some non-generic Jigglypuff too due to her popularity with the ****.

I know what you're saying with the Mii becoming the new mascot and incredibly popular for the casual gamer, but that's what it's more aimed at in my eyes, casual and I don't think it'd be such a genius plan to incorporate it into a predominately hardcore game (even though no-one could dispute it has casual appeal). Like I said before, I just don't think they'll "cash in" on the Mii mascot but I recognise that it is an entirely plausable possibilty all the same.

About tomorrow, got any thoughts on who'll be announced and how many? I'm going for something along the lines of DK, Diddy, Peach, Zelda, Ganondorf, Yoshi, Marth and maybe a couple of newcomers such as Sonic and King DeDeDe perhaps. Going only on about 10 have been released so far and the exact magnitude of tomorrow's announcement is anyone's guess.

 

[Fawriel]

I predict the appearance of one newcomer per major franchise, plus another one from a completely different one.
WW Link for upcoming trailer!

And Wiseguy, my argument was that Wiis aren't even actual PERSONS. There are singular Pokemon like there is a singular Yoshi, and the Wiis are just... thingies.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

For tomorrow, I assume we'll get a better grasp on who is actually returning (not just Yoshi and DK, but going into Peach, Bowser, Zelda, Captain Falcon etc., and probably learn about the more controversial returners like Ness, Marth and Ice climbers). We'll probably get a few newcomers such as Diddy, DeDeDe and Ike, and chances are we'll et a 3rd party character or 2 (probably all the ones that are included). However, I think there will still be a large proportion of unveiled characters, so I'm not expecting that many newcomers to be announced just yet. Though I'd appreciated if they did tell us who is and isn't returning by now, part of me feels they may still hold back on this information somewhat.

 

[Vali]

Though I'd appreciated if they did tell us who is and isn't returning by now, part of me feels they may still hold back on this information somewhat.

I've just had the greatest idea ever. I want the new Brawl trailer to have "Newcomer: <insert awesome character here>" and then have them slo-mo execute whoever they're replacing/is getting the chop. For example we could have Roy getting smashed off stage by the Black Knight, it'd just make an awesome trailer. Sakurai will never have thought of it

 

[Fawriel]

Haha. "This idea is so awesome Sakurai can't possibly have thought of it. =<"

But that idea actually seems kinda cruel.

Fan: "Oh my god, Roy's returning! My prayers have been heard!"
Trailer: "NOT!"
Fan: *whimper*

 

[Vali]

Haha. "This idea is so awesome Sakurai can't possibly have thought of it. =<"

But that idea actually seems kinda cruel.

Fan: "Oh my god, Roy's returning! My prayers have been heard!"
Trailer: "NOT!"
Fan: *whimper*

Doesn't that make you chuckle? Made me

Roy: "Not the face! Anything but the faaaaaaaaaaaaaac-*Ding of a star-ko*"

 

[Smady]

I'll level with you: I have this suspicion that no more third party characters will make the cut - including characters most people have bet the farm on appearing like Sonic and Megaman. This is because the team likely made their final decision on the roster back when sakurai clodes his poll. So, obviously Sora is less likely than Skull Kid - who is, as you pointed out, 100% owned by Nintendo.

However, when making my 3rd party party predictions I decided to disregard the inevitable red tape that comes from attaining the rights to non-Nintendo characters and just went with my inclination of what 3rd party characters Sakurai would include if he could. So I looked at the list of characters Sakurai refered to on his online poll, and chose the three that belonged to critically and comercially successful games popular worldwide (Sora, Simon Belmont, and Mega Man) and threw in Geno (who also appears on the poll and gets the obscure, retro characters vote) as well the the most requested new character outside Japan: Sonic. Its a stretch to assume that all these characters will make it, but I wanted to make my predictions as optimistic as possible in this department - becuase no matter who i choose it will be a stretch.

Regardless, I doubt it would ever come down to a question of including either Skull Kid or Sora. Sora is an ultra popular character that Nintendo would undoubtably like to see in Brawl as it would convince a ton of Square Enix fanatics to buy their game (and console). His inclusion is contingent on how receptive Square and Disney are to the idea. He might not be very "Nintendo", but that's what everyone said about Solid Snake before he was confirmed.

Conversly, Skull Kid is the villian in the unjustly underrated masterpiece Majora's Mask - a game that is becoming more and more overshadowed as the years press on and juggernauts like Twilight Princess get all the press. There is also the question as to whether Sakurai would feel compelled to use the more current TP model of the character (which doesn't hold nearly the same potential for a unique moveset).

Please don't misunderstand: I sincerely hope that I am wrong and Skull Kid gets a proper tribute (I'd personally be in favor of cutting all the Pokemon if I thought it made SK more likely...) but Sakurai hasn't said mum on the character - so I'm concerned that he may have never been considered at all.

But's that's just one guy's opinion. Come Monday, everything I've posted could be proven false: www.smashbros.com

I wouldn't expect anything confirmed when the site changes. I really doubt there'll be anything new. If there's a new trailer I'll be very surprised, as they've only revealed any new information at events before.

If you didn't consider the restrictions, but rather which characters Nintendo would like/you would like to be in 'Brawl, that's not really a "prediction", is it?

Aw, well, it's still a good list. And you make a persuasive argument.

 

[Zeela12]

if you're making the game, what would you add in the game more to promote your company? More Minor charaters from games already popular? or New Charaters from games that's not popular making them popular? Notice how Nintendo did that with SSBM with Marth and Roy, Ice climbers, or Dr. Mario?

This is the main reason why Bowser Jr, Black Knight from FE9, young link windwaker form, midna, diddy kong, king K pool, Samuri Goroh, and Poo won't be in it.

Another important aspect that Nintendo needs to pay attention to is the amount of female charaters they have. Notice how they are changing samus' form? it's because they are in need of real Female heros. Peach, Zelda and Samus are really the only ones right now, and they struggle for more.

Also, it's definatly more likely for main charaters from different games of a series to come rather than multiple charaters of one game of a series to come, like Sothe from FE10 and Ike from FE9 is much more likely to appear than what you have proposed.

 

[Vali]

This is the main reason why Bowser Jr, Black Knight from FE9, young link windwaker form, midna, diddy kong, king K pool, Samuri Goroh, and Poo won't be in it.

Notice how they are changing samus' form?

That makes me a saaaaaaaaaaaad panda.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

if you're making the game, what would you add in the game more to promote your company? More Minor charaters from games already popular? or New Charaters from games that's not popular making them popular? Notice how Nintendo did that with SSBM with Marth and Roy, Ice climbers, or Dr. Mario?

This is the main reason why Bowser Jr, Black Knight from FE9, young link windwaker form, midna, diddy kong, king K pool, Samuri Goroh, and Poo won't be in it.

I don't think Sakurai even intended to promote any characters in the Smash games, the only character that ever intended to promote anything was Roy. It doesn't matter if the franchise is already popular, if Sakurai thinks a character from that franchise will work well, he'll include them.

Another important aspect that Nintendo needs to pay attention to is the amount of female charaters they have. Notice how they are changing samus' form? it's because they are in need of real Female heros. Peach, Zelda and Samus are really the only ones right now, and they struggle for more.

That's partly because there aren't really that many big female names outside of Peach, Zelda and Samus. Krystal sort of counts, but then there aren't really any other major female characters in Nintendo. However, Sakurai did state that the inclusion of ZS Samus was partly due to a need for more female characters, so we may see some more female faces in Brawl.

Also, it's definatly more likely for main charaters from different games of a series to come rather than multiple charaters of one game of a series to come, like Sothe from FE10 and Ike from FE9 is much more likely to appear than what you have proposed.

Sothe isn't a main character. The main characters of FE10 are Ike and Micaiah.

 

[Zeela12]

"Sothe (サザ, Saza?) is one of two main characters of the first part of the game ... Micaiah (ミカヤ, Mikaya?) is one of two main characters of the first part of the game and the leader of the "Part 1" army... Ike (アイク, Aiku?) (the main character of Path of Radiance) returns in Goddess of Dawn, as the main character of the third part of the game." (taken from Wikipedia)

Plus, I was just using Sothe as an example, you can use Eliwood for all I care.

and I don't even like Sothe... actually Ireally don't like Sothe, probably my least favoret Charater in all of FE, exept Old Marcus in FE6, who makes me laugh...

 

[LukeFonFabre]

From what I've seen of the game, he's kind of like the equivalent of Soren to Micaiah, and kind of takes up a Jeigen role. Except Sothe has to be kept alive until the final part (where he suddenly becomes expendable). In FE10 as a whole, he's really not as important as you may think.

 

[Wiseguy]

Oh. Oh bad pick. I can't blame you though as I'm sure you've yet to lay an eye on the Pokemon anime (lucky guy, lucky lucky guy), there was a singular Pikachu which was the main guy's companion. Had you picked Pichu or Jigglypuff you would've been more correct in that they're generic, although I'm pretty sure there was some non-generic Jigglypuff too due to her popularity with the ****.

I know what you're saying with the Mii becoming the new mascot and incredibly popular for the casual gamer, but that's what it's more aimed at in my eyes, casual and I don't think it'd be such a genius plan to incorporate it into a predominately hardcore game (even though no-one could dispute it has casual appeal). Like I said before, I just don't think they'll "cash in" on the Mii mascot but I recognise that it is an entirely plausable possibilty all the same.

About tomorrow, got any thoughts on who'll be announced and how many? I'm going for something along the lines of DK, Diddy, Peach, Zelda, Ganondorf, Yoshi, Marth and maybe a couple of newcomers such as Sonic and King DeDeDe perhaps. Going only on about 10 have been released so far and the exact magnitude of tomorrow's announcement is anyone's guess.

Last time I checked, Smash Bros wasn't a collection of anime' characters. Its only the games that matter. And there is no Pikachu character in Pokemon to my knowlege.

My prediction: we'll see Diddy, Ridley, a new Pokemon and (I hope)Captain Olimar in a new trailer. Hopfully we'll also see all the old characters who are returning.

if you're making the game, what would you add in the game more to promote your company? More Minor charaters from games already popular? or New Charaters from games that's not popular making them popular? Notice how Nintendo did that with SSBM with Marth and Roy, Ice climbers, or Dr. Mario?

This is the main reason why Bowser Jr, Black Knight from FE9, young link windwaker form, midna, diddy kong, king K pool, Samuri Goroh, and Poo won't be in it.

Another important aspect that Nintendo needs to pay attention to is the amount of female charaters they have. Notice how they are changing samus' form? it's because they are in need of real Female heros. Peach, Zelda and Samus are really the only ones right now, and they struggle for more.

Also, it's definatly more likely for main charaters from different games of a series to come rather than multiple charaters of one game of a series to come, like Sothe from FE10 and Ike from FE9 is much more likely to appear than what you have proposed.

I was going to make a lengthy argument for why you are wrong. Then I noticed you said that Diddy Kong won't make it. If you are serious about that prediction, then logic and reason must roll off you like water off a duck's back. It's just not worth the energy. I will say only this: YOU ARE WRONG.

I wouldn't expect anything confirmed when the site changes. I really doubt there'll be anything new. If there's a new trailer I'll be very surprised, as they've only revealed any new information at events before.

If you didn't consider the restrictions, but rather which characters Nintendo would like/you would like to be in 'Brawl, that's not really a "prediction", is it?

Aw, well, it's still a good list. And you make a persuasive argument.

Geez are you ever a pesimist. Well, at least if all our hopes and dreams are crushed tommorow you will have the satisfaction of being right.

Thanks for the compliment. I'm glad you enjoyed my thread.

 

[Joka]

As for Klonoa, I haven't played his games - but I did research him as a possible character for my list after Nintendo Power listed him as one of the characters they most wanted to see in Brawl. Although I see the potential, I think he would have had to appeared in a groundbreaking, genre defining game in more recent years for him to be considered as a Namco rep over Pacman. Still, its not impossible.

How come he's not in your list then?

Oh, and what do you think about Vaati being in Brawl?

 

[Wiseguy]

Like I said, its been a while since he's been in a genre defining game. Also, I think 45 characters is already pushing it. Any more would be overly optimistic in my view.

As for Vaati, I respect his place in the Zelda series (being the main villian in three games is nothing to sneeze at) but there are a lot of other Zelda characters competing for a place in Brawl. In addition to the five on my list, there is also Skull Kid (from Majora's Mask), Zant (from Twilight Princess) and (*shudders*) Tingle. Still, if he turns out to be the villian in the upcoming Phantom Hourglass his chances of having been included go up dramatically. That's my two cents.

Anywho, I think its time I hit the sack. Hopfully, when I awake you will all be congradulating me on how all my predictions were proven 100% correct when Sakurai revealed the entire character roster on Smash Dojo. Hey, a guy can dream.

 

[Zeela12]

I was going to make a lengthy argument for why you are wrong. Then I noticed you said that Diddy Kong won't make it. If you are serious about that prediction, then logic and reason must roll off you like water off a duck's back. It's just not worth the energy. I will say only this: YOU ARE WRONG.

Wow you seem so sure about your own "predictions" you even capitalized them to emphazie how right you are! I'm impressed!

Now how am I wrong when I haven't even made any predictions? I only proposed a reason for why some of these charaters won't be in it, and you so surely by your own standard know for a fact that they will be? No one really knows for certian who will be in it or not, for all you know, Godzilla could even be in it, and how would you know that that won't happen for certian?

logic and reason? I doubt you even understood what I was talking about. Just becuase you wish so much for certian people to be in the game doesn't mean that will actaully happen, plus I have yet to give a complete definition of who will be in it or not, and somehow you think that's wrong.

to techinically, YOU ARE WRONG because I'm not, since I have nothing to be wrong with, because I'm only stating reasons for pausible predictions. How can you have a wrong prediction anyways? You may predict WRONGLY but the prediction is always just a prediction, can't be wrong with that.

great, now I'm using caps, must be a disease.

 

[Fawriel]

Last time I checked, Smash Bros wasn't a collection of anime' characters. Its only the games that matter. And there is no Pikachu character in Pokemon to my knowlege.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pokémon_Yellow
Since I don't want to waste your time, here's the synopsis: The hero ( main name: Ash ) gets a Pikachu as a starter Pokemon that stays outside the Pokeball and can be talked to to see how much it likes the player. It refuses to evolve. And Team Rocket is there, too. Basically, it follows the anime a lot.

Also, Sakurai may have said that no anime characters will be in... BUT, I'm absolutely certain that the development in anime for characters like Pokemon contributes to their image as a whole... if the anime didn't matter, Pikachu wouldn't be the mascot, for he wasn't that popular before. If Jigglypuff hadn't had a role in the anime as a sort of running gag, she probably wouldn't be as popular and thus available in all main games to date. Pichu is derived from Pikachu. Mewtwo is the only character so far who was in for reasons besides popularity gained through the anime, and even for him, starring in the first movie as the villain was a major factor.
Proof? One of Pikachu's costumes makes him don Ash Ketchum's cap.

Point is, Pokemon are still living beings, they're somewhat intelligent, they have a voice, and so on. Wiis have editable faces. They are just fleeting images. They have a place in games, but they do not have the place of a great hero, a fearsome villain, or simply a big star.