pick yur poison | ovah

[Uncle Ruckus]

day rolecop (0)
vengeful mafiate (5) - alakaslam gheb maven red ryu ranmaru
1 shot janitor (4) - zenny jexs rosalina seal
godfather (2) - wott joey

not voting jaytheunseen

 

[ranmaru]

I'm fine with Vengeful as a compromise, definitely do not want Godfather. This is dragging on for far too long.

Gheb I'll get to your post later today. Have class soon.

 

[Alakaslam]

I'm fine with Vengeful as a compromise, definitely do not want Godfather. This is dragging on for far too long.

Gheb I'll get to your post later today. Have class soon.

I am tired.

Ran if I switch will you? I want to get this over with even if it is not exactly what I want. I sux at pyp theory anyway.

 

[ranmaru]

Yes I will bby

 

[Xivii]

How have you guys let Gheb do this. That credibility post was so dumb; especially since gheb consistently loses games, or at least consistently pushes mislynches and bad strategy.

If you look at the town win rate or accuracy rate over the past 3-4 years for the "for jan" group, even with new players, compared to the "for veng" group, you will see a pretty significant gap. I can bring up data if necessary, but this has already reached a level of pettiness that is barely tolerable. I just can't allow Gheb to use ad hominem (which he relies on in every game ever) and actually get away with it.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

How have you guys let Gheb do this. That credibility post was so dumb; especially since gheb consistently loses games, or at least consistently pushes mislynches and bad strategy.

If you look at the town win rate or accuracy rate over the past 3-4 years for the "for jan" group, even with new players, compared to the "for veng" group, you will see a pretty significant gap. I can bring up data if necessary, but this has already reached a level of pettiness that is barely tolerable. I just can't allow Gheb to use ad hominem (which he relies on in every game ever) and actually get away with it.

lol

 

[Alakaslam]

##unvote and janitor

Let's get this shjt started

 

[Alakaslam]

I am pretty creative censor dodging

 

[Maven89]

How have you guys let Gheb do this. That credibility post was so dumb; especially since gheb consistently loses games, or at least consistently pushes mislynches and bad strategy.

If you look at the town win rate or accuracy rate over the past 3-4 years for the "for jan" group, even with new players, compared to the "for veng" group, you will see a pretty significant gap. I can bring up data if necessary, but this has already reached a level of pettiness that is barely tolerable. I just can't allow Gheb to use ad hominem (which he relies on in every game ever) and actually get away with it.

this is the least self aware post i've ever seen

 

[Dooms]

Vote: Vengeful

Yeah I'm not voting Janitor.

 

[Xivii]

this is the least self aware post i've ever seen

How might you mean?

 

[Maven89]

You criticized him for ad hominem when your entire post was ad hominem against everyone who disagreed with you

 

[Maven89]

unvote

vote:Janitor

 

[Xivii]

You criticized him for ad hominem when your entire post was ad hominem against everyone who disagreed with you

You're right. I feel like both posts were equally as pitiful, but I also feel like the only way to deconstruct an ad hominem argument is to present facts to the contrary. Though I guess I didn't have to go into Gheb specifically. That came about more from grumpiness.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

My post wasn't really ad hominem though. The point is that the people who are so adamantly against a Janitor actually know their **** when it comes to that role. Not because they're smarter or better and not because everybody else is stupid but because they have very recent experience with a Janitor. It may or may not be coincidence that the people who argue in favor of Janitor don't have that experience. But that's not arguing on a personal level at all.

 

[Xivii]

Your argument is false though. I have recent experience with janitor and multiple previous experiences. As does Ran. Idk about JeXs. You're just discounting our experiences in favor of your argument.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Your argument is false though. I have recent experience with janitor and multiple previous experiences. As does Ran. Idk about JeXs. You're just discounting our experiences in favor of your argument.

None of these Janitors hid lynches though but NKs. That's a major difference.

 

[Xivii]

I've played with day jan too (with multi shot, though the janned peeps were revealed after jan death). I very much understand how one could be opposed to it, but it just can't do as much as it seems in an open game design, which will become apparent as we get into the game.

 

[Maven89]

Unvote; Janitor

Vote: Vengeful

Honestly I'm starting to think that if other people don't make up their minds i'm going to flip back and forth for another 15 pages so someone else jump in

 

[~ Gheb ~]

It won't become apparent because we're not giving them the Janitor.

 

[Maven89]

for the record, at this moment I do not really care which of the two we give, I honestly don't know which one I prefer because i keep swapping in my own head, one moment vengeful seems better, then it seems too risky, then back and forth. Right now I just want the day to start, and I still stand that we're not going to lose the game because of the janitor or the vengeful.

 

[Maven89]

Right now I just want the day to start, and I still stand that we're not going to lose the game because of the janitor or the vengeful.

well, we probably wont

 

[Xivii]

Gheb, I think the issue is that you guys are pulling your experiences from a closed set up. In an open design, the role has little power.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

How have you guys let Gheb do this. That credibility post was so dumb; especially since gheb consistently loses games, or at least consistently pushes mislynches and bad strategy.

If you look at the town win rate or accuracy rate over the past 3-4 years for the "for jan" group, even with new players, compared to the "for veng" group, you will see a pretty significant gap. I can bring up data if necessary, but this has already reached a level of pettiness that is barely tolerable. I just can't allow Gheb to use ad hominem (which he relies on in every game ever) and actually get away with it.

But gheb is consistently referred to as one of the people to go to when it comes to setup issues

 

[Maven89]

But gheb is consistently referred to as one of the people to go to when it comes to setup issues

Are you arguing that or just pointing it out?

 

[JayTheUnseen]

I doubt things will change at this point so
Vote Vengeful

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Are you arguing that or just pointing it out?

Pointing out that zens argument for why not to trust gheb here i s a crock of ****

 

[ranmaru]

Unvote vote Jan

Jaytheunseen why did you switch?

 

[JayTheUnseen]

Unvote vote Jan

Jaytheunseen why did you switch?

Like I said,things didn't seem likely to change

 

[ranmaru]

Never mind we have vengeful instead. Still want to know why you voted that way Jay.

 

[ranmaru]

Oh ninja. 10char

 

[RosalinaSGS]

@ Maven89 I needed to point our that only one person can be found out from the mason's role. You thought it was possible to use the following NKs to gain further information on them, except the mafia can easily WIFOM, meaning any information we infer from the NKs can be quite dramatically flawed.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Yeah I'm not budging at this point.

vote: Vengeful
Double Vote Vengeful

 

[RosalinaSGS]

Never mind we have vengeful instead. Still want to know why you voted that way Jay.

We don't yet. It's six for vengeful, not seven.
(Joey, Gheb, Maven, Red Ryu, Ranmaru, JayTheUnseen)

 

[ranmaru]

Ah. Maven as already one.

Vote: Vengeful

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

interesting change, I thought it was seven though given roleblocker needed seven.

 

[RosalinaSGS]

interesting change, I thought it was seven though given roleblocker needed seven.

We still do need seven, but currently we're only on six. So Ranmaru was wrong when he said "we have vengeful". (I'm assuming he meant vengeful has already been voted in)

 

[Maven89]

@ Maven89 I needed to point our that only one person can be found out from the mason's role. You thought it was possible to use the following NKs to gain further information on them, except the mafia can easily WIFOM, meaning any information we infer from the NKs can be quite dramatically flawed.

oh right, i actually followed that post up with one stating i had misread the role.

 

[RosalinaSGS]

oh right, i actually followed that post up with one stating i had misread the role.

Oh yeah, sorry, I remember. There was quite a lot of messages to go through and I just forgot about it.

 

[RosalinaSGS]

As I think about it, Vengeful seems like a worse and worse option. Whilst janitor does mean we lose a bit of information, if we apply Ranmaru's plan, we can minimise it's impact. On the other hand, Vengeful not only means we lose another innocent, we can no longer apply parity correctly and safely, which can strongly impact our chances of lynching correctly. As such, I don't particularly like it. If we compare the two, one loses us information, but we can try to minimise the impact of this loss. After all, it is only one flip. The other prevents us from properly using parity, making it more likely we'll lynch incorrectly, and we lose another innocent.