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[ArikadoSD]

Does anyone know the hit box on Fair btw? I keep getting punished when I try to shfair someone that's shielding(they immediately shield grab me)

I've had that problem for forever and still do, sometimes. You just gotta pracrice to space your fairs properly on shield so that they're safe. Try a retreating fair. There is a thread on it here in the 2nd page maybe, which i didnt read tbh, but seems useful. Cant link cuz im on pgone

edit:

After watching Mr.R gameplay I'm wondering how he is able to input a jump (or an attack) after a ''single jump --> BF'' . I'm trying to do the same, but it seems like after a ''single jump --> BF'' I don't have enough time before hitting the floor... This is probably stupid, but is there a way to make the BF high enough to do this? (please don't judge me)

Here's the link : https://youtu.be/XjtzWXMeF1s?t=7m51s

When you use Bouncing Fish and it finishes the animation at a certain height then Sheik could land normally or act out of it in the air. What can also be done is if you do a normal Down B but then instantly press B again so that Bouncing Fish could be done quicker and therefore you'll get out of the animation quickly enough to be able to do something before you land out of a full hop. I hope that explains it :]

 

[TheMarthRunner]

Trying to pick up shiek. I was looking for a top tier character to learn to play, and I realized... SHIEK IS FLIPPIN AWESOME! Are there any experienced players who could play me online and give me feedback for improvement?

 

[TheMarthRunner]

Trying to pick up shiek. I was looking for a top tier character to learn to play, and I realized... SHIEK IS FLIPPIN AWESOME! Are there any experienced players who could play me online and give me feedback for improvement?

 

[Shroomsy]

What are the inputs for b-reverse needles? Every time I try to b-reverse them without a full charge I wind up turning around and skidding or throwing out a grenade by mistake.

 

[Wasserwipf]

What are the inputs for b-reverse needles? Every time I try to b-reverse them without a full charge I wind up turning around and skidding or throwing out a grenade by mistake.

watching , then , then . It's a few frame window (noticeable by eye actually) I'd guess somewhere around 4 frames. Input Needle, and after you pressed B (and sheik already started charging - for a few frames) flip the stick into the opposite direction.

Trying to pick up shiek. I was looking for a top tier character to learn to play, and I realized... SHIEK IS FLIPPIN AWESOME! Are there any experienced players who could play me online and give me feedback for improvement?

You might want to ask here I guess: http://smashboards.com/threads/does-anyone-want-to-start-a-sheik-chatroom.372865/

 

[Noso]

watching , then , then . It's a few frame window (noticeable by eye actually) I'd guess somewhere around 4 frames. Input Needle, and after you pressed B (and sheik already started charging - for a few frames) flip the stick into the opposite direction.

You might want to ask here I guess: http://smashboards.com/threads/does-anyone-want-to-start-a-sheik-chatroom.372865/

how important would you consider learning to count frames? (and this is probably more technical than needed, but would a 6.5ms tv make things harder to pull off some of her combos?)

 

[Wasserwipf]

how important would you consider learning to count frames? (and this is probably more technical than needed, but would a 6.5ms tv make things harder to pull off some of her combos?)

Given that the human eye can't see single images around 24 FPS (frames per second) anymore (mind, you can't see the images, but you can still see a difference between 30 FPS and 60 FPS, it's just smoother), it's impossible to count frames actually. I usually pull out frames (especially small numbers) to show how small the window for something is.

In a 60FPS environment (which smore is) a frame is equal to 16.6ms. So if your TV has 6.5ms delay (or whatever) it shoudn't really affect you. Then again, there are usually people who believe they can see differences and will refuse to play on "slower" TV's. I at least say 6.5ms tv shoudn't affect you really and you should be totally fine.

On a side note, the human has a reaction time of roughly 200ms - about 12 frames. Compare this to Sheiks attack frame data und you'll see just how good it is.

Last, back to the counting frames, as stated, it's impossible to count but possible to "feel" them. I believe it's important to develop such a "feel". Then again, you don't need to know the exact numbers to feel something so yea.

 

[Noso]

That makes an insanely good amount of sense, thank you for answering my question wasserwipf =)!

 

[sadn3ss]

Could someone recomenmd a setup optimized for sheik with the gc controller

 

[ArikadoSD]

Could someone recomenmd a setup optimized for sheik with the gc controller

all for jump

for grab

tap jump off.

I set Z to jump to easily do the fullhop needles to bouncing fish combo without having to awkwardly position your fingers etc, and its easier to do than with L. I set L for jump for easy OoS up B, which are extremely situational and almost never helpful and I mostly have it there for other characters. X is for grab because I found it convenient and I had no other free button lol.

It's all subjective tho, do whatever you feel comfortable with.

 

[Noso]

In addition to ArikadoX's suggestion, I'd suggest the following.

to attack (helps with people who try to roll behind you and for aerial moves)

 

[ArikadoSD]

I like C stick set to smash attacks to quickly do running usmash, and I also like my fsmash a lot. Never really got into using c stick for tilts, especially because spamming ftilt with it doesn't seem to work all the time. Only time I liked c stick for tilts was when using zss to quickly do utilt, but even then I prefer c stick set for smash attacks for the quick dsmash lol

 

[iAft3rbang]

Hi guys, maybe I'm being lazy but I would really appreciate if someone could list me all the possible combo (or strings) out of a dtilt at specific percent. I'm not using it that much and I know its one of her great tools. Thanks

 

[Noso]

I like C stick set to smash attacks to quickly do running usmash, and I also like my fsmash a lot. Never really got into using c stick for tilts, especially because spamming ftilt with it doesn't seem to work all the time. Only time I liked c stick for tilts was when using zss to quickly do utilt, but even then I prefer c stick set for smash attacks for the quick dsmash lol

My problem is I like to use the c stick more than i probably should, and I would throw out too many smash which got me punished NUMEROUS times.

 

[Sean de Lure]

Hey guys, I did something that I have no idea how I did, but it was pretty cool. So basically, I was screwing around in training like usual, and I saw that post someone made about ledge cancel needles, so I was like, "why not practice that a bit?" After a bit, I realized I was screwing up a lot, so I tried to play around with needle fidgeting to vanish, resulting in some wacky hybrid practice thing. Eventually I got kind of bored and was half not paying attention (resulting in me screwing up even more), when I suddenly, from running to the corner (was on the corner), teleported into a ledge grab. It looked like I did some sort of mini vanish to get straight to the corner. It was a quick silent teleport with a small explosion. I don't think it was a vanish glide because I heard no explosion (volume decently high) I think my button imput was something along the line of shielding to stop the run and jc vanish out of it, or something to do with canceling the needles (as I said, wasnt really paying attention). So yeah, I might be just crazy, but if I correctly saw what happened, it seems kind of useful for an unexpected trump. I havent been able to reproduce it yet, anyone have any ideas on what it might be?

 

[?.?]

Well, did you save the replay? This is why I always practice techs in an actual match against a lvl 1 cpu with like 99 stocks. But there are so many possibilites as to what you did I don't even know.

 

[Sean de Lure]

training mode... yep :[
so do you just suicide a million times when you want to save the replay?

 

[?.?]

yeah pretty much, if it's something as useful as that wouldn't you be willing to?

 

[Sean de Lure]

Now I'm just questioning why I never thought of that... it appears I'm stupider than I thought

 

[?.?]

Sometimes the simplest things can take the longest to think about... Just today someone made a post about aNLC when we've had gNLC since like release/brawl days.

 

[Noso]

Sometimes the simplest things can take the longest to think about... Just today someone made a post about aNLC when we've had gNLC since like release/brawl days.

I agree with you on that, I used to think that if you did nothing but smash you were guaranteed to win and that anyone who didn't was a scrub and then i found out about frame data LOL

 

[Kaffei]

How do I cancel my needles mid air without airdodging

 

[iAft3rbang]

How do I cancel my needles mid air without airdodging

You can needle fidget by inputing an airdodge and right after (I don't know the exact number of frames) input a special move. That way, you won't see the air dodge. I highly recommand Deku Tree's youtube video.

You can also needle cancel on ground by air dodging right before you hit the ground. You'll have almost no lag.

I don't think there is a way to simply cancel needles without air dodging. I might be wrong on this. @ ArikadoSD would you please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[ArikadoSD]

I don't think there is a way to simply cancel needles without air dodging. I might be wrong on this. @ ArikadoSD would you please correct me if I'm wrong.

Not sure why you're tagging me specifically but i appreciate it

I'm actually not sure if you can directly cancel needles in the air without having to air dodge one way or the other. The trick here is that the air dodge itself can also be cancelled; this can be seen in needle fidgeting like you said, as well as when you cancel air dodge by quickly using bouncing fish. So the inputs, assuming you're in needle charging animation in the air, would be to air dodge and then immediately bouncing fish. The air dodge would cancel the needles and the bouncing fish will cancel the air dodge. This is really useful when charging needles off-stage and you wanna recover quickly without having to go through air dodge animation, or as a mixup.

@ Kaffei

 

[Kaffei]

Not sure why you're tagging me specifically but i appreciate it

I'm actually not sure if you can directly cancel needles in the air without having to air dodge one way or the other. The trick here is that the air dodge itself can also be cancelled; this can be seen in needle fidgeting like you said, as well as when you cancel air dodge by quickly using bouncing fish. So the inputs, assuming you're in needle charging animation in the air, would be to air dodge and then immediately bouncing fish. The air dodge would cancel the needles and the bouncing fish will cancel the air dodge. This is really useful when charging needles off-stage and you wanna recover quickly without having to go through air dodge animation, or as a mixup.

@ Kaffei

That's probably what it is. I was watching Cyve's Sheik and he kept doing stuff like that

 

[XCounter]

So I've decided to pick up Sheik as a secondary to Ness in order to cover his worse matchups. I'm trying to learn her combos, best options OOS, etc.

Which Sheik players should I be watching to learn the ropes? I've seen False play a lot, a few sets from Mr. R, Nietono and Vinnie and I've seen Ralph Cecil and Ed play on stream. Are there any other notable players I should be taking notes from?

 

[ArikadoSD]

So I've decided to pick up Sheik as a secondary to Ness in order to cover his worse matchups. I'm trying to learn her combos, best options OOS, etc.

Which Sheik players should I be watching to learn the ropes? I've seen False play a lot, a few sets from Mr. R, Nietono and Vinnie and I've seen Ralph Cecil and Ed play on stream. Are there any other notable players I should be taking notes from?

You got that covered lol. Those are the best sheiks that constantly go to tournaments.

Although cyve and dill (not sure if thats his full tag) have tight Sheiks also, especially the latter. Only seen him once in a tournament streamed yesterday on TeamSp00ky.

 

[Smasher89]

The framedatathread lacks the startup on needles, is there any source i can see the different startups for all the needles including custom ones?

 

[iLLEST]

how many people have set and use shoulder button as primary jump?

 

[iAft3rbang]

how many people have set and use shoulder button as primary jump?

I use the Z button for all my jumps. I find it easier to SH with Z rather than R or L. That way, I can do all my aerials with my C-stick (except Nair, I use A). I find it hard to use different jump button, but I guess it's all about habit. What is the advantage of using different jump buttons ?

 

[Jaxas]

how many people have set and use shoulder button as primary jump?

I used to (L), but Sm4sh's trigger-handling sucks...

Trying to train myself to jump with Z, but I'm really not a fan of it

 

[Rizen]

I'm having a lot of trouble learning Sheik because she's not my style. Are there any good sheik videos I should look at, like tourney games, to see how she plays?

 

[Spark31]

Ever since the Bair nerf, I've had a hard time in the Ness MU. Any advice for netting kills?

 

[WondrousMoose]

I'm having a lot of trouble learning Sheik because she's not my style. Are there any good sheik videos I should look at, like tourney games, to see how she plays?

I don't know about specific matches to watch, but check out videos by some of the best players like Mr. R, False, and Nietono.

 

[Lizard_Buttock]

I'm looking for a secondary character to counteract my own main's weaknesses (guess who), so I'd like to know who the number 1 counter character for sheik is?

 

[Sean de Lure]

I'm looking for a secondary character to counteract my own main's weaknesses (guess who), so I'd like to know who the number 1 counter character for sheik is?

"counter" is a pretty bad term tbh, in this game, there are very few bad MU (only one I can think of is Pac vs rosaluma)
So, I say sheik has no counters, however, characters like heavies put lots of pressure on the sheik to not make mistakes, because if sheik makes a mistake when she is above 60, she's probably dead. Lucario is probably the only MU where I don't want to play sheik, he's decently heavy and aura is a ****.



Anyway, hey guys, I was wondering if I could get some help on breverse timings

(hope the pic works, am a scrub on forums)
Anyway, so what you see here is "sheik" the green X running off the platform and breversing needles. Usually, I end up landing on the blue Xs, more commonly the center stage blue X -(when I don't nade which is like 75% of the time)-. However, once in a while, I land on the red Xs, (i think) more commonly under the green X. I can then usually after that do it up to 3 times consecutively, but then I start messing it up and either go back to nading / blue Xs. As a mixup tool, the red Xs would probably be more useful, but I'm really unsure of the timing of those. Does anyone have any framedata on needles / window for breverses that would result in diffrent drifts? Thanks :]

Edit: doesn't look like the pic works, ugh, welp try the link http://imgur.com/exCafVH

 

[ArikadoSD]

I'm looking for a secondary character to counteract my own main's weaknesses (guess who), so I'd like to know who the number 1 counter character for sheik is?

Lucario is something all Sheik mains pretty much agree to, and the other bad matchups really come down to each player's preference. For example a lot of Sheik mains say Ness is a problem to them, but to me Ness is screaming "gimp me!" and can't handle needles all that well. I personally struggle with Yoshi and Rosalina a lot while other sheik mains say we have the advantage in that matchup (but it could probably be because of my own lack of matchup experience) etc. Find the matchups you think are annoying and maybe get a secondary that handles them.

 

[tennissnowball]

I'm looking for a secondary character to counteract my own main's weaknesses (guess who), so I'd like to know who the number 1 counter character for sheik is?

Lucario is a great one, if he gets to a 100% he gets an aerial stall in dair and does insane damage

 

[Sean de Lure]

So I'm a scrub at making gifs/videos, and I think I found something (it doesn't seem very useful, but I might be wrong). I posted the replay onto the 3ds replays under the title "sheikbcncl slide" (sheik needle canceling slide) and the mii "_" (underscore). For filtering, US, Smash, FD, and Sheik. Basically I came across this when practicing breversing needles in training mode. I went to normal smash vs a dummy jigglypuff to record the replay. In the replay, I just tried to do it under the same conditions of my discovery, which was FD and full hand of needles. I first found it on the left side, but after I discovered it works on the right, I went for the right more due to more consistency. I tried to record a previous replay, but I forgot to save it. It left me a bit annoyed so I grenaded a decent amount in this replay.

So essentially what I was doing/ trying to do was breverse at an exact point where it canceled the needles, but I slid onto the stage, much further than a normal waveneedle would let me slide. The very first attempt was successful (somehow), so if you get tired of me failing, you can just rewatch the very beginning over and over. The slide seems to be from me breversing in the air, but since I was still close enough onto the stage, I was able to slide back onto it. I think it is very similar to the post I made earlier about running off BF platform b reverse to get a rather large amount momentum. However, for that one I did not have needles charged, leading me to believe that this is possible to do without a full needle charge (I began speculating after I recorded this because I was not really sure what happened until after I rewatched it). I guess it would work with piercing needles as well. If it does work without charged needles, it probably would have no landing lag, making it potentially useful. (edit: ) I forgot to mention no needles come out despite a full charge.

Anyway, if anyone could point me to a guide for recording/creating gifs, or record it with a capture card and post it (I don't have a capture card), I'd appreciate it. Also if this was already found, go ahead and yell at me for not noticing. I'm going to go back to testing it under new conditions (custom needles/no charge). Right now, I doubt this needs its own thread, so I'm putting it here (should this be a new thread?). Anyway, thanks for reading my essay on a probably not very useful thing. I'll edit in my results of new conditions/discoveries about it when I get it to work. :] This whole thing is probably messy and hard to understand, sorry :[

Edit: piercing needles work
slide appears to have 2 different lengths on stage, and 2 different momentum trajectories off stage, so it really seems like the same kind of slide as the one off the BF platform I was talking about

currently still no success with no charge needles on FD, but I found there is a 3rd slide length for off BF platform, but it appears to only work with charged needles (so basically useless due to landing lag). It lets you slide back just past the platform (left of the red X under platform), or under just the opposite platform (right of red X past that is right of center stage)

 

[ArikadoSD]

So I'm a scrub at making gifs/videos, and I think I found something (it doesn't seem very useful, but I might be wrong). I posted the replay onto the 3ds replays under the title "sheikbcncl slide" (sheik needle canceling slide) and the mii "_" (underscore). For filtering, US, Smash, FD, and Sheik. Basically I came across this when practicing breversing needles in training mode. I went to normal smash vs a dummy jigglypuff to record the replay. In the replay, I just tried to do it under the same conditions of my discovery, which was FD and full hand of needles. I first found it on the left side, but after I discovered it works on the right, I went for the right more due to more consistency. I tried to record a previous replay, but I forgot to save it. It left me a bit annoyed so I grenaded a decent amount in this replay.

So essentially what I was doing/ trying to do was breverse at an exact point where it canceled the needles, but I slid onto the stage, much further than a normal waveneedle would let me slide. The very first attempt was successful (somehow), so if you get tired of me failing, you can just rewatch the very beginning over and over. The slide seems to be from me breversing in the air, but since I was still close enough onto the stage, I was able to slide back onto it. I think it is very similar to the post I made earlier about running off BF platform b reverse to get a rather large amount momentum. However, for that one I did not have needles charged, leading me to believe that this is possible to do without a full needle charge (I began speculating after I recorded this because I was not really sure what happened until after I rewatched it). I guess it would work with piercing needles as well. If it does work without charged needles, it probably would have no landing lag, making it potentially useful. (edit: ) I forgot to mention no needles come out despite a full charge.

Anyway, if anyone could point me to a guide for recording/creating gifs, or record it with a capture card and post it (I don't have a capture card), I'd appreciate it. Also if this was already found, go ahead and yell at me for not noticing. I'm going to go back to testing it under new conditions (custom needles/no charge). Right now, I doubt this needs its own thread, so I'm putting it here (should this be a new thread?). Anyway, thanks for reading my essay on a probably not very useful thing. I'll edit in my results of new conditions/discoveries about it when I get it to work. :] This whole thing is probably messy and hard to understand, sorry :[

If you have a smartphone then record the replay off the gamepad and upload it directly to youtube from your phone, should be really simple/straightforward.